OT: Erie County to allow control of Key Bank Center to revert to the City of Buffalo at the end of the current lease

[Brawndo]

 

[LGR4GM]

What does this mean for the team?

[HOUSE]

Cheap bastards

 

 

Edited April 8 by HOUSE

[PromoTheRobot]

40 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

What does this mean for the team?

Not sure.

31 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

Cheap bastards

 

 

Erie County is handing off the building just when it's going to need updating. 

[GoPuckYourself]

I say they allow all the citizens to purchase a share of it like they do with the Packers.

[Doohickie]

9 hours ago, GoPuckYourself said:

I say they allow all the citizens to purchase a share of it like they do with the Packers.

This is the arena, not the team.

[PromoTheRobot]

10 hours ago, GoPuckYourself said:

I say they allow all the citizens to purchase a share of it like they do with the Packers.

Oh that would work well 🙄

[Porous Five Hole]

This all comes down to if Terry wants the building or not. I don’t know the specifics of the lease and maintenance, but I did perk up last year when Terry footed the bill for a new roof and scoreboard when he didn’t own the building. 

This could be the first step toward Terry acquiring the arena for peanuts. And he might as well if he’s obligated to maintain the place. 

The reason why I’m not sure if Pegula wants the building is because deals like this are usually ironed out long before six months prior to the expiration of a 25 year lease. The article said the acting mayor was unaware this was coming…wtf?

How it could play out:

1) Erie County walks away.

2) The city, surprised & who did not budget for this while facing a 50 million dollar budget deficit, also walk away or put the building up for sale.

3) Pegula, who I believe already runs all events for the building, assumes ownership or purchases the building.

 

Any alternative to this would be unsettling to say the least. 

[PromoTheRobot]

3 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

This all comes down to if Terry wants the building or not. I don’t know the specifics of the lease and maintenance, but I did perk up last year when Terry footed the bill for a new roof and scoreboard when he didn’t own the building. 

This could be the first step toward Terry acquiring the arena for peanuts. And he might as well if he’s obligated to maintain the place. 

The reason why I’m not sure if Pegula wants the building is because deals like this are usually ironed out long before six months prior to the expiration of a 25 year lease. The article said the acting mayor was unaware this was coming…wtf?

How it could play out:

1) Erie County walks away.

2) The city, surprised & who did not budget for this while facing a 50 million dollar budget deficit, also walk away or put the building up for sale.

3) Pegula, who I believe already runs all events for the building, assumes ownership or purchases the building.

 

Any alternative to this would be unsettling to say the least. 

This is not the best time to assume ownership of an old arena. As we see with the new stadium, costs are ballooning. Even if they gave him the arena for free it might not be worth it. Not to mention losing a good number of Canadian visitors. Unsettling is a good word to use here.

Edited April 8 by PromoTheRobot

[LGR4GM]

Remember that time Terry Pegula, "self made" Billionaire, got 850million from the State/County for his new football stadium? Pepperidge Farms remembers. 

[That Aud Smell]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

This is not the best time to assume ownership of an old arena. As we see with the new stadium, costs are ballooning. Even if they gave him the arena for free it might not be worth it. Not to mention losing a good number of Canadian visitors. Unsettling is a good word to use here.

Yeah - "not great, Bob."

Has anyone posted here that Tweet about how weirdly anemic the demand is for tickets to the upcoming Leafs game?

If Canadians stay away because of America's federal policy of antagonism, the Sabres are gonna have a serious problem. (As will the Bills, for that matter.)

[Weave]

23 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

Yeah - "not great, Bob."

Has anyone posted here that Tweet about how weirdly anemic the demand is for tickets to the upcoming Leafs game?

If Canadians stay away because of America's federal policy of antagonism, the Sabres are gonna have a serious problem. (As will the Bills, for that matter.)

Yup. I was much less concerned that a sale of the team would result in a move before all of the recent nonsense started.  If ticket demand plummets, the team is gone.

[PromoTheRobot]

3 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

Yeah - "not great, Bob."

Has anyone posted here that Tweet about how weirdly anemic the demand is for tickets to the upcoming Leafs game?

If Canadians stay away because of America's federal policy of antagonism, the Sabres are gonna have a serious problem. (As will the Bills, for that matter.)

It hurts all Buffalo teams. But I think the Bills can survive a drop in Canadian fans. Games are weekly and fans can drive further. 

Let me take this to an extreme. What happens if foreign NHL (or any league) players start getting hassled at the US border? They are already giving artists on tour a hard time.

Edited April 8 by PromoTheRobot

[Mango]

2 hours ago, Porous Five Hole said:

This all comes down to if Terry wants the building or not. I don’t know the specifics of the lease and maintenance, but I did perk up last year when Terry footed the bill for a new roof and scoreboard when he didn’t own the building. 

This could be the first step toward Terry acquiring the arena for peanuts. And he might as well if he’s obligated to maintain the place. 

The reason why I’m not sure if Pegula wants the building is because deals like this are usually ironed out long before six months prior to the expiration of a 25 year lease. The article said the acting mayor was unaware this was coming…wtf?

How it could play out:

1) Erie County walks away.

2) The city, surprised & who did not budget for this while facing a 50 million dollar budget deficit, also walk away or put the building up for sale.

3) Pegula, who I believe already runs all events for the building, assumes ownership or purchases the building.

 

Any alternative to this would be unsettling to say the least. 

To the underlined, this was in the lease and he was required to do so. 

I was shocked he let it go so long. There were reports the roof was leaking on the upper deck seats for years and the vendor recommended the scoreboard be replaced like 10 years ago. 

