2023 Stanley Cup Finals: Florida vs Vegas

[SwampD]

Just now, Randall Flagg said:

Also, "it was a marginal call, but" is part of the issue - Apparently we are playing hockey that won't send a Knight to the box for cross checking Tkachuk's head into the net and then slashing him like crazy when he gets out. But need to make that "marginal" call heading into OT of game 3

So I’m guessing you want Florida to win.

[Randall Flagg]

1 minute ago, SwampD said:

Sure. Go with that.

Yes, I have no issue going with the idea that it is possible to both trip over something, and be tripped by something, and that one of those is a penalty and the other isn't

Just now, SwampD said:

So I’m guessing you want Florida to win.

You haven't read the thread very closely! I want Eichel to win badly, to torment people who said stupid things here for 2 years. And I hate Florida because they have kicked the ***** out of us for the last few years 

[SwampD]

Just now, Randall Flagg said:

Yes, I have no issue going with the idea that it is possible to both trip over something, and be tripped by something, and that one of those is a penalty and the other isn't

I saw a trip, you didn’t. I’m comfortable leaving it at that.

[Randall Flagg]

1 minute ago, SwampD said:

I saw a trip, you didn’t. I’m comfortable leaving it at that.

YOU HAVE TO AGREE WITH ME 

 

[SwampD]

7 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

YOU HAVE TO AGREE WITH ME 

 

And if you think I am comfortable agreeing with the refs, then you don’t know me at all.😂

[Randall Flagg]

2 minutes ago, SwampD said:

And if you think I am comfortable agreeing with the refs, then you don’t know me at all.😂

That was the funny part of this convo

Swamp: "Flagg, Vegas is better and winning fair and square"

Flagg: "I know, but you're wrong. Swamp, the refs have been really biased"

Swamp: "I know, but you're wrong." 

 

[PerreaultForever]

4 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

I agree the refs seem really slanted, but I don't agree that Florida would have won in regulation. I didn't see every second of the game but they looked terrible for most of the parts I saw. And had just 16 shots on goal through 95% of the game. They look spent, not like a cup finalist 

Vegas could only score on the PP though. 5 on 5 it was pretty much 0-0 with Florida getting a few more high danger chances. 

[That Aud Smell]

I watched most of the game last night. Turned it off and presumed that the score would hold and Las Vegas would be up 3-0.

I'm glad that Florida scratched that one out.

I'll add my voice to those who are saying it: Eichel is a funking 2-way monster. A beast. Regularly doing things that are noticeable and positive for his side. Good on him.

[Wyldnwoody44]

Yeah, I can't deny how good Eichel has been, I'm sure he would have been the same beast come playoff time for Buffalo. I'm softening a bit on his situation. They medically wanted to handicap him permanatley and, I have worked for awful bosses. You can't blame the employee in those situations and Buffalo really screwed the pooch for his prime years here. 

His attitude was poor but I would be a little pisser as well under those circumstances

Lasly, that was a softie goal in OT by Hill. I think if Florida can generate more shots instead of looking for the perfect chance, they may start getting some to squeak in. 

[K-9]

1 hour ago, Wyldnwoody44 said:

Yeah, I can't deny how good Eichel has been, I'm sure he would have been the same beast come playoff time for Buffalo. I'm softening a bit on his situation. They medically wanted to handicap him permanatley and, I have worked for awful bosses. You can't blame the employee in those situations and Buffalo really screwed the pooch for his prime years here. 

His attitude was poor but I would be a little pisser as well under those circumstances

Lasly, that was a softie goal in OT by Hill. I think if Florida can generate more shots instead of looking for the perfect chance, they may start getting some to squeak in. 

He wanted out of Buffalo well before he injured his neck. He screwed his own pooch for his prime years here.

[Wyldnwoody44]

39 minutes ago, K-9 said:

He wanted out of Buffalo well before he injured his neck. He screwed his own pooch for his prime years here.

He was excited as a rookie.... Who didn't want out of Buffalo, we've been a wasteland for over a decade. Hell, 50% or more of the fans also left. 

[JohninMinn.]

Everything that could go wrong did go wrong as far as Eichel and Buffalo's relationship went. I still don't like him though he didn't want to be one of us. He was hoity toity New England stock.

[Randall Flagg]

1 hour ago, K-9 said:

He wanted out of Buffalo well before he injured his neck. He screwed his own pooch for his prime years here.

This is silly

Dude played his butt off and tried to be the best he could be like any reasonable hockey player would. Nothing ever worked, and he said he wanted out if we were going to do a rebuild, which we wanted to do, then the neck stuff happened

His last full season here he was an awesome, awesome hockey player, I still vividly remember a lot of those games

[K-9]

1 hour ago, Wyldnwoody44 said:

He was excited as a rookie.... Who didn't want out of Buffalo, we've been a wasteland for over a decade. Hell, 50% or more of the fans also left. 

