Some troubling comments attributed to Terry Pegula (and denied by Pegula) and Jerry Jones from SI Writer Jim Trotter’s Lawsuit against the NFL

[Stoner]

4 hours ago, nfreeman said:

From The Buffalo News today:
 

 

Does this satisfy you? Is there anything missing from this account?

[Cascade Youth]

7 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

If the statements are demonstrably false and it can be shown that the plaintiff knew as much when he caused his complaint to be filed, then the lawsuit could be dismissed as frivolous. That could undo the privilege generally afforded to judicial statements.

Just taking a break. Hard times, actually.

That is correct but good luck proving it.  Getting a lawsuit dismissed as frivolous (as opposed to unable to state a cause of action) is probably an even higher bar than proving defamation.

[darksabre]

2 hours ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

At least this terrible topic is bringing out long-term MIAs out of the cobwebs.

It is good to see two veterans, both of whom have been missed - at least by me - contributing.

Racism is the scourge of the planet.

 

2 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

Love reading/seeing you here. Twitter isn’t enough.

 

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

Wish @qwksndmonster and @darksabre were talking hockey on here rather than being drawn back in by more important things.

 

1 hour ago, SDS said:

Great to see you again. I hope all is well.

 

1 hour ago, Taro T said:

100%.

Maybe we'll get lucky and they'll stick around.

Thanks guys. We'll see. The death of Twitter is unfortunate. I've migrated to BlueSky and set up a Sabres feed there, I'm bullish on that platform as it continues to grow its user base. 

[Stoner]

Just now, darksabre said:

 

 

 

 

Thanks guys. We'll see. The death of Twitter is unfortunate. I've migrated to BlueSky and set up a Sabres feed there, I'm bullish on that platform as it continues to grow its user base. 

I'm on StormCloud. Come join us. We have cookies, but they are fat-free bran.

[darksabre]

2 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

I'm on StormCloud. Come join us. We have cookies, but they are fat-free bran.

I need more fiber these days anyway 

[Stoner]

3 minutes ago, darksabre said:

I need more fiber these days anyway 

Sounds like you're in our demographic now.

[That Aud Smell]

52 minutes ago, Cascade Youth said:

That is correct but good luck proving it.  Getting a lawsuit dismissed as frivolous (as opposed to unable to state a cause of action) is probably an even higher bar than proving defamation.

Yes, I’m familiar. I think in either instance, you’d need to prove malice. And I think those frothing for such a lawsuit harbour the suspicion that these claims are maliciously made.

[Cascade Youth]

15 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

Yes, I’m familiar. I think in either instance, you’d need to prove malice. And I think those frothing for such a lawsuit harbour the suspicion that these claims are maliciously made.

Leon Black is trying to do it.  But those missions are rare and expensive.

[Curt]

 

3 hours ago, qwksndmonster said:

In what way does the knowledge that the league conducted an investigation lead the case to be closed? How would it benefit the NFL to do to anything other than sweep it under the rug?  An anonymous source assured us that nothing was said. Oh okay.

People here responded defensively to the lawsuit as if it's about smearing Terry Pegula. Look at what Trotter is actually doing (who works for the Athletic now, and is not desperately trying to get his job back).  As he tells it, he tried to push for change internally through all the right channels but was met with resistance.  He had reason to believe his contract was going to be renewed, and instead he was fired.

Why would he open himself up to the risk of being counter sued? Why get in a legal battle with one of the most powerful, deep pocketed organizations in the world? Because he's telling the truth.  The NFL will settle.  Pegula and Jones's denials will stand. But Trotter is putting the truth out there for people to do with as they will.

What is the truth that you are referring to that Trotter is putting out there?

Is it true that someone told him that Terry Pegula said something kinda inappropriate at a dinner party 2 years prior?

Ok, MAYBE that’s true, but was the person who told Trotter that being 100% honest and correct about it?

We don’t know.

I don’t know Terry Pegula personally, but from a far he seems to be a bit of a blathering idiot whose foot fits perfectly in his mouth.  He seems to have a knack for speaking in a thoughtless and tone deaf manner.

