Peyton Krebs signs 2 year 1.45 million AAV contract

[Thorny]

40 minutes ago, Weave said:

At that price is he waiver-proof?  

Playoff proof 

[Taro T]

Just now, Thorny said:

That’s a lot of money for a 13th F, and when looking at comparables 

This is sort of just what the Sabres do. 

It is.  But it is right in line with what the presumed 11 and 12 are getting.  Still expect the 13th guy on any given night to be determined based upon matchups with the opponent that night.

 

[Thorny]

Just now, Taro T said:

It is.  But it is right in line with what the presumed 11 and 12 are getting.  Still expect the 13th guy on any given night to be determined based upon matchups with the opponent that night.

 

Kevyn Adams! 

[DarthEbriate]

39 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Not in my opinion.

Also in my opinion, the only way Krebs was ever getting waived was if Lindy just couldn't stand him, and I always thought he was Lindy's type

If waived, he'd likely be claimed by Columbus, which still needs to get to the cap floor and could play Krebs on their 3rd line. Barring a long-term camp injury, the question will be who is more likely to pass through waivers: Rousek 1x775k or Krebs 2x1.45M?

[Night Train]

With Krebs signed and all these off-season acquisitions of bottom 6 forwards, somebody has to be waived or traded. Can't see carrying so many extra's in the press box.

I guess this makes competition in camp more interesting than normal. 

[mjd1001]

28 minutes ago, Thorny said:

That’s a lot of money for a 13th F, and when looking at comparables 

This is sort of just what the Sabres do. 

I think its a bit too much, what options did he have? and what is he going to bring to the team?

On the other hand, its not really hurting them with cap space all that much. They have the room this year and likely next year.  I still think its too much.

[#freejame]

I like Peyton Krebs. Liked him before the trade, like him after the trade. I don’t see why he can’t be a 40pt, two-way energy guy. Glad he’s sticking around to prove me wrong.

[mjd1001]

I'm not devasted by this, its not a big deal, but why I don't like this deal that much...

Peyton Krebs. Hes not a bruiser, he's not a speedster. I haven't seen him play a game where I said "wow, he's really effective at forchecking".  I HAVE seen him on the ice for goals scored against the Sabres where if he was one step faster, put in a tiny bit more of an effort to catch up to the play or was faster,  a goal wouldn't have been scored when it was.  

So basically, I do not see anything that shows me is is anything else other than "another guy' in every way besides scoring.

So what about production?

Nick Robertson last year...14 goals in 56 games.

Peyton Krebs last year....4 goals in 80 games.

Robertson: 1 year deal at $875,000.  Krebs yet gets $1.45m per year and double the term.

[Thorny]

3 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

I think its a bit too much, what options did he have? and what is he going to bring to the team?

On the other hand, its not really hurting them with cap space all that much. They have the room this year and likely next year.  I still think its too much.

It eats away at the 8 mil we had for next year a bit, ya. But realistically the contract is a function of / evidence of the fact we don’t need that cap space this year + next ie don’t intent to use it. We gave Krebs the extra because we simply could 

Adams for one thing doesn’t seem concerned the dollars of his guys lining up with performance so much as whatever pre determined cap structure he’s figured out: saw it with Cozens and Samuelsson etc 

[Thorny]

5 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

I'm not devasted by this, its not a big deal, but why I don't like this deal that much...

Peyton Krebs. Hes not a bruiser, he's not a speedster. I haven't seen him play a game where I said "wow, he's really effective at forchecking".  I HAVE seen him on the ice for goals scored against the Sabres where if he was one step faster, put in a tiny bit more of an effort to catch up to the play or was faster,  a goal wouldn't have been scored when it was.  

So basically, I do not see anything that shows me is is anything else other than "another guy' in every way besides scoring.

So what about production?

Nick Robertson last year...14 goals in 56 games.

Peyton Krebs last year....4 goals in 80 games.

Robertson: 1 year deal at $875,000.  Krebs yet gets $1.45m per year and double the term.

That’s what I mean. Overpaying is one thing but it suggests a certainty of role that doesn’t seem to line up with the performance committed to record. Presumably you give 1.45 and 2 years to the “Robertson” you know you want to keep: the scary thing is, because I’m not convinced they feel that way with regards to Krebs, I think that leaves the deal less so reflective of certainty of role, as it is the certainty we have a bunch of money we won’t be using. Seems like they were at a stalemate waiting for him to sign his QO and the Sabres balked because they knew they were rejecting terms they could easily afford. Would be harder to sit on that

Edited Tuesday at 03:43 PM by Thorny

[Doohickie]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

1 hour ago, Bangarang said:

Kudos to Adams for getting the deal done with limited cap space. Ideally Krebs is the extra forward on game days 

The Sabres have 7 million left in cap space. That's a lot.

