4 Nations Face-Off

[inkman]

3 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Most NHL games, even among the top teams and rivals, are not played at the level of the USA v Canada games.  Playoffs can get to that level as the stakes go up. 

No one player saves a team.  Gretzky, Lemuiex (sp), Crosby, Ovechkin, Kane - they all had help, and lots of help.  

It is sad that they wasted Reinhart and Eichel.  They never brought in the right veteran leadership or developed the glue players.  None of the GMs and coaches under Pegula were qualified to take on a tear down/ tank and rebuild.  None of the coaches were good enough.  The players know it, and that is the only reason we cannot  get the right players, the Sabres are not a serious franchise.  

Look at Hagel.   A guy we drafted and never even looked it, never had an ELC to play a game in Rochester.  Isn’t he exactly what this team needs?   Who from Canada’s team offered to take on Matt Tkachuck?   Hagel.  Yeah, we need a guy like that. He more than held his own too.   I guess he fell through the crack of Boterill and Adams?   

So many good players come and go and the Sabres continue to be irrelevant.  

My heart aches every time I see Hagel on any ice surface. Same with Borgen, Reinhart, Montour, etc.  I just want to wake up from this nightmare.  

[inkman]

12 hours ago, 7+6=13 said:

To me we're not as far away from being good as it feels.  My issue is the 4-5 type of players we NEED aren't attainable for our organization.  The only way is/was through the draft and it didn't/hasn't happened and feels like we're stuck again.

This sounds like they are far away from being good 

[Stoner]

12 hours ago, 7+6=13 said:

To me we're not as far away from being good as it feels.  My issue is the 4-5 type of players we NEED aren't attainable for our organization.  The only way is/was through the draft and it didn't/hasn't happened and feels like we're stuck again.

@Thorner

I mean, what COULD KA have done?

[EM88]

15 minutes ago, inkman said:

It’s not that the Sabres are awful, they are, it’s that they are never going to be good.  I’m 53 and I don’t think this team will be good again until I’m gone. 
 

If you are 53, it is likely that, if the team remains in Buffalo, that the Sabres will have a new owner before you are gone.  Is that looking on the bright side?

[Stoner]

7 minutes ago, inkman said:

This sounds like they are far away from being good 

Those five players? Dom Mario Wayne Raymond Young Patrick.

[SwampD]

26 minutes ago, Jorcus said:

There is a counter balance to the watered down argument that the league has many more players from Europe and Russia now than when it was smaller. I think there are enough good players around. I don't really want more expansion but If they do there are enough bodies. 

I’m aware of that argument, but I think we’ve reached the limit of that talent pool, plus they’ve been pulling goalies for an even longer amount of time. That pool might be even shallower. Add to that that other leagues have more money than they have in the past and can compete, salary wise, while offering an option to having to relocate to North America.

I don’t agree that there are enough bodies, at least not top end, best in the world, bodies.

Edited February 16 by SwampD

[Archie Lee]

13 hours ago, 7+6=13 said:

To me we're not as far away from being good as it feels.  My issue is the 4-5 type of players we NEED aren't attainable for our organization.  The only way is/was through the draft and it didn't/hasn't happened and feels like we're stuck again.

If I thought this were true, I would stop watching Sabre hockey.

We could have traded for Sam Bennett. At the time he was acquired by FLA, his stock was down. He was a pending RFA. There is zero reason to think we would have been unable to extend him. We didn’t sign Hagel when we could have, but nothing stops us from identifying the next Hagel and trading for him. Tampa had the guts to offer what was thought to be higher than value. They won that one, then lost on Jeannot. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. 

I’m generally a glass half-full guy. Looking at the approximately 100 players in this tourney, I would say about half are no-doubters. Then there are 35 or so who could be interchanged with similar players depending on the preferences of the management and coaches. Then there is the bottom 15 who are there because someone has to be (ie: the entire Finnish D). We have a legit no-doubter in Dahlin. We have a guy in the interchangeable category, IMO, in Thompson. We have a couple of additional forwards in Tuch and Peterka, who are in this tourney if they are Swedish or Finnish (Cozens, on reputation, might be also). Byram and Power are 1st or 2nd pairing Finns. Last year’s UPL belongs. 

