Players that should NOT be on this team next year

[Pimlach]

7 minutes ago, inkman said:

 

If your $11 million dollar player is on the ice “too much” maybe he’s the wrong player. 

Maybe.   Or maybe 25 to 30 mins a night, every night, is really too much for a 23 year old defenseman?

It was commented on by the HNIC crew just last night, they marveled at his play and his ice time, while saying it is not sustainable.  

We have Byram and Power, why not split the minutes a little bit more?  

Edited March 31 by Pimlach

[inkman]

Just now, Pimlach said:

Maybe.   Or maybe 25 to 30 mins a night, every night, is really too much for a 23 year old defenseman?

It was commented on by the HNIC crew just last night, they marveled at his play and his ice time while saying it is not sustainable.  

We have Byram and Power, why not split the minutes a little bit more?  

I’m all for more Byrum.  Give him the C. Don’t give Dahlin a letter.  Put him on the 2nd pair. 

[TheAud]

9 minutes ago, inkman said:

If your $11 million dollar player is on the ice “too much” maybe he’s the wrong player. 

Colorado giving Makar 0:42 less per game

Nashville giving Josi 0:59 less per game

Dallas giving Heiskanen 1:06 less per game

The only two guys with slightly more TOI per game are Doughty and Carlson, two grizzled, HOF caliber vets.  And Dahlin's 'counting stats' are right there (and slightly better) than both of them. 

[Pimlach]

1 minute ago, inkman said:

I’m all for more Byrum Byram.  Give him the C. Don’t give Dahlin a letter.  Put him on the 2nd pair. 

You have been drinking a lot and not watching as much lately.

Byram is losing some of his Colorado shine.   The Mathews goal last night was on Byram.  Once he lost his stick he became a spectator.  He could have used his body to block Mathews out, but he just watched.  

Byram will not get the C.   Adams will be lucky to extend him.  

[PerreaultForever]

4 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

You have been drinking a lot and not watching as much lately.

Byram is losing some of his Colorado shine.   The Mathews goal last night was on Byram.  Once he lost his stick he became a spectator.  He could have used his body to block Mathews out, but he just watched.  

Byram will not get the C.   Adams will be lucky to extend him.  

So true. He looked absolutely dreadful on that and you can see he does not have the size and/or physicality to handle hard play in tight. few of our D do. 

I said this in another thread but I think it's worth stressing. If you look at Adams building a team he "filled a need at D" with a fast puck moving D man but that's exactly the same move JBots made when he got Montour and he's basically the same guy. In fact, Montour is a lot tougher and might be the better of the two. When Montour got here he wanted to be here (being from Ontario) until the losing kicked in and he was poorly coached and the D system sucks and his game was garbage so he goes to Florida where they have proper structure and good coaching and he's a star for their D. 

Byram is just Montour V2 and so in terms of building this team if you look at the whole time line, Adams has simply given away Mitts. We have not progressed here.

[7+6=13]

We've never tried trading our best players.  

[pi2000]

5 more wins out of 82 games is the difference between making the playoffs and a 13th year of disappointment.

I can think of atleast a dozen games where they underpformed as a team, top to bottom, sleepwalking through the first period.   Going 0-2 against the Ducks.

Trading Owen Power or any other player/group of players won't fix that.

A new coaching staff could.

[inkman]

1 minute ago, pi2000 said:

5 more wins out of 82 games is the difference between making the playoffs and a 13th year of disappointment.

I can think of atleast a dozen games where they underpformed as a team, top to bottom, sleepwalking through the first period.   Going 0-2 against the Ducks.

Trading Owen Power or any other player/group of players won't fix that.

A new coaching staff could.

But they’ll still be soft as puppy poop.  I like Owen more than most but he’s never going to be Chris Pronger.  Please give me someone that strikes fear into the opposition.  

[pi2000]

Just now, inkman said:

But they’ll still be soft as puppy poop.  I like Owen more than most but he’s never going to be Chris Pronger.  Please give me someone that strikes fear into the opposition.  

The game isn't played that way anymore (I wish it was!).   Karlsson, Makar, Q. Hughes.... do they strike fear in anybody?   

You put someone like Pronger or Stevens in todays game, where they can't clutch and grab, and guys will skate right around them like they're standing still. 

[SABRES 0311]

2 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

The game isn't played that way anymore (I wish it was!).   Karlsson, Makar, Q. Hughes.... do they strike fear in anybody?   

