Michael Peca is joining the NY Rangers as an Asst Coach

[Flashsabre]

4 minutes ago, Buffalonill said:

Are we really going to use this  excuse every freaking time "youngest team in the NHL" its been  A decade without playoffs  Give me a freaking break they had 4 guys 20+ and the rest ***** men 

 What's the next  Excuse they're too old ? 

 

What are Peca’s strengths as an assistant coach? Why would he help improve the team’s record next year while other coaches wouldn’t?

[Porous Five Hole]

36 minutes ago, Buffalonill said:

Are we really going to use this  excuse every freaking time "youngest team in the NHL" its been  A decade without playoffs  Give me a freaking break they had 4 guys 20+ and the rest ***** men 

 What's the next  Excuse they're too old ? 

 

Are you just in a bad mood tonight? 
Everyone knows where this team is. No one is making excuses. It was the most successful season in more than a decade. 
 

Happy Father’s Day 🍻

36 minutes ago, Buffalonill said:

Are we really going to use this  excuse every freaking time "youngest team in the NHL" its been  A decade without playoffs  Give me a freaking break they had 4 guys 20+ and the rest ***** men 

 What's the next  Excuse they're too old ? 

 

Are you just in a bad mood tonight? 
Everyone knows where this team is. No one is making excuses. It was the most successful season in more than a decade. 
 

Happy Father’s Day 🍻

[Eleven]

42 minutes ago, Flashsabre said:

What are Peca’s strengths as an assistant coach? Why would he help improve the team’s record next year while other coaches wouldn’t?

This is the big IF I mentioned in my first post in this thread.

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

 

This doesn't mean the coaching staff is right for this team (I know PTR is being tongue-in-cheek).  Granato is a development coach who has serious problems to address when it comes to tactics and maybe strategy as well, and that has permeated the rest of the coaching staff (as it naturally should).  I'm not sure that Peca is the answer to the problem or that he would be a good "coach-whisperer," but Granato is out of his depth often enough.  The fact that he's the best the Sabres have managed since firing Ruff is of no moment; I think he's already done what he's good at.

IF--and that's an IF--Peca is the right guy to take over in-game tactics, promote him; otherwise, gotta let him chase his dream.

This is honestly *****.

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

 

This doesn't mean the coaching staff is right for this team (I know PTR is being tongue-in-cheek).  Granato is a development coach who has serious problems to address when it comes to tactics and maybe strategy as well, and that has permeated the rest of the coaching staff (as it naturally should).  I'm not sure that Peca is the answer to the problem or that he would be a good "coach-whisperer," but Granato is out of his depth often enough.  The fact that he's the best the Sabres have managed since firing Ruff is of no moment; I think he's already done what he's good at.

IF--and that's an IF--Peca is the right guy to take over in-game tactics, promote him; otherwise, gotta let him chase his dream.

This entire post is atrocious and wrong. You're wrong, flat out about Granato and I think this post reflects a deep seeded bias against Granato simply because he wasn't some well known ex head coach. 

[Night Train]

6 hours ago, kas23 said:

I don’t know what we would promote him to. We already have a HC for the Amerks. An assistant coach for the Sabres? As much as our defensive woes, I think Muel, Dahlin, and Power are developing well.  Coaching previously stunted Dahlin considerably. 

 He could teach forwards how to get back on D. That was a huge problem. Getting caught pinching deep. 

[Hank]

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

I can agree with everything but your last sentence here.  Granato's refusal to change goalies (at all or until too late), refusal to pull goalies until too late, and line decisions in-game were worth at least a win.  

Here's the thing though, we can't go back and redo it to see if your preferences were correct. I may even concede that it's more likely than not some of your preferences would have worked out. We just can't know. I believe, and I think you agree, there are coaches that could have gotten more than 91 points out of last year's team. I still believe Granato did a good job last year. All things considered, I personally can't get to a place where I think he did not do a good job. 

[Hank]

8 minutes ago, Night Train said:

 He could teach forwards how to get back on D. That was a huge problem. Getting caught pinching deep. 

A more structured defensive system would have allowed fewer goals. I believe it also would have resulted in fewer goals scored so may not have resulted in more wins. I'm hoping upgrades in D and net will go towards fixing it. 