We need a GM who knows what he is doing. To hell with the current “woe is me” guy. 

[inkman]

4 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

If I thought this were true, I would stop watching Sabre hockey.

We could have traded for Sam Bennett. At the time he was acquired by FLA, his stock was down. He was a pending RFA. There is zero reason to think we would have been unable to extend him. We didn’t sign Hagel when we could have, but nothing stops us from identifying the next Hagel and trading for him. Tampa had the guts to offer what was thought to be higher than value. They won that one, then lost on Jeannot. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. 

I’m generally a glass half-full guy. Looking at the approximately 100 players in this tourney, I would say about half are no-doubters. Then there are 35 or so who could be interchanged with similar players depending on the preferences of the management and coaches. Then there is the bottom 15 who are there because someone has to be (ie: the entire Finnish D). We have a legit no-doubter in Dahlin. We have a guy in the interchangeable category, IMO, in Thompson. We have a couple of additional forwards in Tuch and Peterka, who are in this tourney if they are Swedish or Finnish (Cozens, on reputation, might be also). Byram and Power are 1st or 2nd pairing Finns. Last year’s UPL belongs. 

We need a GM who knows what he is doing. To hell with the current “woe is me” guy. 

More like Woe is us.  There is no indication that Kevyn Adams, the worst sports GM of all time, is going anywhere.  

[pastajoe]

46 minutes ago, EM88 said:

If you are 53, it is likely that, if the team remains in Buffalo, that the Sabres will have a new owner before you are gone.  Is that looking on the bright side?

I’m 64 and have been a fan since the 70’s. I have a shirt that says, “Just one before I die”. The light is starting to dim. 😵‍💫

[SabreFinn]

No starts for Luukkonen in the tournament. Lankinen starting goalie against Canada.

[SabresBillsFan]

How Hagel was not sign by Buffalo is an absolute tragedy after he was drafted. This team along with numerous Gm’s have messed this franchise up. 

[7+6=13]

10 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

We do this repeatedly and will likely do it again. We never take the leap or step forward at the critical moment because we wait for our development prospects rather than going out and getting players we need. 

I mean I think every single poster here said we need a top 6 winger and/or a 2C and a defensive partner for Power and everyone here has said it for a long time. It's obvious. Many of us have also said we are too soft and Ruff said he wanted a "guy who could chuck 'em" and we didn't address that either even though he said he wanted it so clearly Adams does not do what his coach wants. 

The problem is that by the time enough prospects develop (even if you have the right kind of players in the system) somebody else will lose their love or want out or just get unaffordable and so it goes forever step forward step back and forever on the outside. 

I comprehend what you're saying and disagreeing is maybe the wrong word.  I think we're closer than we think but also further than we think.

I don't think the roster is pure crap but I also think the pieces we need can't be obtained.

1 hour ago, inkman said:

This sounds like they are far away from being good 

Yes but I think that's different than, the only piece we have is Dahlin.  I don't think that's true.  I think we're missing important pieces that we can't sign or trade for. 

[inkman]

1 hour ago, EM88 said:

If you are 53, it is likely that, if the team remains in Buffalo, that the Sabres will have a new owner before you are gone.  Is that looking on the bright side?

Doubt I’m around much more than a decade 

[7+6=13]

Just now, inkman said:

Doubt I’m around much more than a decade 

Sure hope you're wrong about that.

[oddoublee]

1 hour ago, SwampD said:

I’m aware of that argument, but I think we’ve reached the limit of that talent pool, plus they’ve been pulling goalies for an even longer amount of time. That pool might be even shallower. Add to that that other leagues have more money than they have in the past and can compete, salary wise, while offering an option to having to relocate to North America.

I don’t agree that there are enough bodies, at least not top end, best in the world, bodies.

4th lines are better than they have ever been. But....is the on ice product better bc of it? You could argue no. I think expansion can wait.

[inkman]

6 minutes ago, 7+6=13 said:

Yes but I think that's different than, the only piece we have is Dahlin.  I don't think that's true.  I think we're missing important pieces that we can't sign or trade for. 

