Connolly & Briere...

[LabattBlue]

Connolly's health status is up in the air and there is a possibility that Briere walks or traded prior to the season. If Connolly is sidelined for the season(or calls it a career), this team just lost it's two most dynamic/creative players and would probably be a huge blow to the PP and offensive production in general.

 

If Connolly status for the start of the season is unknown to even Darcy at this point in time, how much of a factor is that is deciding what to do with Briere.

 

 

Deluca no need to respond, I'll take care of it for you...Briere is overrated, can't stay healthy, has not scored more than 60+ points in a season, blah, blah, blah :P

[Screamin'Weasel]

Connolly's health status is up in the air and there is a possibility that Briere walks or traded prior to the season. If Connolly is sidelined for the season(or calls it a career), this team just lost it's two most dynamic/creative players and would probably be a huge blow to the PP and offensive production in general.

 

If Connolly status for the start of the season is unknown to even Darcy at this point in time, how much of a factor is that is deciding what to do with Briere.

Deluca no need to respond, I'll take care of it for you...Briere is overrated, can't stay healthy, has not scored more than 60+ points in a season, blah, blah, blah :P

My question concerning Connolly is more about what kind of arbitration award he can get. Yes he had a great season. He is incredibly talented. He had a concussion. He also had a concussion forcing him to miss an entire season. Signing him is risky. Will an arbitor take these injuries/lost play-time into consideration?

[Corp000085]

i'm very worried about connolly's health. I really have no doubt that he'll come back, but like Lafontaine, primeau, wayne "flashlight" chrebet, lindros, etc. it's just a matter of time before he gets his head scrambled again.

 

 

If he's awarded a very high arbitration #, if i were darcy, i'd consider a sign and trade. If connolly does well, good for him... If not, the sabres would have saved face.

 

Although, we could sign him for a lower value contract and roll the dice.

[nfreeman]

I am pretty confident we are going to accept the $5 million arbitration award and keep Danny for the year. I also think we are going to try hard to negotiate a 3- or 4-year deal with Timmy.

[Screamin'Weasel]

I am pretty confident we are going to accept the $5 million arbitration award and keep Danny for the year. I also think we are going to try hard to negotiate a 3- or 4-year deal with Timmy.

You posted one minute before another post mentioned Timmy was signed. Please post that I will win a bazillion dollars....

[nfreeman]

Screamin' Weasel will win a bazillion dollars as soon as he eliminates vice from his life.

[Screamin'Weasel]

Screamin' Weasel will win a bazillion dollars as soon as he eliminates vice from his life.

1 wife, four kids, two jobs...it's not easy to keep vice in my life...

 

However, I may be able to try and do something about the Connoly vid for you. I'll have to see if I can still get the footage. I'll let you know.

 

Edit: Here's a link to a thread showing some of the videos I have already made:

Link

[nfreeman]

1 wife, four kids, two jobs...it's not easy to keep vice in my life...

 

However, I may be able to try and do something about the Connoly vid for you. I'll have to see if I can still get the footage. I'll let you know.

 

 

4 kids? Good man. I've got 1 wife, 2 kids and 1 job and it's pretty GD hard to find time to do anything (although I do seem to find time for this board).

 

Anything on Connolly would be great.

[deluca67]

Connolly's health status is up in the air and there is a possibility that Briere walks or traded prior to the season. If Connolly is sidelined for the season(or calls it a career), this team just lost it's two most dynamic/creative players and would probably be a huge blow to the PP and offensive production in general.

 

If Connolly status for the start of the season is unknown to even Darcy at this point in time, how much of a factor is that is deciding what to do with Briere.

Deluca no need to respond, I'll take care of it for you...Briere is overrated, can't stay healthy, has not scored more than 60+ points in a season, blah, blah, blah :P

 

Don't you want to add Hecht to that list? You remember him. He's the one that showed up for game Seven versus the 'Canes. Unlike Briere who had 0 points, was a minus 1 and had 0 shots.

 

Could you PLEASE start another thread and tell me how important Danny Briere is to the Sabres again. ;)

[LabattBlue]

Don't you want to add Hecht to that list? You remember him. He's the one that showed up for game Seven versus the 'Canes. Unlike Briere who had 0 points, was a minus 1 and had 0 shots.

