LGR4GM Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 This is the guy Helenius would need to be better than because Tage and Cozens aren't sitting. I don't think it even remotely likely Helenius can be better than this at 18. At 22, sure but not at 18 playing for the first time the NA style/ system Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustache of God Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 It is exceedingly rare for an 18 year old kid to jump straight to the NHL, especially when they're not at the top of the draft. Benson was an exception and only because the team had zero depth which made his window of opportunity slightly bigger. I am hopeful that when call-ups arise, we'll be looking for Kulich, Rosen or hopefully a taste of Helenius and not Lukas Rousek since GMKA spent the off-season filling in those types of roles. What if Benson hits a sophomore slump this year and struggles in camp? Is there a chance Helenius can take his spot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drag0nDan Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 3 minutes ago, Mustache of God said: It is exceedingly rare for an 18 year old kid to jump straight to the NHL, especially when they're not at the top of the draft. Benson was an exception and only because the team had zero depth which made his window of opportunity slightly bigger. I am hopeful that when call-ups arise, we'll be looking for Kulich, Rosen or hopefully a taste of Helenius and not Lukas Rousek since GMKA spent the off-season filling in those types of roles. What if Benson hits a sophomore slump this year and struggles in camp? Is there a chance Helenius can take his spot? Quinn getting hurt opened up a spot for Benson as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 57 minutes ago, Mustache of God said: It is exceedingly rare for an 18 year old kid to jump straight to the NHL, especially when they're not at the top of the draft. Benson was an exception and only because the team had zero depth which made his window of opportunity slightly bigger. I am hopeful that when call-ups arise, we'll be looking for Kulich, Rosen or hopefully a taste of Helenius and not Lukas Rousek since GMKA spent the off-season filling in those types of roles. What if Benson hits a sophomore slump this year and struggles in camp? Is there a chance Helenius can take his spot? Far more likely Kulich would take that spot over Helenius if Benson were to struggle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 Hoppe and Jokinen make a fair case the Helenius might be “ready” for the NHL. However, I don’t believe it’s in Buffalo’s or the kid’s best interest to start the year in Buffalo even if he is good enough physically. He needs to learn to play at speed on the smaller ice surface. The Sabres also have no need to rush anyone. The Benson situation was unique. The Quinn injury coupled with Benson being required to play in the CHL forced the Sabres hand. He didn’t look out of place in the NHL, but he was often physically over matched. Send Helenius to Rochester. If he dominates, then call him up and see what happens. One other note. McLeod isn’t sitting. He is the Sabres best FO guy and he has NHL experience at wing. He also kills penalties. I’d say Lafferty or Aube-Kubel would sit before McLeod as neither player contributes on special teams. Malenstyn played over 200 PK minutes last year. Of the new 4th liners, I expect him in the lineup nightly because of his PK ability, hitting and speed. Note: Returning top Sabres Pker forwards - Greenway (194 minutes), Cozens (126), Tuch (121) and then Quinn (30 minutes - would be 90+ in a full season). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashsabre Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 There is no need for Helenius to start the year in Buffalo. Start him in Rochester and if he blows the doors off then figure something out. A solid AHL season and he can be called up if a major injury happens. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjd1001 Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 (edited) 1 hour ago, Flashsabre said: There is no need for Helenius to start the year in Buffalo. Start him in Rochester and if he blows the doors off then figure something out. A solid AHL season and he can be called up if a major injury happens. Agreed. There are very few players that are so good they can't learn from time in the AHL. A new country. The language. The rink size. The different style of NA game. If he is 'good enough' to be a mid-level forward in the NHL, he can be even better than that in a year after a season in the AHL. If you put him in the AHL and he dominates at 18, is in the top 10 in the league in scoring and takes over games...then you bring him up if you want. If not, then he can still stay down there and learn. Edited August 2 by mjd1001 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 1 hour ago, Flashsabre said: There is no need for Helenius to start the year in Buffalo. Start him in Rochester and if he blows the doors off then figure something out. A solid AHL season and he can be called up if a major injury happens. I truly hope that is correct, but if he’s better than the guy “in front of him,” he should play. Period. Even if it’s at wing. If he makes the team better, he should play. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 The Savoie injury also played a big role in Benson getting his shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MISabresFan Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 I remember a radio conversation they were having with Craig Button. He was addressing the differences in play between the AHL and NHL. He commented that in the AHL, players hold on to the puck longer than in the NHL. I wonder how that plays into player development. If a player shows up in camp and can play with the big boys, do you want to send him down and learn different skills? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 1 hour ago, Flashsabre said: There is no need for Helenius to start the year in Buffalo. Start him in Rochester and if he blows the doors off then figure something out. A solid AHL season and he can be called up if a major injury happens. Only thing I want to add here is the Sabres do not need to "figure something out" because the answer is simple, if he is lighting up the AHL, leave him the AHL until injury requires him. Sabres shouldn't open a spot in their NHL lineup for an 18yr. That's what teams planning to miss the playoffs and continue building do. 5 minutes ago, SwampD said: I truly hope that is correct, but if he’s better than the guy “in front of him,” he should play. Period. Even if it’s at wing. If he makes the team better, he should play. He isn't and he won't be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 26 minutes ago, mjd1001 said: Agreed. There are very few players that are so good they can't learn from time in the AHL. A new country. The language. The rink size. The different style of NA game. If he is 'good enough' to be a mid-level forward in the NHL, he can be even better than that in a year after a season in the AHL. If you put him in the AHL and he dominates at 18, is in the top 10 in the league in scoring and takes over games...then you bring him up. If not, then he can still stay down there and learn. No you don't. Again, you don't clear a spot in your NHL roster for an 18yr old who is playing well in the AHL. Of course I think Helenius will probably start slow in the AHL and will take a couple months to adjust anyways but that doesn't mean that if he is a ppg player in the AHL you go "oh man, gotta find a spot for him, sorry McLeod or idk Benson or whatever, we are going to sit you for this kid". No, he simply stays in the AHL and continues to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjd1001 Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 5 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: No you don't. Again, you don't clear a spot in your NHL roster for an 18yr old who is playing well in the AHL. Of course I think Helenius will probably start slow in the AHL and will take a couple months to adjust anyways but that doesn't mean that if he is a ppg player in the AHL you go "oh man, gotta find a spot for him, sorry McLeod or idk Benson or whatever, we are going to sit you for this kid". No, he simply stays in the AHL and continues to work. I get what you are saying, but I'm not saying if he is just a PPG player. I meant what I really wrote...top 10 in the NHL in scoring, and his overall game is so good he is taking over (dominating) games. Even then I'm not even saying you give him a permanent spot on the Sabres. If, IF he was playing that well over 1/2 of a season down there, then you bring him up, see how he does fit into the NHL, and worst case scenario he goes back down and now has more of an idea how close/far away he is from a permanent NHL player. I agree with the concept that just about every prospect (unless your name is McDavid or Matthews) could benefit from time in the AHL, and many/most should have more than a season down there. My point was in the slight chance he really dominates, give him a look up here to see how he fits in (if he earns it), but that doesn't mean giving him a sport, nor does it mean 'showing flashes only' in the AHL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 3 hours ago, Mustache of God said: It is exceedingly rare for an 18 year old kid to jump straight to the NHL, especially when they're not at the top of the draft. Benson was an exception and only because the team had zero depth which made his window of opportunity slightly bigger. I am hopeful that when call-ups arise, we'll be looking for Kulich, Rosen or hopefully a taste of Helenius and not Lukas Rousek since GMKA spent the off-season filling in those types of roles. What if Benson hits a sophomore slump this year and struggles in camp? Is there a chance Helenius can take his spot? It would be a wild stroke of luck if the Sabres had two straight years of an 18 year old making the line up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 26 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: Only thing I want to add here is the Sabres do not need to "figure something out" because the answer is simple, if he is lighting up the AHL, leave him the AHL until injury requires him. Sabres shouldn't open a spot in their NHL lineup for an 18yr. That's what teams planning to miss the playoffs and continue building do. He isn't and he won't be. Oh, thank god. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimlach Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 2 hours ago, LGR4GM said: Far more likely Kulich would take that spot over Helenius if Benson were to struggle. Isn't Benson ineligible to play in the AHL due to his age? He does not turn 20 until next May. So if Benson struggles, what do they do to keep him playing and developing? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 5 minutes ago, Pimlach said: Isn't Benson ineligible to play in the AHL due to his age? He does not turn 20 until next May. So if Benson struggles, what do they do to keep him playing and developing? Correct, Benson is not AHL eligible. Tbh, I just don't believe a scenario exists where Benson isn't better than last year. If he struggles, you bench him for Krebs or Kulich and Benson figures his ***** out at practice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashsabre Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 McLeod is a good centre. He is what the doctor ordered at 3C. If Helenuis turns into a Lundell in a couple years then they are in good shape down the middle. I don’t know what the plan with Krebs is. Is he 13th forward, is he moved as part of a trade for a top 6 winger? That Sabres video sure indicated that they love the new 4th line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 (edited) 1 hour ago, Flashsabre said: I don’t know what the plan with Krebs is. Is he 13th forward, is he moved as part of a trade for a top 6 winger? That Sabres video sure indicated that they love the new 4th line. I think people tend to fall into thinking “he’s the 13th forward so he doesn’t fit” when the fact is that the “13th forward” plays a lot, the opening night roster rarely sticks, roles change, injuries happen, and players fall in and out of favour. This time last year we would probably be arguing as to whether or not the 13th forward was Jost or Olofsson. Regardless, that player was already in the starting line-up due to Quinn’s injury. That same injury created an opening for the “14th forward” which Benson seized, and he quickly pushed past those two to become a lineup regular. Meanwhile, disappointing results led Adams to add Robinson into that same mix at the bottom of the roster. Bottom line? The Sabres 12th, 13th and 14th most used forwards last year played 51, 43 and 40 games respectively. And the “14th forward” going in, Benson, actually finished 8th on the team in ice time. In terms of where he fits, Krebs might end up like Jost did, or he might end up like Benson. But your 13th forward is going to get used and how good he is matters. Edited August 2 by dudacek 1 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted August 2 Report Share Posted August 2 Agree with the above. We finallllllly have some depth. Basketball is all about stars as they play almost the entire game. Stars matter in hockey but when the best only play less than half the game you had better have depth. Injuries are unfortunately part of it too. I'm disappointed we didn't add a game-changer in the top 6 but on paper, this is the best depth the Sabres have had in years. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimlach Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 20 hours ago, dudacek said: I think people tend to fall into thinking “he’s the 13th forward so he doesn’t fit” when the fact is that the “13th forward” plays a lot, the opening night roster rarely sticks, roles change, injuries happen, and players fall in and out of favour. This time last year we would probably be arguing as to whether or not the 13th forward was Jost or Olofsson. Regardless, that player was already in the starting line-up due to Quinn’s injury. That same injury created an opening for the “14th forward” which Benson seized, and he quickly pushed past those two to become a lineup regular. Meanwhile, disappointing results led Adams to add Robinson into that same mix at the bottom of the roster. Bottom line? The Sabres 12th, 13th and 14th most used forwards last year played 51, 43 and 40 games respectively. And the “14th forward” going in, Benson, actually finished 8th on the team in ice time. In terms of where he fits, Krebs might end up like Jost did, or he might end up like Benson. But your 13th forward is going to get used and how good he is matters. ^ A voice of reason. Some people here are posting to trade Krebs and/or Greenway, which essentially takes away any NHL level depth we have. It's one thing to trade one of them if we get an NHL forward in return, but there is no sense in trading them just to make room for prospects. We have prospects in Rochester that will see some NHL ice, but I prefer to see them advance past the NHL roster guys before we hand them NHL jobs. Ruff will use his entire roster. If a forward is not working, then the 13th forward (likely to be Krebs) will get ice. Having guys that can play center and wing is valuable. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 On 8/3/2024 at 10:44 AM, Pimlach said: Having guys that can play center and wing is valuable. *cough* *cough* Casey Mittelstadt *cough* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimlach Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 1 hour ago, Doohickie said: *cough* *cough* Casey Mittelstadt *cough* I think both McLeod and Lafferty can play both, so can Krebs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 Tappara issues statement that makes it appear as though Helenius will be playing in NA this season. They wished him good luck. I would count on Helenius then opening the year in Rochester. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted August 5 Report Share Posted August 5 3 hours ago, LGR4GM said: Tappara issues statement that makes it appear as though Helenius will be playing in NA this season. They wished him good luck. I would count on Helenius then opening the year in Rochester. Translation: Konsta Helenius signed a rookie contract in the NHL in the summer and is looking for a place to play in the Buffalo Sabres' organization. Tappara wishes his breed good luck on the journey! #Tappara #Liiga Breed? 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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