So what you are saying is we are only 4-5 players away, which they will never be able to acquire but because it’s only 4-5 players, they are close?  

3 minutes ago, 7+6=13 said:

Sure hope you're wrong about that.

I don’t 

[7+6=13]

3 minutes ago, inkman said:

So what you are saying is we are only 4-5 players away, which they will never be able to acquire but because it’s only 4-5 players, they are close?  

I don’t 

Yes sir.  I think we've got good players and a really nice cupboard, but we lack the hardest players to find and obtain.

I respect your response but wish I knew more so maybe I could offer more to think about.  Which maybe your reply would still be, I don't.  Still offering though.

[OverPowerYou]

Watching this tournament has made me hate the Sabres. What’s a good team to root for until the Sabres stop being a laughing stock team? Maybe I’ll pick the golden knights, maple leafs or Florida panthers. They all seem to take hockey seriously 

[inkman]

3 minutes ago, OverPowerYou said:

Watching this tournament has made me hate the Sabres. What’s a good team to root for until the Sabres stop being a laughing stock team? Maybe I’ll pick the golden knights, maple leafs or Florida panthers. They all seem to take hockey seriously 

I don’t know how anyone would choose to root for a team with Eichel that circumvents the cap every year with no repercussions. I guess that’s the new America, root for whatever immoral thing you want if the ends justify the means.  

[Mr. Allen]

1 hour ago, inkman said:

My heart aches every time I see Hagel on any ice surface. Same with Borgen, Reinhart, Montour, etc.  I just want to wake up from this nightmare.  

Just coming on here about to post the same thing.  Not sure if Hagel would be as good as he is now if we signed him, but even at half his production would be tremendous for this franchise.  Especially with the way he plays and the heart he shows. 

[PerreaultForever]

5 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

Re: USA-Canada. Had to watch it on delay. The fighting was a surprise to be sure, but a silly one. It was highly entertaining (and Hagel... bloody hell, JBott....). The good thing was they got it all out of their system and none of it carried onward in the game. Then, it was just fun high-speed hockey. Hellebuyck was ready and square for everything, like a bigger R.Miller.

Canada not having an elite goalie is the big difference in this thing and may very well be the deciding factor. 

I'm just glad it's a real and meaningful tournament and not just an all star showcase. 

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, 7+6=13 said:

I comprehend what you're saying and disagreeing is maybe the wrong word.  I think we're closer than we think but also further than we think.

I don't think the roster is pure crap but I also think the pieces we need can't be obtained.

This can't be true. It would mean every single possible piece had a NTC with Buffalo on it. The problem is the will and the courage to make the big moves needed. 

First off, spending to the cap. Not doing that when all your competition is doing that is an instant kick in the teeth to fans. The second is getting the players. It can be done. Adams has a massive amount of trade capital in picks and prospects. The problem is he wants to win trades and he has to be willing to overpay to get what he needs for a while and then when we make the playoffs we can get back to winning trades. You can get what you need if you really want it. Make them the offer they can't refuse. 

[inkman]

2 hours ago, pastajoe said:

I’m 64 and have been a fan since the 70’s. I have a shirt that says, “Just one before I die”. The light is starting to dim. 😵‍💫

At this point, I don’t think they are making the playoffs before either of us are gone 

Edited Sunday at 09:13 PM by inkman

[bunomatic]

We are owned and run by morons. The evidence is everywhere and the witnesses are many. Everyone appears aware of it except the owner. Its like he’s covering his ears and shouting la la la as loud as he can to drown out the noise. I just got my first senior discount last week and I’ve been a fan since I was ten. F.U. Terry.

[JohnC]

6 hours ago, Wyldnwoody44 said:

I have family over so I just peeped the score through the first 2 periods, but once my neices passed out (after making them watch Princess Bride, of course) I watched the 3rd. 

Very good D against those speedy and skilled forwards, but I was also a little sad seeing a full 20 minute alamo mode. 

If you want to have your nieces to hit the sack sooner, then just have them watch a Sabre's game. The urge to snooze will come a lot quicker. 😀