Game Discussion Thread: Prospects Challenge vs Devils, 9/14/24

[LGR4GM]

Guess Leenders needs to figure it the ***** out

 

 

[PerreaultForever]

From these 2 games there are some interesting prospects but right now Kulich is the only one who might press for a roster spot on the Sabres. 

[dudacek]

13 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

From these 2 games there are some interesting prospects but right now Kulich is the only one who might press for a roster spot on the Sabres. 

It's an NHL roster designed with no space for any of these guys, including Kulich.

[Crusader1969]

10 minutes ago, dudacek said:

It's an NHL roster designed with no space for any of these guys, including Kulich.

What happens if he blows the doors off at camp? If you really want to bring the best out of players, you have to have competition.  I think he has a really good chance to start the season with Sabres 

[mjd1001]

19 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

What happens if he blows the doors off at camp? If you really want to bring the best out of players, you have to have competition.  I think he has a really good chance to start the season with Sabres 

A lot of people want Greenway around, but a 'top 9' spot can be had if Kulich is awesome in camp, and I think Greenway ($3 salary, last year) might be the odd man out, or at least the guy in the press box IF Kulich gets a spot in Buffalo.

[dudacek]

Just now, Crusader1969 said:

What happens if he blows the doors off at camp? If you really want to bring the best out of players, you have to have competition.  I think he has a really good chance to start the season with Sabres 

I think my point is that in order to make the roster he will have to blow the doors off in camp, not just be good enough.

Prospects challenge is a way to see how the prospects stand up against their peers: what their games are and where the holes are.

Not sure if this was exactly his point, but I generally agree with @PerreaultForever in the sense that Kulich is the only one you look at and not say "he's going to have to ... before he takes a step"

Ryan Johnson might be an exception?

I think there might be a 1/2-dozen guys out there tonight who have some tools that translate to NHL potential

Helenius looks pretty well-rounded, but needs more exposure to the pace before he can make plays at the next level.

Rosen has flat-out NHL skill, but needs to produce more or defend better to carve out a role.

Komarov and Novikov have NHL size and aggression, they have to show they can handle NHL speed

Östlund has NHL speed, motor and IQ, he needs to show he can handle NHL size

Wahlberg's a physical beast who can skate, but his hands and processor ain't there yet

To put this in perspective, Kulich and Rosen are the only guys on this team who have played 100 pro games yet.

[JoeSchmoe]

29 minutes ago, dudacek said:

It's an NHL roster designed with no space for any of these guys, including Kulich.

I feel like all the groupthink and armchair GM's on here have anointed our 4th as being set in stone when as far as I know, the team has said nothing at all to that effect.

These new guys are all making tweener salaries (between press box and playing). On a 23 man roster, any one of them can be alternated in and out of the lineup. As I said in another thread, Greenway can easily be dropped to the 4th line in favour of a legitimate scoring threat.

And all that says nothing about the inevitable injuries we'll be sure to get.

In short, between injuries and the team likely carrying 14 forwards... as long as Kulich comes in hot in training camp, he's on the team.

[dudacek]

5 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

A lot of people want Greenway around, but a 'top 9' spot can be had if Kulich is awesome in camp, and I think Greenway ($3 salary, last year) might be the odd man out, or at least the guy in the press box IF Kulich gets a spot in Buffalo.

Not saying you're wrong, but there is nothing in the resumes of Malenstyn, Lafferty, McLeod or Aube-Kubel other than being acquired by Kevyn Adams this summer that suggests they are or should be ahead of Greenway in the pecking order.

Krebs is another one Kulich would have to elbow aside.

[dudacek]

14 minutes ago, JoeSchmoe said:

I feel like all the groupthink and armchair GM's on here have anointed our 4th as being set in stone when as far as I know, the team has said nothing at all to that effect.

These new guys are all making tweener salaries (between press box and playing). On a 23 man roster, any one of them can be alternated in and out of the lineup. As I said in another thread, Greenway can easily be dropped to the 4th line in favour of a legitimate scoring threat.

And all that says nothing about the inevitable injuries we'll be sure to get.

In short, between injuries and the team likely carrying 14 forwards... as long as Kulich comes in hot in training camp, he's on the team.

As it sits right now, he's the 15th forward. I suspect they will keep 13 and 8 D, but we shall see.

2 of Krebs, Rousek, Aube-Kubel, Gilbert and Bryson would have to waived for Kulich makes the roster, three if they stupidly keep 3 goalies again. If he's outright better, he'll make it, but if there'a any doubt about him being an every-night player, he will go to the minors and be the first call-up.

I agree with you on the 4th line thing.

