Fire Kevyn Adams

[Night Train]

This must be an ad for a stool softener. 

[nfreeman]

22 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I guess Adams forgot how to make trades since the Eichel, Risto and Reinhart trades. 🤔

If a team wants one of our prospects they can make a legit offer. It feels like yesterday when people were losing their minds over Eichel not getting moved immediately. Everyone thought Adams was over a barrel. Instead Kev held fast until VGK got serious.

What you call inexperience is more the opposite. Anyone of you whiners would have been taken to the cleaners while you show off the magic beans you just acquired.

Adams will make a trade when teams start offering value.

 

20 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Nice story, bro.

Here's what was exchanged:

VGK:

>Jack Eichel2

>2023 third-round pick (Mathieu Cataford)

BUF:

>Alex Tuch

>Peyton Krebs

>2022 first-round pick (Noah Östlund)

>2023 second-round pick (Riley Heidt)

Considering how many of us were willing to take a bag of pucks just to get Eichel off the team, I'd say Kev did well. 

Funny you didn't bring up getting a 1 for Risto (Isak Rosen) and getting Devon Levi and 1st (Jiri Kulich) from the Panthers.

Well, I agree with some of what you've said in this thread, but taking a victory lap on the Eichel and Reino trades at this point is just insane.

[Pimlach]

15 hours ago, Mr Peabody said:

I always wondered if there was friction between Eichel and KA before KA got the job.  

There may have been.  Certainly KA was not impressed at all with the team culture and there were known "factions of friends" within the team.  There are reports of young players and 4th liners being snubbed by Eichel and the cool kids.  The team had no soul and you could see it on the ice.  

My channels always point to the road trip that Adams went on when Bots/Krueger were at the helm.  He was not part of Hockey Ops yet he traveled with them and no doubt he did a detailed report to TP on what he saw and heard.  

Kruger was exposed as a fraud and Covid hit, and TP  and KP started to worry about the finances and started streamlining the empire and cutting costs.  Bots said he was not going to comply with massive layoffs, the EEE (under the cap) policies, and another rebuild.  Goodbye Bots and hello Kevyn, the guy with almost no Hockey Ops experience but yet we trust.  

Eichel's injury and how to treat it was the easy out for everyone involved.  Don't think that other players and agents did not see this.  Lehner was already out there complaining about the team, the doctors, the culture, and he clearly thought he did not get good support from the team.  

You heard Eichel's interview after Buffalo beat Vegas on his return game.  He certainly had bad feelings when he left.  

 

Edited June 30 by Pimlach

[JohnC]

20 hours ago, Taro T said:

Considering the moves the teams around the Sabres have made, barring something major happening in the next couple of days, yes, they'd need a fairly substantial bit if luck to make the playoffs this season.

Still say Adams focus is on '26-'27 and being a legit contender that year.  Hoping we don't find out if Pegula is fully on board with that being the goal at the expense of this upcoming season. 

 

I understand why you are saying that the GM is focusing more on the 26-27 season, but I don't buy it at all. Our GM is not so clueless of where this team currently is, and its standing with the fanbase. He also has enough self-awareness that if he doesn't show some success soon (playoffs) that he will be another staffing casualty. The Sabres have had many of their best players work feverishly to get out of this deeply stuck franchise. If our GM has a nickel's worth of common sense, he would realize that the constant attention to the future at the expense of the present is a self-crippling approach to continue with that "get me out of here" attitude.  

I'm simply not receptive to your proposition that the GM is more focused on the future a few years down the road than he is about the near future i.e. next season. That is not to say that he would willing to jettison a lot of his assets for a short-term burst of success that sells out the future. My point is that he is very concerned about the upcoming season and is willing to do what he needs to do, within reason, to have a successful season this year.  I'm sure he is now at the stage where his attention is about the now. 

Edited June 30 by JohnC

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, Mango said:

Dude. That’s insane.

That would put the Sabres at what, 16 years? And the Adams era at like a 6-7 year drought? On its own that would be the 3rd/4th longest active drought in the league. 

That is a totally unreasonable time frame to “focus” on. 

 

 

Did not say that Adams doesn't want to make the playoffs now.  He wants to be there and thought he had a team good enough to be there last year. 

But am fairly convinced that he isn't going to give up enough future assets to make that a very likely outcome today at the cost of being a legit contender then.

Personally do expect him to be in on trying to get some FAs and might even pull the trigger on Eriksson Ek (or similar).  But even that won't cost much of his prospect pool.

IF the GTing holds up & they stay healthy, do expect they'll be in the mix.  But right now would say they'd be on the outside looking in.  Let's see what happens the next few days, but right now it isn't encouraging.

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, Taro T said:

Did not say that Adams doesn't want to make the playoffs now.  He wants to be there and thought he had a team good enough to be there last year. 

