UPL is NOT an NHL goaltender

[LGR4GM]

14 hours ago, JoeSchmoe said:

This thread can easily be summarized.

Look at old man Reimer, and then look at UPL. One is an NHL goalie in the twilight of his career. One is not an NHL goalie.

One wins us games. One does not.

[Cranky old man]

On 3/23/2025 at 8:03 PM, The Jokeman said:

I'm not sure Risto or Zadorov have. 

The guys whose names are etched as part of three recent Stanley cup teams have done pretty well. Risto was on a bad team. Zadorov provided everything to his teams that we lack here in Buffalo—-nastiness and muscle. But we avoid those traits in players like wins in Sabre land. 

[matter2003]

On 3/22/2025 at 5:01 PM, mjd1001 said:

I think he has the talent to be an NHL goaltender.  

I think this year he is having a really bad year.  There are some that are saying he is being hung out by the team in front of him. There is SOME truth to that, but there are way too many times he needs to be making more saves.   Every goal is not black and white....there are some goals that even the best goalie in the world is not going to make a save on everytime....but they will make saves on them 50-60% of the time. UPL is making saves on seemingly 25% of those.  

I don't need him to make every save when a quality NHL shooter is one on one with him, but he certainly needs to make more than he currently is.

Goaltending, in particular UPL, to me is the 2nd biggest reason for this team being as low as they are in the standings (Behind the collective early/mid season play of Cozens/Quinn, and just ahead of the utter failure of the 4th line giving up so many goals when their only job is to NOT give up goals.)

I'm don't want him jettisoned from the team yet, but he needs to be better next year.

The only really good year he has was in a contract year which makes me wonder how focused he is day to day outside of when big time money is on the line. Wouldn't be the first athlete who way outperformed his career average in contract years.  Even with that very good year last year, his career save percentage is sub .900 which is abysmal for a starting goalie in today's NHL.

In fact, come to think of it, UPL only really seems to be prepared nightly when something is on the line for him.  His rookie year he put up really good stats similar to his contract year in a small sample size trying to earn a spot on the Sabres...same in his contract year. Seems like he slacks off and gets lazy and doesn't pay attention to details unless he has something at stake which isn't what you want from a pro athlete who should be constantly pushing themselves regardless.

Edited Tuesday at 08:56 PM by matter2003

[PromoTheRobot]

On 3/22/2025 at 5:01 PM, mjd1001 said:

I think he has the talent to be an NHL goaltender.  

I think this year he is having a really bad year.  There are some that are saying he is being hung out by the team in front of him. There is SOME truth to that, but there are way too many times he needs to be making more saves.   Every goal is not black and white....there are some goals that even the best goalie in the world is not going to make a save on everytime....but they will make saves on them 50-60% of the time. UPL is making saves on seemingly 25% of those.  

I don't need him to make every save when a quality NHL shooter is one on one with him, but he certainly needs to make more than he currently is.

Goaltending, in particular UPL, to me is the 2nd biggest reason for this team being as low as they are in the standings (Behind the collective early/mid season play of Cozens/Quinn, and just ahead of the utter failure of the 4th line giving up so many goals when their only job is to NOT give up goals.)

I'm don't want him jettisoned from the team yet, but he needs to be better next year.

We ruined UPL. He felt like he had to carry every game because his teammates couldn't stop a nosebleed. So that body discipline he was developing went right out the window, trying to do too much to stop the puck because he knew his guys weren't going to help.

[JohnC]

11 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

We ruined UPL. He felt like he had to carry every game because his teammates couldn't stop a nosebleed. So that body discipline he was developing went right out the window, trying to do too much to stop the puck because he knew his guys weren't going to help.

You have a keen eye in recognizing his lack of body discipline. However, his misplays are his misplays. Reimer is playing with the same team and is demonstrating body discipline even when frequently under siege. No more excuses for me. A generation of excuses is enough for me. 

