Timo Meier rumour - Sabres contact Sharks

[NAF]

11 hours ago, Brawndo said:

Friedman and Marek reported that the asking price is similar to what DeBrincat received which was a 7OA, a second and a third and unlike DeBrincat, Meier is not under team control for two full seasons which should have an effect on his return. 

This seems absurdly low. If I'm KA I'd probably pull the trigger on our first this year (lotto protected), and two seconds. I get it. The contract will be rough. Conversely, players like this don't become available often. Meier is a fantastic young hockey player -- I'm drooling thinking about Meier with Cozens for the next six years.  

Edited January 31, 2023 by NAF

[thewookie1]

It's a rather tight squeeze but would theoretically work

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/3903178

 

Our lack of ELC Dmen makes it tougher

[Marvin]

16 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

It's a rather tight squeeze but would theoretically work

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/3903178

 

Our lack of ELC Dmen makes it tougher

Meier is low probably by $600k.  Dahlin is low by at least $500k.

I have not seen a plausible, let alone convincing, reason for Cozens, Dahlin, and Power to take the minimum of what they should get when Meier is getting near his maximum.

[Scottysabres]

The cap isn't a concern for me if we trade for Meiers. His qualifying offer is 10 mil for his last rfa year, if you can't sign him to a reasonable deal, I'm more than confident he'll be very tradable by next deadline. We'll have more than enough cap space for that QO. Dahlin isn't due up until the following season.

My concern would be the assets given. I'm hesitant on over paying.

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, Scottysabres said:

The cap isn't a concern for me if we trade for Meiers. His qualifying offer is 10 mil for his last rfa year, if you can't sign him to a reasonable deal, I'm more than confident he'll be very tradable by next deadline. We'll have more than enough cap space for that QO. Dahlin isn't due up until the following season.

My concern would be the assets given. I'm hesitant on over paying.

The goal for the Sabres going forward is to be a buyer at the deadline. KA won’t acquire him unless an extension is already agreed upon.

[JohnC]

4 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

The goal for the Sabres going forward is to be a buyer at the deadline. KA won’t acquire him unless an extension is already agreed upon.

It wouldn't be surprising if the Sabres make a deal or two at the deadline. However, I doubt that it will be for a top tier player who will command a high future salary. If there is going to be any acquisitions, it most likely will be for a Lyubushkin or Jost type player to fill out a lower line or pairing. If you listen to KA since he took over, he has made it clear that the primary avenue to roster building relates to players already in the system. I'm not suggesting that KA won't make a blockbuster type deal if the opportunity is available. I just don't see it happening this season. 

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, Marvin said:

Meier is low probably by $600k.  Dahlin is low by at least $500k.

I have not seen a plausible, let alone convincing, reason for Cozens, Dahlin, and Power to take the minimum of what they should get when Meier is getting near his maximum.

Really doubt Adams would give him the sort of contract he'd want as there are guys in house that have deserved the raise for what they've done here.

The other Q that we don't know is would Meier be all in for ending up in Buffalo.  The players that are here genuinely want to be here.  Giving Meier Skinner money could be an issue.

That said, am firmly in the camp that if Adams trades for him it'll be a good move.  If he doesn't get him, am OK with it because he either didn't want to be here or the price (either in assets or $'s) was deemed too high.

[Scottysabres]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

The goal for the Sabres going forward is to be a buyer at the deadline. KA won’t acquire him unless an extension is already agreed upon.

Could be. But Meiers would be a buy with an option to sell if the price to keep is not palatable. In other words, he'd be a pricey pick up asset wise but would most certainly net you assets if you had to move him next deadline.

I'd have to see which prospect the Sabres would give to get him. I'm not so concerned about the roster player, I think it'd be Mitts anyways, but, who knows.

[Crusader1969]

On 1/25/2023 at 11:43 PM, inkman said:

If I’m SJ, I’m asking for this years 1st, Jack Quinn and Juri Kulich 

They could ask but that’s not what they get.  