But am fairly convinced that he isn't going to give up enough future assets to make that a very likely outcome today at the cost of being a legit contender then.

Personally do expect him to be in on trying to get some FAs and might even pull the trigger on Eriksson Ek (or similar).  But even that won't cost much of his prospect pool.

IF the GTing holds up & they stay healthy, do expect they'll be in the mix.  But right now would say they'd be on the outside looking in.  Let's see what happens the next few days, but right now it isn't encouraging.

I agree with you that there is a balance between having future assets and smartly using them to put out a more competitive team. Most people would agree with that sentiment. There is also a recognition that the prospect talent is fulsome enough where there is not enough room on the big roster for all of them when they are ready to move up. As you point out, there are enough chips in the system to work out some reasonable deals that will improve and better balance out the roster. As an example, the trade with the Caps was not a major deal but it was a good deal for us. 

I also agree with you that I expect a more significant deal to happen soon. I don't expect it to be in the blockbuster category but I do expect/hope that it will add a 2/3 C to the roster. And you are being very astute in recognizing that the play of our goalies is going to be critical to our success. Can UPL play up to last year's level and stay healthy? 

 

[Mango]

11 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Did not say that Adams doesn't want to make the playoffs now.  He wants to be there and thought he had a team good enough to be there last year. 

But am fairly convinced that he isn't going to give up enough future assets to make that a very likely outcome today at the cost of being a legit contender then.

Personally do expect him to be in on trying to get some FAs and might even pull the trigger on Eriksson Ek (or similar).  But even that won't cost much of his prospect pool.

IF the GTing holds up & they stay healthy, do expect they'll be in the mix.  But right now would say they'd be on the outside looking in.  Let's see what happens the next few days, but right now it isn't encouraging.

Right. I agree with you here. For me it’s tough to look at the window from now until 26-27 in a vaccuum without accounting for the fact that he was hired in 2020.

I am less arguing with you and more arguing with Kevyn Adams/yelling at clouds. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

30 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Did not say that Adams doesn't want to make the playoffs now.  He wants to be there and thought he had a team good enough to be there last year. 

But am fairly convinced that he isn't going to give up enough future assets to make that a very likely outcome today at the cost of being a legit contender then.

Personally do expect him to be in on trying to get some FAs and might even pull the trigger on Eriksson Ek (or similar).  But even that won't cost much of his prospect pool.

IF the GTing holds up & they stay healthy, do expect they'll be in the mix.  But right now would say they'd be on the outside looking in.  Let's see what happens the next few days, but right now it isn't encouraging.

It’s becoming clear that Adams hasn’t displayed the guts necessary to make an aggressive move to improve his roster.  His last two major moves have significantly downgraded his offense by trading Mitts, trading away his best playmaker, and buying out Skinner, one of his best goal scorers.

His moves to “upgrade” the defense, Stillman, Clifton, Johnson, Lyubuskin, and now Byram, are all 3rd pairing quality players or less at this point.  Byram’s O skills are top 4 potential, but his D metrics last season were bottom pairing and we need better defensive play.  

Only the trade for Greenway is a roster upgrade and that wasn’t much of a risk.  Just think we got Greenway for 2 plus years for a 2nd rd pick.  This draft Adams just wasted a 2nd on a an Arb eligible 26 year old RFA 4th line player.  

 

[JP51]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I understand why you are saying that the GM is focusing more on the 26-27 season, but I don't buy it at all. Our GM is not so clueless of where this team currently is, and its standing with the fanbase. He also has enough self-awareness that if he doesn't show some success soon (playoffs) that he will be another staffing casualty. The Sabres have had many of their best players work feverishly to get out of this deeply stuck franchise. If our GM has a nickel's worth of common sense, he would realize that the constant attention to the future at the expense of the present is a self-crippling approach to continue with that "get me out of here" attitude.  

I'm simply not receptive to your proposition that the GM is more focused on the future a few years down the road than he is about the near future i.e. next season. That is not to say that he would willing to jettison a lot of his assets for a short-term burst of success that sells out the future. My point is that he is very concerned about the upcoming season and is willing to do what he needs to do, within reason, to have a successful season this year.  I'm sure he is now at the stage where his attention is about the now. 

I don't disagree i personally think he knows it's now or never. I think he is stuck and suffering from 2 decades of incompetence and his own failure to recognize or at least execute on what is needed to make a championship team. The brand he is working with has been so devalued it is literally at junk bond status at this point. He is part not all of the reason. But the fact of the matter is he had been unable to lead them out of the wilderness. Coaches, players. Etc... would prefer not to engage the train wreck that is the Sabres and who can blame them. The only way he can bring in top end talent is if he drastically over pays. We will see how that works. In the end he will get this year but it is my belief he is a dead man walking and will not and probably cannot accumulate what he needs to right this ship. As much as we all hate this in my humble opinion the only way to fix this is to pay mega bucks for a GM with credibility and a plan that players may see as someone capable of righting this ship. Who that is please don't ask i don't know of anyone out there at this point that does this.... maybe you all have ideas. In the end I am sorry but I feel more disappointment in our immediate future. Again just my feelings and where I am at now. I hope I am wrong.

