Off-season Game Plan 2024

[Flashsabre]

1 hour ago, tom webster said:

FWIW, and I know at least one poster doesn’t think it’s worth much, but after a few conversations over the weekend, I am 100% convinced that the Sabres will make a big splash in the coming weeks. Something along the likes of Danault, Jenner. Eriksson EK, Jenner. And it won’t stop there.

 

The hire of Ruff was significant but the real notice of intent was the hiring of Pete Guelli. Ruff had some leverage but Guelli is a rising star and doesn’t sign on without some significant guarantees. 
 

TPegs was not in Buffalo to discuss draft prospects. He was here to agree to the monetary ramifications of the pending moves.

Thanks for the info. Just a question: are those names you heard directly or just speculation based on the type of player they are looking for? I think any of those guys would be great adds but Erickson EK would be a big ticket. I would love that. 

[French Collection]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Eriksen Ek?

I can’t think of a more perfect add.

27, under contract for 5 more years at $5.2, one of the best 2-way centres in the game and his no-movement clause doesn’t kick in until July.

Assets like that don’t go on the market unless a team is hitting the reset button.

That would be an expensive get.

The centre spine would be better than with Mitts in it. Eriksson Ek is an ideal 2C and could provide the means to have 3 scoring lines. Cozens could move to the wing if a veteran 3C is brought in, Krebs finally breaks out or one of the prospect trio earns a chance.

This is a guy KA should have moved Mitts for. Minnesota boy going home to be a 1C.

[French Collection]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

I see 2 things that might make Ek available.

• The fact that Minnesota is in an awful spot under the cap this year thanks to the Parise buyout
• The fact that their core has quietly gotten old and they might need to re-focus on a Faber/Boldy window.

I could see them trying to do a quick reset by flipping some of their older players for some players in their early 20s. And Ek certainly is someone who could generate the best type of return under that scenario.

And the fact that Ek is owed $22.5M over the next few years including $9M next year isn’t insignificant.

I guess we’ll see if Terry really is cheap.

Eriksson Ek and Rossi are about all that Minnesota has at C. Hartman has played there a lot due to necessity not him being a pure C.

A reset there could mean a desire to bring in a Savoie and perhaps giving Krebs a fresh start.

As an added fantasy, could we include more pieces to get a Hartman included. Gritty vet who can play anywhere in the middle six. 

[dudacek]

1 minute ago, French Collection said:

The centre spine would be better than with Mitts in it. Eriksson Ek is an ideal 2C and could provide the means to have 3 scoring lines. Cozens could move to the wing if a veteran 3C is brought in, Krebs finally breaks out or one of the prospect trio earns a chance.

This is a guy KA should have moved Mitts for. Minnesota boy going home to be a 1C.

I’d much rather have Byram and Ek than Mitts and prospects.

Ek is better than Mitts and a better fit for this team than Mitts. Thompson Cozens Ek would be a load down the middle; maybe the league’s biggest centre spine with skill.

Byram we shall see if he’s more the player we saw the first 5 games or the one who looked lost after that.

The organization didn’t acquire him to be a #5 and will put him in a position to succeed.

He has more talent than Casey and at least as much compete. Fingers crossed he can change some minds around here.

[Brawndo]

Imagine a line of 

Benson-JEE-Quinn when the ice needs to be tilted in Buffalo’s Favor

[Flashsabre]

22 minutes ago, French Collection said:

Eriksson Ek and Rossi are about all that Minnesota has at C. Hartman has played there a lot due to necessity not him being a pure C.

A reset there could mean a desire to bring in a Savoie and perhaps giving Krebs a fresh start.

As an added fantasy, could we include more pieces to get a Hartman included. Gritty vet who can play anywhere in the middle six. 

There has been a lot of chatter that Minnesota wanted to trade Rossi because he was not big enough for them. If true then they want bigger players-prospects.

[Flashsabre]

2 hours ago, tom webster said:

FWIW, and I know at least one poster doesn’t think it’s worth much, but after a few conversations over the weekend, I am 100% convinced that the Sabres will make a big splash in the coming weeks. Something along the likes of Danault, Jenner. Eriksson EK, Jenner. And it won’t stop there.

 

The hire of Ruff was significant but the real notice of intent was the hiring of Pete Guelli. Ruff had some leverage but Guelli is a rising star and doesn’t sign on without some significant guarantees. 
 

TPegs was not in Buffalo to discuss draft prospects. He was here to agree to the monetary ramifications of the pending moves.

I wonder if buying out Skinner is a real possibility and they need Pegula to sign off. Want to free up some cash for other moves.  
 