[mjd1001]

13 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You have a keen eye in recognizing his lack of body discipline. However, his misplays are his misplays. Reimer is playing with the same team and is demonstrating body discipline even when frequently under siege. No more excuses for me. A generation of excuses is enough for me. 

 

26 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

We ruined UPL. He felt like he had to carry every game because his teammates couldn't stop a nosebleed. So that body discipline he was developing went right out the window, trying to do too much to stop the puck because he knew his guys weren't going to help.

Maybe the reason he is playing poorly is because he was trying to hard as you said above.  That may be true...but if it is...it still leads to him not being good enough.  You don't want it to happen again to another goalie, and it may not be UPL's fault..but he is playing so poortly it is currently an issue for this team.

A lot of the success last year was due to UPL's good play at the end of the season.  He was one of the top 5 goalies in the league the 2nd half of the season.

From Jan 1 last year until the end of the season, UPL had 4 shutouts, 25 games with a save percentage over .900 (including 9 games in a row at one point), and 19 games with a save percentage about .920.  And they weren't all easy games. 15 times he faced over 30 shots, a couple times over 40 shots. Only 2 times did he have a save percentage of .850 or less.  A 25 game to 2 game ratio in his favor of games with a saver percentage over .900 vs .850 or below.

This year since Jan 1, he has 1 shutout, only 8 games with a save percentage over .900,  and only 6 with a save percentage over .920.  10 games he has a save percentage below .850. A 8 game to 10 game ratio against him in terms of of games with a saver percentage over .900 vs .850 or below. 

Maybe the team plays differently in front of Reimer, but since Jan 1, Reimer has played in 8 games. 7 of those 8 he has a save percentage over .900. (and those games are among games against Edmonton, Carolina, Winnipeg, and Ottawa, and NONE of the bottom 5 teams in the league) 

For those saying UPL's failures this year are a result of how bad the team is in front of him....the numbers on Reimer aren't just with 1 or 2 games anymore...once you get to 8 games played, you have to wonder is it REALLY the team just sucking in front of UPL but not in front or Reimer? or is it actually UPL?

I don't want to get rid of UPL yet. We know he has it in him to potentially be a very good goaltender. It actually happened last year.  But he has been a major problem with this team this year. Get to the offseason. If you have a phantom injury let it heal. Get your head back on straight.  Because while I want him to probably be the starter next year, if he plays next year like he has this year, then there is a major issue.  Its not all on the team in front of him, most of his issues are his.

Edited Wednesday at 01:50 PM by mjd1001

[JohnC]

7 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

 

Maybe the reason he is playing poorly is because he was trying to hard as you said above.  That may be true...but if it is...it still leads to him not being good enough.  You don't want it to happen again to another goalie, and it may not be UPL's fault..but he is playing so poortly it is currently an issue for this team.

A lot of the success last year was due to UPL's good play at the end of the season.  He was one of the top 5 goalies in the league the 2nd half of the season.

From Jan 1 last year until the end of the season, UPL had 4 shutouts, 25 games with a save percentage over .900 (including 9 games in a row at one point), and 19 games with a save percentage about .920.  And they weren't all easy games. 15 times he faced over 30 shots, a couple times over 40 shots. Only 2 times did he have a save percentage of .850 or less.  A 25 game to 2 game ratio in his favor of games with a saver percentage over .900 vs .850 or below.

This year since Jan 1, he has 1 shutout, only 8 games with a save percentage over .900,  and only 6 with a save percentage over .920.  10 games he has a save percentage below .850. A 8 game to 10 game ratio against him in terms of of games with a saver percentage over .900 vs .850 or below. 

Maybe the team plays differently in front of Reimer, but since Jan 1, Reimer has played in 8 games. 7 of those 8 he has a save percentage over .900. (and those games are among games against Edmonton, Carolina, Winnipeg, and Ottawa, and NONE of the bottom 5 teams in the league) 

For those saying UPL's failures this year are a result of how bad the team is in front of him....the numbers on Reimer aren't just with 1 or 2 games anymore...once you get to 8 games played, you have to wonder is it REALLY the team just sucking in front of UPL but not in front or Reimer? or is it actually UPL?

