GDT: Colorado Avs @ Buffalo Sabres 12/3/24 --7 pm MSG

[That Aud Smell]

6 minutes ago, Thorner said:

Ya that’s fair too 

the point that you and others are making is a stronger one.

the fact that harrington refuses to acknowledge its relevance is symptomatic of that guy being a world class derp.

[Mr Peabody]

Adams was very clear last summer on why he didn’t spend to the cap.  He had to hold back money for the young ones coming up.  That is the issue behind this team - his big contracts have been futures and few if any are paying off now.  Additionally there’s no guarantee they’ll ever be value contracts.

IMO we’re 3-4 for years away from our entire second line maturing.  If our players were earning the $80M we’d be a solid team.  They’re not, nor did I expect they would.   So in a nutshell it’s the $80 we’re spending,  not the $8 we aren’t. 

[Archie Lee]

6 minutes ago, Thorner said:

That’s not how this works.

the Adams regime was borne out of the desire to fix the terrible team culture. Point out the board member who disagreed that was necessary. We are still under the agreement the culture was a significant issue affecting performance, correct?

It defies the limits of credibility to suppose the *clear* refusal of the organization to prioritize winning wouldn’t have an affect on the players. On the team, on the culture. This imbibes the psyche of the players who make up the 80 million we do spend.

On a less important, but still important side note: It’s also incredibly rich to read about how an $8 million dollar player “wouldn’t make a difference” when the line re: making the playoffs might be (currently is) like a couple points. Rich, because all I’ve heard around here was how Jack Eichel didn’t do enough for what we paid him, didn’t put the team on his back, and now we/you want to pretend the output of an 8 million dollar play is “irrelevant”?

- - - 

This (way too young) collection of players hasn’t played under a legitimate expectation of winning since being assembled. 

it’s a f*cking problem, and now you’ve seen it manifest. I’ve only been harping on it for 4 years around here  

He absolutely does not have a point 

I agree.  Spending more and bringing in an additional veteran player or two would not guarantee a better outcome.  Committing to not spending that money is a self-inflicted handicap though.  

Here is an example of an alternate off-season

- They still trade for McLeod

- They sign Zucker for $1 million less on his AAV by giving him a two year deal

- They sign Warren Foegele to the same $3.75 AAV that LA got him at, by giving him a 4th year

- They trade Quinn and Kulich and a pick to Winnipeg for Ehlers, who was willing to come to Buffalo but not willing to extend in advance

- They opt against qualifying Jokiharju and trade for Cody Ceci

- They pass on the Malenstyn trade but still sign Lafferty, Aube-Kubel, Gilbert and Reimer

These  deals would have made them a more-veteran, experienced, and talented team.  And it comes in under the cap.  Perhaps they aren't all realistic.  Some might object to Foegele or Ceci because they don't think they are all that good.  Some might hate trading Quinn and Kulich for a player who we might lose after a year.  All points are good, but these are just examples.  Would such moves have put us in the playoffs?  I don't know.  But they would have signaled that we were serious about the playoffs.  Opting against such bold moves has not worked.

 

[Thorner]

2 minutes ago, Mr Peabody said:

Adams was very clear last summer on why he didn’t spend to the cap.  He had to hold back money for the young ones coming up.  That is the issue behind this team - his big contracts have been futures and few if any are paying off now.  Additionally there’s no guarantee they’ll ever be value contracts.

IMO we’re 3-4 for years away from our entire second line maturing.  If our players were earning the $80M we’d be a solid team.  They’re not, nor did I expect they would.   So in a nutshell it’s the $80 we’re spending,  not the $8 we aren’t. 

Knowing the old saying “a bird in hand is worth 2 in the bush”, and deciding to make your entire strategy essentially a microcosm of doing the opposite of that logic is a choice a man can make 

[Thorner]

8 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I agree.  Spending more and bringing in an additional veteran player or two would not guarantee a better outcome.  Committing to not spending that money is a self-inflicted handicap though.  