Edited June 30 by JP51

[Thorner]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

Right. I agree with you here. For me it’s tough to look at the window from now until 26-27 in a vaccuum without accounting for the fact that he was hired in 2020.

I am less arguing with you and more arguing with Kevyn Adams/yelling at clouds. 

No, you had it right the first time: if he “wants” to make the playoffs in 2025 but his priority is 2027, he should be fired 

If he’s *equally* weighing 2025 and 2027, he should also be fired. You don’t have the luxury of equally prioritizing two years down the line when you haven’t earned the goodwill from one playoff roster in 13 years and 4 already under your watch. That prioritizing of later is demonstrably handcuffing our ability to convert in the now.

I don’t think that's the case though, I do think the focus is on playoffs cause I think he’s gonzo if we miss

Edited June 30 by Thorny

[PromoTheRobot]

18 hours ago, stinky finger said:

Nor should he sell. He needs to bring in a respected GM who has the cache to create and close a deal. 

Explain what it is about Adams that prevents other GMs from dealing with him? If he's such a clueless noob wouldn't savvy GMs be calling him often to see if they could get our better prospects for little value in exchange? 

[PromoTheRobot]

3 hours ago, GoPuckYourself said:

Adams was hired in June 2020 with a much better roster that included F Jack Eichel, F Sam Reinhart, F Taylor Hall, D Brandon Montour, D Colin Miller, D Jake McCabe, D Rasmus Ristolainen and a bunch of current Sabres (Samuelsson, Thompson, Skinner, Okposo, Cozens, Middlestadt)   they went 30-31-8 68 Points, in 21-22 they went 32-39-11 75 points, finally in 22-23 a miracle happened and they went 42-33-7 91 points and missed playoffs by 1 point, then they went back down to earth in 23-24 going 39-37-6 for 84 points, this is the improvement you speak about moving up 16 points in the standings and still being knocked out of the playoffs? He had a legit team to work with when he first got here and I get his hands were tied with the Eichel situation and I'm fine with that but please tell me where the improvements are? I'd want Sam and Jack over anyone on this roster, I'd want Montour over everyone but Dahlin. I'm not trying to call you out but what do you mean this roster is improved since he took over?

You seen to have selective amnesia about why those players left.

Adams improved the Sabres by moving good but disgruntled players who wanted out. And he drafted what is now ranked the #2 prospect pool. He also stuck with UPL when everyone said he was trash. He locked up players like Tage, Samuelsson and Cozens early. Unfortunately injuries set all three back. 

But last year was definitely a black eye. And now we are at a crossroads.

[PromoTheRobot]

2 hours ago, nfreeman said:

 

Well, I agree with some of what you've said in this thread, but taking a victory lap on the Eichel and Reino trades at this point is just insane.

Nothing is ever 100% a win or a loss. I'm just trying to maintain perspective while people express their frustration with what's happening now 

I have to believe GMs were low balling Adams, testing to see how desperate he was. Eventually someone will make a serious offer for a Kulich or Östlund or whoever.

Edited June 30 by PromoTheRobot

[matter2003]

On 6/29/2024 at 11:43 AM, Buffalonill said:

Lets start it up no GM respects him he is the laughing stock of the NHL now.

Congrats

Hard to believe this is true considering he has the best prospect pool in the NHL which he drafted and that's after promoting the best ones out of them to the NHL roster already. Most GM's would probably give their left nut to have our prospect pool.

Edited June 30 by matter2003

[GoPuckYourself]

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

You seen to have selective amnesia about why those players left.

Adams improved the Sabres by moving good but disgruntled players who wanted out. And he drafted what is now ranked the #2 prospect pool. He also stuck with UPL when everyone said he was trash. He locked up players like Tage, Samuelsson and Cozens early. Unfortunately injuries set all three back. 

But last year was definitely a black eye. And now we are at a crossroads.

I don't care what the excuses are, you stated we have a better roster now when he took over. Other than a promising prospect pool where is the better roster? 1 season of an Adams lead squad that had a chance to make the playoffs and he blew it. There is no way anyone is going to tell me this squad is better than the one we had with 3 players who all have held up the Stanley Cup now. 

[mjd1001]

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

You seen to have selective amnesia about why those players left.

Adams improved the Sabres by moving good but disgruntled players who wanted out. And he drafted what is now ranked the #2 prospect pool. He also stuck with UPL when everyone said he was trash. He locked up players like Tage, Samuelsson and Cozens early. Unfortunately injuries set all three back. 

But last year was definitely a black eye. And now we are at a crossroads.