 

Could you PLEASE start another thread and tell me how important Danny Briere is to the Sabres again. ;)

What do you want me to do...start threads about how important Adam Mair and Andrew Peters are instead?

 

As far as Hecht goes, I'm not sure what your point is. I've acknowledged many times how valuable I feel Hecht is to the Sabres, but why would I mention him when talking about the Sabres most dynamic/creative players? :blink:

 

 

 

Could you PLEASE start another thread and tell me how important Danny Briere is to the Sabres again. ;)

Could you PLEASE keep responding to these threads stating how Briere is nothing special, not worth more than about 3 million per year and is easily replaceable. <_<

[deluca67]

What do you want me to do...start threads about how important Adam Mair and Andrew Peters are instead?

 

As far as Hecht goes, I'm not sure what your point is. I've acknowledged many times how valuable I feel Hecht is to the Sabres, but why would I mention him when talking about the Sabres most dynamic/creative players? :blink:

Could you PLEASE keep responding to these threads stating how Briere is nothing special, not worth more than about 3 million per year and is easily replaceable. <_<

 

Would you rather I start a thread on how the logo sucks? :P

 

If you can explain to me why everyone has their panties in a bunch for a player who at age 28 has one good half season? I will be happy to stop ragging on him. :rolleyes:

 

As far as Hecht? He is by far one of the Sabres most creative players. He may not show it all the time because he plays a little game called 'back checking'. ;)

[BetweenThePipes00]

Labatt, you are going to have to agree to disagree with DeLuca. He is a "Show me" kind of guy. He was not optimistic about the team or the plan before the season, but he was obviously convinced by the results and is now a huge proponent of the team concept.

He doesn't hate or dislike Briere for no reason. If he produces, DeLuca will come around. But there are no hard facts from the past to back up some huge expectations for Briere, so you will not convince him.

[deluca67]

Labatt, you are going to have to agree to disagree with DeLuca. He is a "Show me" kind of guy. He was not optimistic about the team or the plan before the season, but he was obviously convinced by the results and is now a huge proponent of the team concept.

He doesn't hate or dislike Briere for no reason. If he produces, DeLuca will come around. But there are no hard facts from the past to back up some huge expectations for Briere, so you will not convince him.

 

Yeah! Well, I could have just said that :blink: But where would all of the fun be :P

 

It's more than that.

 

Before Briere. McKee was the most important Sabre. Then it was Grier. When does it end.

 

If Max came up first we would be reading how the Sabres would die without him.

 

The Sabres won at a better rate without Briere then with him. That's a fact.

He sucks in his own end and on the PK. But yet everyone wants to make him the next big thing? :blink:

 

There's no I in team. But there is in Briere :D :P :D :P :D :blush:

[hopeleslyobvious]

Before Briere. McKee was the most important Sabre. Then it was Grier. When does it end.

 

Don't forget Pyatt :P

[LabattBlue]

Labatt, you are going to have to agree to disagree with DeLuca. He is a "Show me" kind of guy. He was not optimistic about the team or the plan before the season, but he was obviously convinced by the results and is now a huge proponent of the team concept.

He doesn't hate or dislike Briere for no reason. If he produces, DeLuca will come around. But there are no hard facts from the past to back up some huge expectations for Briere, so you will not convince him.

I think Briere showed a hell of a lot in both the regular season and the playoffs of the "new" NHL. So he came up empty in game 7 of the ECF's. SO did a bunch of other Sabres not named Janik. I don't hear a lot of people ragging on Max and he came up empty the ENTIRE playoffs. Wait until you see his arbitration award.

[Bmwolf21]

I don't hear a lot of people ragging on Max and he came up empty the ENTIRE playoffs. Wait until you see his arbitration award.