You put someone like Pronger or Stevens in todays game, where they can't clutch and grab, and guys will skate right around them like they're standing still. 

Until they line em up and end their career. If Stevens hit McDavid, McKinnon, or Matthews they’d be done. 

[inkman]

9 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

The game isn't played that way anymore (I wish it was!).   Karlsson, Makar, Q. Hughes.... do they strike fear in anybody?   

You put someone like Pronger or Stevens in todays game, where they can't clutch and grab, and guys will skate right around them like they're standing still. 

Jacob Trouba seems to be doing fine. Give me someone like him.  I’m tired of our guys getting their ***** kicked constantly.  I don’t need 15 guys on the roster like that but 3-4 would be nice. 

[mjd1001]

5 hours ago, Crusader1969 said:

My first thought is that  anyone who writes off a 20 year old dman hasn't leant the lesson that history keeps teaching over and over and over again.   
My second thought is you are probably right about Skinner but it's virtually impossible

.  girgensons does bring something to this team and you need a couple of more guys like him to fill out your 4th line 

Krebs is a young centre trying to find his way, if he is part of a trade , I won't have any issue with this 

 

The people wanting him out of town continues to baffle me.  He is a good to great forchecker, he is one of the faster skaters on the team. He does not make glaring errors in his own zone leading to goals, AND he scores as much (actually statistically at a higher rate) than most 4th liners in the league.  He's a 4th liner, and a very good one.

[oddoublee]

54 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

The people wanting him out of town continues to baffle me.  He is a good to great forchecker, he is one of the faster skaters on the team. He does not make glaring errors in his own zone leading to goals, AND he scores as much (actually statistically at a higher rate) than most 4th liners in the league.  He's a 4th liner, and a very good one.

Girgs is fine. He is definitely not the teams problem. Lock him up for 2-3 years imo

[Thorner]

4 hours ago, pi2000 said:

Dahlin has played 41% of even strength minutes and is a -7, a team worst -11.53 trpm.

Power has played 35% of even strength minutes and is a +3, -0.85 trpm.

Power is not the problem.

Cozens, Thompson and Dahlin are bottom 3 in trpm.   The fact those 3 get outscored at even strength and are part of an anemic power play is the problem.

Have you compared the strength of competition faced between Dahlin and Power? 

3 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

I'd be curious to know Dahlin's +/- with the Sabres goalie pulled this season.

Despite a career high in goals scored, he's not having the dynamic season he had last year. However, he's got a higher Corsi 5-on-5 than last season, and more blocked shots and hits. An average powerplay would have him closer to 70 points. He probably still tries to do too much and occasionally blows an assignment like every other defender. But overall, having the forwards do their jobs and finding a legitimate 2nd D pairing will be the things that make Dahlin a Norris contender.

He’s facing more difficult competition than anyone last I checked 

[Thorner]

2 hours ago, inkman said:

I’m all for more Byrum.  Give him the C. Don’t give Dahlin a letter.  Put him on the 2nd pair. 

Maybe we should start by giving “Byrum” an “a”, first 

2 hours ago, TheAud said:

Colorado giving Makar 0:42 less per game

Nashville giving Josi 0:59 less per game

Dallas giving Heiskanen 1:06 less per game

The only two guys with slightly more TOI per game are Doughty and Carlson, two grizzled, HOF caliber vets.  And Dahlin's 'counting stats' are right there (and slightly better) than both of them. 

It’s definitely a “blame our only good players” thing 

His plus minus is merely reflective of overall team differential and his difficult competition 

he’s been our best player and mvp by a country mile

2 hours ago, Pimlach said:

You have been drinking a lot and not watching as much lately.

Byram is losing some of his Colorado shine.   The Mathews goal last night was on Byram.  Once he lost his stick he became a spectator.  He could have used his body to block Mathews out, but he just watched.  

Byram will not get the C.   Adams will be lucky to extend him.  

Second pairing D

Edited March 31 by Thorny

[mjd1001]

As with many things, it is hard to view this in a vacuum. Its not for me so much who should be here or not in a binary fashion, but it has to do with what type of player are they going to be next year and how much will they cost?

 

Who can go.

-Comrie.  He can/should be gone.  I wanted to like him as a backup, but its just not there.

-Krebs.  I don't think they will 'give up' on him yet, but I wasn't a fan of him when he got here, a BRIEF moment I liked his play a month or so ago, but he isn't bringing much now.  If he is back, he has to show a lot in camp.  I wouldn't be upset if he was moved in a trade though.

