GDT:Sabres at Panthers 3/8/25 6pm MSG, WGR550

[Rasmus_]

Just more of the same.  This team is brittle, broken and soft.  Not skilled enough to be a finesse team and no where near physical enough.  Go Sabres.

[Archie Lee]

8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Norris looked flat and miserable. Reminded me a lot of Quinn. 

Rosen isn't an NHL player.

The tough guy was alright but he looked slow. I'd keep him around though. We need one. If he's the best we got so be it. 

I thought that pretty much everyone, both teams, looked flat. There were even a couple of times where a Sabre half did something that would normally have set Bennett off and Bennett just seemed to shrug and skate away. It was an example of two teams who knew the likely outcome in advance and decided, for the most part, to just get through the game without anyone getting hurt. The exception was the 4th line types (Greer/Dunne) who can’t afford to take a night off. Kinda sad to watch. 
 

 

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, Pimlach said:

And do what?  Move them to Houston? 

He could try to "influence" the silent owner to bring in experienced NHL hockey people to analyze his failed organization and give him some outside advice as to how to better restructure and re-staff this failed franchise. When your franchise has become the most mocked and player scorned franchise in the league, there has to be a realization that how you as an owner has operated has hideously failed. Stumbling is part of the cyclical business. However, stumbling for almost a full generation is outside the normal. The league certainly has a stake in reviving a comatose franchise. 

[LGR4GM]

4 minutes ago, JohnC said:

He could try to "influence" the silent owner to bring in experienced NHL hockey people to analyze his failed organization and give him some outside advice as to how to better restructure and re-staff this failed franchise. When your franchise has become the most mocked and player scorned franchise in the league, there has to be a realization that how you as an owner has operated has hideously failed. Stumbling is part of the cyclical business. However, stumbling for almost a full generation is outside the normal. The league certainly has a stake in reviving a comatose franchise. 

Billionaires do not recognize their failures and society doesn't ask them to or force them to. Terry has no concept of it being his fault. 

When someone that rich fails, they just move on. 

Edited 12 hours ago by LGR4GM

[JohnC]

6 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Billionaires do not recognize their failures and society doesn't ask them to or force them to. Terry has no concept of it being his fault. 

When someone that rich fails, they just move on. 

No one can force him to do anything. But even a silent billionaire recognizes the difference between success and failure. He can't fake his record in a business that keeps score with wins and losses as the metric. Even Terry P. recognizes that. Is this stubborn guy receptive to outside advice? So far, he has not. However, the hope, fanciful as it may be, he has to come to the realization that what he did with the Bills and Bandits, having knowledgeable people run your sports franchises is the better route to take from a competitive and financial standpoint. 

[Pimlach]

4 minutes ago, JohnC said:

He could try to "influence" the silent owner to bring in experienced NHL hockey people to analyze his failed organization and give him some outside advice as to how to better restructure and re-staff this failed franchise. When your franchise has become the most mocked and player scorned franchise in the league, there has to be a realization that how you as an owner has operated has hideously failed. Stumbling is part of the cyclical business. However, stumbling for almost a full generation is outside the normal. The league certainly has a stake in reviving a comatose franchise. 

Sure. Bettman can try.  He probably cannot make Terry increase his payroll or operating costs, and the “experienced NHL hockey people  doing the analysis and providing outside advice” would have to be paid by the league.  And then what about their access to the team and the teams processes?   And who will listen to their findings?   Is Terry even obligated to make changes based on the findings?  Probably not.  

I consult to Program Management Executives in the Aerospace and Defense business, providing independent analysis to my customers.  I can tell you that without the backing at the top level, and a willingness to fix problems and make change, my work can be a waste of money.  

Terry can hire his own outside consulting, and maybe supplement them with league staffers, but he has to want it, pay for it, and be willing to listen.  
 

 

[JohnC]

Just now, Pimlach said:

Sure. Bettman can try.  He probably cannot make Terry increase his payroll or operating costs, and the “experienced NHL hockey people  doing the analysis and providing outside advice” would have to be paid by the league.  And then what about their access to the team and the teams processes?   And who will listen to their findings?   Is Terry even obligated to make changes based on the findings?  Probably not.  

I consult to Program Management Executives in the Aerospace and Defense business, providing independent analysis to my customers.  I can tell you that without the backing at the top level, and a willingness to fix problems and make change, my work can be a waste of money.  

Terry can hire his own outside consulting, and maybe supplement them with league staffers, but he has to want it, pay for it, and be willing to listen.  
 

