What in the world happened to Jack Quinn?

[kas23]

There appears to be a major conditioning/training issue on this team. It seems like the majority of the team spends the summer months on the beach instead of training for the coming season. And why exactly did the Sabres discover something was wrong with Quinn upon landing in Prague? This should have been an issue identified last season and he should’ve been spending major time during the summer trying to overcome it. It’s not like they were busy in the playoffs. And if he wasn’t ready yet, he should’ve been sitting until he was. He should not have picked the regular season to rehab. 

Edited Tuesday at 12:45 PM by kas23

[LGR4GM]

34 minutes ago, kas23 said:

There appears to be a major conditioning/training issue on this team. It seems like the majority of the team spends the summer months on the beach instead of training for the coming season. And why exactly did the Sabres discover something was wrong with Quinn upon landing in Prague? This should have been an issue identified last season and he should’ve been spending major time during the summer trying to overcome it. It’s not like they were busy in the playoffs. And if he wasn’t ready yet, he should’ve been sitting until he was. He should not have picked the regular season to rehab. 

I don't think this is accurate. We know that Dahlin organized a group to come to Sweden and workout together for one. It could be that the offseason training related to stamina wasn't as good as needed but I think this scenario is just not happening. 

[bob_sauve28]

8 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Just some stats on Östlund this season.

Noah has 35 points in 43 games including 18 goals and is a +20.  4 PPG and 3 SHG.  That is a stellar rookie campaign in the A and for a 1st NA season.  But that only tells part of the tale.

In his 1st 12 games in NA, Noah had 1g 0a with a +1

In the next 31 games he scored 17g 17a + 19.

In his last 7 games he added 7g 5a +12

This is someone who is improving game by game and rapidly before our eyes.  I downgraded him on my prospect list for the slow start.  I am thrilled to be proven wrong about this young player.  He is probably the best prospect in our system at this point.

https://theahl.com/stats/player/10157  (Östlund game log)

 

Sabres prospect Noah Östlund has been named the AHL’s Player of the Week for the period ending Sunday after recording three goals and six points in three games.

Östlund, 21, has been one of the league’s hottest players, having scored 14 goals and 23 points in his last 18 outings.

Right now, the Swedish center has a five-game goal streak.

 

https://www.buffalohockeybeat.com/sabres-jacob-bernard-docker-earning-regular-duty-after-trade-noah-Östlund-honored-for-hot-stretch/

[Thorner]

1 hour ago, kas23 said:

There appears to be a major conditioning/training issue on this team. It seems like the majority of the team spends the summer months on the beach instead of training for the coming season. And why exactly did the Sabres discover something was wrong with Quinn upon landing in Prague? This should have been an issue identified last season and he should’ve been spending major time during the summer trying to overcome it. It’s not like they were busy in the playoffs. And if he wasn’t ready yet, he should’ve been sitting until he was. He should not have picked the regular season to rehab. 

Was it this year or last that Adams had that quote about how the team was “a little too overconfident” heading into the season? He doesn’t seem to have the pulse of things often 

[Archie Lee]

5 minutes ago, Thorner said:

Was it this year or last that Adams had that quote about how the team was “a little too overconfident” heading into the season? He doesn’t seem to have the pulse of things often 

Yeah, Adams is not good at his job.  According to Adams and/or his head coach, he has assembled a group of players who are over-confident, don't take accountability, and don't take off-season workouts seriously enough.  At some point, maybe the players just recognized that accountability is a one-way street with the Sabres.  A leadership change at the GM position, is the most needed move for the coming off-season.   

Edited Tuesday at 01:54 PM by Archie Lee

[North Buffalo]

I think that Sabres need to organize better off season workouts or at least have some off season program and monitor each guy and track them... Quinn's issue was achilles during work out and then regaining confidence on how much he could push himself...

[Doohickie]

2 hours ago, Cascade Youth said:

I would not be surprised if Quinn becomes a perennial all star or if he washes out of the league completely.  Literally either option seems highly possible.

The Concept of Olofsson.

[Doohickie]

40 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

he has assembled a group of players who are over-confident, don't take accountability, and don't take off-season workouts seriously enough.

But their Fortnight game is elite.

[Mr. Allen]

1 hour ago, North Buffalo said:

I think that Sabres need to organize better off season workouts or at least have some off season program and monitor each guy and track them... Quinn's issue was achilles during work out and then regaining confidence on how much he could push himself...

Who is the teams strength and conditioning coach? 

[kas23]

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I don't think this is accurate. We know that Dahlin organized a group to come to Sweden and workout together for one. It could be that the offseason training related to stamina wasn't as good as needed but I think this scenario is just not happening. 

Ok. Probably an oversimplification. I don’t know the schedules of each player during the offseason. But, I do know that if you have an injury late in the season, you should be making every effort to rehab during the summer. I don’t know Quinn’s schedule either, but how this season has played out, it’s apparent he really enjoyed his summer break. Ruff’s comments would support this. 
 