[Crusader1969]

Why not trade for Meier, qualify him for $10mill for 1 year and let him become a UFA after next season

you give Quinn and Peterka another year to develop 

if Meier is a great fit and he likes it in Buffalo, maybe  they work out a deal for long term later

they will have a better idea of what Cozens , Power and Dahlin will cost long term in another  year as well 

 

[thewookie1]

3 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Why not trade for Meier, qualify him for $10mill for 1 year and let him become a UFA after next season

you give Quinn and Peterka another year to develop 

if Meier is a great fit and he likes it in Buffalo, maybe  they work out a deal for long term later

they will have a better idea of what Cozens , Power and Dahlin will cost long term in another  year as well 

 

Far too expensive to trade for a nigh rental player

[Crusader1969]

4 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

Far too expensive to trade for a nigh rental player

You would have him all next season as well 

[thewookie1]

4 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

You would have him all next season as well 

You don't trade our 2023 1st, and "Östlund" + a lesser prospect in order to get a guy for  about 100 games

[Crusader1969]

7 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

You don't trade our 2023 1st, and "Östlund" + a lesser prospect in order to get a guy for  about 100 games

You are assuming that’s the price.  
would you change your mind if it was Rosen instead of Östlund ?  

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, Crusader1969 said:

You are assuming that’s the price.  
would you change your mind if it was Rosen instead of Östlund ?  

Rosen, this year's 1st, & another guy (Weisbach perhaps?) for roughly 110 games + however many playoff games this year & next of a guy that will simply walk after the '24 playoffs are done?

You seem to be channeling your inner Tim Murray w/ that one.  

IMHO the only way they bring him in is if they have at least a mid-term (4 years) deal ready to be signed.  The Snarks aren't going to just let him go cheaply & the Sabres aren't going to convert LT assets into a 1 year & change deal.

[Andrew Amerk]

21 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Rosen, this year's 1st, & another guy (Weisbach perhaps?) for roughly 110 games + however many playoff games this year & next of a guy that will simply walk after the '24 playoffs are done?

You seem to be channeling your inner Tim Murray w/ that one.  

IMHO the only way they bring him in is if they have at least a mid-term (4 years) deal ready to be signed.  The Snarks aren't going to just let him go cheaply & the Sabres aren't going to convert LT assets into a 1 year & change deal.

The bolded is likely correct. 

I also don’t understand the opinions adverse to the situation. You are getting a proven asset with room to grow for 3 unproven assets. It’s highly unlikely you are giving up 3 Timo Meiers for 1 Timo Meier. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

3 minutes ago, Andrew Amerk said:

The bolded is likely correct. 

I also don’t understand the opinions adverse to the situation. You are getting a proven asset with room to grow for 3 unproven assets. It’s highly unlikely you are giving up 3 Timo Meiers for 1 Timo Meier. 

Historically the team who trade acquires the best player usually “wins” the deal.  That also depends on when you view the deal.  Stl won a Cup by getting ROR, but TnT is now our franchise center.

I think the biggest issue with such a trade isn’t the 3 pieces to get Meier, but how his big contract could negatively affect our ability to re-sign guys like JJP and Quinn when their ELCs end.

[dudacek]

I’ve had 2 contradictory streams of thought about Meier.

The first was based on Tuch/Eichel comparisons:

If Tuch and Eichel are similarly useful players on the ice, who in their right minds would prefer Eichel at 4 years at $10 million to Tuch at 4 years at $4.75?

Similarly, Meier, 26, at $10 million for 1 year or Chychrun,24, for $4.6 million for 2 years?

What helps us more? Chychrun at 20 minutes a night upgrading Jokiharju and removing Bryson going into next year? Or Meier at 16 minutes a night upgrading Quinn and removing Okposo? Aren’t we far deeper up front?

Plus, trading for Meier now kinda forces you to negotiate an extension for him now, ahead of Cozens, Dahlin and Power.

Trading for Chychrun now, you can decide what/if you’re willing to pay him after you get those guys signed. More flexibility. More time for both sides to feel out the fit.

Edited February 1, 2023 by dudacek

[Andrew Amerk]

3 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I’ve had 2 very contradictory thoughts about Meier.