 

Even without a "formal" consulting process the stubborn owner has the ability to talk to a myriad number of people in the hockey business and get some advice. It's not a secret that the owner has made some "mystifying" hires whose primary appeal is that they would bend a knee to his whims. Your last sentence in your post captures the essence of the problem: His willingness to do so and listen. So far, he has walled himself off to the outside. So, we get what we get, and continue to get what we got. I'm so tired of this stubborn owner who lacks the self-awareness of recognizing his glaring deficiencies. This is such a ridiculous situation!

[Cascade Youth]

10 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Sure. Bettman can try.  He probably cannot make Terry increase his payroll or operating costs, and the “experienced NHL hockey people  doing the analysis and providing outside advice” would have to be paid by the league.  And then what about their access to the team and the teams processes?   And who will listen to their findings?   Is Terry even obligated to make changes based on the findings?  Probably not.  

I consult to Program Management Executives in the Aerospace and Defense business, providing independent analysis to my customers.  I can tell you that without the backing at the top level, and a willingness to fix problems and make change, my work can be a waste of money.  

Terry can hire his own outside consulting, and maybe supplement them with league staffers, but he has to want it, pay for it, and be willing to listen.  
 

 

All of this is true but sports leagues are somewhat different.  They are closely-held oligarchies whose members rely on each other in a myriad of ways.  Yes some of them can be impervious to peer pressure but it tends to not work out too well in the long run.  Dan Snyder being the most recent example but there have been several instances in the NBA where owners have pressured other owners to make changes and even forced buyouts.  The league suffers if a hockey market like Buffalo fails - and that is not an unlikely scenario at this point given brand value, fan apathy, a rising salary cap and a fragile local economy.

Edited 11 hours ago by Cascade Youth

[CallawaySabres]

Nashville won. Come Buffalo, you can get 2 losing streaks of 10 or more in Same season, I know you can!

[JohnC]

11 minutes ago, Cascade Youth said:

All of this is true but sports leagues are somewhat different.  They are closely-held oligarchies whose members rely on each other in a myriad of ways.  Yes some of them can be impervious to peer pressure but it tends to not work out too well in the long run.  Dan Snyder being the most recent example but there have been several instances in the NBA where owners have pressured other owners to make changes and even forced buyouts.  The league suffers if a hockey market like Buffalo fails - and that is not an unlikely scenario at this point given brand value, fan apathy, a rising salary cap and a fragile local economy.

When Dan Snyder was "essentially" forced out as an owner and replaced by a new owner, the once moribund franchise was quickly revived. One of the first things the new owner did was form a committee made up of football and people from other lines of businesses to analyze the former contaminated organization. It resulted in restructuring the organization and providing a legitimate staffing search to restaff the organization. The revival was stunningly quick. 

Terry Pegula has become Buffalo's version of Dan Snyder, without the sleaze. He looked at the franchise as his toy to tinker with. Just as the Snyder owned franchise was a mocked and scorned franchise, so has the Pegula owned franchise become a mocked and scorned franchise. The Sabres have become the model of what not to do when managing a franchise. It's so sad and maddening.  

[PromoTheRobot]

So I get home after the HS basketball game. (Far more entertaining contest. That link I posted will play the game on demand.) I put ESPN+ on and start watching. 

So we are losing, right? But I notice that the end of the replay is still quite far away. Now ESPN+ Sabres broadcasts end right when the games end. So I'm thinking "the Sabres must have gotten this to overtime."

More and more time goes by, later and later into the 3rd and I'm still expecting this Sabres goal explosion that puts the game into OT.

Game ends, Sabres lose, turns out ESPN+ decided to show the Sabres postgame with Duffer & Marty. 😂 Lol, they fooled me.

[PromoTheRobot]

13 minutes ago, JohnC said:

When Dan Snyder was "essentially" forced out as an owner and replaced by a new owner, the once moribund franchise was quickly revived. One of the first things the new owner did was form a committee made up of football and people from other lines of businesses to analyze the former contaminated organization. It resulted in restructuring the organization and providing a legitimate staffing search to restaff the organization. The revival was stunningly quick. 

Terry Pegula has become Buffalo's version of Dan Snyder, without the sleaze. He looked at the franchise as his toy to tinker with. Just as the Snyder owned franchise was a mocked and scorned franchise, so has the Pegula owned franchise become a mocked and scorned franchise. The Sabres have become the model of what not to do when managing a franchise. It's so sad and maddening.  