Sounds like spending to the cap is on the table.

I think some big changes are coming.

[dudacek]

15 minutes ago, Flashsabre said:

I wonder if buying out Skinner is a real possibility and they need Pegula to sign off. Want to free up some cash for other moves.  
 

Sounds like spending to the cap is on the table.

I think some big changes are coming.

Ek’s cap hit is $5M this year, but his salary is $9M.

just an example, but any real improvement is going to involve spending more money and could involve eating some real money beyond the cap.

Adams says he will get the resources he needs, but we haven’t seen Pegula spending for a few years now.

[French Collection]

15 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Ek’s cap hit is $5M this year, but his salary is $9M.

just an example, but any real improvement is going to involve spending more money and could involve eating some real money beyond the cap.

Adams says he will get the resources he needs, but we haven’t seen Pegula spending for a few years now.

If KA has the green light to spend to the limit and he makes a big move like the one mentioned above, all of the bubble eastern conference teams will poop their pants a little bit.

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, Brawndo said:

Imagine a line of 

Benson-JEE-Quinn when the ice needs to be tilted in Buffalo’s Favor

I'm skeptical of JEE being available but would be very interested if true. 

[PerreaultForever]

If Erikson Ek is actually on the market I would do whatever it takes to make that happen. He'd be a good fit and fill the need.

Erikson Ek and Marcus Foligno for Savoie, Rosen and our first.  Would that get it done? If not, throw in whatever else it takes. 

[nfreeman]

8 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

If Erikson Ek is actually on the market I would do whatever it takes to make that happen. He'd be a good fit and fill the need.

Erikson Ek and Marcus Foligno for Savoie, Rosen and our first.  Would that get it done? If not, throw in whatever else it takes. 

Interesting.  Foligno turns 33 this summer and is slowing down.  He also has a 4-year, $4MM per year contract extension starting next year.  That is exactly the kind of contract a rebuilding team typically looks to unload.

I would make the trade you suggest in a heartbeat.  Foligno shouldn't cost much due to the contract, but JEE will be very expensive.  I'd guess that Minny would demand either Quinn or JJP instead of Rosen though.

Would JJP, Savoie and #11 be too high of a price?  Or maybe JJP, Jokiharju and #11?  I think I would do the latter but not sure about the former.

[PerreaultForever]

3 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Interesting.  Foligno turns 33 this summer and is slowing down.  He also has a 4-year, $4MM per year contract extension starting next year.  That is exactly the kind of contract a rebuilding team typically looks to unload.

I would make the trade you suggest in a heartbeat.  Foligno shouldn't cost much due to the contract, but JEE will be very expensive.  I'd guess that Minny would demand either Quinn or JJP instead of Rosen though.

Would JJP, Savoie and #11 be too high of a price?  Or maybe JJP, Jokiharju and #11?  I think I would do the latter but not sure about the former.

I'd be fine with Jokiharju but I do not want to trade JJP. I think he can still get even better than what we've seen. I would prefer to see him stay a Sabre. I'd rather give future picks or prospects that equate. 

My thinking on adding Foligno is twofold. From their perspective, if the motivation is cap relief and a rebuild then shedding the 33 year old 4 million dollar guy should be motivating. It might put trading with us in a preferred position to other teams who wouldn't want to eat that contract. From our perspective, we return leadership, grit, legacy (undo a bad trade if you like) and we have a role model leader on the team even if it does eat money and age poorly (I still think he can give us 2-3 good years). The young guys would benefit from a guy like that in the room, even if their on ice contribution fades away. 

idk, but Erikson Ek is a very tantalizing possibility. He elevates in the playoffs too. He'd be perfect. So perfect I have trouble thinking Minnesota would actually move him. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

8 hours ago, dudacek said:

I’d much rather have Byram and Ek than Mitts and prospects.

Ek is better than Mitts and a better fit for this team than Mitts. Thompson Cozens Ek would be a load down the middle; maybe the league’s biggest centre spine with skill.

I love the idea of Eriksson-Ek, and he maybe a better fit for the needs of the 2024 Sabres.  He is certainly a better goal scorer and a more physical player, but Mitts is a a much better playmaker, and as he is two years younger than Ek, Mitts has yet to reach his full potential.  

I'm also not yet convinced that Byram is all that.  The jury is still out, but he wasn't exactly good after the hot start.

As to your comparison of Byram and Ek vs Mitts and prospects, it's a bit of a straw man.  You have no idea whether KA would then turn those prospects into a top 4 D even if he choose to retain Mitts.  Don't forget Ek still has 5 years at 5.25 per season.  AFP projects Mitts at 5 years 5.9.  We are not talking a great deal of savings here.  What happens if we can't secure Bennett, Karlsson or Ek to anchor our 3rd line?  Would be better off with Mitts and a top 4 D acquired with prospects or Byram and Kerfoot, Domi, Roslovic or Gourde?    