Agreed. Will Adams even make it through this year, who knows. But Eichel for sure, probably Reinhart, and Mountour were likely to not be staying here whether it was Adams as GM or Botts or anyone else before them or most new hires. They were likely going to be out of Buffalo. Its unfair to me to Judge the current roster of this team now than what the team would be with those guys on it....and again, I'm pretty sure all of them (most of them for sure) wouldn't be here and that was/is not Adams fault.

[Buffalonill]

1 hour ago, matter2003 said:

Hard to believe this is true considering he has the best prospect pool in the NHL which he drafted and that's after promoting the best ones out of them to the NHL roster already. Most GM's would probably give their left nut to have our prospect pool.

I've heard this numerous times and it's been a decade with no success

[PromoTheRobot]

20 minutes ago, GoPuckYourself said:

I don't care what the excuses are, you stated we have a better roster now when he took over. Other than a promising prospect pool where is the better roster? 1 season of an Adams lead squad that had a chance to make the playoffs and he blew it. There is no way anyone is going to tell me this squad is better than the one we had with 3 players who all have held up the Stanley Cup now. 

So you're giving me the prospect pool as improvement. But now exclude that point because "he blew it "

The Sabres got to within a point of the playoffs. So the team did improve to that point. (Something else we'll have to exclude for the sake of your argument.) But the team took a step back this year. 

You can pin part of that on Kevyn. He failed to add to the team, and then injuries struck and certain players underperformed. He also didn't act sooner with Granato.

[GoPuckYourself]

17 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

So you're giving me the prospect pool as improvement. But now exclude that point because "he blew it "

The Sabres got to within a point of the playoffs. So the team did improve to that point. (Something else we'll have to exclude for the sake of your argument.) But the team took a step back this year. 

You can pin part of that on Kevyn. He failed to add to the team, and then injuries struck and certain players underperformed. He also didn't act sooner with Granato.

So the improvement you're talking is prospects who may or may not be NHL worthy in some years and 1 seasons where he was 1 point away from making the playoffs but failed again? You do realize he's been here going on year 5 and his best season was 1 point away from playoffs but failing to make it. Seriously wtf are we areguing about here? lol

[PromoTheRobot]

1 minute ago, GoPuckYourself said:

So the improvement you're talking is prospects who may or may not be NHL worthy in some years and 1 seasons where he was 1 point away from making the playoffs but failed again? You do realize he's been here going on year 5 and his best season was 1 point away from playoffs but failing to make it. Seriously wtf are we areguing about here? lol

No. Not just that. The team got to 91 points last year too. I'm saying it was all pointing up until last season. And I pointed out where Adams fell short.

[Berg]

On 6/29/2024 at 8:29 PM, PromoTheRobot said:

He has improved the team since taking over. They took a step back last year. But because we are building though the draft and not through trades and free agency, it takes longer.

IMHO he destroyed the roster and get almost nothing. Show me just one top star who came to Buffalo with Adams. We get some good players like Thompson or Tuch but they are not top stars and it's not enough to make playoffs...

We don't have top goalie, don't have top forward like Draisaitl or McDavid..We have nothing and lost everything...

[stinky finger]

3 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Explain what it is about Adams that prevents other GMs from dealing with him? If he's such a clueless noob wouldn't savvy GMs be calling him often to see if they could get our better prospects for little value in exchange? 

His job is to create a playoff contender. Him throwing up his freaking arms and saying "I tried" isn't a strategy. 

Until proven otherwise, he's failing miserably.

 

[Big Guava]

1 hour ago, Buffalonill said:

I've heard this numerous times and it's been a decade with no success

Yeah it was the same with the Bills until all of a sudden one day it wasn't.

Now they are regarded as one of the best run franchises in all of sports, not only the NFL and have the 2nd best winning percentage since 2019 in the 4 major sports.

I don't care when it ends, I only care they do it right so that it ends properly and with a team setup for many years of success.

I can watch the Bills and Bandits make the playoffs til then.

I don't think you are going to have to wait much longer regardless of how many new players they bring in. Just a hunch. Talent eventually overcomes any deficiency and they've got boatloads up on boatloads coming.

Edited June 30 by Big Guava

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, Berg said:

 

We don't have top goalie, don't have top forward like Draisaitl or McDavid..We have nothing and lost everything...

We have 2 top defensemen in Dahlin and Power. We have UPL and Levi in goal. We have Thompson, Tuch, Cozens, JJ Peterka, Qunn, Benson and Kulich coming up. Are you saying that's trash?

Edited June 30 by PromoTheRobot

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, stinky finger said:

His job is to create a playoff contender. Him throwing up his freaking arms and saying "I tried" isn't a strategy. 

Until proven otherwise, he's failing miserably.

 

You didn't answer my question. What is preventing NHL GMs from dealing with Adams? You brought that up.