Fixing the power play

[dudacek]

Team’s single biggest downfall last year in my opinion and we need a thread to talk about why and how to fix it.

I’d like to start with something that doesn’t get talked about enough.

And it really fits with the notion of accountability.

Skinner, Tuch and Cozens had just 12, 11 and 10 points respectively on the power play. The latter 2 had just 2 PP goals each. Skinner and Cozens killed plays repeatedly by coughing up pucks or making poor passes. We bitched about getting to the net. Tuch and Skinner were the low guys

Despite that, these 3 kept getting skated out there time and again despite their ineffectiveness, finishing 4th, 2nd and 5th on the team in PP ice time. Sure other guys got tastes, but they were brief, and usually one at a time.

Maybe it wasn’t just the system at fault here?

Im really looking forward to someone looking at how to set this unit up with some fresh eyes.

Edited April 22 by dudacek

[GASabresIUFAN]

From watching other teams' PPs it seems they utilize more plays down low with a player often behind the PK net.  They also move the puck quicker.  

[dudacek]

10 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

From watching other teams' PPs it seems they utilize more plays down low with a player often behind the PK net.  They also move the puck quicker.  

Agreed. Down low, and they also move the puck to and through the bumper to finish from the slot.

Skinner can do neither of those things, and he is a huge risk when the rotation moves him up high.

If the team does nothing else, please get him off the PP.

I know he was second on the team with 8 PP goals. That’s not enough for a guy in that spot who comes up short in so many other areas.

 

Edited April 22 by dudacek

[LGR4GM]

13 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

From watching other teams' PPs it seems they utilize more plays down low with a player often behind the PK net.  They also move the puck quicker.  

I argued for this all year. Play the puck from low and behind the net.

[PerreaultForever]

Stop relying on Dahlin so much as QB.

Stop looking for the Tage shot all the time.

More net front presence.

More activity down low and from the bumper. 

Also win face offs in the O zone.

Most of all though it just comes down to pace and winning the puck battles when they occur. Not enough urgency and tempo. 

[dudacek]

11 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

Stop relying on Dahlin so much as QB.

Stop looking for the Tage shot all the time.

More net front presence.

More activity down low and from the bumper. 

Also win face offs in the O zone.

Most of all though it just comes down to pace and winning the puck battles when they occur. Not enough urgency and tempo. 

I’m going to go against the grain on the bold a bit.

I’m not really disagreeing, just changing that to “develop another threat so it opens up Tage’s shot more often”.

When teams started cheating to Tage, the response was to move him, or the puck, around in a way to get it to him in a different place. Which basically resulted in even more time wasted moving it around to set up his covered shot.

The response should be to take advantage of the 4-on-3 the Tage cheat creates, and make them pay. That in turn will free up Tage again.

I want him shooting. It’s a huge weapon. But locking in on him as your target is counter-productive to making that happen.

Edited April 22 by dudacek

[SabreFinn]

I think the pp is too easy to read, it's like an open book. Tage need to find some new tools as a complement to the slapshot. Maybe unfair example, but looking att Kutcherov you never know where the puck will go until it leaves the blade. And there is no player that is really good in the "Hyman-area".

[PerreaultForever]

4 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I’m going to go against the grain on the bold a bit.

I’m not really disagreeing, just changing that to “develop another threat so it opens up Tage’s shot more often”.

When teams started cheating to Tage, the response was to move him, or the puck, around in a way to get it to him in a different place. Which basically resulted in even more time wasted moving it around to set up his covered shot.

The response should be to take advantage of the 4-on-3 the Tage cheat creates, and make them pay. That in turn will free up Tage again.

I want him shooting. It’s a huge weapon. But locking in on him as your target is counter-productive to making that happen.

That's part of it. His shot is a weapon, but to make it a better PP he has to do more than just wait for the shot in the same general area. We need to move people around more and Tage has to not shoot when it isn't there and also move into the net front at times and just create more motion and variability. It's not as simple as just sticking another shooter on the other side and saying okay, that's fixed. 

The PP has to adapt to the opposition's PK scheme. This is on the coaching and game prep, which is sorely lacking here and hopefully a new head coach will be less concerned with developing players and more concerned with game prep and game management. 

[bob_sauve28]

Quinn and JJP need to be on first unit

[dudacek]

The guy on the left half-wall needs to be able to pass to both sides, have a dangerous shot from distance, and have the ability to drive the net. I say that’s Byram.

The guy in the bumper slot needs to be able to find cracks in traffic, be fearless and aggressive in tight, have quick hands and a fast accurate release, and some passing ability. Quinn?

