It Is Time: Fire the GM, the Coaching Staff, get some experience in here. Fans deserve better!!!

[Brawndo]

1 hour ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

I still say no.

I agree Pegula’s Reputation around the league is not very good to put it mildly. 
 

Elliott Friedman was talking on a 32 Thoughts Podcast about how a sought after GM Candidate once mentioned to him the biggest thing that the high quality GM and HC candidates look for in an owner is can I win with them. Terry Pegula does not fit this description. 
 

Before they hired Krueger, Todd McClellan agreed to interview him the Sabres, primarily because he was in town to watch His Son play in the Frozen Four. McClellan was reportedly quite blunt with Pegula and told Him he has a reputation around the league for firing people and that he wasn’t interested in the job. 
 

This reputation has lead to recent strings of first time hires as experienced hockey personnel are staying far away.

Based on this reputation how would it look if Granato and/or Adams were fired now one year after getting the highest point total for the team in 11 seasons and missed the playoffs by two points. 
 

Yes this season is an abject disaster, starting with  Adams Offseason of running it back and continuing with Granato’s Coaching Decisions.

Adams has the difficult task of rehabbing not only the Sabres Reputation but Pegulas as well. The Front Office has improved, Jason Karmanos was not only interviewed for the Pittsburgh GM Job but was offered the Canucks GM Position by Jim Rutherford. Sam Ventura was also interviewed for the Pittsburgh Job and probably will be an AGM if not a GM in the league soon. He did improve the prospect pool through better scouting and drafting, but needs to improve UFA Acquisitions (which have been disappointing to put it mildly) and start making deals. Stability in the front office would increase the chances of getting a veteran coach.

 

After the season if the team is drafting in the Top Ten, then move on from Granato when there is a bigger pool of coaching candidates. I still believe that Rod Brindamour will have a bearing on the future of the Sabres HC Position, firing Adams reduces the slight chance of Him Coming to NFW it happens. The Athletic has an article about Mike Sullivan’s Future in Pittsburgh so there might be an attractive candidate available 

[Marvin]

30 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

I agree Pegula’s Reputation around the league is not very good to put it mildly. 
 

Elliott Friedman was talking on a 32 Thoughts Podcast about how a sought after GM Candidate once mentioned to him the biggest thing that the high quality GM and HC candidates look for in an owner is can I win with them. Terry Pegula does not fit this description. 
 

Before they hired Krueger, Todd McClellan agreed to interview him the Sabres, primarily because he was in town to watch His Son play in the Frozen Four. McClellan was reportedly quite blunt with Pegula and told Him he has a reputation around the league for firing people and that he wasn’t interested in the job. 
 

This reputation has lead to recent strings of first time hires as experienced hockey personnel are staying far away.

Based on this reputation how would it look if Granato and/or Adams were fired now one year after getting the highest point total for the team in 11 seasons and missed the playoffs by two points. 
 

Yes this season is an abject disaster, starting with  Adams Offseason of running it back and continuing with Granato’s Coaching Decisions.

Adams has the difficult task of rehabbing not only the Sabres Reputation but Pegulas as well. The Front Office has improved, Jason Karmanos was not only interviewed for the Pittsburgh GM Job but was offered the Canucks GM Position by Jim Rutherford. Sam Ventura was also interviewed for the Pittsburgh Job and probably will be an AGM if not a GM in the league soon. He did improve the prospect pool through better scouting and drafting, but needs to improve UFA Acquisitions (which have been disappointing to put it mildly) and start making deals. Stability in the front office would increase the chances of getting a veteran coach.

 

After the season if the team is drafting in the Top Ten, then move on from Granato when there is a bigger pool of coaching candidates. I still believe that Rod Brindamour will have a bearing on the future of the Sabres HC Position, firing Adams reduces the slight chance of Him Coming to NFW it happens. The Athletic has an article about Mike Sullivan’s Future in Pittsburgh so there might be an attractive candidate available 

This is a horrible look for the franchise because now they may be in a Catch-22: it might be the best hockey move to move on from GMKA and/or HCDG, but it would be another black eye fof the team's perception.  Just peachy keen.