 

You're just not listening to the right people... ;)

 

Seriously, there are a lot of people (including some onthis very message board) who have taken Max to task for disappearing in the playoffs. I think it was his regression back to the rookie Max who thought he could beat the opponents' entire team 1-on-5 (probably like he was able to in juniors) that really got under my skin - often ignored his linemates, and when he did look for them, made tons of bad passes in the offensive zone, including a couple of blind drop passes that resulted in scoring chances for the Canes (someone might have to correct me on that; its late, and I'm pretty tired) and to top it all of, couldn't finish the breakaway at the end of Game 5in the ECF.

 

BTW, I'll go on record right now as saying that if he hits the jackpot in arbitration, the Sabres need to sign & trade while he still has some value.

[deluca67]

I think Briere showed a hell of a lot in both the regular season and the playoffs of the "new" NHL. So he came up empty in game 7 of the ECF's. SO did a bunch of other Sabres not named Janik. I don't hear a lot of people ragging on Max and he came up empty the ENTIRE playoffs. Wait until you see his arbitration award.

 

Your right. Game 7's don't mean anything. ;)

 

To me Max is in the same boat as Briere. It would be nice to keep him if the price is right. But since he has only one aspect to his game I don't want them to overpay for him either. Anything over $3 a year say goodbye Max. There is no room on the Sabres roster for oneway players. :)

[nfreeman]

DeLuca -- as I've said before, I agree with a lot of what you've said about Danny. However, I don't think it's fair to call him a 1-way player or to say he sucks in his own end. If those statements were true, he wouldn't get ice time from Lindy. Briere averaged over 19 min. per game last year -- close to the top among forwards.

 

He may not be as good as Drury or Connolly in the defensive zone, but he doesn't suck either.

[deluca67]

DeLuca -- as I've said before, I agree with a lot of what you've said about Danny. However, I don't think it's fair to call him a 1-way player or to say he sucks in his own end. If those statements were true, he wouldn't get ice time from Lindy. Briere averaged over 19 min. per game last year -- close to the top among forwards.

 

He may not be as good as Drury or Connolly in the defensive zone, but he doesn't suck either.

 

Briere is a weaklink in his own end. It's part of the reason why Ruff likes to pair him with Hecht when he can to protect Briere. He is often targeted by other teams. Teams know if they can get their best lines out against Briere they can get some some serious scoring chances or at least change some momentum.

 

If Briere had any game in his own end then I would be with all of you who think the Sabres should pay $5 a year.

 

Briere's 19:04 minutes per game? 12:43 of that comes at even strength. Which is #1 on the team. :20 more then Max. I think that says something.

 

Briere plays 5:25 a game on the powerplay which you would expect for a offense only player. He also played :55 a game on the PK which is only :10 more then Taylor Pyatt.

 

When you compare Briere's ice time to that of Drury, Connolly and Hecht you will find that their time is a much more balanced beacuse they give the Sabres a much more balanced game.

 

I wish I could find some stats regarding the last minute of play in close games. I would guess Briere's ice time in close games would be close to zero. Did you know he hasn't scored one empty net goal in the past four seasons. ;)

[BetweenThePipes00]

Briere is a weaklink in his own end. It's part of the reason why Ruff likes to pair him with Hecht when he can to protect Briere. He is often targeted by other teams. Teams know if they can get their best lines out against Briere they can get some some serious scoring chances or at least change some momentum.

If Briere had any game in his own end then I would be with all of you who think the Sabres should pay $5 a year.

Briere's 19:04 minutes per game? 12:43 of that comes at even strength. Which is #1 on the team. :20 more then Max. I think that says something.

Briere plays 5:25 a game on the powerplay which you would expect for a offense only player. He also played :55 a game on the PK which is only :10 more then Taylor Pyatt.

When you compare Briere's ice time to that of Drury, Connolly and Hecht you will find that their time is a much more balanced beacuse they give the Sabres a much more balanced game.

I wish I could find some stats regarding the last minute of play in close games. I would guess Briere's ice time in close games would be close to zero. Did you know he hasn't scored one empty net goal in the past four seasons. ;)

 

DeLuca, I have kind of defended you on this one but ... I have to take issue with some of this. I am not a "SIGN HIM AT ALL COSTS!!!!" guy, and I DO think he was a bit of a hypocrite on the money issue. But in this post you make him out to be an anchor dragging the team down with him, which is just not true.