And I don’t know if I blame Quinn for this either. It’s the team’s responsibility to have these players ready to start playing in the fall. It’s obvious these kids need babysitting and are not acting like professionals yet. Hindsight is 20/20, but I would’ve sat his ass until he was ready to go. 

[Jorcus]

20 hours ago, mjd1001 said:

I'm not as optimistic on Quinn as some, but I'm not ready to give up on him.

I don't think I need to see him get bigger/strong. For me its about his throught process and effort.  Go to the front of the net more, and for sure engage more in the neutral zone and D-zone.  

I honestly can't tell if he is good or not at engaging players in the D-zone or backchecking/winning battles in the neutral zone...because you hardly see him even try to do those things.  I don't think there has been a more invisible forward outside of the offensive zone since Jeff Skinner.

He has a good shot. He needs to be taking 200+ shots per year. But not just ANY shots.  He needs to work to get into better position, can't be a perimeter guy (which he has been for most of this year). I know he loves to take that shot from inside the circles, but he seems to too often just hang around there waiting for someone to get him the puck. 

Maybe the recent success that has been with him playing with McLeod is that McLeod's skating if forcing Quinn to move a bit more.  Such a small sample size though, the next 9 games will be important, and next year is a make-or-break year for him.

If Tuch can score 30+ 2 of the last 3 years, Quinn has the shot to do it too. Just he needs to earn the extra ice time to allow him to get more chances by improving the rest of his game, and he has to skate a lot harder himself to generate his own chances, instead of the vast majority of his chances being generated by someone else on his line.

 

Yes the skating issue is a big problem. He never was very fast but post injury he is even slower than he was. He only has 53 speed bursts above 20 mph. Most top 6 forwards have twice as many for the amount of games he has played. His one real asset is his shot but in order to get it off he has to be in the clear and that just does not happen all that often. He is a hesitant pick a spot shooter to often the lane closes on him as he is aiming on the goal. He needs to one time more shots. 

The other issue is he does nothing else to help the team. No penalty kill time, no face offs, low hit counts. If your only asset is your ability to score you better be scoring. There are a number Rochester guys aiming for his spot. If any of them were right handed shots they might have taken it already.  

[JohnC]

4 hours ago, Doohickie said:

The Concept of Olofsson.

One of my main criticisms of KA is his inability to properly assess his own players and individually put the players in the best position to succeed. Olofsson is a good example of that. There is no question that he is an offensive specialty player. He's primarily a shooter. This season with Vegas, in 49 games he has 13 goals and 12 assists, with a +/- of +14. And half of his goals were scored on the PP. He's certainly not a well-rounded player you would want on any of your top two lines, and obviously you wouldn't want him on a checking line. But by utilizing his strengths and minimizing his weaknesses he can be a contribute when his role is properly assigned. 

[Doohickie]

5 minutes ago, JohnC said:

One of my main criticisms of KA is his inability to properly assess his own players and individually put the players in the best position to succeed.

Isn't that the coach's job?

On this year's team, is seems like Zucker is kind of that guy.  Doesn't play on the top two lines, not really a checker.  He's a third liner and playoff specialist (not so much in terms of shooting, more by tip-ins and rebounds).

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Isn't that the coach's job?

On this year's team, is seems like Zucker is kind of that guy.  Doesn't play on the top two lines, not really a checker.  He's a third liner and playoff specialist (not so much in terms of shooting, more by tip-ins and rebounds).

Roster construction is mostly the GM's responsibility through player acquisitions. No doubt, there is plenty of communication between the two parties to get the right mix of players and then put them in a position to succeed. 

I'm a Zucker guy. Whatever line he is on he provides toughness and net presence. He's also a factor on the PP because of his ability to go to the tough areas in front of the net. I'm often critical of the GM but do give him credit for the Zucker and McCleud acquisitions.  He needed to do a little more on that front to make our very young roster a little better balanced.  

[Drag0nDan]

42 minutes ago, Jorcus said:

 

Yes the skating issue is a big problem. He never was very fast but post injury he is even slower than he was. He only has 53 speed bursts above 20 mph. Most top 6 forwards have twice as many for the amount of games he has played. His one real asset is his shot but in order to get it off he has to be in the clear and that just does not happen all that often. He is a hesitant pick a spot shooter to often the lane closes on him as he is aiming on the goal. He needs to one time more shots. 

The other issue is he does nothing else to help the team. No penalty kill time, no face offs, low hit counts. If your only asset is your ability to score you better be scoring. There are a number Rochester guys aiming for his spot. If any of them were right handed shots they might have taken it already.  

Seems pretty spot on to me.  Better skating can get him into better positions to win some puck battles that drive possession as well, being late puts less pressure on the opponent.  Felt like line with cozens was always bogged down turning it over behind the net, then having to hustle back on defense.  

[Doohickie]

45 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Roster construction is mostly the GM's responsibility through player acquisitions.

But for the players already on the team, it's the coach, not the GM, who is tasked with putting "the players in the best position to succeed," no?

[JohnC]

16 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

But for the players already on the team, it's the coach, not the GM, who is tasked with putting "the players in the best position to succeed," no?

Yes.