Biggest Sabres issue - losing the 1st period badly too often

[Weave]

54 minutes ago, Big Guava said:

So let me get this straight. I am supposed to believe a pretty smart guy like Pegula sees how successful the Bills have been when he isn't interfering but yet ignores that and tries to interfere every chance he gets with the Sabres?

Is that what I am supposed to believe based on your opinions?

I find that stretches the bounds of believability and credibility.

It’s not smarts to realize that you are the problem.  It is self awareness.  And most folks don’t have it sufficiently enough to recognize when they are the problem. 

[inkman]

4 minutes ago, Weave said:

It’s not smarts to realize that you are the problem.  It is self awareness.  And most folks don’t have it sufficiently enough to recognize when they are the problem. 

I’ve said it before but you don’t need to be smart to get rich. You just need to know how to remove money from people’s pockets and put it in yours.  Plenty of dolts turned millionaire out there. 

[Drag0nDan]

28 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Ppl keep saying this but did they? 

Upl was good but was team defense really any better?

I think the backchecking has improved, forwards are more engaged, and absent eric Johnson they have improved as a net front team.  But their transition and zone exits are super messy now.  

[Bangarang]

I'm out of the loop here but is there any thing that proves Pegula is still meddling?

[LGR4GM]

5 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

I'm out of the loop here but is there any thing that proves Pegula is still meddling?

He is. See Buffalo take on dead salary ever? Even though they have been almost dead last the last 3 years in cap? That's Pegula. 

[Bangarang]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

He is. See Buffalo take on dead salary ever? Even though they have been almost dead last the last 3 years in cap? That's Pegula. 

 

I'm not as well versed in how dead salary works in the NHL. Is it the same as the NFL?

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

 

I'm not as well versed in how dead salary works in the NHL. Is it the same as the NFL?

Buffalo could have have gotten assets to basically be a pass through team. Let's say player y is 1 million bucks. Buffalo agrees to retain up to 50% and Ys og team agrees to retain 25% which is the max. Buffalo has a cap hit of 500k on their books and pays that 500k in real money (unless there's a lower actual salary but let's keep it simple). Player Y goes directly to 3rd team and Buffalo gets an extra 4th or something. 

So it works differently than the nfl. 

[TheAud]

11 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

He is. See Buffalo take on dead salary ever? Even though they have been almost dead last the last 3 years in cap? That's Pegula. 

To me there is a difference between setting business rules for the organization, and meddling. 

Telling KA that he doesn't want to take on dead cap is a business rule, within his prerogative as owner (not saying I like this at all, just that it's not 'meddling') 

Whereas telling KA to draft or not draft a certain player, or sign or not sign a certain FA is clearly meddling in hockey matters. 

Using that definition I don't know if he's 'meddling' or not (it would not surprise me at all if he is) but deciding to not take on dead cap isn't proof that he is, in my opinion.

[Drag0nDan]

Just now, LGR4GM said:

Buffalo could have have gotten assets to basically be a pass through team. Let's say player y is 1 million bucks. Buffalo agrees to retain up to 50% and Ys og team agrees to retain 25% which is the max. Buffalo has a cap hit of 500k on their books and pays that 500k in real money (unless there's a lower actual salary but let's keep it simple). Player Y goes directly to 3rd team and Buffalo gets an extra 4th or something. 

So it works differently than the nfl. 

Just one of the many issues with NHL, their cap, and free agency:

I just don't see a ton of value trading cap space - until someone starts offering tangible pick value i don't see the point.  Why help someone circumvent the cap? 

The NMC/NTC/M-NTC lists are getting out of hand at this point as it seems like almost every player has something.  There's also too much term on contracts that are fully guaranteed.  

Offer sheet compensation is in a word - ridiculous.  4 1st rounders is just too much at any level for one, but the level with which to offer a 1st (and a 3rd) is way too low.  They've built that to not be an option.  

Figure out LTIR because man is it stupid.  

[LGR4GM]

8 minutes ago, TheAud said:

To me there is a difference between setting business rules for the organization, and meddling. 

Telling KA that he doesn't want to take on dead cap is a business rule, within his prerogative as owner (not saying I like this at all, just that it's not 'meddling') 

Whereas telling KA to draft or not draft a certain player, or sign or not sign a certain FA is clearly meddling in hockey matters. 

Using that definition I don't know if he's 'meddling' or not (it would not surprise me at all if he is) but deciding to not take on dead cap isn't proof that he is, in my opinion.

No it isn't, imo. 

When Pegula made that a rule, which it clearly is, it restricts Adams ability to take on anyone. He has less options. 

An example, team calls and says they'll trade you X but you gotta take Y too. Adams can't say yes even if it's a good deal. So he asks Terry, Terry says nope. He's now meddled in a hockey trade. 

Edited April 10 by LGR4GM

[Pimlach]

2 hours ago, Big Guava said:

So let me get this straight. I am supposed to believe a pretty smart guy like Pegula sees how successful the Bills have been when he isn't interfering but yet ignores that and tries to interfere every chance he gets with the Sabres?

Is that what I am supposed to believe based on your opinions?

I find that stretches the bounds of believability and credibility.

Yes.  If you have been following closely since TP took over you would have seen the meddling and heard about it.  If you know any former Sabres, former coaches, or employees you might believe it.  The guy blew it right out of the gate, starting with Lafontaine and almost every move since. 

He is now past the massive interfering he did with the Sabres in the early days.  Since he shut them down at Covid, and fired Boterill for not following his new plan, he has this team in a slow rebuild autopilot.  He installed Adams, a guy with ZERO NHL hockey operations experience,  to run his efficient, economic, and effective policies - we have not yet seen the effective part  of this plan BTW.