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, Porous Five Hole said:

Just because Meatballs hasn’t had anything at the nhl level to work with other than a developing team doesn’t mean that’s all he knows. I’m willing to give him some latitude to see how he evolves as his team does.  
 

This team doesn’t have a problem scoring goals.
Defending at the NHL level with a bunch of young D and young forwards will come with experience. It’s not like this team has a ton of experienced two-way forwards and they’re failing compared to previous results. Plus goaltending has been replacement level for his entire tenure. 
 

Im optimistic. 

I'm CAUTIOUSLY optimistic. It depends what they do in this off season. 

I still firmly believe when this season started management had zero thoughts about making the playoffs. Good draft coming up, development year, not a "tank" but also no real ambition to make the playoffs (yet). A few things went right and maybe better than expected so near the end when they found themselves close maybe they shifted their focus a bit but it was too late and they didn't get the addition(s) done so it is what it was. 

Now I truly hope they will set their sights on playoffs. I've heard a number of "experts" and "insiders" saying they think Buffalo will make some big moves this off season. I'm hoping they're not just pulling that out of their butts for summer chatter. If we make the necessary moves then we should contend. 

As for Granato, he hasn't done a good job on the defensive side so far. What I don't know is if he's not good at designing and implementing that OR was it just an offense first then we do defense philosophy. I know that's been said, but it still remains to be seen. The biggest question for me will be IF we do employ a good defensive system next year, how much will the offense suffer? Balancing that is Granato's job and we will see how he does or doesn't do it. 

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, Flashsabre said:

What are Peca’s strengths as an assistant coach? Why would he help improve the team’s record next year while other coaches wouldn’t?

What are ANY assistant coach's strengths? One presumes he brings (and teaches) some of what he was. Physical 2 way player that did things the right way. If some of our young guys become more Peca-like we'd be in great shape. 

[Flashsabre]

21 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

What are ANY assistant coach's strengths? One presumes he brings (and teaches) some of what he was. Physical 2 way player that did things the right way. If some of our young guys become more Peca-like we'd be in great shape. 

That’s my point. If no one knows an assistant coach’s strengths then why argue over whether losing him is a huge issue. The “ he was a good player so he is a good coach” argument doesn’t work.

[matter2003]

10 hours ago, Brawndo said:

 

This one hurts. He has been great for forward development 

Sabres had the option of promoting him themselves so there wouldn't be a reason for him to leave. It's not like the special teams were any great shakes. Power play had good numbers but looked disjointed the second half of the year. Penalty kill sucked all year.

Pretty sure he could help out in one of those areas.

[Eleven]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

Here's the thing though, we can't go back and redo it to see if your preferences were correct. I may even concede that it's more likely than not some of your preferences would have worked out. We just can't know. I believe, and I think you agree, there are coaches that could have gotten more than 91 points out of last year's team. I still believe Granato did a good job last year. All things considered, I personally can't get to a place where I think he did not do a good job. 

This is fair; I still wonder whether he is the right coach going forward.

[Eleven]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

This is honestly *****.

This entire post is atrocious and wrong. You're wrong, flat out about Granato and I think this post reflects a deep seeded bias against Granato simply because he wasn't some well known ex head coach. 

You know me better than that by now.  (And it's "deep-seated.")  I'm not biased in favor of big-name coaches.  I think it's well-known on this board that my favorite Sabres coach of all time was a rookie head coach when he got here.  Meanwhile, since that particularly excellent coach was fired, I've seen three head coaches with prior NHL experience--two with Jack Adams awards--fail here. 

My main problem with Granato is his lack of ability to adjust tactics in-game.  I posted about it frequently last season.  I also wonder whether he is able to make the jump from development coach to a winning head coach of a well-assembled team.  (Assuming Adams finishes assembly with a G and D.)

None of this has anything to do with his prior experience.  Frankly, this was a very bad "take" from you.

Edited June 19, 2023 by Eleven

[SDS]

4 hours ago, Buffalonill said:

Did you miss how they folded? This is what's wrong with some in this Fanbase we have accepted   participation awards .

 

Is the guy who was arguing that this team was going to finish in the bottom five really going to try and make this point? 🙄

[Hank]

3 minutes ago, Eleven said:

This is fair; I still wonder whether he is the right coach going forward.

