Anonymous players spill on what went wrong this year

[Mango]

3 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I'm curious what the "disconnect" was all about? Did Lindy do a poor job making his wishes known, or were the players not used to being held to a higher standard? I wonder if being in the Sabres locker room there was a sense that losing was acceptable because "it's what we do." Maybe players put in a level of effort but we're okay when they didn't win? And Lindy tried to get them to "look in the mirror," a specific phrase he used in the press conference.

I think that also relates to being upset at Adams for not signing more names. Maybe they expected someone else to get them out of their funk, but Lindy said "no, this is your job." Guys like Tage and Rasmus aren't "youth" anymore. So when do you start acting like grown men?

The disconnect seems to be that these guys were used to answering to Tom Hanks in Big. And then a real life adult entered the room and it took them 6 months how to figure out how to be professionals.

[Pimlach]

7 hours ago, Pimlach said:

You are missing the point.  It has nothing to do with whether Benson plays defense or is a good player.  

The were supposedly going for it.  This was the playoff push.  Yet they left camp with no veteran replacement for an injured Quinn and gave a roster spot to an 18 year old.   All Adams brought in was Eric Johnson who was on his last legs   They gave the goalie job to Levi, a kid with 7 NHL games and 0 AHL games under his belt.   They added no physical players or any other veteran experience, in fact the teams average age went down.   Does this sound like a great plan for a team that committed to win?  

After the season Adams called the  players over-confident,   He also blamed the coach for not making them accountable. 

This time around the players are doing the talking, they know Adams is over his head.   They should be.  It is no wonder Peterka wants out at the first opportunity.  

Holy Cow @Mango,  the beer you sent me put me in the Sabrespace Hall of Fame. 
 

A tip  of my Fedora to you. 
 

[Thorny]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

The disconnect seems to be that these guys were used to answering to Tom Hanks in Big. And then a real life adult entered the room and it took them 6 months how to figure out how to be professionals.

AND ADAMS FACILITATED THIS ENVIRONMENT lol

[spndnchz]

55 minutes ago, Thorner said:

AND ADAMS FACILITATED THIS ENVIRONMENT lol

So. Do something. 

[PerreaultForever]

The case of Erik Johnson is interesting. The way it's worded there seems odd to me and yes, he didn't work out but I remember his being the first veteran voice to speak up that year and in Philly I heard he was considered a leader and culture builder despite his declining play. If I'm not mistaken he's dressing for Colorado right now. So it seems weird to me to suggest he was seen as not wanting to win by others here. 

The bottom line though is many people here, myself included, have been screaming to have more veterans on the roster for years and it just never happens. A little bottom end rotation is all we get. The few adds they have done recently are a step but only a tiny one. They have to do much more and yes, as others have said, all of this screams FIRE ADAMS and yet he's still here. 

The one thing I don't like regarding Ruff is the statement he made saying he "met the players half way". That still says a little the inmates running the asylum to me but I suppose details on exactly what that meant might matter. To me though, if he was brought in to be the man, he should be that and the players need to step up and step in line. 

Now fire all the assistant coaches. All of them. 

[PerreaultForever]

14 hours ago, dudacek said:

You got that the complaints about Benson being on the team arent being made today and aren’t being made about his actual play?

They come from the start of his rookie season when veterans wanted Adams to use his cap space and that roster spot on a proven player.

Yes, remember though the bs about calling it a "development year" earlier. How do you think guys who feel they are already developed feel about that? It's a horrible way to try to build a culture. We all know that but for some reason Adams didn't. He had a firm plan in his mind. Subtract the disillusioned stars and acquire picks to stock the cupboard. Then spend several years developing the young guys all together and then magically it will all come together and under the veteran coach they will launch into the next level and stay there forever. That was his plan, and it always was and still is stupid. 

[Jorcus]

 

So they don't like Lindy's sense of humour.

 

[thewookie1]

2 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

The case of Erik Johnson is interesting. The way it's worded there seems odd to me and yes, he didn't work out but I remember his being the first veteran voice to speak up that year and in Philly I heard he was considered a leader and culture builder despite his declining play. If I'm not mistaken he's dressing for Colorado right now. So it seems weird to me to suggest he was seen as not wanting to win by others here. 

The bottom line though is many people here, myself included, have been screaming to have more veterans on the roster for years and it just never happens. A little bottom end rotation is all we get. The few adds they have done recently are a step but only a tiny one. They have to do much more and yes, as others have said, all of this screams FIRE ADAMS and yet he's still here. 

The one thing I don't like regarding Ruff is the statement he made saying he "met the players half way". That still says a little the inmates running the asylum to me but I suppose details on exactly what that meant might matter. To me though, if he was brought in to be the man, he should be that and the players need to step up and step in line. 