I don't really care what you believe either.   You can question me, that is fine. 

He runs the NFL team differently because Beane and McDermott really do run the Bills and they keep him at bay.   They like him, and he likes them, and they are winning - so you keep on keeping on.   Terry gets to go into the draft war room and be with the boys. He gets to say, "I like Josh Allen the best", and that is ok.  Because Beane makes the picks. 

You can believe what you want.  You can think because a guy makes billions in energy that he can run a hockey team.  I don't see that correlation and 14 years of watching him in action tells me a lot.  I cannot think of anyone that he hired to run the hockey operations side that had the right experience, and the track record to do the job.  All of the GMs since Darcy have been very young and first timers.  

Murray is out of hockey, never to be heard from again. 

Boterill is back with his old boss and working at the same level he was before he took the Sabres GM job.  He is one of 3 AGMs in Seattle btw. 

Adams had the least experience of the three.  

Why do you think he hires these young dudes?   

Why do senior level men like Trotz, Boudreau, Berube, Gallant, etc, not get a call to help in some manner? 

 

 

Edited April 10 by Pimlach

[TheAud]

3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

No it isn't, imo. 

When Pegula made that a rule, which it clearly is, it restricts Adams ability to take on anyone. He has less options. 

An example, team calls and says they'll trade you X but you gotta take Y too. Adams can't say yes even if it's a good deal. So he asks Terry, Terry says nope. He's now meddled in a hockey trade. 

Would you consider an internal salary cap (i.e. lower than the league cap) as meddling too? 

I mean, as a fan it would piss me off for various reasons, but I also believe it's within Pegula's purview as owner to set those guidelines. Then KA has to live within them. To me this is not what we mean by meddling. 

I don't see the scenario you describe as much different. A trade offer could come that would put the team over the internal cap. KA would have to decline (or come up with some other way to fund it through another trade, etc.) But that's not the same thing as Terry saying "I don't like that player." (which I think he used to, and may still, do)

In my experience, when there are financial constraints, such as the one we think may exist within the Sabres organization around not taking on dead cap, it's not always impossible to get around them.  The manager (KA in this case) needs to come up with the right value prop and selling points to get the owner onboard. No one said it's easy.

Although I do tend to agree with you that Pegula has likely mandated this constraint, it's also possible that he hasn't and all we are seeing is KA being a dumbass. Our data is all implicit at this point.  

[SwampD]

10 hours ago, Bangarang said:

I'm out of the loop here but is there any thing that proves Pegula is still meddling?

 

10 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

He is. See Buffalo take on dead salary ever? Even though they have been almost dead last the last 3 years in cap? That's Pegula. 

 

9 hours ago, TheAud said:

To me there is a difference between setting business rules for the organization, and meddling. 

Telling KA that he doesn't want to take on dead cap is a business rule, within his prerogative as owner (not saying I like this at all, just that it's not 'meddling') 

Whereas telling KA to draft or not draft a certain player, or sign or not sign a certain FA is clearly meddling in hockey matters. 

Using that definition I don't know if he's 'meddling' or not (it would not surprise me at all if he is) but deciding to not take on dead cap isn't proof that he is, in my opinion.

Weren’t there tweets, Sabres tweets, about how involved TP is in the hockey operations and how he is in every meeting and a part of every decision? Why would you let people know how involved you are in the decisions that have led to the worst playoff drought in league history. And the funny part was that they tweeted it like it was a positive thing. Absolutely clueless.

[5th line wingnutt]

On 4/8/2024 at 3:46 PM, Big Guava said:

This has been a thorn in the side of this team far too often the past 2 seasons. They simply are not ready to play at the beginning of the game.

First period goal differential this year is -33. Second period goal differential is +7. Third Period goal differential is +24.

There is no explanation for this and it falls squarely on coaches that don't have them ready to play and players who don't have any fear of the coaches because they allow them to not be ready to play without any consequences night in and night out.

In the Granato post mortem thread it was mentioned that the Sabres practices were slow.  I have heard coaches say that you play like you practice.

Slow practice = slow start?

[MISabresFan]

Similar fate as head coach's which lead to their firing. From a Newark Newspaper "This wouldn’t even be a thought if the team did not spiral under his direction. The Devils, just a season removed from what looked like a meteoric rise, failed to win more than three games in a row this year and surrendered the first goal in a game 45 times in 61 games under Ruff."

Interesting comparison.  Both teams battled with injuries.  

[Drag0nDan]

On 4/10/2024 at 12:20 PM, Drag0nDan said:

I think the backchecking has improved, forwards are more engaged, and absent eric Johnson they have improved as a net front team.  But their transition and zone exits are super messy now.  

Messy and slow as molasses.  Winger gets the puck on the wall and is waiting to pass every time.  Everything is later than it should be, pace is slower than it should be, and often times the pass is still terrible. 

[Drag0nDan]

2 hours ago, MISabresFan said:

Similar fate as head coach's which lead to their firing. From a Newark Newspaper "This wouldn’t even be a thought if the team did not spiral under his direction. The Devils, just a season removed from what looked like a meteoric rise, failed to win more than three games in a row this year and surrendered the first goal in a game 45 times in 61 games under Ruff."

Interesting comparison.  Both teams battled with injuries.  

They were already a really young team (Hughesx2, Nemec, Mercer).  Then you factor in Dougie Hamilton playing in only 20 games, that creates a rather huge hole in the lineup.  I don't really want to think about Buffalo's record if Dahlin missed 62 games.