I don't want to get rid of UPL yet. We know he has it in him to potentially be a very good goaltender. It actually happened last year.  But he has been a major problem with this team this year. Get to the offseason. If you have a phantom injury let it heal. Get your head back on straight.  Because while I want him to probably be the starter next year, if he plays next year like he has this year, then there is a major issue.  Its not all on the team in front of him, most of his issues are his.

Stating the obvious: Good goaltending is team transformative. Last night was an example of that. I thought overall that Ottawa was the better team. I'm not saying that the Sabres played poorly because that wasn't the case. But if you take this game as an example of good goaltending, and you apply it to the season, the record is dramatically much better.  

The Washington Capitals acquired both Logan Thompson and Charlie Lindgren on the cheap. Their netminding has been stellar. That's an example of good GM work. Our GM is being outclassed, and the spillover is evident in the standings. 

[mjd1001]

On 3/26/2025 at 10:02 AM, JohnC said:

Stating the obvious: Good goaltending is team transformative. Last night was an example of that. I thought overall that Ottawa was the better team. I'm not saying that the Sabres played poorly because that wasn't the case. But if you take this game as an example of good goaltending, and you apply it to the season, the record is dramatically much better.  

The Washington Capitals acquired both Logan Thompson and Charlie Lindgren on the cheap. Their netminding has been stellar. That's an example of good GM work. Our GM is being outclassed, and the spillover is evident in the standings. 

I can't blame Adams for giving UPL the contract last year. I know some didn't want it, but based on how he played, his age, his pedigree...I would have done the same thing.   

Going into this season with UPL as the starter, Levi a full year in Rochester, and Reimer as the backup actually was a good plan to me and probably exactly what I would have done.  I just don't think many expected UPL's play to drop off SO much from last year.   Yeah, he was a top 5 goalie in the league the 2nd half of last year...maybe you didn't expect THAT to continue, but I certainly did not expect his play to drop off so much.

Edited 9 hours ago by mjd1001

[JohnC]

19 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

I can't blame Adams for giving UPL the contract last year. I know some didn't want it, but based on how he played, his age, his pedigree...I would have done the same thing.   

Going into this season with UPL as the starter, Levi a full year in Rochester, and Reimer as the backup actually was a good plan to me and probably exactly what I would have done.  I just dont' think anyone expected UPL's play to drop off SO much from last year.   Yeah, he was a top 5 goalie in the league the 2nd half of last year...maybe you didn't expect THAT to continue, but I certainly did not expect his play to drop off so much.

I'm not questioning the contract given to UPL. However, that doesn't mean that his declining performance shouldn't be acknowledged. (As you also point out.) Goaltending is a challenge to evaluate. One year, a goalie plays at an elite level, and then the next year the performance plummets. It's one of the most mercurial positions in all of sports. 

Las Vegas has gone through a series of goaltenders and felt that Logan Thompson was expendable. The Capitals acquired him for next to nothing. This year he has been stellar and is a main factor for his new team's impressive success. This is an example of good GM assessment and judgment. That's why the Capitals are where they are, and the Sabres are where they are. Stating the obvious, a good GM makes a difference. 

[K-9]

UPL is a 25-30 game backup NHL goalie. He is capable of hot streaks but also capable of cold streaks. He lacks stamina to be a full time starter and I attribute his poor mechanics on fatigue due to overuse. 

This idea that he is simply a victim of the poor play in front of him is just an excuse. Yes, the play in front of him outright sucks and we need better players, but two things can be true at once: our defensive play sucks and UPL isn’t good enough, either. Just not enough key saves vs. wide open looks at opposing shooters. And his lateral movement is a liability as well.

We need a bonafide NHL starter between the pipes and Levi ain’t ready yet and needs another full year in the A, imo. 
 

 

[Ross Rhea]

If the guy makes 3 more saves per 100 shots he is about .915 sv % and about 2.40 GAA.