For those who have watched the games more closely than I have, please feel free to correct me in the next bit of you disagree and have a better theory.

Far too often, the Sabres start the game seemingly completely disorganised --almost as of they had forgotten the basics of their system.  They are routinely missing assignments, not giving the defence an outlet, in too deep in the offencive zone, and all those other details they forget to pay attention to.  (I am sure that the opposition often has something to do with that.)  As the game wears on, they figure out what the heck they are supposed to do while the opposition plays a bit more passively.  (Aside: this is the perfect argument against people like me who thought that going offence first last season and learning defence this season would work out.)

IMHO, the system HCDG has installed will work once the guys have figured out all of its nuances because when they execute it from the start of a game, they look very good.  But that looks like the readiness from the opening whistle will not happen before the All Star Break.

[Goldseatsaud]

Their spinning their wheels. It’s just sad that the franchise is so full of themselves. 

[mjd1001]

Ok, I decided to take a closer look at the goals allowed last night, not sure where to put this so it goes here:

-1st goal: Kinda back luck, but I keep going back to forwards in the D-zone just floating around and having no sense of covering zones.  It starts out OK with both D-men behind the net with the puck, Mitts in front of the goal and Thompson on the wing (Skinner IS on the ice but no where to be found). But as soon as the puck goes to the near boards, BOTH Thompson and Mitts go toward the puck carrier/near boards...why is Mitts there?  The center of the ice is WIDE open. Thompson I think got a piece of the pass, but the score was scored from out front anyway, The entire center of the ice was open.  Assist to Samuelsson on this one though...he went toward the shooter just slow enough to not get there, but just fast enough to provide a massive screen for Comrie.

-2nd goal:  Go back and watch the replay on this. Forward and defensemen just have no sense of who should be where.  When the puck goes in one direction, often times NO Sabres follow the puck or TOO many Sabres follow the puck.  They have no idea who should cover who. I'm not a big NBA guy but I do know when an a team in a half court offense sets a pick or guys cross over, the Defense in the NBA knows who should pick up who/guard who when that happens. Its pretty common. The Sabres? Not a clue.  Have 2 offensive players change positions from side to side and I'm surprised the Sabres don't just run into each other and take each other out. Again, watch the replay, simple puck movement by Detroit and the Sabres have no idea who is covering who.  Assist here to Power, he seems like he is allergic to making any kind of contact to interfere with an opposing player right in front of the net.

-3rd Goal:  PP goal.  This is the same story over and over.  The Sabres AGAIN have no discipline in their own end.  When they DO maintain the pk box, they are effective.  When they stay in position, they cause the other team to pass the puck around the perimeter and take perimeter shots. You ONLY leave your spot when there is a loose puck you have a chance to get to, right? The Sabres? Nope, watch the replay they start chasing all over the place and the PK box? Its a Box, then a Triangle, then a different triangle, then a Rhombus, then kinda to a straight line and then the goal is scored.  Now go watch when the Sabres on on the PP and they fail to score, you know why? the other team maintains the PK box and causes the Sabres to play the perimeter.

-4th goal allowed: This one is confusing. How does Dahlin and Clifton both end up in the same spot on the ice leaving a wide open lane for the scorer to go in on net alone?  Looks to be no communication again. Clifton takes a forward and stays with him crossing the ice..While Dahlin is looking up the ice at?  I'm not sure.  Again, is like the offense is running a simple pick play and the Sabres have one guy playing man-to-man while the other guy is playing zone (Dahlin).  That is mistake #1. Mistake #2, the eventually goal scorer streaks down the far side of the ice where neither Dahlin or Clifton are...but through the neutral zone Skinner was with him. Skinner just STOPS near Center ice, he slams on the figurative brakes and lets his guy go. Now why would he do that?  When you freeze the replay just before the pass is made to the goal scorer, ALL 5 Sabres players are looking at the puck. No one is remotely close to being aware where the other 4 detroit players are.