It wouldn’t surprise me if he went to Africa or some ***** back in 2018 and was blathering to everyone for months after about “wow, people complain about stuff over here, they should go try living there…”.  Wouldn’t surprise me a bit, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that Terry has hate in his heart for people of another race.

[Pimlach]

3 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

Who's the first anonymous source?

You know, that anonymous guy over there. 

Edited September 14, 2023 by Pimlach

[qwksndmonster]

I'm curious why it's specified in the (wonderfully written passive voice) thread title that Pegula denied it and Jones didn't? Is it because Jones is a racist? Or is it because it doesn't matter because he owns a different team?

[nfreeman]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

Does this satisfy you? Is there anything missing from this account?

Well, I didn’t post it to say “this matter has now been conclusively determined” — I posted it because I thought it was relevant info.

At this point, on one hand, we have an accusation of a racist comment 5ish years ago, made by someone who didn’t hear it, but who claims to have been told about it 3 years ago by an unidentified person at a meeting with about 40 others in attendance — none of whom have said anything publicly about it.

And on the other hand, we have a forceful, on-the-record denial by the person who allegedly made the comment, plus a report that the NFL interviewed everyone who was there the night of the alleged comment and they all denied hearing it.

Is that enough to say we absolutely know what happened?  Of course not.   But I would not believe this type of accusation about anyone without quite a bit more to support it than what we have here   

 

47 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

Yes, I’m familiar. I think in either instance, you’d need to prove malice. And I think those frothing for such a lawsuit harbour the suspicion that these claims are maliciously made.

As one of the frothers, my suspicion is that the accusation was made recklessly, not maliciously — and IMHO if you smear someone with a serious accusation like this recklessly, you deserve to get sued.  

[qwksndmonster]

4 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

As one of the frothers, my suspicion is that the accusation was made recklessly, not maliciously — and IMHO if you smear someone with a serious accusation like this recklessly, you deserve to get sued.  

Are you going to sue me for the times I called you racist?

[Curt]

4 minutes ago, qwksndmonster said:

Are you going to sue me for the times I called you racist?

People don’t always get what they deserve.

[That Aud Smell]

5 minutes ago, Curt said:

People don’t always get what they deserve.

And thank God for that.

[That Aud Smell]

16 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

As one of the frothers, my suspicion is that the accusation was made recklessly, not maliciously — and IMHO if you smear someone with a serious accusation like this recklessly, you deserve to get sued.  

It’s okay to say that it’s more than that, if that’s what you feel in your heart.

[nfreeman]

8 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

It’s okay to say that it’s more than that, if that’s what you feel in your heart.

I was using your phrasing.  Either way, my suspicion wouldn’t ripen into, say, belief (which appears to be what you’re driving at) without more facts — e.g. I’d like to know whether Trotter did any work to confirm the story he allegedly heard before making the accusation.  

[Stoner]

24 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Well, I didn’t post it to say “this matter has now been conclusively determined” — I posted it because I thought it was relevant info.

At this point, on one hand, we have an accusation of a racist comment 5ish years ago, made by someone who didn’t hear it, but who claims to have been told about it 3 years ago by an unidentified person at a meeting with about 40 others in attendance — none of whom have said anything publicly about it.

And on the other hand, we have a forceful, on-the-record denial by the person who allegedly made the comment, plus a report that the NFL interviewed everyone who was there the night of the alleged comment and they all denied hearing it.

Is that enough to say we absolutely know what happened?  Of course not.   But I would not believe this type of accusation about anyone without quite a bit more to support it than what we have here   

 

As one of the frothers, my suspicion is that the accusation was made recklessly, not maliciously — and IMHO if you smear someone with a serious accusation like this recklessly, you deserve to get sued.  

Let's try some logic. If the league interviewed everyone at the dinner where Pegula is alleged to have made the comment, then the comment must have been mentioned during the NFL Media Zoom meeting to start the whole process. That much would seem to be not in doubt. Except you clearly have a doubt that it was even mentioned during the Zoom meeting. That seems odd and illogical.

My question is why wasn't the original reporter sued? Why the one who is merely citing the alleged quote as part of a lawsuit?

By the way what's missing from the TBN story citing a leagur source is what the investigation yielded about the reporter. What's his or her side of the story?