Sorry, but I don’t give a crap about players that didn’t want to be here for whatever reason why they didn’t want to be here so there’s no reason to dredge up that old argument. The Sabres sucked, the coaches sucked, the management sucked and he just couldn’t take it anymore. If a player checks out and doesn’t want to be part of the solution, especially after getting a long term lucrative commitment from the team he wants to quit on, then good riddance. 

[Marvin]

3 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

This is silly

Dude played his butt off and tried to be the best he could be like any reasonable hockey player would. Nothing ever worked, and he said he wanted out if we were going to do a rebuild, which we wanted to do, then the neck stuff happened

His last full season here he was an awesome, awesome hockey player, I still vividly remember a lot of those games

He still wanted out of Buffalo before the COVID season.  I do not blame him - friends of mine from around the country had heard less than flattering things about our front office going back to Ron Rolston.  The noise got louder as the years passed.

[Kristian]

5 hours ago, Marvin said:

He still wanted out of Buffalo before the COVID season.  I do not blame him - friends of mine from around the country had heard less than flattering things about our front office going back to Ron Rolston.  The noise got louder as the years passed.

The Sabres haven been a joke pretty much since Pegula took over. It’s the place where careers go to die. Everyone knew this.

Looks like this may have changed now hopefully, but it’ll take at least 4-5 years of relevance to get the stench out of the of walls in the Keybank Center.

The Sabres did this to themselves. Blaming ex-players is understandable, but the real issue here is Terry Pegula making one terrible hire after another.

[JohnC]

12 hours ago, K-9 said:

Sorry, but I don’t give a crap about players that didn’t want to be here for whatever reason why they didn’t want to be here so there’s no reason to dredge up that old argument. The Sabres sucked, the coaches sucked, the management sucked and he just couldn’t take it anymore. If a player checks out and doesn’t want to be part of the solution, especially after getting a long term lucrative commitment from the team he wants to quit on, then good riddance. 

You know what my position is on the Eichel issue so I'm not going to belabor that point. Standing back and reviewing the trade it was a good deal for both sides. Vegas took a calculated risk on acquiring an injured player who needed surgery. The player got the surgery he wanted. It resulted in an outcome that restored his health and career. Now he is one of the prime players on a team competing for the Cup championship. Good for him. 

This trade worked out wonderfully for Buffalo. Tuch is turning out to be an elite player and a leader on the team. Krebs is emerging from being a raw prospect to being a good NHL player. And he will get better. In addition, we used a first-round pick from the trade to get a high end prospect. On top of that, Greenway was acquired from one of the draft picks that we got in return. 

In many ways it was that Jack deal that re-centered this faltering franchise and stabilized it. What is often forgotten is that with Jack's departure other players' roles were changed and elevated. Tage, Cozens and Mitts to a lesser extent were given elevated roles that they embraced and thrived on. Another benefit to the Jack trade is that his large cap cost was redistributed to lock up the emerging players already on the team. 

There are a number of reasons why the Sabres are now on an upper trajectory. But it can't be denied that the Jack trade was the jolt that changed the course of this flailing franchise. Player movements are part of the pro sports and maybe even more so in college sports landscape. It's obvious why the Jack saga gets so much attention. Of all the players who left in the reshuffle the one player I would have loved to have kept is Montour. 

[Zamboni]

4 hours ago, Kristian said:

The Sabres haven been a joke pretty much since Pegula took over. It’s the place where careers go to die. Everyone knew this.

Looks like this may have changed now hopefully, but it’ll take at least 4-5 years of relevance to get the stench out of the of walls in the Keybank Center.

The Sabres did this to themselves. Blaming ex-players is understandable, but the real issue here is Terry Pegula making one terrible hire after another.

I disagree about 4-5 years. If the Sabres make the playoffs and get bounced in the first round, that is an improvement over last season. And the season that just ended was an improvement over 21-22. Players and media are seeing the talent and depth of prospects the organization has. The “stench” you speak of is not nearly as bad as it was 2+ years ago. I know some want to deny that. 

[Kristian]

41 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

I disagree about 4-5 years. If the Sabres make the playoffs and get bounced in the first round, that is an improvement over last season. And the season that just ended was an improvement over 21-22. Players and media are seeing the talent and depth of prospects the organization has. The “stench” you speak of is not nearly as bad as it was 2+ years ago. I know some want to deny that. 

One or two good years are not going to make players want to come here, that’s the stench I speak of.

