GDT: Sabres @ Penguins 7PM 9/24/24, wgr & sabres.com, preseason

[dudacek]

12 minutes ago, K-9 said:

My post had nothing to do with Lindy, but I agree entirely. 

I was fine with the first two periods, but going Alamo mode in a preseason game when you need to evaluate these kids made no sense to me. 

I would imagine Leone wanted to evaluate how adept his troops were at bringing a game home.

New coach, that was very much the bulk of his team out there.

[dudacek]

That game was exactly why I’m highly skeptical of  Rosen.

There was a no-look one-touch pass he made with his back hand under pressure from behind the net, and another blink-and-you-miss-the release rocket he pinged off the post through traffic that showcased high-end NHL skill.

And he was painfully diligent defensively, consistently circling back high and trying to stay in the right side of the puck.

But the vast majority of the game he was just circling and waiting; he’s never demanding the puck or going out if his way to get it.

The kid has real NHL skill and he doesn’t seem to get bullied out there, his game is just so quiet.

Edited September 25 by dudacek

[DarthEbriate]

I like this win for the Amerks. The Penguins didn't dress their top lines, but they had a bunch of their bottom 6: Acciari, Hayes, Lizotte, Glass, plus reclamation NHLer/13th Beauvillier in. Those guys played a ton. Graves and Aho on D, and their #2 goalie. Toss in a long-term AHL vet like Imama for fun.

The Pens should've suffocated the Amerks defensively and ground them to dust. It didn't happen.

[SabreFinn]

36 minutes ago, dudacek said:

That game was exactly why I’m highly skeptical of  Rosen.

There was a no-look one-touch pass he made with his back hand under pressure from behind the net, and another blink-and-you-miss-the release rocket he pinged off the post through traffic that showcased high-end NHL skill.

And he was painfully diligent defensively, consistently circling back high and trying to stay in the right side of the puck.

But the vast majority of the game he was just circling and waiting; he’s never demanding the puck or going out if his way to get it.

The kid has real NHL skill and he doesn’t seem to get bullied out there, his game is just so quiet.

To me, that sounds like Rosén isn't motivated. Maybe he has realized he will be stuck in Rochester the rest of his time as a Sabre?

[dudacek]

9 minutes ago, SabreFinn said:

To me, that sounds like Rosén isn't motivated. Maybe he has realized he will be stuck in Rochester the rest of his time as a Sabre?

I'm sure he was disappointed his buddy Kulich was headed to Prague and he wasn't

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

That game was exactly why I’m highly skeptical of  Rosen.

There was a no-look one-touch pass he made with his back hand under pressure from behind the net, and another blink-and-you-miss-the release rocket he pinged off the post through traffic that showcased high-end NHL skill.

And he was painfully diligent defensively, consistently circling back high and trying to stay in the right side of the puck.

But the vast majority of the game he was just circling and waiting; he’s never demanding the puck or going out if his way to get it.

The kid has real NHL skill and he doesn’t seem to get bullied out there, his game is just so quiet.

It's the opposite almost of Östlund. 

[dudacek]

18 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

It's the opposite almost of Östlund. 

Exactly, in approach at least. In skill Östlund is right up there too, but he is constantly around the puck.

[Archie Lee]

52 minutes ago, SabreFinn said:

To me, that sounds like Rosén isn't motivated. Maybe he has realized he will be stuck in Rochester the rest of his time as a Sabre?

I think there have been a lot of successful NHL players over the years who played that style. It is not in their nature to be aggressive or physical or - pick your expression - “get to the net” or “mix it up”. They tend to play on the perimeter and often leave you wanting more. Some though are effective in their way. They can stabilize a line, cut-off the opposition or create offence with intelligence, instinct, speed and positioning rather than by relying on physicality. Of course it is better to have the complete package, but it is a rare player, even in the NHL, who has it all. 

[RochesterExpat]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

That game was exactly why I’m highly skeptical of  Rosen.

There was a no-look one-touch pass he made with his back hand under pressure from behind the net, and another blink-and-you-miss-the release rocket he pinged off the post through traffic that showcased high-end NHL skill.