Is this coaching? Are the players not listening to coaching?

Take a look at the picture I put in here. I would think effective NHL defensive play would not have EVERY SINGLE player on your team looking at the puck carrier with NO-one having any sense of where the opposing players are. In the NFL, if all 11 players in the Defense were just watching the QB all the time, you would think that eventaully a receiver is going to get open for a reception...well, that is what is happening to the Sabres.

The Sabres are losing a lot because scoring is down for them Thompson had a slow start, got hurt and is just coming back but between him and Cozens, they are missing a lot of goals.  But play without the puck?  I don't get it.  When the other team has the puck they are playing pond hockey.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2023 by mjd1001

[Marvin]

16 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

Ok, I decided to take a closer look at the goals allowed last night, not sure where to put this so it goes here:

-1st goal: Kinda back luck, but I keep going back to forwards in the D-zone just floating around and having no sense of covering zones.  It starts out OK with both D-men behind the net with the puck, Mitts in front of the goal and Thompson on the wing (Skinner IS on the ice but no where to be found). But as soon as the puck goes to the near boards, BOTH Thompson and Mitts go toward the puck carrier/near boards...why is Mitts there?  The center of the ice is WIDE open. Thompson I think got a piece of the pass, but the score was scored from out front anyway, The entire center of the ice was open.  Assist to Samuelsson on this one though...he went toward the shooter just slow enough to not get there, but just fast enough to provide a massive screen for Comrie.

-2nd goal:  Go back and watch the replay on this. Forward and defensemen just have no sense of who should be where.  When the puck goes in one direction, often times NO Sabres follow the puck or TOO many Sabres follow the puck.  They have no idea who should cover who. I'm not a big NBA guy but I do know when an a team in a half court offense sets a pick or guys cross over, the Defense in the NBA knows who should pick up who/guard who when that happens. Its pretty common. The Sabres? Not a clue.  Have 2 offensive players change positions from side to side and I'm surprised the Sabres don't just run into each other and take each other out. Again, watch the replay, simple puck movement by Detroit and the Sabres have no idea who is covering who.  Assist here to Power, he seems like he is allergic to making any kind of contact to interfere with an opposing player right in front of the net.

-3rd Goal:  PP goal.  This is the same story over and over.  The Sabres AGAIN have no discipline in their own end.  When they DO maintain the pk box, they are effective.  When they stay in position, they cause the other team to pass the puck around the perimeter and take perimeter shots. You ONLY leave your spot when there is a loose puck you have a chance to get to, right? The Sabres? Nope, watch the replay they start chasing all over the place and the PK box? Its a Box, then a Triangle, then a different triangle, then a Rhombus, then kinda to a straight line and then the goal is scored.  Now go watch when the Sabres on on the PP and they fail to score, you know why? the other team maintains the PK box and causes the Sabres to play the perimeter.

-4th goal allowed: This one is confusing. How does Dahlin and Clifton both end up in the same spot on the ice leaving a wide open lane for the scorer to go in on net alone?  Looks to be no communication again. Clifton takes a forward and stays with him crossing the ice..While Dahlin is looking up the ice at?  I'm not sure.  Again, is like the offense is running a simple pick play and the Sabres have one guy playing man-to-man while the other guy is playing zone (Dahlin).  That is mistake #1. Mistake #2, the eventually goal scorer streaks down the far side of the ice where neither Dahlin or Clifton are...but through the neutral zone Skinner was with him. Skinner just STOPS near Center ice, he slams on the figurative brakes and lets his guy go. Now why would he do that?  When you freeze the replay just before the pass is made to the goal scorer, ALL 5 Sabres players are looking at the puck. No one is remotely close to being aware where the other 4 detroit players are.

