bottlecap Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 First off I wanted to say I love our 6-2 start. With luck we could be 7-1. Both our offense and defense are clicking and our goalie is making the big saves. That being said, there's lots of frustration with our previous attempts to replace the Dominator. First with #1 draft pick Biron and then #1 draft pick Noronen. They are languishing on the bench behind #5 draft pick Miller. Biron has proven serviceable but not spectacular and Noronen IMO never given a real chance. Just goes to show you unless you're Luongo, the rest of those #1 goalies are pretty much the same as #5s and sometimes the #5s are better. Now we're stuck with 2 #1s on the bench. And Trader Darcy is stuck; who wants a #1 draft pick goalie who lost out a job to a #5? What a waste! How about a real hockey guy doing the drafting. :angry:
BetweenThePipes00 Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 First of all, place the blame where it belongs if you are going to talk about wasting picks on Biron and Noronen ... Biron was drafted by Muckler in 1995 and Noronen in 1997, either right after Regier came on or right before Muckler left, I forget if that happened before the draft. Either way, they didn't throw out all the scouts with Muckler, so it was basically the same guys who decided to take both of them. Second, Miller would have been a #1 pick for sure except everyone stayed away from him because he was going to play college hockey ... the Sabres took a chance they could lure him away before he finished his college career and they did. You think he doesn't go in the first round if the Sabres don't sign him and he goes back into the draft after what he did at MSU? I understand the frustration, but in this case it is misplaced. If you want to be mad at Regier, be mad he didn't deal Noronen after he was player of the year in Rochester or something, he has made plenty of mistakes. But you should be happy he got the deal with Miller done.
shrader Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 Second, Miller would have been a #1 pick for sure except everyone stayed away from him because he was going to play college hockey ... the Sabres took a chance they could lure him away before he finished his college career and they did. You think he doesn't go in the first round if the Sabres don't sign him and he goes back into the draft after what he did at MSU? College players don't go back into the draft. As for the rest of what you said, Miller wasn't regarded all too highly before he got to Michigan State. He developed quickly there and we lucked out. There are tons of stories like this in every NHL draft.
Eleven Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 Actually, not until we saw what Miller did in the AHL last season, and maybe not until we saw what he did in the first couple of games this season, would it have made any sense to trade Noronen and/or Biron. Now we know Miller is at least capable of playing to Biron's standards, and probably is better, and the Sabres can trade either of the other two.
BetweenThePipes00 Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 College players don't go back into the draft. As for the rest of what you said, Miller wasn't regarded all too highly before he got to Michigan State. He developed quickly there and we lucked out. There are tons of stories like this in every NHL draft. I stand corrected, but there would certainly have been a biddiing war for him if he became a free agent. In that case, Regier did his job well, seeing something in Miller and then getting im on board before losing his rights (unlike Zigomanis :blink: ) Either way, the whole premise that Regier "wasted" two picks on Biron and Nornonen was flawed since he certainly didn't draft Biron and like I said may not have been on board yet when they drafted Noronen.
Knightrider Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 The draft is a crapshoot at best. Eighteen-year-olds can be a little unpredictable. With that said, neither of those former #1s are what I would call a bust yet...
shrader Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 I stand corrected, but there would certainly have been a biddiing war for him if he became a free agent. In that case, Regier did his job well, seeing something in Miller and then getting im on board before losing his rights (unlike Zigomanis :blink: ) To be fair, he did sign Zigomanis. Anyway, he isn't the best comparison to Miller. They Sabres controlled Zigomis' rights for 2 years. The Sabres controlled Miller's for 5 years, assuming that he stayed in college (which was a virtual lock with his family history at Michigan State).
Taro T Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 To be fair, he did sign Zigomanis. Anyway, he isn't the best comparison to Miller. They Sabres controlled Zigomis' rights for 2 years. The Sabres controlled Miller's for 5 years, assuming that he stayed in college (which was a virtual lock with his family history at Michigan State). He did and he didn't. He did get his signature on a contract, but for whatever reason got the contract to the league too late for it to be valid. So, as far as the NHL was concerned, he didn't sign Zigomanis.
mphs mike Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 While you'd like at least one of the Biron/Noronen picks to have become your starting goalie, they aren't even at the top of Sabres wasted #1 picks.
ThePolishSabre Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 First of all, place the blame where it belongs if you are going to talk about wasting picks on Biron and Noronen ... Biron was drafted by Muckler in 1995 and Noronen in 1997, either right after Regier came on or right before Muckler left, I forget if that happened before the draft. Either way, they didn't throw out all the scouts with Muckler, so it was basically the same guys who decided to take both of them. But it's not Mucklers fault Biron and Noronen aren't the goalies they should be.
Taro T Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 But it's not Mucklers fault Biron and Noronen aren't the goalies they should be. What SHOULD they be? The last time Marty played in the regular season he was only 26. Mika is currently 26. That is a typical age for most goaltenders to start playing at an NHL caliber level. They've both shown signs of not being mentally tough, but that could just be due to immaturity. (It might be due to inherent character flaws as well, but right now both are too young to say so definitively.) They've also both shown flashes of brilliance. Both of these guys could very well still be in the NHL 10 years from now. Heck, after he leaves Buffalo, Mika could still turn out to be a top notch goalie. He has excelled at every level but the NHL and he has shown flashes of an ability to do well at this level also. I don't see Marty in the top echelon, but I see him as a serviceable starter or an excellent backup. If you want to talk wasted #1's, talk about David Cooper or Erik Rasmussen; don't talk about Marty and Mika.
Eleven Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 While you'd like at least one of the Biron/Noronen picks to have become your starting goalie, they aren't even at the top of Sabres wasted #1 picks. Right on. David Cooper? Joel Savage? More recently, Kryukov comes to mind, and I doubt that Novotny will crack the lineup anytime soon. Of course, there's also Barrett Heisten, who never signed and is now playing in the ECHL (not exactly where you want your first-rounder to end up). I could throw out names like Shawn Anderson, Jiri Dudacek, and Joe Kowal, too. Oh, I just did. Biron and Noronen were fine first round picks, regardless of the GM.
shrader Posted October 24, 2005 Report Posted October 24, 2005 He did and he didn't. He did get his signature on a contract, but for whatever reason got the contract to the league too late for it to be valid. So, as far as the NHL was concerned, he didn't sign Zigomanis. I see that sarcasm is lost on you.
bottlecap Posted October 25, 2005 Author Report Posted October 25, 2005 whatever happened to Taro Tsujimoto?
Taro T Posted October 25, 2005 Report Posted October 25, 2005 whatever happened to Taro Tsujimoto? The better question is: whatever happened to Bob Geoffrion?
DrunkenSabre Posted October 25, 2005 Report Posted October 25, 2005 thanks for stating that, i wasnt aware there was frustration regarding biron and noronen. lol. yer, sure they havent really worked out, but miller did, lets move on.
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