[MattPie]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

Yeah - "not great, Bob."

Has anyone posted here that Tweet about how weirdly anemic the demand is for tickets to the upcoming Leafs game?

If Canadians stay away because of America's federal policy of antagonism, the Sabres are gonna have a serious problem. (As will the Bills, for that matter.)

"If Canadians stay away"? They already are. We're booking vacation stuff out west and there are surprising amounts of discounts and stuff available. My parents mentioned that Florida has been quieter than normal this winter. They listen to Fox, so it's "because the Canadian dollar is down" and not "the seething hatred for the US government and border hassles".

[PromoTheRobot]

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Remember that time Terry Pegula, "self made" Billionaire, got 850million from the State/County for his new football stadium? Pepperidge Farms remembers. 

For a $1.4B stadium that now costs $2.2B and he's responsible for all overruns. I remember that part, too. The state's stake went from 61% to 38% and falling.

27 minutes ago, Mango said:

To the underlined, this was in the lease and he was required to do so. 

I was shocked he let it go so long. There were reports the roof was leaking on the upper deck seats for years and the vendor recommended the scoreboard be replaced like 10 years ago. 

COVID-19 might have had an impact.

[That Aud Smell]

2 hours ago, MattPie said:

"If Canadians stay away"? They already are. We're booking vacation stuff out west and there are surprising amounts of discounts and stuff available. 

Bro - the worst of this shiznit just started happening.

Don't make me cross the Peace Bridge and give you some what for.

No. Seriously. Don't make me cross that bridge.

I'm scared. Hold me.

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

For a $1.4B stadium that now costs $2.2B and he's responsible for all overruns. I remember that part, too. The state's stake went from 61% to 38% and falling.

Rumour has it that you need to provide a trigger warning before mentioning Ron Raccuia's name in front of T Pegs.

Edited April 8 by That Aud Smell

[Porous Five Hole]

4 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

This is not the best time to assume ownership of an old arena. As we see with the new stadium, costs are ballooning. Even if they gave him the arena for free it might not be worth it. Not to mention losing a good number of Canadian visitors. Unsettling is a good word to use here.

What’s interesting to me is while the county provides all of the services to support the arena (police, snow removal, utilities, etc), they collect county sales tax on all things Key Bank Center to offset. I don’t know the numbers, but tax on every penny spent in that building *probably* covers these expenses. That 4.75% adds up on every transaction.  
 

By walking away, Erie County is going to keep all of that tax revenue generated without any arena expenses.  The city will now have to budget for these ‘new to them’ costs without any sales tax benefit.
 

I think the County is doing the City dirty.   

Edited April 8 by Porous Five Hole
Typo

[LTS]

3 hours ago, Porous Five Hole said:

What’s interesting to me is while the county provides all of the services to support the arena (police, snow removal, utilities, etc), they collect county sales tax on all things Key Bank Center to offset. I don’t know the numbers, but tax on every penny spent in that building *probably* covers these expenses. That 4.75% adds up on every transaction.  
 

By walking away, Erie County is going to keep all of that tax revenue generated without any arena expenses.  The city will now have to budget for these ‘new to them’ costs without any sales tax benefit.
 

I think the County is doing the City dirty.   

Not that I pay attention to the politics in Erie County, but don't the mayor and county exec not get along so well?

Could the County be hosing the City so they would have no choice but then to offer up the building for sale?

Wouldn't be surprised if the person who was interested in purchasing it was already known to the County Exec.

Certainly going to be interesting and I bet more information will be dug up (or leaked, or faked).

[shrader]

9 hours ago, Weave said:

Yup. I was much less concerned that a sale of the team would result in a move before all of the recent nonsense started.  If ticket demand plummets, the team is gone.

Ticket demand plummeting? Would this be like a mountain climber falling after taking one step?

[Brawndo]

8 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

It hurts all Buffalo teams. But I think the Bills can survive a drop in Canadian fans. Games are weekly and fans can drive further. 

Let me take this to an extreme. What happens if foreign NHL (or any league) players start getting hassled at the US border? They are already giving artists on tour a hard time.

The World Cup in 2026 is being played in Canada, Mexico and the US, along with the 2028 Olympics in LA, what happens to the fans of those teams, especially the WC where teams will play in all three nations? 

[PromoTheRobot]

Just now, Brawndo said:

The World Cup in 2026 is being played in Canada, Mexico and the US, along with the 2028 Olympics in LA, what happens to the fans of those teams, especially the WC where teams will play in all three nations? 

I'm hoping for sanity to return, somewhat.

[LGR4GM]

26 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I'm hoping for sanity to return, somewhat.

[Goldseatsaud]

City is broke.  No maintenance from the city it’s yours Pegula

[Porous Five Hole]

4 hours ago, Goldseatsaud said:

City is broke.  No maintenance from the city it’s yours Pegula

And there is the rub.

If the county is walking away, it’s probably because they’re not making money. While we expect the billionaire owner to just spend whatever it takes to buy & improve the building, he’s still a business man. New expenses without new revenue streams.  

And everyone in Sabrehood seems to hate the guy for his failure in results. Totally valid! But we cannot just yell sell more tickets/be good because that won’t offset the purchase price and new recurring expenses.  The Sabres were losing money each year before this. Larry Quinn stated on After The Whistle this past week that the team wasn’t profitable even when there was a waiting list for season tickets. 
 

I’m still not panicking because TP cannot walk away from this because he owns the Bills. He cannot alienate Buffalo. But it’s still unsettling.