Sabres Trade Dylan Cozens/Dennis Gilbert and 2026 2nd Round Pick to Ottawa for Josh Norris and Bernard Docker

[caseydean]

Just now, bob_sauve28 said:

How good or bad is Docker? 

 

St. Bernard? 

Hoping for the promise with a fresh start.  1st round pick, has not lived up to it so far.

[LGR4GM]

Pretty much everyone from the locker room to the fanbase loves Josh Norris. Like dude is considered a genuinely good human it seems.

[dudacek]

43 minutes ago, inkman said:

Why?  He’s been terrible for two straight seasons.  Every player on the Sabres roster was worse when Dylan is on the ice. 

I worry about Cozens’ upside and Norris’ injuries coming back to haunt us. I don’t think Docker is worth a 2nd any more than Malenstyn was. This seems like an iffy trade from an asset value point of view.

In terms of on-ice play this year, no player has hurt us as much as Cozens. I will be very sad if Norris isn’t an immediate improvement in the 2C role. Bernard-Docker appears to fill a need. In terms of getting better now, I see it.

47 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Meanwhile... this RHD with better analytics went for...

 

What am I missing here ^^^?

20 minutes ago, darksabre said:

Yup. It's fine. I think he's got the talent, and I think he's got the smarts, to keep developing. It's too bad they couldn't let him develop in the AHL, but that's the modern NHL.

He might be the only young player I like on this team, but I'm not going to argue that he deserves more ice time on a higher line right now.

Im not surprised I guess, and I love Benson, but people seem to ignore how little offence he generates. Traffic isn’t his issue at all. It’s open ice and his inability to utilize it to create and finish.

Edited Friday at 06:11 PM by dudacek

[mjd1001]

10 minutes ago, Hawerchuk said:

Where did you see/hear Tkachuk is upset about this trade?

"Yeah, it's pretty tough," Ottawa captain Brady Tkachuk said. "It [stinks] losing a guy like [Norris]. Obviously, everybody knows how much he means to me. Just spent the last little bit with him and I'll kind of take advantage of every minute for the rest of the day ... Tough practice today."

"It's the unfortunate reality of it being a business," Tkachuk said. "We're getting back important pieces that are really going to help us. I mean, it [stinks]. It's part of it, but with 'Cozy' and Gilbert, we're going to welcome them with open arms. I feel bad a little bit that this is the initial reaction and of course I think they're going to understand why it's a little bit of a whirlwind for me personally, but with that being said, it's all about being a good captain, being a good teammate and making sure that they have everything that they need and have the support right from Day 1. They're going to be important pieces to our team."

https://www.nhl.com/news/dylan-cozens-traded-to-ottawa-senators-by-buffalo-sabres-for-josh-norris

Edited Friday at 06:06 PM by mjd1001

[DarthEbriate]

Josh Norris is now the Sabres' highest-paid forward.

5 more years remaining on the contract and a modified 10-team No Trade Clause that kicks in for the final 4 years.

The shoulder is the primary concern. A thrice-bacta-tanked shoulder is not going to magically improve as he ages.

[Thorner]

Adams re-signed 2 players, and did a substantial core shakeup. Not only is he almost assuredly back next year, he might feel he’s almost done for the summer 

[Flashsabre]

I think this is the start of a bunch of moves. Maybe not today but this summer.  They need to overhaul this lineup, especially on the back end

[mjd1001]

Just now, Thorner said:

Adams re-signed 2 players, and did a substantial core shakeup. Not only is he almost assuredly back next year, he might feel he’s almost done for the summer 

 

Just now, Flashsabre said:

I think this is the start of a bunch of moves. Maybe not today but this summer.  They need to overhaul this lineup, especially on the back end

My head is spinning.

[Thorner]

1 minute ago, mjd1001 said:

 

My head is spinning.

Because I admitted he’s likely back? It’s hard to read it any other way 

I’ve never maintained he WILL get fired merely that should 

Edited Friday at 06:09 PM by Thorner

[Hawerchuk]

3 minutes ago, Flashsabre said:

TSN he was almost in tears trying to answer reporters about it

Ok, ok... I'm liking that. This could end up being an underrated trade. Keep going GMKA! More work to do.

[DarthEbriate]

1 minute ago, Thorner said:

Adams re-signed 2 players, and did a substantial core shakeup. Not only is he almost assuredly back next year, he might feel he’s almost done for the summer 

Enjoy those palm trees while in Florida, GM Sheevyn. You've earned it!

[HumanSlinky39]

4 minutes ago, caseydean said:

Life is a risk.  Could we get a rock solid superior player for Cozens?

Correct. And I'm not saying the trade was bad or shouldn't have been made. Just expressing my concern about the return. Could we have done better? I honestly don't know, but I suspect not much better. They're trading Cozens at a pretty low point, so probably not.

[mjd1001]

5 minutes ago, Thorner said:

Unrelated to the trade, but I never saw any of those movies until about 3 years ago...now I watch any of them whenever I come across them on TV.

[Thorner]

Just now, mjd1001 said:

Unrelated to the trade, but I never saw any of those movies until about 3 years ago...now I watch any of them whenever I come across them on TV.

The new one was so good, too 

[Brawndo]

4 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

"Yeah, it's pretty tough," Ottawa captain Brady Tkachuk said. "It [stinks] losing a guy like [Norris]. Obviously, everybody knows how much he means to me. Just spent the last little bit with him and I'll kind of take advantage of every minute for the rest of the day ... Tough practice today."

