Ruff and Adams end-of-season press conference: Saturday, April 19, 4:30pm

[Flashsabre]

Paul Hamilton mentions how much the Pegula’s love Forton. Oh Boy they are just going to reshuffle the deck and not cost Terry a dime.

[dudacek]

28 minutes ago, kas23 said:

I’ll be happy with Ruff going to POHO. All ACs gone or the decision of the next HC. And Kevyn donning the Sabretooth costume. 

Serious question: why do you want a 65-year-old coach who has won exactly 2 playoff series in the past 18 years and never worked in management to take over your hockey operations department?

[kas23]

1 minute ago, dudacek said:

Serious question: why do you want a 65-year-old coach who has won exactly 2 playoff series in the past 18 years and never worked in management to take over your hockey operations department?

I think he knows a lot about hockey and is well connected. Your stats provide good reason on why he shouldn’t remain as head coach. Is a winning record as a head coach a requirement to be POHO? I do believe he should also help name a GM with more knowledge as well. 

[PerreaultForever]

4 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

And the weird thing is... they had the veteran average-but-stable goalie this year. Reimer ended with .899 with the Sabres this year, the same as MA Fleury with the Wild. MAF played in 26 games with 22 starts at age 40. With those numbers, Fleury ended the season 14-9-1. Better team defense around him, yes. But .900 is average. The Sabres had exactly what they needed behind a young starter.

Then they did two things: 

1) Adams waived him, sacrificing 6 starts to two young goalies behind a shaky/learning defensive team.

2) Ruff didn't play him. I won't count November because they didn't get him back until later in the month. But Reimer had two starts in December and two more in January. That's it. Two starts in February, but it had the tournament break. Spread out the starts, don't waive him, and give him 30 starts to UPL's 52 and maybe keep the young guy sharper and structured.*

This season, they had the right plan and then Adams and Ruff both cast it aside to the detriment of the team.

 

*And before anyone yells that he stinks, in his November-January starts, Reimer was solid. 5 GA in a SO loss to Detroit was the poor game, and he got road starts at Vegas and at Edmonton in which he gave up 3 on 30 shots -- which is fine. Everything else was 2 GA or fewer -- enough to win.

That's fair but I wanted even more than Reimer. A lot of goalies have switched teams over Adams tenure. A lot. Some of them were given away for next to nothing. They might not all have worked out, but trying to get one that would is what you should have been doing. Look how Colorado makes moves even when they are already good. That's how a GM is supposed to work. Doing his job, constantly trying to be better rather than just "believing in this group". 

[dudacek]

6 minutes ago, kas23 said:

I think he knows a lot about hockey and is well connected. Your stats provide good reason on why he shouldn’t remain as head coach. Is a winning record as a head coach a requirement to be POHO? I do believe he should also help name a GM with more knowledge as well. 

Can’t argue with the first sentence, although I wonder how current his knowledge and connections are.

I think management experience should be a POHO requirement.

[Archie Lee]

3 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Serious question: why do you want a 65-year-old coach who has won exactly 2 playoff series in the past 18 years and never worked in management to take over your hockey operations department?

I have listened to multiple podcasts in the last few days, hosted by Buffalo media, and the deference paid to Ruff is really surprising to me. I get that he is a local legend and means a lot to the community, but nobody in the media seems to have noticed that Ruff has really not been a good head coach for a while now.  Yes, he has had a couple of amazing seasons (one in Dallas and one in NJ), but in both cases his teams regressed quickly and he was fired within a year.

The biggest frustration I have with the Ruff hiring/situation, is in how he continues to be presented and sold as the anti-Granato. Neither coaches a sound defensive structure, in my view. The players are taking a lot of heat for the team's defensive shortcomings, when I really don't think our coaches have positioned them to be successful.

 

 

[JohnC]

30 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I have listened to multiple podcasts in the last few days, hosted by Buffalo media, and the deference paid to Ruff is really surprising to me. I get that he is a local legend and means a lot to the community, but nobody in the media seems to have noticed that Ruff has really not been a good head coach for a while now.  Yes, he has had a couple of amazing seasons (one in Dallas and one in NJ), but in both cases his teams regressed quickly and he was fired within a year.

