Quinn Scratched…Who’s next?

[Ruff Around The Edges]

I think the Sabres need TWO legit centers, Cozens and Tage would be more consistent and successful on the wings, and this would push some of the other forwards down into better roles as well.

 

 

[mjd1001]

17 hours ago, Ruff Around The Edges said:

I think the Sabres need TWO legit centers, Cozens and Tage would be more consistent and successful on the wings, and this would push some of the other forwards down into better roles as well.

 

 

Cozens yes, but I don't think Tage would be better on the wing.  

He isn't one that looks to distribute so I get that part of it, but I think he works best in space.  I really don't think he does his best work on the boards, and he is best when he doesn't have the boards to one side of him. Even if its not passing, I think you want him to spend more time near the center of the ice, he can use his hands and his size best with the most space around him.

Edited October 19 by mjd1001

[7+6=13]

6 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Shall I assume Eichel is the POS center you refer to?   Look at him now.  He has 10 points in 5 games.  He is just hitting his prime and he played excellent two-way hockey when they won a Cup.   

You say we drafted very few centers?  How about 6 in the past 4 years in the upper 2 rounds?   Rosen in 2021;  Savoie, Kulich, and Östlund in 2022; Wahlberg in 2023; and Helenius in 2024.   Many of them do not project to be centers, but you cannot say we aren't drafting them. 

And the notion that Thompson is best suited to be a center in this league is on shaky ground.  He can play center, but is he carrying this team as a 1C?  Look at our Power Play, does he look like a 1C? 

Some day we will trade Thompson and he will end up with a true playmaking center, lead the league in goals, win a Cup,  and we will wonder why this management could not see it.   

We didn't draft all of them to be or to project to be centers.  So that's not the same as we've drafted many centers.  Yes, if course Eichel is a POS.  You know that.  He's an excellent player for sure.

[Pimlach]

17 hours ago, mjd1001 said:

Cozens yes, but I don't think Tage would be better on the wing.  

He isn't one that looks to distribute so I get that part of it, but I think he works best in space.  I really don't think he does his best work on the boards, and he is best when he doesn't have the boards to one side of him. Even if its not passing, I think you want him to spend more time near the center of the ice, he can use his hands and his size best with the most space around him.

This is a good theory on Thompson, but I’m not sure that it’s true any more.   His inability to carry a puck and distribute is a first line liability.  Every team knows how to defend him so the goals and assists have slowed way down.  Someone else on his line has to create.  

And what happens on the power play?   He doesn’t set anyone up.  He works near the wall, sets up for one timers.  Again, the league knows how to defend this.  

They need first line help, then we will have good players trickling down to help other lines.    Either a wing that creates, or a playmaking center.  I say get a center, try Tage at wing, then you can move Tuch to where he really fits.   Or you move Tage to 2C.  

The Top 6 has to improve and 1C/2C are just not strong enough.  

Edited October 19 by Pimlach

[Pimlach]

14 hours ago, 7+6=13 said:

We didn't draft all of them to be or to project to be centers.  So that's not the same as we've drafted many centers.  Yes, if course Eichel is a POS.  You know that.  He's an excellent player for sure.

Spin it any way you want.  We used 6 prime picks on centers in the past 4 years.  
 

Maybe Östlund and Helenius will hit?   We have waited 14 years, what’s a few more. 

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Spin it any way you want.  We used 6 prime picks on centers in the past 4 years.  
 

Maybe Östlund and Helenius will hit?   We have waited 14 years, what’s a few more. 

I'm not arguing to trade away our top prospects such as Helenius or even Östlund. My frustration is directed at some of the perplexing decisions that our GM has recently made. I still am perplexed by the Mitts for Byram trade? And even more perplexing is why the GM couldn't have added another second line player/wing this offseason when he had more than enough cap and assets to parlay. I have no doubt that the GM is a good guy, but as a GM he is bland. He lacks the creativity and savvy to improve the roster. 

I'm not giving up on this season. It's clear that players are adjusting to the new coach. They are obviously pressing. Cozens and Dahlin are examples of that. The last offseason was the time to tweak the roster and make some judicious adds. Our GM stumbled and didn't make a consequential move to upgrade this roster. The GM is the head of the hockey operation. He's simply mediocre. 

[MISabresFan]

I think Ruff has lost touch with the way the game is played today.  Look at the results.  The one win in the first 10 is my expectation.  He lost favor in NJ for a reason.

[LabattBlue]

9 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The GM is the head of the hockey operation. 

Nope.  Go higher.  

[Pimlach]

53 minutes ago, MISabresFan said:

I think Ruff has lost touch with the way the game is played today.  Look at the results.  The one win in the first 10 is my expectation.  He lost favor in NJ for a reason.