Now fire all the assistant coaches. All of them. 

It wasn’t that they felt Johnson didn’t want to win but rather Adams didn’t because Johnson was no where near enough to fix their defensive woes.

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

The case of Erik Johnson is interesting. The way it's worded there seems odd to me and yes, he didn't work out but I remember his being the first veteran voice to speak up that year and in Philly I heard he was considered a leader and culture builder despite his declining play. If I'm not mistaken he's dressing for Colorado right now. So it seems weird to me to suggest he was seen as not wanting to win by others here. 

The bottom line though is many people here, myself included, have been screaming to have more veterans on the roster for years and it just never happens. A little bottom end rotation is all we get. The few adds they have done recently are a step but only a tiny one. They have to do much more and yes, as others have said, all of this screams FIRE ADAMS and yet he's still here. 

The one thing I don't like regarding Ruff is the statement he made saying he "met the players half way". That still says a little the inmates running the asylum to me but I suppose details on exactly what that meant might matter. To me though, if he was brought in to be the man, he should be that and the players need to step up and step in line. 

Now fire all the assistant coaches. All of them. 

The world has changed from the 60s where dictatorial coaches controlled their peasant players. Communication is not a one-way street in the modern world of life that includes businesses, education, sports etc. When you noted that Ruff met his players halfway, I considered it demonstrating flexibility and an ability to listen before responding. That's a sign of growth in how to handle players/people, not weakness of yielding to players. What you may consider to be a weakness in style of coaching is something that I see as showing positive traits of a willingness to listen and adjust to players of today. The era of the "old school" coaching for all sports is long gone, eras and people change. You either adapt or go by the wayside. 

[JP51]

16 hours ago, Taro T said:

Not just about 900 W's.  In the RS, exactly 900 W's.  (Took 5 tries to get #900, but he got there.)

Yes that was my hedge lol... I for the life of me couldnt remember if he got it... and was too lazy to look it up... so I figured about would work LOL... thanks for the confirm 🙂 

[inkman]

1 hour ago, Jorcus said:

 

So they don't like Lindy's sense of humour.

 

Yeah wtf does that have to do with anything?  Are the players saying that Lindy hurt their feelings with his humor and that’s why they sucked this year?  If that’s the case, this team is doomed.  I don’t know if I’ve heard of professional athletes being softer than that.  

[Taro T]

13 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I'm curious what the "disconnect" was all about? Did Lindy do a poor job making his wishes known, or were the players not used to being held to a higher standard? I wonder if being in the Sabres locker room there was a sense that losing was acceptable because "it's what we do." Maybe players put in a level of effort but we're okay when they didn't win? And Lindy tried to get them to "look in the mirror," a specific phrase he used in the press conference.

I think that also relates to being upset at Adams for not signing more names. Maybe they expected someone else to get them out of their funk, but Lindy said "no, this is your job." Guys like Tage and Rasmus aren't "youth" anymore. So when do you start acting like grown men?

At the B&GI, Ruff addressed your Q to a degree.  Because they had essentially an abbreviated TC and ran with the lines that seemed to make sense from last year while playing a full NHL team against 1/2 NHL squads it caused at least 2 issues.  1. The lines weren't optimized (my wording, not Ruff's) prior to facing an actual NHL caliber opponent.  And 2. they thought they were better than they were because of the way the preseason played out (pretty much Ruff's words).  Which resulted in them not being ready for the 2 games vs the Devils.  They didn't get the structures in place that Ruff wanted installed before the bullets started flying.

They played a little better when they got back to this side of the pond and might've had a better start with some puck luck (they definitely could've won the LA game at a minimum) but they didn't really even get to their more typical early season solid play for a couple more weeks.  That had them chasing points early.

[Thorny]

8 hours ago, spndnchz said:

So. Do something. 

You couldn’t have responded to me if I didn’t 

[Archie Lee]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but I wanted to make a comment about the 13 game losing streak.  A lot has been written about Adams's failure to do anything to try and course correct during the streak., and I certainly understand the sentiment. Adams has now said that if he could do it over again he would do something, like call up a player from Rochester or maybe a trade (qualified, as always, by: "But I don't want to do anything reactionary that hurts us down the line".).  I think this narrative that Adams should have done something and his begrudging acknowledgement of this, is letting Adams off the hook a bit. It suggests that Adams can learn from the mistake of letting things go south for too long before acting.  It's really missing the point.  THE POINT, is that in his 5th year as GM Adams iced a hockey team that was capable of losing 13 games in a row.  The fix for this catastrophic error was required in June and July of 2024, not at the 4 game point of the losing streak. Calling up Brett Murray or Ryan Johnson or Isaac Rosen, was not going to fix that mess. 