Me too. While the team was fun to watch and entertaining, I'm not a huge fan of the system they played. Regardless of additions this year, because I think internal growth should be enough, if they don't make the playoffs next year I'll cross over to your side. 

[Eleven]

1 minute ago, Hank said:

Me too. While the team was fun to watch and entertaining, I'm not a huge fan of the system they played. Regardless of additions this year, because I think internal growth should be enough, if they don't make the playoffs next year I'll cross over to your side. 

I don't really have a "side," but I do question whether Granato is the right guy.  Just questioning--not demanding his head by any means.

[PerreaultForever]

45 minutes ago, Flashsabre said:

That’s my point. If no one knows an assistant coach’s strengths then why argue over whether losing him is a huge issue. The “ he was a good player so he is a good coach” argument doesn’t work.

cause we like Michael Peca.

[PerreaultForever]

10 minutes ago, Eleven said:

My main problem with Granato is his lack of ability to adjust tactics in-game.  I posted about it frequently last season.  I also wonder whether he is able to make the jump from development coach to a winning head coach of a well-assembled team.  (Assuming Adams finishes assembly with a G and D.)

I agree with this, except I'm not sure if it was Granato's inability to adjust tactics in game or the team's, and thus his knowing there was no point to trying that. 

He has young, and presumably malleable players on this roster so if he can't teach them a defensive system this training camp and into this season, well then he needs to be replaced. We shall see. 

[Eleven]

7 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

I agree with this, except I'm not sure if it was Granato's inability to adjust tactics in game or the team's, and thus his knowing there was no point to trying that. 

He has young, and presumably malleable players on this roster so if he can't teach them a defensive system this training camp and into this season, well then he needs to be replaced. We shall see. 

Changing goalies when one is getting shelled and pulling goalies in a one or two goal game in a timely manner are not team decisions.

Shaking up lines when they aren't working is not a team decision.

Granato is a work in progress just like the team is.  But he'd better work on it or hire an assistant who can help him.

Edited June 19, 2023 by Eleven

[PerreaultForever]

4 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Changing goalies when one is getting shelled and pulling goalies in a one or two goal game in a timely manner are not team decisions.

Shaking up lines when they aren't working are not team decisions.

Granato is a work in progress just like the team is.  But he'd better work on it or hire an assistant who can help him.

Ya, I talked about the goalie thing when it happened. That was strange I agree. 

Line juggling idk. We weren't a deep team and have a lot of guys that are similar so there weren't really tons of options for anything different stylistically than what he tried. 

[dudacek]

With all due respect, Sabrespace knows ***** about coaching. As in, even Ralph Krueger knows more about coaching hockey than any of us. (Except @Taro T that guy is coach smart)

I’ve been reading this place for years. Many of us seem to operate under the misunderstanding that hockey is like football and coaches have an entire playbook that they are constantly able to pull from to attack or counter opponents throughout the game. Or that coaches are somehow able to dictate what a player does in that split second after puck hits a skate at the left circle and bounces at a 60 degree angle on a cross-ice pass attempt during the cycle. Or we pick a specific moment or game decision or coaching tendency we disagree with and hold on to it forever like it is the clear reason the team lost or won.

We say things like “Sullivan totally outcoached Granato tonight” because “way too many turnovers” or “the Sabres are soft”. Because I guess Granato told them to make bad passes or not battle for pucks?

Let’s be honest, most of us don’t understand tactics and strategies and wouldn’t recognize an in-game shift if it slashed us in the shins. We have no clue about what the Sabres are being told on the bench or in the room. We have no insight into who is hurt, or sick, or hungover. We say and believe stupid things like “coach is an idiot for not letting Skinner shoot in the shootouts” without ever checking to see if he is good at shootouts. Or “Granato has no experience” when he has been coaching pro hockey players for 30 years.

Eleven is smart guy, I respect most of his opinions. But he has no more ***** clue whether or not Don Granato can coach a non-development team than I do.  Because neither of us has ever seen him in that situation.

Let’s face it, we basically judge a coach on whether we like his pressers and his demeanour behind the bench, as well as his won/lost record filtered through our expectations. That’s it.

That’s fine. I do it too. But it has very little to do with actual coaching.

Nearly every player on Don Granato’s roster had career seasons while the Sabres had their highest point total in 12 years. If you think that carries less weight than the fact he didn’t pull Eric Comrie with 10 minutes left against Dallas when a 5-3 game turned into an 8-3 game, you’re welcome to that.