 

First of all, can't argue with the numbers. And yeah, Hecht covers Briere's ass ... that's every NHL offensive star in history, with a solid 2-way guy on his line so he can think offense. It's the same philospohy as playing four forwards on the PP ... yeah, you are going to take your lumps with a shorty here and there, but you will score enough to make up for it. Turning Briere loose is the same philosophy. Get him out there with Tallinder and Lydman and Hecht and let him go ... and then, yeah, when the situation warrants it, make sure Drury or Gaustad is out there for the big draws and protecting the lead. But how many of those leads will you have because of Briere? That's not an indictment on Briere, it is Drury and Gaustad's role.

 

Second, I swear, if I took that whole post, replaced "Briere" with "Satan," and posted it in October you would have flipped out saying that Satan brings offense you can't replace. Even if that is a slight exaggeration, it warrants mentioning that you have done a 180 on this issue. And actually that is cool because you are not so hard-headed as some think. But I think you got it backward because for whatever deficiencies you see in Briere's game, at least he busts his ass every night, unlike Satan.

[LabattBlue]

DeLuca, I have kind of defended you on this one but ... I have to take issue with some of this. I am not a "SIGN HIM AT ALL COSTS!!!!" guy, and I DO think he was a bit of a hypocrite on the money issue. But in this post you make him out to be an anchor dragging the team down with him, which is just not true.

 

First of all, can't argue with the numbers. And yeah, Hecht covers Briere's ass ... that's every NHL offensive star in history, with a solid 2-way guy on his line so he can think offense. It's the same philospohy as playing four forwards on the PP ... yeah, you are going to take your lumps with a shorty here and there, but you will score enough to make up for it. Turning Briere loose is the same philosophy. Get him out there with Tallinder and Lydman and Hecht and let him go ... and then, yeah, when the situation warrants it, make sure Drury or Gaustad is out there for the big draws and protecting the lead. But how many of those leads will you have because of Briere? That's not an indictment on Briere, it is Drury and Gaustad's role.

 

Second, I swear, if I took that whole post, replaced "Briere" with "Satan," and posted it in October you would have flipped out saying that Satan brings offense you can't replace. Even if that is a slight exaggeration, it warrants mentioning that you have done a 180 on this issue. And actually that is cool because you are not so hard-headed as some think. But I think you got it backward because for whatever deficiencies you see in Briere's game, at least he busts his ass every night, unlike Satan.

Amen! B-)

[deluca67]

DeLuca, I have kind of defended you on this one but ... I have to take issue with some of this. I am not a "SIGN HIM AT ALL COSTS!!!!" guy, and I DO think he was a bit of a hypocrite on the money issue. But in this post you make him out to be an anchor dragging the team down with him, which is just not true.

 

First of all, can't argue with the numbers. And yeah, Hecht covers Briere's ass ... that's every NHL offensive star in history, with a solid 2-way guy on his line so he can think offense. It's the same philospohy as playing four forwards on the PP ... yeah, you are going to take your lumps with a shorty here and there, but you will score enough to make up for it. Turning Briere loose is the same philosophy. Get him out there with Tallinder and Lydman and Hecht and let him go ... and then, yeah, when the situation warrants it, make sure Drury or Gaustad is out there for the big draws and protecting the lead. But how many of those leads will you have because of Briere? That's not an indictment on Briere, it is Drury and Gaustad's role.

 

Second, I swear, if I took that whole post, replaced "Briere" with "Satan," and posted it in October you would have flipped out saying that Satan brings offense you can't replace. Even if that is a slight exaggeration, it warrants mentioning that you have done a 180 on this issue. And actually that is cool because you are not so hard-headed as some think. But I think you got it backward because for whatever deficiencies you see in Briere's game, at least he busts his ass every night, unlike Satan.

 

Please. Briere couldn't hold Satan's jock.

 

In Satan's last season with the Sabres he played he played 20:02 minutes a game. 1:49 on the PK and 4:37 on the pp. He also had 29 goals and 28 assists for 57 points in an off year. He followed that up with 35 goals for 66 points. Not a bad comeback year. Hell it beats Briere's best.