Here is an example of an alternate off-season

- They still trade for McLeod

- They sign Zucker for $1 million less on his AAV by giving him a two year deal

- They sign Warren Foegele to the same $3.75 AAV that LA got him at, by giving him a 4th year

- They trade Quinn and Kulich and a pick to Winnipeg for Ehlers, who was willing to come to Buffalo but not willing to extend in advance

- They opt against qualifying Jokiharju and trade for Cody Ceci

- They pass on the Malenstyn trade but still sign Lafferty, Aube-Kubel, Gilbert and Reimer

These  deals would have made them a more-veteran, experienced, and talented team.  And it comes in under the cap.  Perhaps they aren't all realistic.  Some might object to Foegele or Ceci because they don't think they are all that good.  Some might hate trading Quinn and Kulich for a player who we might lose after a year.  All points are good, but these are just examples.  Would such moves have put us in the playoffs?  I don't know.  But they would have signaled that we were serious about the playoffs.  Opting against such bold moves has not worked.

 

It’s a simple matter of logic that Mike seemingly can’t get past:

no, spending doesn’t guarantee winning. It does not change the fact that refusing to spend nearly ensures you won’t.

You take your chances or you don’t.

You prioritize saving $, job security, the fear of trying and failing, or all 3

Or you can dance 

[JohnC]

3 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Mitts apparently told Duffer and Marty that he was good with the trade and it was “time to move on”.    I’m sure he told that same thing to his buddies Dahlin, Cozens,  etc.     

The Adams core of “players that want to be here” will be dismantled within the next year.  

There will come a time when Dahlin (and others) gets tired of being stuck in this squalid organization and annually watching his former teammates thrive in the playoffs while he is watching the post season games from his coach. And what happens if Byram, the player dealt for Mitts, concludes that it is in his best interest to not sign an extension when he has other better options in the market?  

If things don't change soon, there won't be core players who want to be here. Ask Jack and Reinhart about their determination to get the freak out of this muddling franchise! 

[HumanSlinky39]

The sad thing about all of this is that from the last couple of months of 2021-22 through the 2022-23 season, we saw real progression individually as players and as a team. I thought by the last few weeks of 22/23 this was a damn good hockey team that was right there and ready to make the leap into the playoffs in 2023-24 with just a little bit of roster tweaking. Then last year, they regressed almost across the board. The development of the individual players (for the most part) seemed to stall out. That has carried over to this season and it's looking more and more like they peaked in Feb-Apr of 2023 as a team. Like maybe that was just a career year for many of these guys.

My confidence has been slowly dwindling this season and after last night I am now 100% convinced this team and this core cannot get over the hump. Kevyn Adams' plan, that once appeared to be paying dividends has flopped and he needs to go. There needs to be a pretty significant roster shakeup and I don't want Adams making those decisions.

I don't think we're looking at anything resembling a ground-up rebuild, but there needs to be an overhaul. From the front office on down, and for me that includes Lindy. I love Lindy, but I don't think he's the right coach to shepherd a team through (yet another) rebuild.

I'll keep watching, because unfortunately this is the team I hitched my wagon to; but goddamn this is frustrating.

[PotentPowerPlay21]

It tells you a lot about the team when the only player with any balls is 5'9" and only 19 years old. Owen Power is huge and might be the softest player in the NHL. Pathetic! Where's the pride? How do these players look in the mirror?

[Archie Lee]

20 minutes ago, HumanSlinky39 said:

The sad thing about all of this is that from the last couple of months of 2021-22 through the 2022-23 season, we saw real progression individually as players and as a team. I thought by the last few weeks of 22/23 this was a damn good hockey team that was right there and ready to make the leap into the playoffs in 2023-24 with just a little bit of roster tweaking. Then last year, they regressed almost across the board. The development of the individual players (for the most part) seemed to stall out. That has carried over to this season and it's looking more and more like they peaked in Feb-Apr of 2023 as a team. Like maybe that was just a career year for many of these guys.

My confidence has been slowly dwindling this season and after last night I am now 100% convinced this team and this core cannot get over the hump. Kevyn Adams' plan, that once appeared to be paying dividends has flopped and he needs to go. There needs to be a pretty significant roster shakeup and I don't want Adams making those decisions.

I don't think we're looking at anything resembling a ground-up rebuild, but there needs to be an overhaul. From the front office on down, and for me that includes Lindy. I love Lindy, but I don't think he's the right coach to shepherd a team through (yet another) rebuild.

I'll keep watching, because unfortunately this is the team I hitched my wagon to; but goddamn this is frustrating.

This is pretty much where I'm at, though I don't think the overhaul need be as extensive. 