"It's the unfortunate reality of it being a business," Tkachuk said. "We're getting back important pieces that are really going to help us. I mean, it [stinks]. It's part of it, but with 'Cozy' and Gilbert, we're going to welcome them with open arms. I feel bad a little bit that this is the initial reaction and of course I think they're going to understand why it's a little bit of a whirlwind for me personally, but with that being said, it's all about being a good captain, being a good teammate and making sure that they have everything that they need and have the support right from Day 1. They're going to be important pieces to our team."

https://www.nhl.com/news/dylan-cozens-traded-to-ottawa-senators-by-buffalo-sabres-for-josh-norris

Here is the video link

 

 

[Mr. Allen]

If Norris can stay healthy I’ll really like this trade.  Maybe the 2nd was needed.  Whatever.  We’ve just done pretty well drafting early 2nd recently.  

[Drag0nDan]

Just now, Flashsabre said:

I think this is the start of a bunch of moves. Maybe not today but this summer.  They need to overhaul this lineup, especially on the back end

Jokiharju is a UFA so he's gone.  I'd be open to moving on from pretty much everyone but Dahlin.  Power's 22 so i'd also say its tough to give up on him - and elite puck movers are harder to come by.  Byram was the swap from mittelstadt but he's a RFA and definitely valuable to teams around the league.  If you can get out of samuelsson's contract, do it.  He's an absolute JAG and i see no reason to be committed to someone like him long-term.  Seen enough bryson, jokiharju and clifton too.  

Just now, HumanSlinky39 said:

Correct. And I'm not saying the trade was bad or shouldn't have been made. Just expressing my concern about the return. Could we have done better? I honestly don't know, but I suspect not much better. They're trading Cozens at a pretty low point, so probably not.

Scouts and GM's have watched him play enough to know... there's a reason he's available.  

[Flashsabre]

1 minute ago, Drag0nDan said:

Jokiharju is a UFA so he's gone.  I'd be open to moving on from pretty much everyone but Dahlin.  Power's 22 so i'd also say its tough to give up on him - and elite puck movers are harder to come by.  Byram was the swap from mittelstadt but he's a RFA and definitely valuable to teams around the league.  If you can get out of samuelsson's contract, do it.  He's an absolute JAG and i see no reason to be committed to someone like him long-term.  Seen enough bryson, jokiharju and clifton too.  

Yep keep Dahlin, reshape the rest of the corps

[Alaska John]

Is it possible that Cozens played like crap to force a trade?

[SwampD]

8 minutes ago, Thorner said:

Adams re-signed 2 players, and did a substantial core shakeup. Not only is he almost assuredly back next year, he might feel he’s almost done for the summer 

I would laugh at that if it wasn’t so terrifying.

[darksabre]

2 minutes ago, Alaska John said:

Is it possible that Cozens played like crap to force a trade?

For two whole seasons?

I don't think it's fair to say he played like crap either. He just isn't the type of player this team needs.

[Pimlach]

I am pretty surprised that so many here don't like the trade when most here felt that Cozens leaving in any capacity is addition by subtraction.  

Whenever we played Ottawa Norris always stuck out to me as a good player, and a dangerous player.  I was not aware of his injury history. 

Looking at the stats Norris, like Cozens, does not appear to be a playmaker but he is a better scorer/shooter than Cozens.  There is a very reasonable chance that he is a better overall 2C than Cozens was. 

Gilbert for Docker  - Docker has more upside and is a RHD which are in short supply on our roster.   If he can be a steady 5/6 instead of Gilbert as a 6/7 that is a win.   Gilbert provides muscle that is needed and that role will need to be replaced in the off season, preferable with an everyday player.  

The 2nd rounder is not a big deal to me, typical Sabres overpay tax I guess.  I am willing to let it go to move on from the Cozens contract and the Cozens noise which has been a distraction.  

I truly wish Cozens well.  I am disappointed that he didn't turn out for Buffalo because I thought we were getting a skilled, big, tough Canadian kid from the Yukon.  The Sabres development of Cozens may turn out to be a case of too much too soon.  It won't surprise me to see him get his head straight and fix his game. 

 

[...]

17 minutes ago, OverPowerYou said:

Am I the only one that likes this move? Get the soft Pansy ass toxic players out of here 

Nope. I'm with you. Opens up room for someone else. Cozens is a super-soft, too in-his-own-head player. Has the tools, not the brain or constitution. I don't know the player coming back, but, if any of the analytics and anecdotes posted in this thread mean anything, we are at least shaking up the team culture if the remaining change is a net-zero.

[JoeSchmoe]

36 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Benson's on the 4th line cuz the coaching staff sucks

I agree, but there's a case to be made the senior guys are ahead of him (not that I agree with it). Given Benson is more senior than the rest of the bunch, someone needs to go.

[mjd1001]

The dowside obviously:

-Norris misses a lot of games, at least he has in the past.

The upside:

-In the past 4 years, 460 forwards have played over 100 games.  He is 38th out of 460 players in terms of goals per games played.

He is also much better than Cozens on the PowerPlay:

-Cozens 12 career PP goals in 341 games (1 PP goal every 28.4 games)

-Norris 33 career PP goals in 236 games (1PP goal every 7.1 games)

Of players with over 500 minutes of ice time on the PP over the last 4 seasons (basically a PP regular), he is 17th best in the entire league in goals per 60 (out of 150 forwards with that many minutes or more.)

Edited Friday at 06:26 PM by mjd1001