Edited September 15 by dudacek

[mjd1001]

13 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Not saying you're wrong, but there is nothing in the resumes of Malenstyn, Lafferty, McLeod or Aube-Kubel other than being acquired by Kevyn Adams this summer that suggests they are or should be ahead of Greenway in the pecking order.

Krebs is another one Kulich would have to elbow aside.

Not on their 'resumes' so to speak, but it could be about style, a 'forcheck' first thing Ruff maybe wants?  All 4 of those guys are consistently in the top 10 percentile of fasted skaters in the league.  Greenway is not.  That doesn't mean Greenway won't make the team, but if style of play means anything, all of those guys above have something Greenway does not, and they all were aquired/selected AFTER Ruff became coach.

I personally think you just take the best guys from camp. Sure they may have who they THINK will be on the roster, but I think what you do is have an open mind, and the top 12 guys that fit the roles you want them to fit in, you take them. If Kulich outperforms Krebs, then he gets a spot over Krebs. If Greenway outperforms Aube-Kubel, he gets that spot...and so on. Let camp play out.

Edited September 15 by mjd1001

[phil_soisson]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

It's an NHL roster designed with no space for any of these guys, including Kulich.

Kulich's body of work includes 50+ goals in 120 AHL games. He should get a legitimate shot to make the this team at camp. No one should be penciled in after 13 years without playoffs, especially free agent pickups just to make Adams look good, when some "prospect" outearns them.

[JoeSchmoe]

28 minutes ago, dudacek said:

2 of Krebs, Rousek, Aube-Kubel, Gilbert and Bryson would have to waived for Kulich

Rousek would need to be waived as well?

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

It's an NHL roster designed with no space for any of these guys, including Kulich.

Most likely. I'm just saying Kulich might press for a roster spot and force them to make a difficult decision. Benson played his way onto the roster last year. Kulich could force a decision. Might not, but he's the only one of them that I see having that chance right now. 

49 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I think my point is that in order to make the roster he will have to blow the doors off in camp, not just be good enough.

Prospects challenge is a way to see how the prospects stand up against their peers: what their games are and where the holes are.

Not sure if this was exactly his point, but I generally agree with @PerreaultForever in the sense that Kulich is the only one you look at and not say "he's going to have to ... before he takes a step"

Ryan Johnson might be an exception?

I think there might be a 1/2-dozen guys out there tonight who have some tools that translate to NHL potential

Helenius looks pretty well-rounded, but needs more exposure to the pace before he can make plays at the next level.

Rosen has flat-out NHL skill, but needs to produce more or defend better to carve out a role.

Komarov and Novikov have NHL size and aggression, they have to show they can handle NHL speed

Östlund has NHL speed, motor and IQ, he needs to show he can handle NHL size

Wahlberg's a physical beast who can skate, but his hands and processor ain't there yet

To put this in perspective, Kulich and Rosen are the only guys on this team who have played 100 pro games yet.

I was actually underwhelmed by him. He's good at that level, but he should be dominant if he was in any way ready to bump any of the starting 6 we currently have. He's not. Not even close. 

[PerreaultForever]

33 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

Not on their 'resumes' so to speak, but it could be about style, a 'forcheck' first thing Ruff maybe wants?  All 4 of those guys are consistently in the top 10 percentile of fasted skaters in the league.  Greenway is not.  That doesn't mean Greenway won't make the team, but if style of play means anything, all of those guys above have something Greenway does not, and they all were aquired/selected AFTER Ruff became coach.

I personally think you just take the best guys from camp. Sure they may have who they THINK will be on the roster, but I think what you do is have an open mind, and the top 12 guys that fit the roles you want them to fit in, you take them. If Kulich outperforms Krebs, then he gets a spot over Krebs. If Greenway outperforms Aube-Kubel, he gets that spot...and so on. Let camp play out.

The thing is I don't see Ruff just taking the 12 best guys, I see him creating the 4 best lines. There's often a big difference in those approaches. 

[thewookie1]

Frankly I wouldn’t even say the first two games indicate anything when it comes to Kulich making the team. They may have him play the 2 Czech games as long as he plays well enough and then send him down once they get back to Buffalo.

[nfreeman]

4 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

idk, Komarov is big but he skates really awkward at times and there's this hesitation in his game that makes me think he won't be able to handle NHL speed. Definitely needs more development imo. 

 

4 hours ago, Flashsabre said:

His skating has always been awkward but I think he has a chance to be special 

I only watched the 2nd half of the game, but I was pretty impressed with Komarov.  He looked highly skilled and confident and his skating seemed fine.

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, nfreeman said:

 

I only watched the 2nd half of the game, but I was pretty impressed with Komarov.  He looked highly skilled and confident and his skating seemed fine.