Except Dan Snyder didn't own 3 other very successful franchises. You'd have a very hard time convincing someone who isn't emotionally invested in the Sabres that he's another Dan Snyder or even Alex Meruelo.

And again, no one is buying the Sabres to keep them in Buffalo. There are too many larger cities lusting for an NHL team to think someone with a billion dollars to burn wants to keep a team in a city that is too small and too poor to support even one pro team.

Plus, this said magical new owner still wouldn't turn the fortunes of the Sabres around quickly enough to make fans happy and get them to show up.

It's worth noting if things start getting weird for Canadians crossing the border, the Sabres might be toast anyway. They can't afford to lose a third of their fan base.

 

Edited 11 hours ago by PromoTheRobot

[JohnC]

12 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Except Dan Snyder didn't own 3 other very successful franchises. You'd have a very hard time convincing someone who isn't emotionally invested in the Sabres that he's another Dan Snyder or even Alex Meruelo.

You are not paying attention. Re-read what I actually said and not what you think I said. I acknowledged that TP has been successful with the Bills and Bandits. And I cited the primary reason is that he allowed competent people to manage the respective operations. That's the opposite of what he did with the Sabres. He inexplicably hired an ill-equipped and incompetent GM whose appeal was that he could restart another rebuild on the cheap and would be amenable to the owner's whims. Just as Dan Snyder was a failure as a football owner, Terry P is a failure of as a hockey owner. Isn't a generation of failure enough proof for you to recognize the stupendous incompetence of this silent hockey owner.  

Edited 10 hours ago by JohnC

[Believer]

2 minutes ago, Cascade Youth said:

All of this is true but sports leagues are somewhat different.  They are closely-held oligarchies whose members rely on each other in a myriad of ways.  Yes some of them can be impervious to peer pressure but it tends to not work out too well in the long run.  Dan Snyder being the most recent example but there have been several instances in the NBA where owners have pressured other owners and even forced buyouts.  The league suffers if a market like Buffalo fails - and that is not an unlikely scenario at this point given brand value, fan apathy, a rising salary cap and a fragile local economy.

It’s a small club of 32. All are billionaires.

Based on public information, Pegula is worth an estimated $6.7B ranking behind the owners of the Winnipeg Jets, LA Kings, Anaheim Ducks, Colorado Avalanche, San Jose Sharks, and NJ Devils at least. 

In any group there is a pecking order. So, on a net worth basis Pegula is around the top owners. He must get some ribbing from them about his team’s miserable record over soon 14 playoff-less seasons. Question is when does it turn to pressure to act or sell?

 

[DarthEbriate]

The one clear takeaway from this game: Florida is obviously peaking too soon. 1st round exit. It is their destiny.

Edited 10 hours ago by DarthEbriate

[PromoTheRobot]

19 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

The one clear takeaway from this game: Florida is obviously peaking too soon. 1st round exit. It is their destiny.

I thought Florida looked pretty flat. They could have destroyed the Sabres but kept screwing up plays to the net.

[Stoner]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

So I get home after the HS basketball game. (Far more entertaining contest. That link I posted will play the game on demand.) I put ESPN+ on and start watching. 

So we are losing, right? But I notice that the end of the replay is still quite far away. Now ESPN+ Sabres broadcasts end right when the games end. So I'm thinking "the Sabres must have gotten this to overtime."

More and more time goes by, later and later into the 3rd and I'm still expecting this Sabres goal explosion that puts the game into OT.

Game ends, Sabres lose, turns out ESPN+ decided to show the Sabres postgame with Duffer & Marty. 😂 Lol, they fooled me.

I do the same thing with the 10 minute ish highlight package. At a certain point you know the Sabres aren't getting this game to OT.

My overriding thought: just like when the Sabres are winning this time of year, out of the race, losing also doesn't matter.

It is Hockey Purgatory.

[HumanSlinky39]

Oilers up next. Yikes.

[PerreaultForever]

5 hours ago, Archie Lee said:

I thought that pretty much everyone, both teams, looked flat. There were even a couple of times where a Sabre half did something that would normally have set Bennett off and Bennett just seemed to shrug and skate away. It was an example of two teams who knew the likely outcome in advance and decided, for the most part, to just get through the game without anyone getting hurt. The exception was the 4th line types (Greer/Dunne) who can’t afford to take a night off. Kinda sad to watch. 
 

 

Well sure, Florida didn't give us their A game because they didn't have to. This is why we have had late season runs. Teams don't take us seriously at this point. Same every year. It fools some people, including management it seems.