Is this coaching? Are the players not listening to coaching?

Take a look at the picture I put in here. I would think effective NHL defensive play would not have EVERY SINGLE player on your team looking at the puck carrier with NO-one having any sense of where the opposing players are. In the NFL, if all 11 players in the Defense were just watching the QB all the time, you would think that eventaully a receiver is going to get open for a reception...well, that is what is happening to the Sabres.

The Sabres are losing a lot because scoring is down for them Thompson had a slow start, got hurt and is just coming back but between him and Cozens, they are missing a lot of goals.  But play without the puck?  I don't get it.  When the other team has the puck they are playing pond hockey.

 

 

I see what you see.  I think that they often just don't know what they are doing in their own end.  You look down, blink, and then look up and it's 2-0 with shots being 7-1.  It gets better later, but by then it's too late.

[Pimlach]

11 hours ago, sabremike said:

This is a dying franchise in a dying city.

We are the Hartford Whalers.

Five more years until relocation tops.

The franchise is dying but the city is not.   The cities population and wealth per capita have been s l o w l y increasing.  

[Pimlach]

7 hours ago, inkman said:

I don’t think the Sabres player usage in the preseason was much different than other teams 

I do.  I remember games when we played far fewer regulars than the opponent did.   

There is no denying they were not ready to play this season, and that they never gave a thought to the fact that every team in the league knew how to slow them down.  They did little to address their weaknesses and they did not count on player slumps.   Power and Samuelsson are killing us every night.  Cozens is overwhelmed with expectations and pressure.  

They showed up with 3 goalies by design.  WTF ??? 

This was the year that you make sure you start where to left off, and you get better as you go.  That is called improving.  Strange concept for this organization.  

[Marvin]

3 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

The franchise is dying but the city is not.   The cities population and wealth per capita have been s l o w l y increasing.  

The metro population increased from 2000-10 and 2010-20 based on an influx of immigrants and their children.  Upstate IT people are trying to turn us into the "silicon ice box."

[Carmel Corn]

Listened to DG's latest presser today.  I've reached the point that I can no longer tolerate his "word salad" gibberish.  His answers never address the point and his tone is so "blah".  I've tuned him out as a fan and I could only imagine the players have tuned him out as well (if he speaks to them the same way).  It's like listening to Mister Rogers or Bob Ross....he makes me want to take a nap.

[Weave]

lol

Its been the same DG pressers from day one.  He was refreshing, until he’s not.

[Believer]

1 hour ago, Weave said:

lol

Its been the same DG pressers from day one.  He was refreshing, until he’s not.

He’s not… and hasn’t been all season… My bet is if he lost most of us… he lost most of the team.

[Gatorman0519]

Granato is clearly in over his head.  He is a developmental coach of young players.  That is his gift.  He is not an NHL head coach.  It is obvious by now.  KA should be fired immediately as well as the whole of the coaching staff.  We need to bring in experienced GM and coach.  I personally want Gallant.  He is a tough, no nonsense guy, that will turn this ship around within a year. 

[Sabres Super Fan]

I think the chances are greater that Don Granato will get fired than Kevyn Adams even though they both should be fired for incompetence. The Buffalo Sabres losing out on a home town player who grew up a Buffalo Sabres fan Patrick Kane was the final straw for me that Kevyn Adams needs to be fired too he will never be a big closer like the New York Yankees traded for Juan Soto from the San Diego Padres. Kevyn Adams is incapable of pulling off a big splash deal like that he failed with Patrick Kane which is a disgrace fire both Don Granato, Kevyn Adams and sell the Buffalo Sabres Terry Pegula you are a cheap owner that isn’t capable of pulling off big deals either. Terry Pegula is one of the worse owners in the NHL 13 years and no playoffs that is a disgrace in my opinion. Go Sabres! Let’s Go Buffalo 

[LGR4GM]

38 minutes ago, Sabres Super Fan said:

I think the chances are greater that Don Granato will get fired than Kevyn Adams even though they both should be fired for incompetence. The Buffalo Sabres losing out on a home town player who grew up a Buffalo Sabres fan Patrick Kane was the final straw for me that Kevyn Adams needs to be fired too he will never be a big closer like the New York Yankees traded for Juan Soto from the San Diego Padres. Kevyn Adams is incapable of pulling off a big splash deal like that he failed with Patrick Kane which is a disgrace fire both Don Granato, Kevyn Adams and sell the Buffalo Sabres Terry Pegula you are a cheap owner that isn’t capable of pulling off big deals either. Terry Pegula is one of the worse owners in the NHL 13 years and no playoffs that is a disgrace in my opinion. Go Sabres! Let’s Go Buffalo 

There are a ton of things we should be mad at Adams and Granato for. Not getting a guy who hasn't lived in Buffalo in 20 years and is coming off hip resurfacing, imo isn't the hill to die on. He might have helped sure but I don't view it as the big splash this team needs. 

[Marvin]

I feel funny about putting too much blame on HCDG because he has yet to be given a full line-up that could not be plausibly be claimed to be in development mode.  Teams that go deep in the playoffs tend to have a lot of veterans, even if the kids on ELCs are leading the scoring.

[Goldseatsaud]

17 hours ago, Gatorman0519 said:

Granato is clearly in over his head.  He is a developmental coach of young players.  That is his gift.  He is not an NHL head coach.  It is obvious by now.  KA should be fired immediately as well as the whole of the coaching staff.  We need to bring in experienced GM and coach.  I personally want Gallant.  He is a tough, no nonsense guy, that will turn this ship around within a year. 

Ellis probably too 

[Gatorman0519]

Just now, Goldseatsaud said:

Ellis probably too 

100%.  How is that guy running the power play?

 

[Carmel Corn]

1 hour ago, Goldseatsaud said:

Ellis probably too 

Ellis might be over his head even if he was in Rochester, let alone Buffalo.

[PerreaultForever]

It's funny there's an "is it time" sort of thread and also this "it is time" thread. Next comes the it's "way past time" one. 

[zow2]

So how much will it cost Pegula to eat their contracts and get rid of McDermott and Granato?

[Scottysabres]

3 minutes ago, zow2 said:

So how much will it cost Pegula to eat their contracts and get rid of McDermott and Granato?

Who actually cares outside of Terry?

[Mango]

Somebody posted this excerpt from Dunne on TBD. It immediately made me sad about the Sabres.

A lot wrong in both orgs right now, but this is a great reminder that even when one team wins, Buffalo has a major ownership problem. 
 

“The Rex Ryan stories are legendary for all the wrong reasons. As one goes, coaches hollered for a player to enter a game on the sideline… only there was one problem. The player was up in a suite because the coaches forgot to tell him to dress. “The f--ker had to run down and put his ***** on and go play,” said one ex-Bill, dying in laughter. “Rex was retired on the job. Those guys were drinking beer by 4 p.m. every day during training camp and just partying. It was a ***** show.” The moment that broke that Bills team was when Rex and a batch of his assistants rented a bus to attend a World Series game in Cleveland three hours away during a game week.

This isn’t a culture of fear to Mike Zimmer proportions. Players actually do have complimentary things to say about McDermott and even the coaches who felt his wrath weren’t necessarily afraid of him.

Rather, it’s a dreary work environment.”

[lowsabre]

On 12/6/2023 at 4:49 AM, sabremike said:

This is a dying franchise in a dying city.

We are the Hartford Whalers.

Five more years until relocation tops.

Others have responded, but I will add something.

Western NY is the future--

A lot of the new and upcoming areas in other parts of the country are just huge cookie cutter spread out suburbs. The Rust Belt cities, at least in my opinion, have more of an authenticity in their infrastructure and identity. And don't get me wrong, this isn't an insult to the South, they themselves are often complaining about losing their identity or whatever to modern development.