He's fine in open ice but he struggles when the puck is around his skates. It's the awkward big man thing. Not sure how good he will be along the boards and in front of the net. We shall see. I think he needs a fair bit of time yet though. 

[triumph_communes]

6 hours ago, JoeSchmoe said:

I feel like all the groupthink and armchair GM's on here have anointed our 4th as being set in stone when as far as I know, the team has said nothing at all to that effect.

These new guys are all making tweener salaries (between press box and playing). On a 23 man roster, any one of them can be alternated in and out of the lineup. As I said in another thread, Greenway can easily be dropped to the 4th line in favour of a legitimate scoring threat.

And all that says nothing about the inevitable injuries we'll be sure to get.

In short, between injuries and the team likely carrying 14 forwards... as long as Kulich comes in hot in training camp, he's on the team.

Because it’s Lindy and he wants his tools and Kulich is more of the same whereas the new acquisitions fit a role 

[Turbo44]

7 hours ago, dudacek said:

It's an NHL roster designed with no space for any of these guys, including Kulich.

Injuries do happen that would open up a spot for Kulich, or maybe Rousek. A PP with Tage one timing from the left and Kulich on the right would be pretty lethal. Kulich hs been heads ne shoulders better than his competition and teammates so far

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, Turbo44 said:

Injuries do happen that would open up a spot for Kulich, or maybe Rousek. A PP with Tage one timing from the left and Kulich on the right would be pretty lethal. Kulich hs been heads ne shoulders better than his competition and teammates so far

No it wouldn't. 

[LGR4GM]

Tyler Tullio was ranked 38th by EP in his draft year and was 5'9". Now at 5'11" and with more muscle, I wonder if he's a dark horse to be in the bottom of the Sabres lineup later in the year. He's played very well in the tournament. 

[Taro T]

7 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

He's fine in open ice but he struggles when the puck is around his skates. It's the awkward big man thing. Not sure how good he will be along the boards and in front of the net. We shall see. I think he needs a fair bit of time yet though. 

Well, considering he's at best 11th on the depth chart at present, he will get that time.

[Taro T]

10 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

Frankly I wouldn’t even say the first two games indicate anything when it comes to Kulich making the team. They may have him play the 2 Czech games as long as he plays well enough and then send him down once they get back to Buffalo.

Would be shocked if Ruff would put Kulich in the 2 Euro games and then send him down as soon as they get back on this side of the pond.  This season is about winning and unless they see Kulich as earning one of the top 12 slots they aren't going to risk starting the year 0-2 because of feelz.  And if he is in the top 12 after camp, can't see him dropping to 14/15 after 2 games.

Fully expect him to get action against Red Bull, but then expect him and about 5 others to be deemed Amerks by the time the games move to Czechia.

[JohnC]

11 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Most likely. I'm just saying Kulich might press for a roster spot and force them to make a difficult decision. Benson played his way onto the roster last year. Kulich could force a decision. Might not, but he's the only one of them that I see having that chance right now. 

I was actually underwhelmed by him. He's good at that level, but he should be dominant if he was in any way ready to bump any of the starting 6 we currently have. He's not. Not even close. 

I'm not saying you are wrong in your assessment of Ryan Johnson, but I have a different view on him. His even-keel style of play will never fall in the eye-popping category where you will ever consider him to be a dominant (your adjective) player. But he is the type of player who could be the B partner in any of the pairings. He's simply a smooth and efficient defenseman whose contributions are not always appreciated because of the understated way he plays. Needless to say, I think a lot more highly of him than you do. 

[Taro T]

11 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Most likely. I'm just saying Kulich might press for a roster spot and force them to make a difficult decision. Benson played his way onto the roster last year. Kulich could force a decision. Might not, but he's the only one of them that I see having that chance right now. 

I was actually underwhelmed by him. He's good at that level, but he should be dominant if he was in any way ready to bump any of the starting 6 we currently have. He's not. Not even close. 

Personally see 4 "kids" with a VERY outside shot (well 3 with a very outside shot and 1 with an outside shot) of making the Sabres out of camp: Kulich, Johnson, Rousek, and Levi.

Expect before the season is out Kulich and Levi will be full time Sabres with Johnson having a little less than a 50-50 shot of being full time on the big club by then and Rousek needed a few injuries in the bottom 6 to even get to that level of chances he's a full time Sabre by the end of the year.

There's a few others that will likely get looks when injuries hit (Tullio, Rosen, maybe Östlund, Helenius, or even very outside chance of Wahlberg) but doubt any of them stick when the guy they're in for gets healthy.