The first was based on Tuch/Eichel comparisons:

If Tuch and Eichel are similarly useful players on the ice, who in their right minds would prefer Eichel at 4 years at $10 million to Tuch at 4 years at $4.75?

Similarly, Meier, 26, at $10 million for 1 year or Chychrun,24, for $4.6 million for 2 years?

What helps us more? Chychrun at 20 minutes a night upgrading Jokiharju and removing Bryson going into next year? Or Meier at 16 minutes a night upgrading Quinn and removing Okposo? Aren’t we far deeper up front.

Plus, trading for Meier now kinda forces you to negotiate an extension for him now, ahead of Cozens, Dahlin and Power.

Trading for Chychrun now, you can decide what/if you’re willing to pay him after you get those guys signed. More flexibility. More time for both sides to feel out the fit.

What becomes available more often?

A defenseman worth 4mil, or a forward worth 10mil?

[dudacek]

My 2nd Meier thought is are we in a position manipulate the cap in a Meier trade?

Think about what the Canes did with the Kotkaniemi offer sheet, or the Sharks with Kevin Lebanc: essentially secretly agree to one multi-year deal, but officially break it into two contracts.

For example, we sign Meier to his $10 million qualifier, or hell, give him $14 for next year. We’ve got the room under the cap. Then, when the calendar rolls around, sign him to a 5-year, $40-million extension. Effectively, he gets his 6-year $9million deal, but we save a $1 million under the cap when we need it more

[Taro T]

11 minutes ago, Andrew Amerk said:

The bolded is likely correct. 

I also don’t understand the opinions adverse to the situation. You are getting a proven asset with room to grow for 3 unproven assets. It’s highly unlikely you are giving up 3 Timo Meiers for 1 Timo Meier. 

As have said before, if the Sabres land him will believe it was the right move.  But am mildly concerned that right at the point the team is becoming relevant mainly due to chemistry and EVERY player reaching the top 20% of their potential at this stage of their career that they might bring on a big name big $ guy right before they're going to start paying their own guys and that that might mess up that chemistry/ magic that they're currently riding.

It could be a great move and on paper it sure does look it (depending, obviously on what gets moved for him).  But Vegas thought they were making the team that went to the finals their 1st season better by bringing in big $ big names & it seems the more big names they bring the lesser the sum seems to be.  We've been in the woods 11 years.  We're seeing what seems to be the edge of the forest.  Just have concerns that BIG changes could muck it up & send us off on a separate direction.  Again, IMHO Adams has earned a degree of trust, and if he makes a move or 2 will trust that it/they is/are good.  But still would be surprised if he actually does make a big move now.  

[dudacek]

10 minutes ago, Andrew Amerk said:

What becomes available more often?

A defenseman worth 4mil, or a forward worth 10mil?

That’s not exactly what’s happening here. That’s what they’re being paid. What they are worth on the recent market is more like a $7 million defenceman and an $8 million winger.

[Taro T]

2 minutes ago, dudacek said:

My 2nd Meier thought is are we in a position manipulate the cap in a Meier trade?

Think about what the Canes did with the Kotkaniemi offer sheet, or the Sharks with Kevin Lebanc: essentially secretly agree to one multi-year deal, but officially break it into two contracts.

For example, we sign Meier to his $10 million qualifier, or hell, give him $14 for next year. We’ve got the room under the cap. Then, when the calendar rolls around, sign him to a 5-year, $40-million extension. Effectively, he gets his 6-year $9million deal, but we save a $1 million under the cap when we need it more

Very interesting idea.  The question is how do the other guys due deals now & next year view that deal?  Also, why do that for somebody else's player?  Why not give that style deal to Cozens as an example.

[dudacek]

1 minute ago, Taro T said:

Very interesting idea.  The question is how do the other guys due deals now & next year view that deal?  Also, why do that for somebody else's player?  Why not give that style deal to Cozens as an example.

Great point. Why not?

Sure would be a great way to weaponize cap space.

[dudacek]

Is there anything in the world stopping us from paying Dylan $20 million next year, then an 8-year, $48 million extension?

Somebody get Sam Ventura on the phone now!

Edited February 1, 2023 by dudacek