And... climate change, oh man, climate change. It heats up? Bring it, doesn't hurt us. Colorado, California, and all those guys are fighting over that drying river already. Fresh water, we have it all. We have no natural disasters and tons of beautiful nature right around and not too far away. And as annoying as it can be, we have the most famous city in the world in the same state, but far enough away to not physically impact us.

We may some problems, but generally we are an educated, developed, and prosperous land of people. Life wouldn't be worth living without faults.

I love this place! Special shout out to Rochester! Xerox and Kodak are some of the coolest corporate names, even if the latter is a ghost and the former... gone. The flour city, and the flower city! Ha! And even if I'm wrong, I enjoy having a stubborn loyalty to the place 🙃

[mjd1001]

8 hours ago, lowsabre said:

Others have responded, but I will add something.

Western NY is the future--

A lot of the new and upcoming areas in other parts of the country are just huge cookie cutter spread out suburbs. The Rust Belt cities, at least in my opinion, have more of an authenticity in their infrastructure and identity. And don't get me wrong, this isn't an insult to the South, they themselves are often complaining about losing their identity or whatever to modern development.

And... climate change, oh man, climate change. It heats up? Bring it, doesn't hurt us. Colorado, California, and all those guys are fighting over that drying river already. Fresh water, we have it all. We have no natural disasters and tons of beautiful nature right around and not too far away. And as annoying as it can be, we have the most famous city in the world in the same state, but far enough away to not physically impact us.

We may some problems, but generally we are an educated, developed, and prosperous land of people. Life wouldn't be worth living without faults.

I love this place! Special shout out to Rochester! Xerox and Kodak are some of the coolest corporate names, even if the latter is a ghost and the former... gone. The flour city, and the flower city! Ha! And even if I'm wrong, I enjoy having a stubborn loyalty to the place 🙃

This almost deserves a thread of its own.

I grew up in the suburbs of Buffalo, but after college I moved and lived in quite a few areas. Boston Suburbs, Cape Cod, 2 times in Florida (South Florida and the Daytona/Orlando area), and very short stints in South Carolina and New Hampshire.  

My wife was born, grew up, went to college, and had her first full time job right in NY city.  It took her a while to adjust to not being there.

But right now, there really is no other place we'd want to be, and we had choices. Both now, and when we bought our house, we had flexibility in where we could work (remote work and an option to transfer to other places.) As other have said, the 4 seasons (fall and spring... light jacket weather is my personal favorite), less traffic (helped by us being in Niagara county), and a lot of things others have said.

Where I used to live in Florida, we still have relatives that live down there, and we visit every year (sometimes twice a year) and each time we go down there, we hear them telling us over and over how much they love Florida, but it is so bad it's almost as if they are trying to convince both us and themselves of it.  I do know this, one of them has a house about the size of ours. 10 years ago they paid a fraction of the property taxes we do, but now their property taxes have just about caught up to ours, they insurance is triple on their houses and double on their cars, their local supermarket (Publix) is more expensive than Tops or Wegmans, and traffic (even though they don't live in a 'city') is awful by them.

Each time we visit my brother in law complains that his 20 mile commute to and from work takes over an hour, that the summer is too hot he can't get much done outdoors, the his homeowners association keeps raising fees and gives out too many fines, his homeowners insurance got canceled and he had to pay double for a new company/policy, that his property taxes are going up by almost $1000 per year the last few years, there is no good food, restaurants have a 30+ minute wait on any weekend...there are parts of town that are too dangerous to go out at night in.....but he finishes all that by saying he is so lucky to live in 'his paradise' (yes, he calls it a paradise, out loud he says that word over and over)

Everyone likes different things, and honestly many of us live in the area we want to live because we like that.  But honestly, I'm happy being here, and if the population stays the same or grows just slightly that is fine with me.  I wouldn't want our area to turn into those areas that "all the cool people' are moving to.

Edited December 8, 2023 by mjd1001