Edited June 9 by GASabresIUFAN

[dudacek]

21 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Interesting.  Foligno turns 33 this summer and is slowing down.  He also has a 4-year, $4MM per year contract extension starting next year.  That is exactly the kind of contract a rebuilding team typically looks to unload.

I would make the trade you suggest in a heartbeat.  Foligno shouldn't cost much due to the contract, but JEE will be very expensive.  I'd guess that Minny would demand either Quinn or JJP instead of Rosen though.

Would JJP, Savoie and #11 be too high of a price?  Or maybe JJP, Jokiharju and #11?  I think I would do the latter but not sure about the former.

Price on the first seems high for me.

JJ just put up 28 goals in his 2nd season. We haven’t seen his ceiling yet.

Let’s put it this way, at 22, he’s younger yet producing what Tuch was when we got him. Savoie is equal or ahead of where Krebs was. And #11 is certainly well ahead of the 20-something pick Vegas thought they were giving up.

Ek is a great player, but does it warrant an Eichel price?

I struggle to think of the last player to net a futures package that strong.

I can see 2 of those pieces, not 3.

The Joki group is more realistic, but if I’m Adams, if I’m giving up Peterka, Minny’s not getting a piece as good as #11 to flesh things out.

[SabreFinn]

50 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Interesting.  Foligno turns 33 this summer and is slowing down.  He also has a 4-year, $4MM per year contract extension starting next year.  That is exactly the kind of contract a rebuilding team typically looks to unload.

I would make the trade you suggest in a heartbeat.  Foligno shouldn't cost much due to the contract, but JEE will be very expensive.  I'd guess that Minny would demand either Quinn or JJP instead of Rosen though.

Would JJP, Savoie and #11 be too high of a price?  Or maybe JJP, Jokiharju and #11?  I think I would do the latter but not sure about the former.

Jokiharju, Savoie and a 3 round pick?

[dudacek]

35 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I love the idea of Eriksson-Ek, and he maybe a better fit for the needs of the 2024 Sabres.  He is certainly a better goal scorer and a more physical player, but Mitts is a a much better playmaker, and as he is two years younger than Ek, Mitts has yet to reach his full potential.  

I'm also not yet convinced that Byram is all that.  The jury is still out, but he wasn't exactly good after the hot start.

As to your comparison of Byram and Ek vs Mitts and prospects, it's a bit of a straw man.  You have no idea whether KA would then turn those prospects into a top 4 even if he choose to retain Mitts.  Don't forget Ek still has 5 years at 5.25 per season.  AFP projects Mitts at 5 years 5.9.  We are not talking a great deal of savings here.  What happens if we can't secure Bennett, Karlsson or Ek to anchor our 3rd line?  Would be better off with Mitts and a top 4 D acquired with prospects or Byram and Kerfoot, Domi, Roslovic or Gourde?    

Any conversation tied to Ek or any other new 3C is pure speculation.

Mitts turns 26 in November and has played 350 NHL games: he is what he is, a good 2C.

Byram turns 23 this month and has played 160 NHL games: he’s the one who has yet to reach his full potential.

It was a hockey trade made to strengthen the D corps at the cost of weakening centre spine. 

How much Byram adds to the D corps matters. How Adams backfills the centre slot matters as well.

But it’s not really about winning the trade.

How much better the team gets as a result of each move together is what really counts.

Edited June 8 by dudacek

[nfreeman]

32 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Price on the first seems high for me.

JJ just put up 28 goals in his 2nd season. We haven’t seen his ceiling yet.

Let’s put it this way, at 22, he’s younger yet producing what Tuch was when we got him. Savoie is equal or ahead of where Krebs was. And #11 is certainly well ahead of the 20-something pick Vegas thought they were giving up.

Ek is a great player, but does it warrant an Eichel price?

I struggle to think of the last player to net a futures package that strong.

I can see 2 of those pieces, not 3.

The Joki group is more realistic, but if I’m Adams, if I’m giving up Peterka, Minny’s not getting a piece as good as #11 to flesh things out.

I agree with most of this but would point out that Eichel's price was substantially discounted due to the injury/surgery risk.

I just don't see Minny giving up JEE without getting back a good, young, NHL player with upside and a good contract, plus a really good pick or prospect.  I think the Sabres meeting that standard for the first component are JJP, Quinn and Byram, and I kinda doubt KA will give up Byram so soon after trading for him.