46 minutes ago, Thorny said:

That’s a lot of money for a 13th F, and when looking at comparables 

This is sort of just what the Sabres do. 

But neither are the Sabres right up against the cap.  So, meh.

[#freejame]

11 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

 

Nick Robertson last year...14 goals in 56 games.

Peyton Krebs last year....4 goals in 80 games.

Robertson: 1 year deal at $875,000.  Krebs yet gets $1.45m per year and double the term.

Robertson will almost certainly make more over the next two years than Peyton Krebs. 

[RochesterExpat]

As far as the contract goes, I'm fine with it. I think it's a bit much considering his body of work to his point, but we're not using the cap space for anything anyway and it's not my money. Worst case, he's a $400K buried cap hit.

14 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

Nick Robertson last year...14 goals in 56 games.

Peyton Krebs last year....4 goals in 80 games.

 

This is only a good comparison on that small bit of paper. Nick Robertson was coming off an ELC where he played a total of 56 games last season, 15 games the year prior, and total of 16 before that. Add in his 10 playoff games and that's 97 total NHL games. Krebs is now at 215 NHL games and that's an established NHL player whether this board agrees with it or not. It doesn't help Robertson's case that he went scoreless in 6 playoff games this season and was benched in the final game.

More importantly, Nick Robertson took what cap space the Leafs had left to make a massive bet on himself--technically he took extra since the Leafs are currently over on salary cap. He had zero arbitration rights. His QO was $813K. He got a $60K pay raise off of his QO. More importantly, he secured a one year deal where, when it expires, he will have arbitration rights. Arbiters are not allowed to consider a team's salary cap situation. This is going to be the same offseason that Marner and Tavares are off the books and will be a relatively pivotal moment for the Matthews-era Leafs. I can't fault Robertson for trying to maximize his own value given the extenuating circumstances. 

Yes, I'd rather have Robertson than Krebs in my lineup and, yes, Krebs is overpaid, but it's still not a good comparable.

Edited Tuesday at 03:52 PM by RochesterExpat

[#freejame]

1 minute ago, RochesterExpat said:

As far as the contract goes, I'm fine with it. I think it's a bit much considering his body of work to his point, but we're not using the cap space for anything anyway and it's not my money. Worst case, he's a $400K buried cap hit.

This is only a good comparison on paper. Nick Robertson was coming off an ELC where he played a total of 56 games last season, 15 games the year prior, and total of 16 before that. Add in his 10 playoff games and that's 97 total NHL games. Krebs is now at 215 NHL games and that's an established NHL player whether this board agrees with it or not. It doesn't help Robertson's case that he went scoreless in 6 playoff games this season and was benched in the final game.

More importantly, Nick Robertson took what cap space the Leafs had left to make a massive bet on himself--technically he took extra since the Leafs are currently over on salary cap. He had zero arbitration rights. His QO was $813K. He got a $60K pay raise off of his QO. More importantly, he secured a one year deal where, when it expires, he will have arbitration rights. Arbiters are not allowed to consider a team's salary cap situation. This is going to be the same offseason that Marner and Tavares are off the books and will be a relatively pivotal moment for the Matthews-era Leafs. I can't fault Robertson for trying to maximize his own value given the extenuating circumstances. 

Yes, I'd rather have Robertson than Krebs in my lineup and, yes, Krebs is overpaid, but it's still not a good comparable.

Great write-up. Wanted to say something similar, but yours is much better. 

[dudacek]

23 minutes ago, Night Train said:

With Krebs signed and all these off-season acquisitions of bottom 6 forwards, somebody has to be waived or traded. Can't see carrying so many extra's in the press box.

I guess this makes competition in camp more interesting than normal. 

The Sabres can carry a maximum of 3 extras.

Assuming Krebs is in stone as the 13th-forward and won't play unless injury (which I don't think is actually the case), it would be one of him, Rousek, Gilbert or Bryson getting waived.

If Levi (who is not waiver eligible) makes the team, you can add Reimer to that group.