[inkman]

10 hours ago, Eleven said:

Is that supposed to be jism?  What's going on here?

Porn has ruined us 

[qwksndmonster]

1 hour ago, Curt said:

People don’t always get what they deserve.

lmao what.

[RochesterExpat]

I bet Jim Trotter probably did hear something from someone, but I believe the 40+ other people who don’t recall it over a single voice that isn’t even a primary source. The telephone game is fun when you’re a kid for a reason. It could be as simple as that.

Hell, I’ll go further and say Pegula has almost certainly made an off-color comment at some point. You can find comments from everyone if you dig deep enough. I don’t believe anyone is innocent in that regard.

If Pegula actively inhibited minority representation or advancement in the NFL, either by action or voice, I would be shocked, and I would hope he would sell the team.

If the NFL engaged in the practice of discrimination and worked to bury investigations (like this one) as the suit alleges, I would hope people respond in a meaningful way. That’s when a collective boycott would be appropriate.

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, RochesterExpat said:

If the NFL engaged in the practice of discrimination and worked to bury investigations (like this one) as the suit alleges, I would hope people respond in a meaningful way. That’s when a collective boycott would be appropriate.

Except, when it comes to football, "people" kind of respond the opposite way. 99% of Pittsburgh Steeler fans (for example) made excuses for rapey Ben Roethlisberger and almost no one in Baltimore will admit to the possibility that Ray Ray Lewis might have had involvement in murder, and most recently, the Jets (or any other team) wouldn't even give Kapernick a try out (and second chance). When it comes to "issues" football fans prefer to brush aside anything that might get in the way of their teams. That's just a fact. 

I guarantee you that IF it was proven that Terry did say racist things, nobody here who currently watches the Bills would quit watching the Bills and there'd be a ton of excuses and even shouts of fake news. Guaranteed. 

[That Aud Smell]

6 hours ago, nfreeman said:

I’d like to know whether Trotter did any work to confirm the story he allegedly heard before making the accusation.  

As stated upthread, the issue appears to be equally if not more about what the league did and didn’t do in response to the alleged statement being raised. The facts alleged on that issue are pretty specific.

Trotter has big boy lawyers. Wigdor is a small shop, but they are Chambers rated. You only get that rating when the bench and bar agree that your firm is top notch. That complaint appears to be excellent work product. I’m assuming that the lawyers performed due diligence on what they view as the relevant facts.

[Cascade Youth]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

As stated upthread, the issue appears to be equally if not more about what the league did and didn’t do in response to the alleged statement being raised. The facts alleged on that issue are pretty specific.

Trotter has big boy lawyers. Wigdor is a small shop, but they are Chambers rated. You only get that rating when the bench and bar agree that your firm is top notch. That complaint appears to be excellent work product. I’m assuming that the lawyers performed due diligence on what they view as the relevant facts.

Don’t assume those things.

Chambers is an elite list but it’s not a badge of ethical behavior.  You can get on the Chambers list by getting high-profile results and a few key referrals/references.  And Widgor is known for pushing ethical boundaries, again, check out Leon Black’s lawsuit against the firm and it isn’t the first of its kind.  I have dealt with the Wigdor firm and let me just say I have serious concerns about their diligence.  They draft Complaints for the media not for the court and they’re really good at that but that’s what they’re doing, sometimes at the expense of their own clients’ interest.  The moment the Complaint is filed it has its own webpage, think about that.  Media hit jobs are their MO.

[That Aud Smell]

26 minutes ago, Cascade Youth said:

Don’t assume those things.

Chambers is an elite list but it’s not a badge of ethical behavior.  You can get on the Chambers list by getting high-profile results and a few key referrals/references.  And Widgor is known for pushing ethical boundaries, again, check out Leon Black’s lawsuit against the firm and it isn’t the first of its kind.  I have dealt with the Wigdor firm and let me just say I have serious concerns about their diligence.  They draft Complaints for the media not for the court and they’re really good at that but that’s what they’re doing, sometimes at the expense of their own clients’ interest.  The moment the Complaint is filed it has its own webpage, think about that.  Media hit jobs are their MO.

Hmm. Interesting.

Fair deuce.

It’s still a well-drafted pleading.