The biggest frustration I have with the Ruff hiring/situation, is in how he continues to be presented and sold as the anti-Granato. Neither coaches a sound defensive structure, in my view. The players are taking a lot of heat for the team's defensive shortcomings, when I really don't think our coaches have positioned them to be successful.

 

 

There is nothing mystical or innovative about coaching defensive structure. The concept/s is similar for most teams. The real issue is do you have the players (or enough of them) to play the harder and tougher brand of defense. The problem with the Sabres on the defensive end has more to do with roster construction and consistent goaltending. I'm not against upgrading the staff. But even with an upgraded staff you have to have the right mix of players to be able to execute the defensive plan. 

[kas23]

1 hour ago, Archie Lee said:

I have listened to multiple podcasts in the last few days, hosted by Buffalo media, and the deference paid to Ruff is really surprising to me. I get that he is a local legend and means a lot to the community, but nobody in the media seems to have noticed that Ruff has really not been a good head coach for a while now.  Yes, he has had a couple of amazing seasons (one in Dallas and one in NJ), but in both cases his teams regressed quickly and he was fired within a year.

The biggest frustration I have with the Ruff hiring/situation, is in how he continues to be presented and sold as the anti-Granato. Neither coaches a sound defensive structure, in my view. The players are taking a lot of heat for the team's defensive shortcomings, when I really don't think our coaches have positioned them to be successful.

 

 

Maybe this is because Ruff being handed the keys is the most likely thing that will happen. Pegula isn’t going to can the whole front office and bring in some strangers, no matter how well-regarded they are. He abandoned that strategy a while ago. Trust is above competence. 
 

That said, while I don’t think Ruff knows how to coach them to be better, it would be astonishing if he didn’t know what the problems are. I don’t see a POHO as one who is dealing with the day to day management of the team, a GM does that. Although they may have veto power, I see Ruff as more of an advisor. I would rather him have this role given Terry has held this role since forever. 

[LGR4GM]

If your GM needed a POHO, your gm is *****. 

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

If your GM needed a POHO, your gm is *****. 

Who has the last say on personnel decisions? The GM or POHO?

[Taro T]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

Can’t argue with the first sentence, although I wonder how current his knowledge and connections are.

I think management experience should be a POHO requirement.

Personally see the PoHO role as far more of a schmoozer than actually determining who is going to be on the ice.  Ruff has ties to Hockey Canada so he's one of the insiders.  Could Bettman possibly still be mad about Ruff's calling him out on No Goal?  If not, could see it being a net positive having him in that role when the top brass get together and could see him getting involved on leaguewide competition committee at the ownership/operations level.  Keeping owners out of the GM's hair on a day to day basis.  Reining in the worst impulses of both ownerhsip and the GM.  And helping to sell suites and convincing whatever local state power brokers that'd get involved in allowing the Sabres to mess up the MMArena even more than it currently is.  (Some of the ideas on how to renovate the barn were whacked and personally can't see them working in this market.  But we shall see.)

And, yeah, until he came back to Buffalo, never saw him in that sort of a role.  Saw him as more of an advisor to whomever was running the hockey department rather than being the ostensible boss.  Darn shame they never reached out to Dudley back when the new owners took over.  Alas, not meant to be.

4 hours ago, JohnC said:

Who has the last say on personnel decisions? The GM or POHO?

Neither.  The owner.  But, when there's a united front and a compelling reason why the pocketbook should be opened ...

[kas23]

4 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

If your GM needed a POHO, your gm is *****. 

And yet we haven’t had one in 14 years and our GMs have been *****. I don’t see GMs under a POHO as *****, just lacking experience. It’s a mentoring relationship - most successful people have had a great mentor. It’s either that or you hire the guy once he has bounced around the league a bit and has learned (or not) from his mistakes.

 

Call it Senior Advisor or POHO. Same thing. The ***** GM of the Panthers has this guy:

 

https://www.nhl.com/panthers/info/rick-dudley

Edited 11 hours ago by kas23

[Pimlach]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

Can’t argue with the first sentence, although I wonder how current his knowledge and connections are.

I think management experience should be a POHO requirement.

An executive that has actually been a leader and knows many phases of the business?   Great idea! 