This also raises IMHO an interesting question:  as a Sabres fan, if you had to trade one of Quinn or JJP to bring in a difference-maker like JEE, which one would you rather keep?  I think I'd rather keep Quinn and part with JJP, but it's a very tough decision, not least because of the Quinn injury risk.

[tom webster]

17 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

I agree with most of this but would point out that Eichel's price was substantially discounted due to the injury/surgery risk.

I just don't see Minny giving up JEE without getting back a good, young, NHL player with upside and a good contract, plus a really good pick or prospect.  I think the Sabres meeting that standard for the first component are JJP, Quinn and Byram, and I kinda doubt KA will give up Byram so soon after trading for him.

This also raises IMHO an interesting question:  as a Sabres fan, if you had to trade one of Quinn or JJP to bring in a difference-maker like JEE, which one would you rather keep?  I think I'd rather keep Quinn and part with JJP, but it's a very tough decision, not least because of the Quinn injury risk.

Quinn isn’t going anywhere and JJP 99% probably not.

[dudacek]

7 hours ago, nfreeman said:

I agree with most of this but would point out that Eichel's price was substantially discounted due to the injury/surgery risk.

I just don't see Minny giving up JEE without getting back a good, young, NHL player with upside and a good contract, plus a really good pick or prospect.  I think the Sabres meeting that standard for the first component are JJP, Quinn and Byram, and I kinda doubt KA will give up Byram so soon after trading for him.

This also raises IMHO an interesting question:  as a Sabres fan, if you had to trade one of Quinn or JJP to bring in a difference-maker like JEE, which one would you rather keep?  I think I'd rather keep Quinn and part with JJP, but it's a very tough decision, not least because of the Quinn injury risk.

Was it? Wasn’t the whole reason it dragged on for so long was because Adams refused to take a substantial discount?

I go back to this: when was the last time a player got traded for 3 pieces as good, or better than #11 pick?

Ek is an excellent player on an excellent contract, but by no means is he a 1C, a 1D, or an elite sniper or power forward.

• Thomas Hertl went for the equivalent of 2 late firsts
• CaseyMittelstadt went for Bowen Byram
• Elias Lindholm went for a late 1st, a prospect worth a 2nd and what some would consider a cap dump
• Alex Debrincat went for a mid-first and a prospect worth a 2nd.
• PL Dubois went for 2 average NHL wingers and 2 2nd-rounders
• Bo Horvat went for a mid-first and the equivalent of 2 2nds.

Sure there are contract complications, but none of those packages are headlined by anything close to Peterka, let alone 3 Peterka-sized pieces.

A great comparable for Ek was Ryan O’Reilly

The trade where the Sabres got ROR from Colorado translates roughly to: Rosen, Östlund, Strbak and a 2nd for Ek and Foligno.

ROR to The Blues works out to: Kulich, Rosen and a 2nd.

I’d pay more, but the market generally doesn’t demand much more.

 

Edited June 9 by dudacek

[thewookie1]

1 hour ago, nfreeman said:

Interesting.  Foligno turns 33 this summer and is slowing down.  He also has a 4-year, $4MM per year contract extension starting next year.  That is exactly the kind of contract a rebuilding team typically looks to unload.

I would make the trade you suggest in a heartbeat.  Foligno shouldn't cost much due to the contract, but JEE will be very expensive.  I'd guess that Minny would demand either Quinn or JJP instead of Rosen though.

Would JJP, Savoie and #11 be too high of a price?  Or maybe JJP, Jokiharju and #11?  I think I would do the latter but not sure about the former.

For me, I'd give them Savoie and 11 for JEE, but as soon as you start talking about Peterka or Quinn I'd no longer have any interest.

[thewookie1]

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/5216813

[oddoublee]

3 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

If Erikson Ek is actually on the market I would do whatever it takes to make that happen. He'd be a good fit and fill the need.

Erikson Ek and Marcus Foligno for Savoie, Rosen and our first.  Would that get it done? If not, throw in whatever else it takes. 

I'm struggling to believe he is on the market. His contact is not awful. He's young. He's good. Rebuild or not, that doesn't seem like the guy you move. 

That said, your proposal, even without Foligno is fine by me! 

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/5216813

You want Borgen back. This amuses me, but in a good way. 

Krebs in that deal wouldn't get Erikson Ek done. 

[thewookie1]

9 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

You want Borgen back. This amuses me, but in a good way. 

Krebs in that deal wouldn't get Erikson Ek done. 

I just used what was mentioned earlier on.

My cutoff is at roster players besides Krebs