Media and the likes have all agreed for years that Buffalo had lots of talented players, yet we still found ways to finish dead last in the league.

Is there improvement? Certainly seems so, but even two good years followed by another sub-par performance will have everyone going “here we go again”, I guarantee you that much.

Look - We sucked! A lot! For an extremely long time. It’ll take more than 2 seasons to remedy that.

I’m not saying it’s as bad as two years ago, I’m saying that when you’re laughing stock of the league for 8+ years, becoming a reputable organisation again simply takes time.

An don’t say we weren’t the laughing stock of the league, cause we certainly were.

[K-9]

3 hours ago, JohnC said:

You know what my position is on the Eichel issue so I'm not going to belabor that point. Standing back and reviewing the trade it was a good deal for both sides. Vegas took a calculated risk on acquiring an injured player who needed surgery. The player got the surgery he wanted. It resulted in an outcome that restored his health and career. Now he is one of the prime players on a team competing for the Cup championship. Good for him. 

This trade worked out wonderfully for Buffalo. Tuch is turning out to be an elite player and a leader on the team. Krebs is emerging from being a raw prospect to being a good NHL player. And he will get better. In addition, we used a first-round pick from the trade to get a high end prospect. On top of that, Greenway was acquired from one of the draft picks that we got in return. 

In many ways it was that Jack deal that re-centered this faltering franchise and stabilized it. What is often forgotten is that with Jack's departure other players' roles were changed and elevated. Tage, Cozens and Mitts to a lesser extent were given elevated roles that they embraced and thrived on. Another benefit to the Jack trade is that his large cap cost was redistributed to lock up the emerging players already on the team. 

There are a number of reasons why the Sabres are now on an upper trajectory. But it can't be denied that the Jack trade was the jolt that changed the course of this flailing franchise. Player movements are part of the pro sports and maybe even more so in college sports landscape. It's obvious why the Jack saga gets so much attention. Of all the players who left in the reshuffle the one player I would have loved to have kept is Montour. 

Yep. It wasn’t just a good riddance, it was a great riddance. Perhaps the finest riddance of all time! 😂

[Marvin]

Any injury updates?

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, K-9 said:

Yep. It wasn’t just a good riddance, it was a great riddance. Perhaps the finest riddance of all time! 😂

The Jack trade gets a lot of attention. However, it won't be surprising if when all is said and done the trading of Reinhart that brought back Levi and a first round pick turn out to be the most consequential deal from the dealt players. Overall, the GM handled the trading of the old core in a very masterful manner. For me, getting a first round pick for Risto was the biggest surprise in those deals.  

[French Collection]

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

The Jack trade gets a lot of attention. However, it won't be surprising if when all is said and done the trading of Reinhart that brought back Levi and a first round pick turn out to be the most consequential deal from the dealt players. Overall, the GM handled the trading of the old core in a very masterful manner. For me, getting a first round pick for Risto was the biggest surprise in those deals.  

If Levi becomes 1A or even a 1B goalie for the Sabres plus Kulich becoming a solid top 9 contributor that is a good deal.

I know I have my rose coloured prospect glasses on but I think they win that trade. I like Sam and he still has many years ahead of him but our two prospects look good.

[Zamboni]

4 hours ago, Kristian said:

One or two good years are not going to make players want to come here, that’s the stench I speak of.

Media and the likes have all agreed for years that Buffalo had lots of talented players, yet we still found ways to finish dead last in the league.

Is there improvement? Certainly seems so, but even two good years followed by another sub-par performance will have everyone going “here we go again”, I guarantee you that much.

Look - We sucked! A lot! For an extremely long time. It’ll take more than 2 seasons to remedy that.

I’m not saying it’s as bad as two years ago, I’m saying that when you’re laughing stock of the league for 8+ years, becoming a reputable organisation again simply takes time.

An don’t say we weren’t the laughing stock of the league, cause we certainly were.

Ok …

agree to disagree about it taking 4-5 more years. 

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, French Collection said:

If Levi becomes 1A or even a 1B goalie for the Sabres plus Kulich becoming a solid top 9 contributor that is a good deal.

I know I have my rose coloured prospect glasses on but I think they win that trade. I like Sam and he still has many years ahead of him but our two prospects look good.

There is another way of looking at the trade from each side's perspective. The Sabres were clearly in a rebuild mode while the Panthers were in a win now mode. You can't say that Florida lost the deal when the player/s (including Montour) they got from us were instrumental in them winning a number of playoff rounds that got them into the Stanley Cup Finals. And it is obvious how the trade will help us in the near future. The issue comes down to not outsmarting the other party but finding an acceptable deal that addresses each's needs. In my opinion, it was a win-win case for all the parties involved in the Vegas and Florida trades.