To the bolded, I genuinely believe that when a person who is relatively inexperienced has immediate success they can trick themselves into thinking it wasn't just smart decisions that lead to the success, but rather that the decisions were smart because they made them.  This can lead to ignoring evidence and history and advice and assuming your next set of decisions will be just as successful.  I think this (and, possibly, an internal cap) lead to the wasted summer of 2023 when nothing was done to advance the quality of the NHL roster.  We are still catching up from that mistake.

[Kristian]

On a sidenote - Sam Lafferty apparently is liking posts on the Sabres FB page. Lindy’s post-presser to be precise. Some of those comments are, shall we say, “not in favor of the team”?

[#freejame]

23 minutes ago, Kristian said:

On a sidenote - Sam Lafferty apparently is liking posts on the Sabres FB page. Lindy’s post-presser to be precise. Some of those comments are, shall we say, “not in favor of the team”?

Any screenshots? He signed up for this, I don’t feel bad for him. 

[Kristian]

5 minutes ago, #freejame said:

Any screenshots? He signed up for this, I don’t feel bad for him. 

I’m too old to know how to do that in this forum, but they’re right there for everyone to see in the comments section of Lindy’s post-game.

[PerreaultForever]

8 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

The culture is terrible, but we also don’t have enough or the right kind of talent.  

"right kind" would be the operative point. 

[PerreaultForever]

The "panic" narrative is complete and utter BS. 

Cozen's new nickname should be Glue Factory. 

[Kristian]

7 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

The "panic" narrative is complete and utter BS. 

Cozen's new nickname should be Glue Factory. 

And the Sabres should be renamed “The Losers Club” - Tag-line “They all float here” 🤣

[ASlugAbove]

1 hour ago, Kristian said:

On a sidenote - Sam Lafferty apparently is liking posts on the Sabres FB page. Lindy’s post-presser to be precise. Some of those comments are, shall we say, “not in favor of the team”?

the same Sam Lafferty that has 22 GP and 1point? Give me a break. Case and point if this is true....these guys STINK

[PerreaultForever]

12 minutes ago, Kristian said:

And the Sabres should be renamed “The Losers Club” - Tag-line “They all float here” 🤣

They're definitely some type of floaters. 

Merry Christmas from your Buffalo Sabres

 

[Kristian]

21 minutes ago, ASlugAbove said:

the same Sam Lafferty that has 22 GP and 1point? Give me a break. Case and point if this is true....these guys STINK

Just telling you what I’m reading.

[mjd1001]

2 hours ago, Kristian said:

On a sidenote - Sam Lafferty apparently is liking posts on the Sabres FB page. Lindy’s post-presser to be precise. Some of those comments are, shall we say, “not in favor of the team”?

Good. Lafferty isn't playing much. He isn't playing well. He is not a key member or the Roster.

But he has been in some locker rooms a lot better than the Sabres...at least he's seen more success.  It may not mean much, but I'll be happy to see some players voicing, or showing some signs like this.

[ASlugAbove]

14 minutes ago, Kristian said:

Just telling you what I’m reading.

Totally not meant to be an attack at you. Rolling my eyes at him if it's true. Can you link what you're reading I couldnt find that.

[Kristian]

1 minute ago, ASlugAbove said:

Totally not meant to be an attack at you. Rolling my eyes at him if it's true. Can you link what you're reading I couldnt find that.

This is the post : https://fb.watch/wgxJ238KHu/?

[inkman]

6 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

The only reason there was any hope yesterday is because of Colorado's criminally bad starting goaltending. 

Now, if the Avalanche hadn't traded for Wedgewood a few days ago and Annunen comes in... maybe the Sabres win 7-5 anyway. But even in that situation, it wouldn't have changed the fact that once the Avalanche woke up and said, "we need to start skating on offense and defense", the game was over.

There are 82 games a season. I feel the same way about this team as I did on October 1st, November 1st and December 1st.  Bums. Smol D energy. 

[HumanSlinky39]

1 hour ago, ASlugAbove said:

the same Sam Lafferty that has 22 GP and 1point? Give me a break. Case and point if this is true....these guys STINK

Exact same thing I was preparing to post. Dude, you're contributing nothing. Maybe play better?

Edited 4 hours ago by HumanSlinky39