 

I know. I know. If Briere was healthy he would have had 500 points last season.

 

People like to bring up all of Satans empty net goals. You can't score score into an empty net unless your coach has faith in your defensive ability. Which is why Briere has none.

 

Lets look at some career numbers.

 

Satan .744 ppg, 42 game winners and a plus 32 (not bad for a lazy player who takes every other shift off :lol:)

 

Briere .699 ppg, 19 game winners and a minus 22. (you would think he would have more considering he has no defensive responsibilities. :o )

 

:P :P :P

[BetweenThePipes00]

 

Please. Briere couldn't hold Satan's jock.

In Satan's last season with the Sabres he played he played 20:02 minutes a game. 1:49 on the PK and 4:37 on the pp. He also had 29 goals and 28 assists for 57 points in an off year. He followed that up with 35 goals for 66 points. Not a bad comeback year. Hell it beats Briere's best.

I know. I know. If Briere was healthy he would have had 500 points last season.

People like to bring up all of Satans empty net goals. You can't score score into an empty net unless your coach has faith in your defensive ability. Which is why Briere has none.

Lets look at some career numbers.

Satan .744 ppg, 42 game winners and a plus 32 (not bad for a lazy player who takes every other shift off :lol: )

Briere .699 ppg, 19 game winners and a minus 22. (you would think he would have more considering he has no defensive responsibilities. :o )

:P :P :P

 

You missed the point. Or I didn't make it clear.

 

The point was that YES Briere has weaknesses, but what he brings IS valuable and the team is built so that those weaknesses do not cost them games. You can't win if you don't score, and for better or worse he is one of the best OFFENSIVE players on the team. They have a system in place where they can take advantage of his talent and put guys better suited to defend leads out there when it warrants it. I'd love for those guys to get paid the same as the offensive stars in the league, but it's like saying that Kent Hull deserved as much money as Jim Kelly. It's just not reality. You have to pay more for the skill because it is rare.

 

Again, I know they can't pay him more than $5 million a year and even at that price it is tough to swallow, and he should not have called out the team about keeping it together when they are trying and he is not helping. But you are taking the argument to an extreme saying he is easily replaced because of his defensive deficiencies ... they have already dealt with those successfully. They obviosuly were not a huge problem because they have guys to fill the void. Does anything change in that area if Briere is gone? Would it be LESS of a burden on Durry and Gaustad at the end of games? Hell no, they would be out there the same amount because they are the guys who do it well. But they would have to replace his offense somehow. That's all I am saying. And that's what you were saying last year about Satan. You can come at us with crazy numbers now that make him look like a Selke candidate, but at the end of the day, you were upset because he was a rare offensive talent who you didn't think they had the firepower to replace. Turned out they did, but it was a risk. They might not have. Just like it would be a risk to let Briere go. Maybe one worth taking, but it is a risk. That's all i am saying.

[Fighting Chicken]

Please. Briere couldn't hold Satan's jock.

 

In Satan's last season with the Sabres he played he played 20:02 minutes a game. 1:49 on the PK and 4:37 on the pp. He also had 29 goals and 28 assists for 57 points in an off year. He followed that up with 35 goals for 66 points. Not a bad comeback year. Hell it beats Briere's best.

 

I know. I know. If Briere was healthy he would have had 500 points last season.

 

People like to bring up all of Satans empty net goals. You can't score score into an empty net unless your coach has faith in your defensive ability. Which is why Briere has none.

 

Lets look at some career numbers.

 

Satan .744 ppg, 42 game winners and a plus 32 (not bad for a lazy player who takes every other shift off :lol:)

 

Briere .699 ppg, 19 game winners and a minus 22. (you would think he would have more considering he has no defensive responsibilities. :o )

 

:P :P :P

 

Another off-season, another set of "The End Of The World Is Upon Us" posts from DL67.

 

Get over Satan, Briere is twice the player Satan ever was for the Sabres and is ever likely to be for the Isles.

 

I seem to remember that around one year ago there was a certain member on here :rolleyes: who was whining all summer about how the Sabres would suck last season because of losing the changing room cancer and Mr "I couldn't hit a barn door with a banjo, let alone a 6' x 4' net" to free agency.