He did not lose touch in NJ.  His young NJ team set the franchise all time record for points just two years ago.  Last season he had many injuries, and nothing in net.  Hard to blame him alone for that, but NJ is run like a real NHL organization so when you don't produce you go.  

In Buffalo we may be finding out that our Core of "best players" have reached a plateau.   Dahlin, Tage, Cozens, Power, and Samuelsson were all paid.  

Will they get better?  Can Lindy help them get better?   That is the question here today.  

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

He did not lose touch in NJ.  His young NJ team set the franchise all time record for points just two years ago.  Last season he had many injuries, and nothing in net.  Hard to blame him alone for that, but NJ is run like a real NHL organization so when you don't produce you go.  

In Buffalo we may be finding out that our Core of "best players" have reached a plateau.   Dahlin, Tage, Cozens, Power, and Samuelsson were all paid.  

Will they get better?  Can Lindy help them get better?   That is the question here today.  

I believe that the hiring process that resulted in Lindy being hired was a charade. On the other hand, even with a full and legitimate hiring process Lindy would have been a good pick for a number of reasons, including experience and willingness to hold players accountable. In my view, he was the right hire in a bogus hiring process. 

[Pimlach]

56 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I'm not arguing to trade away our top prospects such as Helenius or even Östlund. My frustration is directed at some of the perplexing decisions that our GM has recently made. I still am perplexed by the Mitts for Byram trade? And even more perplexing is why the GM couldn't have added another second line player/wing this offseason when he had more than enough cap and assets to parlay. I have no doubt that the GM is a good guy, but as a GM he is bland. He lacks the creativity and savvy to improve the roster. 

I'm not giving up on this season. It's clear that players are adjusting to the new coach. They are obviously pressing. Cozens and Dahlin are examples of that. The last offseason was the time to tweak the roster and make some judicious adds. Our GM stumbled and didn't make a consequential move to upgrade this roster. The GM is the head of the hockey operation. He's simply mediocre. 

Well I have no interest in trading Helenius, or even Östlund since he could be the playmaker that we need.  But for the right player(s) anything is possible. 

I have said enough about Mitts/Byram, hated the trade, and not because of Byram but mostly because Mitts was the best all around center on our roster.  

At least Byram is playing decent hockey right now.  He looks ok, so does Joker, and Clifton fills his role adequately.     We need much more from Dahlin and Samuelsson.  Power is what he is.  He is an overpaid kid and still developing.  He will reach his peak at 27-29, and probably for another team. 

I am not giving up on the season though, but I see the warts very clearly now.  I will stick with Lindy and give him a fair chance.  

As for Adams, this season is on him.  He says time and again that he and his team do not own the 13 year drought, but he owns 5 years, which is more than enough.  

[Pimlach]

16 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I believe that the hiring process that resulted in Lindy being hired was a charade. On the other hand, even with a full and legitimate hiring process Lindy would have been a good pick for a number of reasons, including experience and willingness to hold players accountable. In my view, he was the right hire in a bogus hiring process. 

It was definitely a silly public charade. 

Hard to say if Lindy was the right guy since we don't know what the other candidates could bring.  We will never know.   I find it incredible that a GM would not formally interview at least 3 or 4 people, just to get to know them, to get ideas, to hear what is going on out there, to fill a rolodex (dated term), to acquire information and possible connections for the future. 

Back in the day I did some recruiting for my company - so many times I was looking for "A", and along the way I also found "B" and "C".   

I can say Lindy was the comfortable choice and the easy choice.  

Edited October 19 by Pimlach

[Taro T]

Getting back to the thread title, it HAS to be Samuelsson; right?

Yes, Levi should've bailed him out when he sent that cross ice pass to the BJ at the end of the 1st; but Levi should NEVER have been put in the position to blow the save in the 1st place.

How much different does that game go if they're just down 1-0 after that horrendous 1st period?

And still ticked that Ruff didn't try to sign Bob Woods as an assistant coach.  Yeah, he went back to his old buddy Bylsma but he was still available for over 2 months after Ruff was hired.  They needed a coach that can run a PP.  So, though have no idea who'd be available at this point; and know it's a pipe dream, but Appert should be on thin ice too.

[mjd1001]

3 hours ago, MISabresFan said:

I think Ruff has lost touch with the way the game is played today.  Look at the results.  The one win in the first 10 is my expectation.  He lost favor in NJ for a reason.

He "lost favor" in NJ because they wanted to try anything to salvage a season. 2 years ago when they were healthy, he had them near the top of the conference. Last year they were destroyed by injuries to key players and had no quality goaltending.  Still even after he was fired, the team played WORSE after he left than they did when he was there.  