The tie in to the thread, is that it has always been the case that the players are aware of management's shortcomings. As much as we want to think that the players should just be professionals and suck it up and play to their highest levels, it's naive to think that the players' preparation, commitment, focus, and effort, won't be negatively impacted by having one of their hands tied figuratively behind their backs by bad management.

[dudacek]

4 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

The case of Erik Johnson is interesting. The way it's worded there seems odd to me and yes, he didn't work out but I remember his being the first veteran voice to speak up that year and in Philly I heard he was considered a leader and culture builder despite his declining play. If I'm not mistaken he's dressing for Colorado right now. So it seems weird to me to suggest he was seen as not wanting to win by others here. 

The bottom line though is many people here, myself included, have been screaming to have more veterans on the roster for years and it just never happens. A little bottom end rotation is all we get. The few adds they have done recently are a step but only a tiny one. They have to do much more and yes, as others have said, all of this screams FIRE ADAMS and yet he's still here. 

The one thing I don't like regarding Ruff is the statement he made saying he "met the players half way". That still says a little the inmates running the asylum to me but I suppose details on exactly what that meant might matter. To me though, if he was brought in to be the man, he should be that and the players need to step up and step in line. 

Now fire all the assistant coaches. All of them. 

 

1 hour ago, thewookie1 said:

It wasn’t that they felt Johnson didn’t want to win but rather Adams didn’t because Johnson was no where near enough to fix their defensive woes.

 

You guys misread this one. The issue was that Ryan Johnson was playing and Erik Johson was not.

"Adams also elected to keep rookie defenseman Ryan Johnson, even though Johnson looked overmatched and overwhelmed. Johnson began to receive ice time and opportunity over veteran Erik Johnson, a Stanley Cup champion who quickly became a respected team leader."

[thewookie1]

Just now, dudacek said:

 

 

You guys misread this one. The issue was that Ryan Johnson was playing and Erik Johson was not.

"Adams also elected to keep rookie defenseman Ryan Johnson, even though Johnson looked overmatched and overwhelmed. Johnson began to receive ice time and opportunity over veteran Erik Johnson, a Stanley Cup champion who quickly became a respected team leader."

Well that also makes sense; damn Johnson & Johnson confusion lol

[Thorny]

2 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but I wanted to make a comment about the 13 game losing streak.  A lot has been written about Adams's failure to do anything to try and course correct during the streak., and I certainly understand the sentiment. Adams has now said that if he could do it over again he would do something, like call up a player from Rochester or maybe a trade (qualified, as always, by: "But I don't want to do anything reactionary that hurts us down the line".).  I think this narrative that Adams should have done something and his begrudging acknowledgement of this, is letting Adams off the hook a bit. It suggests that Adams can learn from the mistake of letting things go south for too long before acting.  It's really missing the point.  THE POINT, is that in his 5th year as GM Adams iced a hockey team that was capable of losing 13 games in a row.  The fix for this catastrophic error was required in June and July of 2024, not at the 4 game point of the losing streak. Calling up Brett Murray or Ryan Johnson or Isaac Rosen, was not going to fix that mess. 

The tie in to the thread, is that it has always been the case that the players are aware of management's shortcomings. As much as we want to think that the players should just be professionals and suck it up and play to their highest levels, it's naive to think that the players' preparation, commitment, focus, and effort, won't be negatively impacted by having one of their hands tied figuratively behind their backs by bad management.

“Adams should have addressed the roster during the losing streak” is essentially a conversational short cut to “who is trading you a good player mid season? What could Adams have even done?” No thanks: you are right. The issue is that at that point the roster seriously needed addressing, just like the additions we gain by subtraction are the subtractions of Adams’ previous mistakes 

Even the things he does right are stacked upon the shoulders of previous failures 

[dudacek]

19 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but I wanted to make a comment about the 13 game losing streak.  A lot has been written about Adams's failure to do anything to try and course correct during the streak., and I certainly understand the sentiment. Adams has now said that if he could do it over again he would do something, like call up a player from Rochester or maybe a trade (qualified, as always, by: "But I don't want to do anything reactionary that hurts us down the line".).  I think this narrative that Adams should have done something and his begrudging acknowledgement of this, is letting Adams off the hook a bit. It suggests that Adams can learn from the mistake of letting things go south for too long before acting.  It's really missing the point.  THE POINT, is that in his 5th year as GM Adams iced a hockey team that was capable of losing 13 games in a row.  The fix for this catastrophic error was required in June and July of 2024, not at the 4 game point of the losing streak. Calling up Brett Murray or Ryan Johnson or Isaac Rosen, was not going to fix that mess. 