And he was painfully diligent defensively, consistently circling back high and trying to stay in the right side of the puck.

But the vast majority of the game he was just circling and waiting; he’s never demanding the puck or going out if his way to get it.

The kid has real NHL skill and he doesn’t seem to get bullied out there, his game is just so quiet.

It reminds me of Skinner. Little question as to the talent, but somehow detached from the game until a desire to get in the play kicks in—if it even does. Skinner has the talent to play at the NHL level as a complimentary piece. I don’t think Rosen has a serious shot at the NHL as only a complimentary guy because, while he is talented, he isn’t a 30+ goal threat. That’s kind of the threshold for being a career peripheral player.
 

If Rosen can find some aggression he would be a great middle-six guy. Maybe they should make him hang out with Benson during the off-season.

3 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I think there have been a lot of successful NHL players over the years who played that style. It is not in their nature to be aggressive or physical or - pick your expression - “get to the net” or “mix it up”. They tend to play on the perimeter and often leave you wanting more. Some though are effective in their way. They can stabilize a line, cut-off the opposition or create offence with intelligence, instinct, speed and positioning rather than by relying on physicality. Of course it is better to have the complete package, but it is a rare player, even in the NHL, who has it all. 

As I said above, Skinner is kind of one of them. The problem is the talent to make a career out of it—especially as the game continues to evolve—is a pretty high barrier and I’m not convinced Rosen is there.

[inkman]

11 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I think there have been a lot of successful NHL players over the years who played that style. It is not in their nature to be aggressive or physical or - pick your expression - “get to the net” or “mix it up”. They tend to play on the perimeter and often leave you wanting more. Some though are effective in their way. They can stabilize a line, cut-off the opposition or create offence with intelligence, instinct, speed and positioning rather than by relying on physicality. Of course it is better to have the complete package, but it is a rare player, even in the NHL, who has it all. 

Sounds like a perfect fit for any team not named Sabres 

Did anyone actually watch the game via HULU / ESPN+?  I searched for it but the only Sabres games that came up in the search had already been played. 

[bob_sauve28]

29 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I think there have been a lot of successful NHL players over the years who played that style. It is not in their nature to be aggressive or physical or - pick your expression - “get to the net” or “mix it up”. They tend to play on the perimeter and often leave you wanting more. Some though are effective in their way. They can stabilize a line, cut-off the opposition or create offence with intelligence, instinct, speed and positioning rather than by relying on physicality. Of course it is better to have the complete package, but it is a rare player, even in the NHL, who has it all. 

Vanek? 

[thewookie1]

14 minutes ago, bob_sauve28 said:

Vanek? 

Vanek was never a physical player but was certainly a tough player in that he would take beatings in front of the net and keep going back.

[Taro T]

3 hours ago, K-9 said:

My post had nothing to do with Lindy, but I agree entirely. 

I was fine with the first two periods, but going Alamo mode in a preseason game when you need to evaluate these kids made no sense to me. 

Well, there are 3 more opportunities to evaluate the kids.  Might it not be better to get them used to the system they're expected to be playing in for 1 period rather than having them follow last season's protocol of "do what you've been doing all game, just maybe a little more (or a little less as the case may be)" in the 3rd.  Practice doesn't make perfect, it makes permanent.  

And for those that were in the system in year's past, there is a lot of stuff to unlearn along with learning the new.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, inkman said:

Sounds like a perfect fit for any team not named Sabres 

Did anyone actually watch the game via HULU / ESPN+?  I searched for it but the only Sabres games that came up in the search had already been played. 

When the game wasn't coming on over at the Sabres website tried to watch it on ESPN+ just because.  The game was there (1 of only 3 NHL games yesterday on ESPN+) but couldn't watch it because it was blacked out in the Sabres market.

[SabreFinn]

1 hour ago, Archie Lee said:

I think there have been a lot of successful NHL players over the years who played that style. It is not in their nature to be aggressive or physical or - pick your expression - “get to the net” or “mix it up”. They tend to play on the perimeter and often leave you wanting more. Some though are effective in their way. They can stabilize a line, cut-off the opposition or create offence with intelligence, instinct, speed and positioning rather than by relying on physicality. Of course it is better to have the complete package, but it is a rare player, even in the NHL, who has it all. 