If Kulich or another kid (none of them are waiver eligible) makes the team that would add another body.

But I think what this contract makes obvious is that Kevyn Adams thinks more of Peyton Krebs than a lot of people on here do and it is very unlikely he will be waived.

 

[WhenWillItEnd66]

Not a bad contract. I believe he has upside. The only problem i have is there any room for him?? I do not see any of the kids other then Kulich ready for the jump up, but we are still going to have a lot of bodies trying to get on the opening night roster. 

[dudacek]

30 minutes ago, Thorny said:

That’s what I mean. Overpaying is one thing but it suggests a certainty of role that doesn’t seem to line up with the performance committed to record. Presumably you give 1.45 and 2 years to the “Robertson” you know you want to keep: the scary thing is, because I’m not convinced they feel that way with regards to Krebs, I think that leaves the deal less so reflective of certainty of role, as it is the certainty we have a bunch of money we won’t be using. Seems like they were at a stalemate waiting for him to sign his QO and the Sabres balked because they knew they were rejecting terms they could easily afford 

Maybe Robertson signed his qualifier because the Leafs refused to honour his trade request and a low deal makes it more likely he does get claimed if he is waived?

He's basically created the best possible scenario for himself to be in the NHL next year.

The difference between Robertson and Krebs is that Robertson has not established himself as an NHL regular. Krebs has. To my knowledge he's not been a healthy scratch for a year and a half. He played 80 games last year.

The other thing I disagree with is the idea I've seen floated that Krebs is Tyson Jost.

Unlike Tyson Jost, Krebs has shown that he can play effectively in a bottom-six role. He was one of the Sabres more effective defensive players last year.

People are judging him through their trade-day top-6 glasses. The guy has shown he can be a decent 4C and the Sabres paid him like one.

Edited Tuesday at 04:13 PM by dudacek

[Flashsabre]

13 minutes ago, dudacek said:

The Sabres can carry a maximum of 3 extras.

Assuming Krebs is in stone as the 13th-forward and won't play unless injury (which I don't think is actually the case), it would be one of him, Rousek, Gilbert or Bryson getting waived.

If Levi (who is not waiver eligible) makes the team, you can add Reimer to that group.

If Kulich or another kid (none of them are waiver eligible) makes the team that would add another body.

But I think what this contract makes obvious is that Kevyn Adams thinks more of Peyton Krebs than a lot of people on here do and it is very unlikely he will be waived.

 

I’m very interested to see what the plan in net is.

UPL is the starter but are they keeping Reimer up and running Levi back and forth all season. I can’t see keeping 3 goalies up again as a viable option.

[msw2112]

Krebs has shown flashes of offensive talent, but has never put it all together in the NHL.  He's a feisty player and isn't afraid to mix it up and get under the other teams' skin, so he may be the type of player that Ruff likes.  A lot of us gave up on guys like Tage Thompson and Casey Mittlestadt and they eventually developed and broke through.  Will Krebs?  I don't know, but this contract is low enough that he'll be a bargain if he does and not too much of a liability if he doesn't.

[Two or less]

1 hour ago, Bangarang said:

Kudos to Adams for getting the deal done with limited cap space. Ideally Krebs is the extra forward on game days 

Maybe. He’s the type of player Lindy will love and it’ll drive fans insane bc he’s constantly not the one who’s in the press box. 
 

He’s one of the only guys who was willing to fight last few seasons, you’ll never question his compete, he’ll block shots and finish checks. 
 

I think Krebs will be a mainstay in our lineup for Lindy. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

Besides Lafferty, does any of the contracts KA signed this summer make sense?  $5 mill for 32 pt player in Zucker, 5 years at 4.75 for a goalie with one good year in pro hockey, 2 years at 1.45 for a 13th forward who had 4 goals last year.  1.5 for a depth forward that hasn’t been good enough to play a full season for any of his previous teams.  2 years at 1.35 for a 26 year old rookie with 6 goals.  

Not that any of these deals are horrible on their face, but they are all overpayments and some significantly like Zucker and UPL.  Not a surprise given he paid a 2nd rd pick for the 26 year old rookie forward and a former top prospect for a 3rd line center with a career high of 12 goals 30 points. 

[Two or less]

1 minute ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Besides Lafferty, does any of the contracts KA signed this summer make sense?  $5 mill for 32 pt player in Zucker, 5 years at 4.75 for a goalie with one good year in pro hockey, 2 years at 1.45 for a 13th forward who had 4 goals last year.  1.5 for a depth forward that hasn’t been good enough to play a full season for any of his previous teams.  2 years at 1.35 for a 26 year old rookie with 6 goals.  