The tie in to the thread, is that it has always been the case that the players are aware of management's shortcomings. As much as we want to think that the players should just be professionals and suck it up and play to their highest levels, it's naive to think that the players' preparation, commitment, focus, and effort, won't be negatively impacted by having one of their hands tied figuratively behind their backs by bad management.

The bold is exactly the point.

All GMs make mistakes and most learn from them.They aren't judged on that, they are judged on the growth and direction of the franchise overall.

Adams was tasked to build a winning hockey team.

He was very clear on how he was going to do it, that it would take time, and how that time would result in a team set up for a decade of contention. He has failed to pull it off. That is what matters.

13 losses is not the symptom, its the result.

Edited 15 hours ago by dudacek

[Taro T]

3 minutes ago, Thorner said:

“Adams should have addressed the roster during the losing streak” is essentially a conversational short cut to “who is trading you a good player mid season? What could Adams have even done?” No thanks: you are right. The issue is that at that point the roster seriously needed addressing, just like the additions we gain by subtraction are the subtractions of Adams’ previous mistakes 

It's the wrong time to make a significant roster altering move, but bringing up an Amerk or making a change trading for a bottom sixer (or considering they were desperately missing their best player who isn't a F) or a 3rd pairing guy that brings that "new team bounce" and looks like worldbeater for a week before becoming what he really is could actually get them a couple of W's during that streak.  That would at minimum get them 2 more points, likely 4 more, and doesn't end up deflating them and possibly doesn't ruin the entire season.

It ISN'T a shortcut to "what could he have even done."  He could've done SOMETHING.

[Stoner]

Lindy's humour: you put shaving cream on Larry Playfair's hand while he sleeps, then tickle his nose.

@That Aud Smell

[Weave]

22 minutes ago, Stoner said:

Lindy's humour: you put shaving cream on Larry Playfair's hand while he sleeps, then tickle his nose.

@That Aud Smell

No, YOU put shaving cream on Larry’s hand and tickle his nose.

[MISabresFan]

23 hours ago, dudacek said:

Interesting follow-up piece by Lance Lysowski, who says there was a large disconnect between Ruff and the players in the 1st half of the season and internal griping about Adams dating back to the start of the previous season.

"And, according to multiple veteran players, the frustration of losing led to some griping over factors that were out of their control."

Players were griping about and second-guessing the defensive coverage and PP schemes in particular and not connecting with Lindy's sense of humour. They were also upset about and mocking of Adams' palm tree presser.

Dating back to the previous year, some loved Benson, but Adams' choice to keep him, Levi and Ryan Johnson in 2023 instead of acquiring veterans for those roles and using Erik Johnson more wasn't seen internally as being in line with wanting to win.

Lance says Adams focus changed in response — he pushed Granato to stop preaching patience and made the Byram, McLeod, Zucker and Ruff moves. The Cozens move was made to further shake the room. Ruff's connection with the players has improved over the course of the year and his influence with Terry has grown.

"New faces and different personalities will join the Sabres this summer. The defense needs upgrades. Dahlin and Thompson should be surrounded by more experienced leaders. Adams’ annual end-of-season meeting with Pegula will determine and finalize staff changes, one of which may include a new title for the embattled general manager.

The coach isn’t going anywhere, though, and the foundation of the roster will be the same. In some ways, the team’s culture will reset and must be earned again."

https://buffalonews.com/sports/professional/nhl/sabres/article_02242795-b912-4558-9618-34c8990e7ed0.html

those players should be released or traded.

 

[Pimlach]

9 minutes ago, MISabresFan said:

those players should be released or traded.

 

Or commended 

[R_Dudley]

1 hour ago, Stoner said:

Lindy's humour: you put shaving cream on Larry Playfair's hand while he sleeps, then tickle his nose.

@That Aud Smell

My experience of that play is using Webers horseradish mustard not shaving cream. That's a wake-up real fast.

[bob_sauve28]

20 hours ago, Pimlach said:

  All Adams brought in was Eric Johnson who was on his last legs    

He is still playing...in the playoffs for a good team. I don't get the complaint about him, he was a very solid player. 

I'm sure there is some wing-ding analytic saying he is weak in 2 on 2 situations away from the puck in high scoring situations, or something. But he is solid 

1 hour ago, Stoner said:

Lindy's humour: you put shaving cream on Larry Playfair's hand while he sleeps, then tickle his nose.

@That Aud Smell

That article, or what was posted, just came off as really strange. Just simple bi tc hing