And I wonder if Benson has enough retrieval and entry skills to replace Tuch as the low man?

[dudacek]

2 minutes ago, bob_sauve28 said:

Quinn and JJP need to be on first unit

I think Quinn can play either low spot and I am with you 100% on this.

JJP would be the guy at look at next on left high spot after Byram. He’s more dangerous from distance, but I think Byram might bring more of the distribution/playmaking.

[PerreaultForever]

1 minute ago, dudacek said:

The guy on the left half-wall needs to be able to pass to both sides, have a dangerous shot from distance, and have the ability to drive the net. I say that’s Byram.

The guy in the bumper slot needs to be able to find cracks in traffic, be fearless and aggressive in tight, have quick hands and a fast accurate release, and some passing ability. Quinn?

And I wonder if Benson has enough retrieval and entry skills to replace Tuch as the low man?

Benson should become the bumper guy. I'd want a bigger body in front and Benson with more motion also entering that area when appropriate. 

Peterka might be able to become the point man opposite Dahlin. Quinn as the shooter on PP2 in Tage's spot.

[dudacek]

17 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

That's part of it. His shot is a weapon, but to make it a better PP he has to do more than just wait for the shot in the same general area. We need to move people around more and Tage has to not shoot when it isn't there and also move into the net front at times and just create more motion and variability. It's not as simple as just sticking another shooter on the other side and saying okay, that's fixed. 

The PP has to adapt to the opposition's PK scheme. This is on the coaching and game prep, which is sorely lacking here and hopefully a new head coach will be less concerned with developing players and more concerned with game prep and game management. 

It’s clearly a one-note song: let Ras play catch until we get it to Tage for a shot.

Its no wonder it stinks.

Is that coaching, too much deference, or not enough ability/willingness to try other things?

There is no doubt in my mind that Quinn would add someone who would both want the puck, and be able to do things with it. He was a PP monster in Rochester.

Edited April 22 by dudacek

[dudacek]

8 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

Benson should become the bumper guy. I'd want a bigger body in front and Benson with more motion also entering that area when appropriate. 

Peterka might be able to become the point man opposite Dahlin. Quinn as the shooter on PP2 in Tage's spot.

I worry about Benson’s shot in the bumper. He’s got the rest of the package though.

Quinn is very good at the right half wall. But he’s too good at too many things to bury on PP2. IMO he’s got the best PP tools on the team outside Dahlin and Tage.

I think we’re in agreement that there is PP talent on the roster that deserves its shot given the failures of Granato’s chosen 5.

Edited April 22 by dudacek

[Jorcus]

8 minutes ago, dudacek said:

The guy on the left half-wall needs to be able to pass to both sides, have a dangerous shot from distance, and have the ability to drive the net. I say that’s Byram.

The guy in the bumper slot needs to be able to find cracks in traffic, be fearless and aggressive in tight, have quick hands and a fast accurate release, and some passing ability. Quinn?

And I wonder if Benson has enough retrieval and entry skills to replace Tuch as the low man?

I am all for using Byram with Dahlin. I think it would free Dahlin to be more mobile with the puck. I still think I would use Tuch in the Bumper with Quinn on the right side and Tage on the left. Benson has not shown enough scoring touch to be the bumper guy on the first unit just yet. 

Whatever happens this team has to shoot more and have skaters in better rebounding positions. 

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

Despite my comments on wasting 2 years of Benson (which still hold by the way), if he is going to be on this team, then we need to get him in open space.  That means PP time.  Just on raw skill he and JJP are probably our most talented forwards.  In the pre-season, Benson looked good as the bumper on the PP.  

I'd like to see JJP, Benson, Tage, Tuch and Dahlin as the 1st PP.

I'd then like to see Cozens, Quinn, Byram, Power and Savoie (if he makes the team) on the 2nd PP.  

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

It’s clearly a one-note song: let Ras play catch until we get it to Tage for a shot.

Its no wonder it stinks.

Is that coaching, too much deference, or not enough ability/willingness to try other things?

There is no doubt in my mind that Quinn would add someone who would both want the puck, and be able to do things with it. He was a PP monster in Rochester.

I'm fine with a coach trying Quinn but I'd want to see what he does at the NHL level before proclaiming him the savior. 