I agree on that, I just don't see an opening in the roster where he could grab a spot. And I am just thinking he might have realized that himself also. But that doesn't mean that he can't be an NHL:er. If he keeps making points in AHL, there might be teams, even contenders, interested in him. 

[JoeSchmoe]

2 hours ago, SabreFinn said:

To me, that sounds like Rosén isn't motivated. Maybe he has realized he will be stuck in Rochester the rest of his time as a Sabre?

Picture our 3rd line from way back when we were good. We need that or better if we're going to win a cup.

Rosen, had a pedestrian 0.75ppg during his 20-21yo season in the AHL. It would take a MAJOR bump on his development curve to get to 05 to 07 era's 3rd line level.

[SabreFinn]

26 minutes ago, JoeSchmoe said:

Picture our 3rd line from way back when we were good. We need that or better if we're going to win a cup.

Rosen, had a pedestrian 0.75ppg during his 20-21yo season in the AHL. It would take a MAJOR bump on his development curve to get to 05 to 07 era's 3rd line level.

Funny thing with young players is that they might have that bump in their development curve. I just can't see that happening with Rosén. Not in this organisation, but a change of environment might help. That is why I think he should be part of a trade.

[dudacek]

44 minutes ago, JoeSchmoe said:

Picture our 3rd line from way back when we were good. We need that or better if we're going to win a cup.

Rosen, had a pedestrian 0.75ppg during his 20-21yo season in the AHL. It would take a MAJOR bump on his development curve to get to 05 to 07 era's 3rd line level.

You keep saying this. I’m not going to look it up again, but he was something like 2nd or 3rd in scoring among all U21 AHL players. His production was not pedestrian.

If you’re comparing to that 06 team, Jason Pominville had 34 points in 73 AHL games at the same stage of his career (Rosen had 50 in 67) and has a similar profile as a player in terms of strengths and weaknesses.

Edited September 25 by dudacek

[JoeSchmoe]

8 minutes ago, dudacek said:

You keep saying this. I’m not going to look it up again, but he was something like 2nd or 3rd in scoring among all U21 AHL players. His production was not pedestrian.

If you’re comparing to that 06 team, Jason Pominville had 34 points in 73 AHL games at the same stage of his career (Rosen had 50 in 67) and has a similar profile as a player in terms of strengths and weaknesses.

I think you may be a year too far back. Pominville was drafted in 2001 and had 64pt in 66 games in his 3rd year after being drafted (03-04).

To your point though, Pominville and Rosen were at about the same pace two years after being drafted. Pominville bumped in year 3 whereas Rosen didn't (or at least not as much). 

I agree with @SabreFinn that we should trade him (and should have done so already).

[dudacek]

22 minutes ago, JoeSchmoe said:

I think you may be a year too far back. Pominville was drafted in 2001 and had 64pt in 66 games in his 3rd year after being drafted (03-04).

To your point though, Pominville and Rosen were at about the same pace two years after being drafted. Pominville bumped in year 3 whereas Rosen didn't (or at least not as much). 

I agree with @SabreFinn that we should trade him (and should have done so already).

The discrepancy comes because Pominville was an older draft pick.

[Ctaeth]

Rosen, to me, has always felt like a player where the sum is less than its parts.  He is a great passer, has good speed, a good shot, and plays solid defense.  Someone referred to him as a peripheral player, but I'm not even sure I would call him that.  

[nfreeman]

In the brief snippets that I’ve seen Rosen, I’ve seen a number of flashes of skill and speed, but he seems to make the wrong decision whenever he has the puck in the offensive zone, resulting in a turnover – it’s reminiscence of Middlestadt in his first three or four seasons.

[Believer]

On 9/25/2024 at 9:36 AM, dudacek said:

The kid has real NHL skill and he doesn’t seem to get bullied out there, his game is just so quiet.

Interesting observation.