[Archie Lee]

5 hours ago, JohnC said:

There is nothing mystical or innovative about coaching defensive structure. The concept/s is similar for most teams. The real issue is do you have the players (or enough of them) to play the harder and tougher brand of defense. The problem with the Sabres on the defensive end has more to do with roster construction and consistent goaltending. I'm not against upgrading the staff. But even with an upgraded staff you have to have the right mix of players to be able to execute the defensive plan. 

I agree that the player mix needs to be better. But also, and I don’t think it should need to be said, some coaches are better than others. 

[dudacek]

I was expecting see and hear a lot more on conditioning here after reading this site the past few days.

Certainly not getting the vibe that they're leaning in to that as an excuse. Dahlin's comment made it seem like it was a point of emphasis in terms of a way the players can get better, but it wasn't a point of emphasis here.

I saw a GM who looked bruised and uncertain. He looks like a guy who feels something hanging over his head. He's expecting to be pushed — either into some moves that he may not want to do, or simply aside.

I did hear confirmation that 'culture' is the buzzword for puck management and game management, and got a sense that any moves they make will be made with that in mind. That fits with Cozens for Norris, and to a lesser extent Joki for Docker.

The problem, as they've identified it is "hero ball" and "stat-padding": players making high-risk plays when they are up because they want to go Globetrotters, or when they're down because they want to score now. And I got the sense they blame the defence most.

That's why I would suspect the next guys to go will be Byram and Samuelsson despite the positive words said about them.I didn't hear the gushing or absolute faith Adams gets when he's touting his guys. (It was still there for Levi). It's pretty easy to read Mule instead of Byram with Dahlin as a deliberate choice for GM reasons, rather than coach reasons.  Clifton fits as well, as do Quinn and Peterka up-front.

Not sure they were being transparent about UPL though. I got a similar vibe as when Adams talked about Mittelstadt: "We have faith in this player and are not shopping him (but would have no problem moving him if we get the right offer.)

I do think they were sincere about Kulich, and are OK with him and McLeod as their middle Cs, behind Norris, with Tage as their ace in the hole, with the caveat of "depending on what else happens in the top 6.

Edited 11 hours ago by dudacek

[sabremike]

When you are the single worst organization in the entire history of your sport doing nothing but hiring from within is a mind-blowingly stupid idea.

[Taro T]

58 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I was expecting see and hear a lot more on conditioning here after reading this site the past few days.

Certainly not getting the vibe that they're leaning in to that as an excuse. Dahlin's comment made it seem like it was a point of emphasis in terms of a way the players can get better, but it wasn't a point of emphasis here.

I saw a GM who looked bruised and uncertain. He looks like a guy who feels something hanging over his head. He's expecting to be pushed — either into some moves that he may not want to do, or simply aside.

I did hear confirmation that 'culture' is the buzzword for puck management and game management, and got a sense that any moves they make will be made with that in mind. That fits with Cozens for Norris, and to a lesser extent Joki for Docker.

The problem, as they've identified it is "hero ball" and "stat-padding": players making high-risk plays when they are up because they want to go Globetrotters, or when they're down because they want to score now. And I got the sense they blame the defence most.

That's why I would suspect the next guys to go will be Byram and Samuelsson despite the positive words said about them.I didn't hear the gushing or absolute faith Adams gets when he's touting his guys. (It was still there for Levi). It's pretty easy to read Mule instead of Byram with Dahlin as a deliberate choice for GM reasons, rather than coach reasons.  Clifton fits as well, as do Quinn and Peterka up-front.

Not sure they were being transparent about UPL though. I got a similar vibe as when Adams talked about Mittelstadt: "We have faith in this player and are not shopping him (but would have no problem moving him if we get the right offer.)

I do think they were sincere about Kulich, and are OK with him and McLeod as their middle Cs, behind Norris, with Tage as their ace in the hole, with the caveat of "depending on what else happens in the top 6.

At the B&GI's back 6 or so weeks ago, Ruff said, what at the time seemed to be a very controversial statement - that several players were not the level of conditioning that he'd expected them to be and that it was a major problem and this coming off-season the Sabres were going to work more closely with individual player's off-season trainers to make sure young guys were developing the way they should.

And personally read that comment as not just an indictment of the players but the staff here - how could they have no idea that the players weren't going to be where they expected them to be.

Seeing "conditioning" being the buzzword du jour coming back, figured that Ruff must've made a comment to that effect elsewhere.