Not that any of these deals are horrible on their face, but they are all overpayments and some significantly like Zucker and UPL.  Not a surprise given he paid a 2nd rd pick for the 26 year old rookie forward and a former top prospect for a 3rd line center with a career high of 12 goals 30 points. 

You’ll never get a player like Zucker to sign with Buffalo coming off 13 straight seasons without a playoff appearance without going over value on him. Sabres are not only paying for goals and assists, but veteran leadership and someone who can uphold a high standard at practice of playing the right way. 
 

I think UPL’s deal is fine, very tradeable deal if Devon Levi becomes the true #1 in the near future. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

2 minutes ago, Two or less said:

You’ll never get a player like Zucker to sign with Buffalo coming off 13 straight seasons without a playoff appearance without going over value on him. Sabres are not only paying for goals and assists, but veteran leadership and someone who can uphold a high standard at practice of playing the right way. 
 

I think UPL’s deal is fine, very tradeable deal if Devon Levi becomes the true #1 in the near future. 

That does change the fact that all are overpayments.  

[mjd1001]

51 minutes ago, RochesterExpat said:

As far as the contract goes, I'm fine with it. I think it's a bit much considering his body of work to his point, but we're not using the cap space for anything anyway and it's not my money. Worst case, he's a $400K buried cap hit.

This is only a good comparison on that small bit of paper. Nick Robertson was coming off an ELC where he played a total of 56 games last season, 15 games the year prior, and total of 16 before that. Add in his 10 playoff games and that's 97 total NHL games. Krebs is now at 215 NHL games and that's an established NHL player whether this board agrees with it or not. It doesn't help Robertson's case that he went scoreless in 6 playoff games this season and was benched in the final game.

More importantly, Nick Robertson took what cap space the Leafs had left to make a massive bet on himself--technically he took extra since the Leafs are currently over on salary cap. He had zero arbitration rights. His QO was $813K. He got a $60K pay raise off of his QO. More importantly, he secured a one year deal where, when it expires, he will have arbitration rights. Arbiters are not allowed to consider a team's salary cap situation. This is going to be the same offseason that Marner and Tavares are off the books and will be a relatively pivotal moment for the Matthews-era Leafs. I can't fault Robertson for trying to maximize his own value given the extenuating circumstances. 

Yes, I'd rather have Robertson than Krebs in my lineup and, yes, Krebs is overpaid, but it's still not a good comparable.

I'm not saying they are the same players.  I'm just saying Krebs does not excel in any other area (defense, getting back to his own end quickly, faceoffs, physical play)...he's at best 'another guy' in those areas...so I feel he should get the league minimum.  If there is anything that justifies more than that, its if he has shown signs of production, and my comparison shows, compared to others in the league that did sign for much lower values, he has not even shown that.

Yeah, their situations are different, different teams, different longevity in the league. The one thing that is not different is neither has shown they are a complete player and you really don't have much of a reason to give over league minimum for both. One accepted that and took a lower deal, a 'prove it to me' deal. The other either wouldn't accept that, or was offered much more when it wasn't needed/justified.

Robertson gave the leafs SOMETHING (scoring in the teens over 56 games, a 20+ goal pace) and that still wasn't enough to justify more than what he accepted.  I don't even get close to that out of Krebs, and I personally don't think he brings much in any other part of the game, to justify what he got.

Edited Tuesday at 04:43 PM by mjd1001

[WhenWillItEnd66]

18 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Besides Lafferty, does any of the contracts KA signed this summer make sense?  $5 mill for 32 pt player in Zucker, 5 years at 4.75 for a goalie with one good year in pro hockey, 2 years at 1.45 for a 13th forward who had 4 goals last year.  1.5 for a depth forward that hasn’t been good enough to play a full season for any of his previous teams.  2 years at 1.35 for a 26 year old rookie with 6 goals.  

Not that any of these deals are horrible on their face, but they are all overpayments and some significantly like Zucker and UPL.  Not a surprise given he paid a 2nd rd pick for the 26 year old rookie forward and a former top prospect for a 3rd line center with a career high of 12 goals 30 points. 

When you suck ass for a dozen years and not make the playoffs you get what you get until you prove you can be a winning team. We have not shown that as of yet.