 

Wheel out the stats all you want dude, the only ones you need are:

 

Satan on large payroll team - long, long summer.

 

Briere on low payroll team with no big (part time) superstar - one game away (and a boat load of injuries) from the Stanley Cup Final.

 

New rules now, all your beloved stats go right out the window. You're only as good as your last game.

 

This league is now made for players like Briere, you'd better believe that he's of twice the value that Satan ever was to this team. The loss of Briere would be ten times worse than the loss of Satan, on team spirit alone, and we all saw how far that took the Sabres last season.

[deluca67]

You missed the point. Or I didn't make it clear.

 

The point was that YES Briere has weaknesses, but what he brings IS valuable and the team is built so that those weaknesses do not cost them games. You can't win if you don't score, and for better or worse he is one of the best OFFENSIVE players on the team. They have a system in place where they can take advantage of his talent and put guys better suited to defend leads out there when it warrants it. I'd love for those guys to get paid the same as the offensive stars in the league, but it's like saying that Kent Hull deserved as much money as Jim Kelly. It's just not reality. You have to pay more for the skill because it is rare.

 

Again, I know they can't pay him more than $5 million a year and even at that price it is tough to swallow, and he should not have called out the team about keeping it together when they are trying and he is not helping. But you are taking the argument to an extreme saying he is easily replaced because of his defensive deficiencies ... they have already dealt with those successfully. They obviosuly were not a huge problem because they have guys to fill the void. Does anything change in that area if Briere is gone? Would it be LESS of a burden on Durry and Gaustad at the end of games? Hell no, they would be out there the same amount because they are the guys who do it well. But they would have to replace his offense somehow. That's all I am saying. And that's what you were saying last year about Satan. You can come at us with crazy numbers now that make him look like a Selke candidate, but at the end of the day, you were upset because he was a rare offensive talent who you didn't think they had the firepower to replace. Turned out they did, but it was a risk. They might not have. Just like it would be a risk to let Briere go. Maybe one worth taking, but it is a risk. That's all i am saying.

 

When Satan was here? He was all we had in the offensive zone.

 

Things have changed since then. Pominville, Kotilik, Roy and Vanek have come along to fill the offensive void. I'm not saying the Sabres need a Satan. They don't. Just like they don't need a Briere and the record and numbers back it up.

 

They have enough fire power. Now with Spacek on the PP point they will have even more. With Pominville and Co. being a year older and a year more mature things are only looking up.

 

I think we are saying the same thing. The only difference is I think Briere is grossly over valued.

 

I brought up the Satan numbers to show that the myth of him being a single minded player who didn't care is crap. In every measuable aspect of the game Satan is a better player then Briere. Even more so since Satan put up his numbers in the Trap/Cluth n Grab era of the game.

 

;)

 

Another off-season, another set of "The End Of The World Is Upon Us" posts from DL67.

 

Get over Satan, Briere is twice the player Satan ever was for the Sabres and is ever likely to be for the Isles.

 

I seem to remember that around one year ago there was a certain member on here :rolleyes: who was whining all summer about how the Sabres would suck last season because of losing the changing room cancer and Mr "I couldn't hit a barn door with a banjo, let alone a 6' x 4' net" to free agency.

 

Wheel out the stats all you want dude, the only ones you need are:

 

Satan on large payroll team - long, long summer.

 

Briere on low payroll team with no big (part time) superstar - one game away (and a boat load of injuries) from the Stanley Cup Final.

 

New rules now, all your beloved stats go right out the window. You're only as good as your last game.

 

This league is now made for players like Briere, you'd better believe that he's of twice the value that Satan ever was to this team. The loss of Briere would be ten times worse than the loss of Satan, on team spirit alone, and we all saw how far that took the Sabres last season.

 

End of the world? I am the only one saying the Sabres will be fine. And they will be without Briere. So that dosen't make any sense. I guess it's the best you can do.

 

I would guess you don't like stats because you have none to back up anything you might be trying to say.

 

The Sabres did have a better winning percentage without Satan. Just like they did without Briere. ;)