The past few years, if anything, actual results show the opposite that he has 'lost touch with the way the game is played today'

[PerreaultForever]

Well It's Benson's turn tonight and otherwise everything is exactly the same and all the lines are exactly the same just Kulich in for Benson instead of Quinn. Rotating deck chairs and really no consequences for bad play at all. Same old Sabres but really, what options does he have? Gilbert for Samuelsson maybe but otherwise, like every year, there's no group of players pushing for roster spots to put in there. 

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, mjd1001 said:

He "lost favor" in NJ because they wanted to try anything to salvage a season. 2 years ago when they were healthy, he had them near the top of the conference. Last year they were destroyed by injuries to key players and had no quality goaltending.  Still even after he was fired, the team played WORSE after he left than they did when he was there.  

The past few years, if anything, actual results show the opposite that he has 'lost touch with the way the game is played today'

Just to be devil's advocate one could point to our goaltending so far and say it's dropped off under Ruff so maybe the way he has the D playing contributes to the goaltending performances. The Sabres D is BAD. 

[ska-T Chitown]

41 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

Just to be devil's advocate one could point to our goaltending so far and say it's dropped off under Ruff so maybe the way he has the D playing contributes to the goaltending performances. The Sabres D is BAD. 

Literally to the bold - lol

It seems to be on par with the Sabres from 2 years ago ... or early last year. Just my take - but this might be bigger than the HC. I know pretty much everyone has said that ... so I guess I am just here for the " (NJ) Devil's advocate" bit ... 

[JohnC]

5 hours ago, Pimlach said:

It was definitely a silly public charade. 

Hard to say if Lindy was the right guy since we don't know what the other candidates could bring.  We will never know.   I find it incredible that a GM would not formally interview at least 3 or 4 people, just to get to know them, to get ideas, to hear what is going on out there, to fill a rolodex (dated term), to acquire information and possible connections for the future. 

Back in the day I did some recruiting for my company - so many times I was looking for "A", and along the way I also found "B" and "C".   

I can say Lindy was the comfortable choice and the easy choice.  

You make keen points about the utility that could have been made by seriously interviewing a number of experienced candidates for the open job, even if Lindy was pre-selected in the hollow search for a new coach. One of them is that you can learn something from "outsider eyes" about the weaknesses and strengths about your organization and roster. It was a second-rate effort from a second-rate organization.

I'm not as negative about this team and season as many already are. But it is exasperating to watch how this organization continues to fumble doing the basic stuff, such as hiring staff. It's ridiculous. 

 

[rickshaw]

Can’t believe Samuelson played against Chicago. Way to send that message Lindy. 

[7+6=13]

15 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Spin it any way you want.  We used 6 prime picks on centers in the past 4 years.  
 

Maybe Östlund and Helenius will hit?   We have waited 14 years, what’s a few more. 

You can't be serious with "spin"?

You're bitching Savoie, Östlund Rosen, Wahlberg, Kulich and Helenius aren't Sabre centres and I'm spinning.

You want consolement for crying about that?  

This is exactly what I'm talking about.  Irrational complaining. 

Ok, Rosen, Wahlberg and Helenius should be centres, we suck.  Happy now?

 

 

 

Edited October 20 by 7+6=13

[Pimlach]

14 minutes ago, 7+6=13 said:

You can't be serious with "spin"?

You're bitching Savoie, Östlund Rosen, Wahlberg, Kulich and Helenius aren't Sabre centres and I'm spinning.

You want consolement for crying about that?  

This is exactly what I'm talking about.  Irrational complaining. 

Ok, Rosen, Wahlberg and Helenius should be centres, we suck.  Happy now?

 

 

 

Edited October 20 by Pimlach

[7+6=13]

1 minute ago, Pimlach said:

 

Freudian.  Empty argument.

[Pimlach]

2 minutes ago, 7+6=13 said:

Freudian.  Empty argument.

Ignore coming 

[7+6=13]

2 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Ignore coming 

I think my soft fans comment proves out.  We traded Savoie for McLeod, who you just posted as wanting to give 2C minutes to.  Then complain we don't have centres and name Savoie.

Our fan base has lost its ability to think clearly.

[MISabresFan]

20 hours ago, JohnC said:

I believe that the hiring process that resulted in Lindy being hired was a charade. On the other hand, even with a full and legitimate hiring process Lindy would have been a good pick for a number of reasons, including experience and willingness to hold players accountable. In my view, he was the right hire in a bogus hiring process. 

LOL - so he was the right choice in a bogus hiring process.  Wonder who would have been coach in a correct hiring process?