-Jost.  If he is back as an AHL guy fine, but he seems to be bringing less now than he did when he arrived.

-VO. I like him.  I like if you use him the right way where he can score you 20-30. The Sabres are NOT committed to putting him in that situation, so as much as I think he is blamed for being worse than he is, there really isn't a spot here anymore.

-Bryson/Jokiharju.  I think Jokiharju is slightly better, but I think you pick ONE of them as a 3rd pair guy, and you move on from the other.

 

Who will/should be here but you need more:

-Tage. I think he's playing hurt, but you need him to give you 40, maybe 50 goals. Get healthy

-Skinner.  He's not good defensively, but I have yet to have anyone show me how he is a liability (meaning he CAUSES  goals against) more than many other forwards on this team.  With that said, if he is giving you 25 goals a year, I'm not getting rid of him until someone else currently not on the team can replace those 25+ goals.

-Cozens. He has gotten to be much less of a liability in his own zone over the last few months, but for what you are paying him he needs to guarantee you 25 goals a year, hopefully closer to 30+ and he has to be a guy that at SOME points shows he is a top player on this team, not just a 'good complimentary' one.

-Power/Bryam/Benson. They are really young. Just be a little bit better each year from the previous year. Can't regress at all if this team is going to be good.

-Greenway. Yeah he brings something different than most other players on this team, but if he is going to spend ANY time on even a 2nd line, I need 15-20 goals out of him. If he can't give you that, he needs to be a 3rd/4th liner.

-Samuelsson. I still am not sure exactly how good he is, but I need 70+ games out of him to find out.

 

Finally, guys that other people seem to not like but I have no problem with (with respect to their performance vs their pay/roll)
 

-Tuch, Zemgus, Quinn, Peterka, UPL, Dahlin, Clifton. They are all fine.

 

[pastajoe]

1 hour ago, inkman said:

Jacob Trouba seems to be doing fine. Give me someone like him.  I’m tired of our guys getting their ***** kicked constantly.  I don’t need 15 guys on the roster like that but 3-4 would be nice. 

I had hoped that Adams would have vigorously persued Radko Gudas last summer, but we ended up with Clifton.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Did I just see @inkman type the *word* physicality ??

Now I know the end times are at our throats.

[inkman]

56 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Maybe we should start by giving “Byrum” an “a”, first 

It’s definitely a “blame our only good players” thing 

His plus minus is merely reflective of overall team differential and his difficult competition 

he’s been our best player and mvp by a country mile

Second pairing D

Sorry.  I haven’t watched a full game since the trade.  They don’t deserve it. 

27 minutes ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

Did I just see @inkman type the *word* physicality ??

Now I know the end times are at our throats.

It pained me

[North Buffalo]

Skinner Jost and Comrie... 

If you can get someone bigger, faster and younger than Girgenson sure... Power agreed too young to give up on but someone needs to teach the guy to hit... Krebs is young too and while a third 4th line guy I like his moxie... Ollie has been playing better lately, but im ok if a replacement can be found, til then keep him on 4th line and power play... find a tough third fourth line center please and a top winger

Edited March 31 by North Buffalo

[Pimlach]

6 hours ago, SABRES 0311 said:

Until they line em up and end their career. If Stevens hit McDavid, McKinnon, or Matthews they’d be done. 

Not McKinnon.  No way.  

[Pimlach]

4 hours ago, oddoublee said:

Girgs is fine. He is definitely not the teams problem. Lock him up for 2-3 years imo

I like Girgs, always have, but I would look to improve his spot in the off season.   

If its not feasible, I sign him for one year again.  No need to lock him up.  

[Doohicksie]

8 hours ago, inkman said:

I’m all for more Byrum.  Give him the C. Don’t give Dahlin a letter.  Put him on the 2nd pair. 

Good lord, I can't wait until you get back to your edibles or smokables or however you imbibe.  Sobriety (/legal intoxication) is clouding your judgment.

Edited April 1 by Doohickie

[TageMVP]

Jokiharju. I'm absolutely befuddled he's  still on the roster and has been for years 

[Doohicksie]

4 hours ago, mjd1001 said:

-Bryson/Jokiharju.  I think Jokiharju is slightly better, but I think you pick ONE of them as a 3rd pair guy, and you move on from the other.

I would say Bryson's stock is increasing as the season draws to a close.  Even if the Sabres decide to move on from him, they could trade him for something of value.  He's made himself into a steady defensive defenseman who doesn't shy away from the occasional pinch at the point or offensive rush.