I really think one of the biggest problems for this (and many things)  comes down to coaching and how they've set this team up and built it. All the emphasis has and is on developing these young players and it's not about winning hockey games in the NHL. All this development is supposed to take place in the AHL and some in practice (and part of the job of assistants is to work one on one with players on things they need to improve) but the head coach should be working on winning games, making adjustments, game planning, and in game decisions. You need to have scouted the oppositions PK and adjust your PP to exploit their weaknesses. We are far from a level where we can try to just dictate the game. 

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

I worry about Benson’s shot in the bumper. He’s got the rest of the package though.

Quinn is very good at the right half wall. But he’s too good at too many things to bury on PP2. IMO he’s got the best PP tools on the team outside Dahlin and Tage.

I think we’re in agreement that there is PP talent on the roster that deserves its shot given the failures of Granato’s chosen 5.

I'm not burying him on PP2. You've seem to have an idea that PP1 should be the threat and PP2 is just what? prayer?   I'm thinking you want TWO solid units that can give you a full 2 minutes plus threat. 

With this roster my PP1 is Dahlin, Thompson, Tuch, Benson, Peterka (this is assuming Benson keeps improving and doesn't have a sophomore slump)

PP2 is Power, Byram, Quinn, Greenway, Cozens

Tuch and Greenway are net front. Benson and Cozens play the bumper. Quinn and Thompson are the snipers, the rest are on the points. 

(if you notice, no Skinner)

[Weave]

The biggest reason why we might see change in the PP units (giggle) is because the 2nd wave is finally reaching a point where they might hold their own.

For all the ***** we are giving Tage, Tuch and Skinner in here, they were the only grown ass men on the team that were as likely as not to win a puck battle.  JJP came of age this season and could be added, but who else?  This is what we had.

Next season Cozens will have another offseason to improve.  Quinn should get to where JJP got.  Hopefully Power does as well.  Honestly, I’m not expecting Benson to be there yet.  But if Cozens, Quinn, Power all take steps we should start to have options.

And the obligatory, KA DO SOMETHING!!!  Get an experienced weapon in here.

[French Collection]

Quinn could be the bumper guy similar to Point in Tampa. No Kucherov to feed him or TNT but Dahlin could slide over as he is also a shooting threat. Byram could join Dahlin as a 2D PP1 and have them rotate around, moving the puck and themselves. Tuch could do net front and goal line/corner work.

[pi2000]

1. Get Tage off the PK.  It was a dumb idea, you don't put your leadng scorer on PK1.   IIRC he hurt his hand on the PK.  A healthy Tage completely changes the PP.  

2. Schematics... more traffic at the net front and more than 1 or 2 breakout/zone entry options.

3. Better practice habits, more attention to detail, sense of urgency.

[Drag0nDan]

Assuming no roster moves - how i think they could look.

Dahlin

Tage - Greenway- Byram

Tuch

Power

JJP - Benson- Quinn

Cozens

 

 

[msw2112]

20 hours ago, SabreFinn said:

I think the pp is too easy to read, it's like an open book. Tage need to find some new tools as a complement to the slapshot. Maybe unfair example, but looking att Kutcherov you never know where the puck will go until it leaves the blade. And there is no player that is really good in the "Hyman-area".

Hasn't Ovechkin played in that same spot his entire career, and nobody has every been able to stop it?  I'm fine with the Tage one-timer threat from the left wall, but the other guys can move around more and create some activity.  I'm in agreement that more activity in the "Hyman-area" is always a good thing.

[DarthEbriate]

Even more than system/design, they need to be willing to outwork the PK. If you get pinched on the boards because you foolishly turn your back, then you have to fight to maintain the puck. Chip it deep again and then fight to get possession again. Every loose puck race you have to win. Every face off you need to battle for position because most draws aren’t clean. And screen the goalie all the time. Outwork them and the PP suddenly will look amazing.

(And TNT may occasionally kill your screener.)

[Weave]

1 hour ago, msw2112 said:

Hasn't Ovechkin played in that same spot his entire career, and nobody has every been able to stop it?  I'm fine with the Tage one-timer threat from the left wall, but the other guys can move around more and create some activity.  I'm in agreement that more activity in the "Hyman-area" is always a good thing.

I’ve been sitting on this type of post, mostly due to laziness.  Damn you for springing me to life.

Ovie had his office, but what was the difference?  Sure, he’s HOF talent, maybe that’s the difference but I don’t think so.  I am assuming Washington geared their PP to hide Ovie’s trips to his office, create diversions, and use players freed up when Ovie was being hunted.  Would love an outside perspective/analysis cuz their shot from that spot is amazingly similar. It shouldn’t be so easy to neutralize that weapon.