 

Edited June 19, 2023 by dudacek

[LGR4GM]

7 hours ago, Eleven said:

You know me better than that by now.  (And it's "deep-seated.")  I'm not biased in favor of big-name coaches.  I think it's well-known on this board that my favorite Sabres coach of all time was a rookie head coach when he got here.  Meanwhile, since that particularly excellent coach was fired, I've seen three head coaches with prior NHL experience--two with Jack Adams awards--fail here. 

My main problem with Granato is his lack of ability to adjust tactics in-game.  I posted about it frequently last season.  I also wonder whether he is able to make the jump from development coach to a winning head coach of a well-assembled team.  (Assuming Adams finishes assembly with a G and D.)

None of this has anything to do with his prior experience.  Frankly, this was a very bad "take" from you.

I don't agree and I'm not going to agree. Calling him just a development coach is just not true. 

There is an underlying bias there whether you want to admit it or not. This board and in this case you, constantly say "he's just a development coach" even though we have evidence that's not true. Granato not pulling goalies is such a low bar because what's he supposed to do? Pull Comrie for UPL? Pull UPL for Comrie? That's like peeing into the wind and wondering why you're wet. 

Line combos? They scored the 3rd most goals in the league. Defense? He only had limited options there. 

Granato is fine. He did exactly what he needed to last year. He got the team to consistently play their style. He wanted them to be free offensively first and has said as much. We watched them adjust down the stretch. We watched them grow when the pressure ramped up. 

"Jump from a development coach" is such a low blow for a guy who has won and just about every level of hockey except one. Don Granato isn't just a "development coach" and I stand by saying your take on him is bad. 

Edited June 19, 2023 by LGR4GM

[LGR4GM]

Last season 22-23, was the first full season Granato had his team together. Yes, last year was about developing because we were the youngest team in the league and if you're not developing that, idk what you're end goal is. Through that process we beat some really good teams and we came up short. I think coming up 1 game short might be the best thing because adversity helps ppl grow. This team will be better for that experience because I think internally their goal was playoffs. Now it is the Stanley Cup, players expectations changed. 

Granato has been mostly great. He's honest and if you listen to him you get a good glimpse of his hockey knowledge. He's not "just a development coach" and I think this team isn't just going to make the playoffs next year with him, they are going to make noise. 

[PromoTheRobot]

14 hours ago, Eleven said:

 

This doesn't mean the coaching staff is right for this team (I know PTR is being tongue-in-cheek).  Granato is a development coach who has serious problems to address when it comes to tactics and maybe strategy as well, and that has permeated the rest of the coaching staff (as it naturally should).  I'm not sure that Peca is the answer to the problem or that he would be a good "coach-whisperer," but Granato is out of his depth often enough.  The fact that he's the best the Sabres have managed since firing Ruff is of no moment; I think he's already done what he's good at.

IF--and that's an IF--Peca is the right guy to take over in-game tactics, promote him; otherwise, gotta let him chase his dream.

Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.

Wanting to be "right" about Granato is sooooo important to some people.

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I don't agree and I'm not going to agree. Calling him just a development coach is just not true. 

There is an underlying bias there whether you want to admit it or not. This board and in this case you, constantly say "he's just a development coach" even though we have evidence that's not true. Granato not pulling goalies is such a low bar because what's he supposed to do? Pull Comrie for UPL? Pull UPL for Comrie? That's like peeing into the wind and wondering why you're wet. 

Line combos? They scored the 3rd most goals in the league. Defense? He only had limited options there. 

Granato is fine. He did exactly what he needed to last year. He got the team to consistently play their style. He wanted them to be free offensively first and has said as much. We watched them adjust down the stretch. We watched them grow when the pressure ramped up. 

"Jump from a development coach" is such a low blow for a guy who has won and just about every level of hockey except one. Don Granato isn't just a "development coach" and I stand by saying your take on him is bad. 

 

[LGR4GM]

9 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.

Wanting to be "right" about Granato is sooooo important to some people.

 

No,  Granato can still fail but it won't be because "he's just a development coach."

Idc about being right. I care about winning the cup. It's why Adams must, I repeat must, strengthen the defense this offseason with a big move. 

Edited June 19, 2023 by LGR4GM