Tells me he isnt too far off the top goalies yet he hasnt been nearly good enough, the difference is tiny yet huge.

[EM88]

1 minute ago, Ross Rhea said:

If the guy makes 3 more saves per 100 shots he is about .915 sv % and about 2.40 GAA.

Tells me he isnt too far off the top goalies yet he hasnt been nearly good enough, the difference is tiny yet huge.

3 more saves per 100 is a lot.  3 saves per 100 may not seem like much when stated that way, but that would be enough to take a league average starter and make him a vezina winner.

[WhenWillItEnd66]

Unfortunately UPL is not going anywhere. He is looking like a backup though, not a starter

[DarthEbriate]

48 minutes ago, EM88 said:

3 more saves per 100 is a lot.  3 saves per 100 may not seem like much when stated that way, but that would be enough to take a league average starter and make him a vezina winner.

Absolutely. That's basically 1 goal per game.

If the Sabres were 1 goal/game better defensively, they'd have the second-best defense in the league with 176 GA (4 more than Winnipeg) and an overall +44 goal differential (sixth in the League).

[Drag0nDan]

On 3/26/2025 at 9:44 AM, mjd1001 said:

 

Maybe the reason he is playing poorly is because he was trying to hard as you said above.  That may be true...but if it is...it still leads to him not being good enough.  You don't want it to happen again to another goalie, and it may not be UPL's fault..but he is playing so poortly it is currently an issue for this team.

A lot of the success last year was due to UPL's good play at the end of the season.  He was one of the top 5 goalies in the league the 2nd half of the season.

From Jan 1 last year until the end of the season, UPL had 4 shutouts, 25 games with a save percentage over .900 (including 9 games in a row at one point), and 19 games with a save percentage about .920.  And they weren't all easy games. 15 times he faced over 30 shots, a couple times over 40 shots. Only 2 times did he have a save percentage of .850 or less.  A 25 game to 2 game ratio in his favor of games with a saver percentage over .900 vs .850 or below.

This year since Jan 1, he has 1 shutout, only 8 games with a save percentage over .900,  and only 6 with a save percentage over .920.  10 games he has a save percentage below .850. A 8 game to 10 game ratio against him in terms of of games with a saver percentage over .900 vs .850 or below. 

Maybe the team plays differently in front of Reimer, but since Jan 1, Reimer has played in 8 games. 7 of those 8 he has a save percentage over .900. (and those games are among games against Edmonton, Carolina, Winnipeg, and Ottawa, and NONE of the bottom 5 teams in the league) 

For those saying UPL's failures this year are a result of how bad the team is in front of him....the numbers on Reimer aren't just with 1 or 2 games anymore...once you get to 8 games played, you have to wonder is it REALLY the team just sucking in front of UPL but not in front or Reimer? or is it actually UPL?

I don't want to get rid of UPL yet. We know he has it in him to potentially be a very good goaltender. It actually happened last year.  But he has been a major problem with this team this year. Get to the offseason. If you have a phantom injury let it heal. Get your head back on straight.  Because while I want him to probably be the starter next year, if he plays next year like he has this year, then there is a major issue.  Its not all on the team in front of him, most of his issues are his.

We also lost 14 straight games and he was in for... a lot of them.  The team has certainly not helped him on goals this year, but he has been a hectic mess back there.  Rebound control, Angles, puck tracking, etc.  All of it is messy.  

It's his net to lose for next year, and he's currently in the process of losing it.  Outside of one strong stretch, the guy has not performed well really at any level here including the AHL.

[mansquito]

On 3/22/2025 at 4:56 PM, mansquito said:

Discussion; some of his flaws should have been fixed by the goaltending coach at this point in his career. He comes out of the net and often can't find his way back. Leaving an empty net. His numbers tell the story, and most of the goals he let's in a competent NHL goalie would save. Whether it's mental or lack of talent, He should have been put on waivers. No one picking him up would tell the real story of how others view his play.

To further the discussion...

https://x.com/Mike_Bundt/status/1904931088679465394