The other thing that was beyond frustrating to hear on that evening was Ruff actually defended that stupid dropback pass they use to enter the zone on the PP.  "We're actually in the top 3 in zone entries; the problem is we don't maintain that control."  Well, if you don't maintain that control because not one single player other than the guy who carried the puck in has ANY speed at all as the other 4 players are all within 10' of the blue line as he's finally carrying the puck not just over the red line, but the blue line as well; then MAYBE just MAYBE you aren't ACTUALLY top 3 on entries and you should do something different.  Yes, most all teams drop the puck back (on rare occassions significantly back, but that is on RARE occassions), but they typically drop it about 12' back, not 80' back, and it gives then 4 players coming in with pace (2 REALLY flying) and the puck carrier has several option upon crossing the red line - he can dump it to a corner, he can work a give and go with any of 3 teammates, he can skate it in himself, or he can pass it to the guy flying up with him who now has the same options he had just had prior to passing it.

The other thing that was interesting about that night is, the questions for the most part were more pointed than the ones that the media asked at the end of season press conference.  Didn't submit a Q myself as didn't expect they'd take "hard" questions via presubmission, and couldn't come up with anything to ask that they'd've wanted to answer.  But they in fact did take hard Q's.  Adams pretty well punted them but Ruff seemed very honest.  When he was asked what he could've done better/different during the losing streak; he said that whenever you get into that situation (losing that many in a row) you pretty much always fire the coach.

He also talked a fair amount about getting more veterans into the lineup.  Really do expect to see them not be the youngest roster in the league this coming year.

[JohnC]

9 hours ago, Archie Lee said:

I agree that the player mix needs to be better. But also, and I don’t think it should need to be said, some coaches are better than others. 

The bigger issue for me isn’t whether the assistant coaches are good or bad (which may or not be the case) but rather are the coaches the HC wants to work with. My understanding is that because some of his coaches were under-contract the HC had to keep them on because the owner didn’t want to buy out the contracts. If that is the case, then it’s another example among many examples why this franchise is such a shabby organization.

[Flashsabre]

7 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The bigger issue for me isn’t whether the assistant coaches are good or bad (which may or not be the case) but rather are the coaches the HC wants to work with. My understanding is that because some of his coaches were under-contract the HC had to keep them on because the owner didn’t want to buy out the contracts. If that is the case, then it’s another example among many examples why this franchise is such a shabby organization.

That’s exactly what is was. Adams lies everytime he states there are no financial restraints on him.

Ruff was brought in but had to keep the entire coaching staff including bringing Appert up from Rochester who was already under contract.

Couple that with not spending to the cap or using any cap space to broker deals and gain assets and it is clear.

Edited 1 hour ago by Flashsabre

[LGR4GM]

17 hours ago, dudacek said:

Serious question: why do you want a 65-year-old coach who has won exactly 2 playoff series in the past 18 years and never worked in management to take over your hockey operations department?

[GASabresIUFAN]

20 hours ago, Pimlach said:

The contrast has been stark and obvious for a long time

The question is why hasn’t he seen for the last 5 years?

[GASabresIUFAN]

10 hours ago, sabremike said:

When you are the single worst organization in the entire history of your sport doing nothing but hiring from within is a mind-blowingly stupid idea.

Can’t argue with that.

[JohnC]

17 hours ago, dudacek said:

Serious question: why do you want a 65-year-old coach who has won exactly 2 playoff series in the past 18 years and never worked in management to take over your hockey operations department?

An intelligently run operation would have serious search efforts for top level jobs. Not this shambolic organization. Acting on an owner's whim instead of serious analysis is the standard operating procedure. It's done in this superficial and self-sabotaging way because that's how the owner wants it done. When you own the toy and you desire to play with it, then you do so.  

[GASabresIUFAN]

17 hours ago, dudacek said:

Serious question: why do you want a 65-year-old coach who has won exactly 2 playoff series in the past 18 years and never worked in management to take over your hockey operations department?

Isn’t that a better track record than an organization that hasn’t seen the playoffs in 14 years run by a former player who had no coaching or management experience before being tapped to run that hapless organization?

[LGR4GM]

8 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

The question is why hasn’t he seen for the last 5 years?

Beane can lead a horse to water, but he cant drown it.