Sabres Trade Deadline 2023 Discussion

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 minute ago, ... said:

If we're using second-round picks to flesh out a deal then the cost in an actual player is too high or the return is too low to make the deal worthwhile IMHO. 

???
What trade our we “fleshing out” with a second.  I’m talking about using a 2nd to upgrade the defense with a Jensen or a Schenn.  Admittedly both are UFA after the season, but I can see KA re-signing one very easily.  Remember we have only 1 D close to NHL ready and he might now even sign with the Sabres.  If he doesn’t KA gets a 4th 2nd rd pick.  

For a guy like Greenway, he has two years left and KA might be able to get him for a 4th or just a medium prospect like Rousek.

We aren’t really talking about major changes, just subtle ones to fill out the roster properly.

[GASabresIUFAN]

6 minutes ago, Thorny said:

You don’t even know the hypothetical deals in question ... ? 

- - - 

a lot of what I’m hearing in this thread isn’t “anti-panic move” or “anti-win now move”, it’s just plain old anti-trade. 

Agreed.  This team has some real issues, and if we can utilize some assets like cap space and a few picks to fix them and help solidify a playoff spot, why shouldn’t KA make a deal or two?  

As I’ve said before, our first line is in their prime, the window is now open. 
 

KA - all we are saying is give playoffs a chance.

KA won’t make any major moves until the off-season.

Edited February 27, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[Thorner]

17 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Agreed.  This team has some real issues, and if we can utilize some assets like cap space and a few picks to fix them and help solidify a playoff spot, why shouldn’t KA make a deal or two?  

As I’ve said before, our first line is in their prime, the window is now open. 
 

KA - all we are saying is give playoffs a chance.

 

A first line all acquired, coincidentally, through trade.

I like that last line, someone should write a song about it. 

- - - 

I support your plight, as a fan, but personally as an analyst I don’t even need to see a move from KA: I just need to know he’s open to them. From all accounts he is, and it’s not insignificantly more than some even posting here.
 

I kinda trust his judgment now shrug emoji 

I feel like nino was a just missed it situation possibly, timing wise. 

Trades are a tool. If you trust your GM’s aptitude, relative to the rest of the GMs league wide, their direct competition, any tool that is able to exploit that advantage is one I would prefer to see wielded.

I’m firm on that position, truthfully. But listening closely and not pulling the trigger is still wielding. Again I’m just pretty adamant and pretty certain for Adams that he’s truly open to potential outside improvement

Edited February 27, 2023 by Thorny

[dudacek]

33 minutes ago, ... said:

I agree with your position on all of this but can't resist pointing out that there is no upgrade for any of the above worth the total cost of the transaction. None. Included in that total cost is the disruption to the room for the rest of the season and teh sacrifice of picks for this coming draft.

I agree it’s unlikely, which kinda where I started in this latest run of posts.

But Arizona says something around Olofsson for Crouse, for example, I think that very much meets the mandate of addressing a need through a position of strength while also meeting our desire for contract certainty and players who match our window,  If we need to throw in a pick or prospect to make something similar happen, why not? We’ve got more than we will be able to use.

But that’s really a secondary point. My primary issue with trading for a forward is our forwards are really good and deep and we’ve 3 or 4 more good ones coming.

We’ve got 5 everyday NHL defencemen with maybe one coming, and huge question marks in goal. If we’re spending, let’s spend on what we need most.

18 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Agreed.  This team has some real issues, and if we can utilize some assets like cap space and a few picks to fix them and help solidify a playoff spot, why shouldn’t KA make a deal or two?  

As I’ve said before, our first line is in their prime, the window is now open. 
 

KA - all we are saying is give playoffs a chance.

KA won’t make any major moves until the off-season.

Do you think can make the playoffs without making a trade, yes or no?

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

7 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I agree it’s unlikely, which kinda where I started in this latest run of posts.

But Arizona says something around Olofsson for Crouse, for example, I think that very much meets the mandate of addressing a need through a position of strength while also meeting our desire for contract certainty and players who match our window,  If we need to throw in a pick or prospect to make something similar happen, why not? We’ve got more than we will be able to use.

But that’s really a secondary point. My primary issue with trading for a forward is our forwards are really good and deep and we’ve 3 or 4 more good ones coming.

We’ve got 5 everyday NHL defencemen with maybe one coming, and huge question marks in goal. If we’re spending, let’s spend on what we need most.

Do you think can make the playoffs without making a trade, yes or no?

 

Sure it’s possible, but given how hard our schedule is for the next 15 games and how shaky our D and goaltending are, I’d say the odds would increase significantly with some D help.

[PerreaultForever]

5 hours ago, Taro T said:

It was on Mittelstadt.  The Caps penalty had already ended and he didn't want to just turn the puck over by dumping it in.  He saw Power out of the corner of his eye but didn't realize Power was about to go to the bench.  Considering Samuelsson was already coming off the bench, there wasn't really anything for Owen to do there.

Mitts needed to understand that giving the Caps the puck behind their own net was the correct play there.

It was definitely on Mitts, but I think it was more about him not realizing the guy had come out of the box than about Power going off. It was a sloppy too casual pass, and as I said elsewhere, those possession oriented drop passes need to go. Krebs made one earlier that almost cost us as well but since there was no goal nobody's talking about it. 

[steveoath]

3 hours ago, French Collection said:

I’m curious about Greenway from the Wild. He has scored a bit over the last few years. Huge winger(6’6” 230), I don’t know about his skating.

He could be a reclamation project for DG, coached him at USNDTP. Jost would know him.
 

His salary is a bit much for Minny with their coming crunch from Parise/Suter. $3M AAV for two more years.

If the ask is in the Jeannot neighborhood it is a big NO. A 2nd or 3rd, sure.

He is not putting up any points this year but has scored in last few.

27 pts in 62 games in 21/22

32 pts in 56 games in 20/21

 

I am all aboard the Greenway hype train. I think he could pair well with Cozens and Quinn. Or, if we are needing a hard line add tuch instead of quinn.

Edited February 27, 2023 by steveoath

[Night Train]

To each their own but if a trade is made, I personally hope it's for another Defenseman. That's where they are short. Not at Forward, even with Tuch out for a while. 

Goalie seems like a huge longshot. They'll live with the current situation until the off-season. 

Sabres are far ahead of where I thought they would be at this juncture. That doesn't mean I'm settling or content with just competing for a playoff spot. I wish to make it with the D improving. JMO. 

[WhenWillItEnd66]

Even though we are doing better then we thought we would be, still hoping for some help. Loved what i saw the last 3 games from the Sabres, but teams around us are looking to improve. We either stay the course, and ride what happens or KA needs to address our problems. Not really seeing a minder come our way, but some defense and some aggression would be nice.

[Contempt]

They score just fine. They need defense, goaltending, and some skilled jam for the playoffs. They also need to add those things without compromising the goal scoring.

[JohnC]

7 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Agreed.  This team has some real issues, and if we can utilize some assets like cap space and a few picks to fix them and help solidify a playoff spot, why shouldn’t KA make a deal or two?  

As I’ve said before, our first line is in their prime, the window is now open. 
 

KA - all we are saying is give playoffs a chance.

KA won’t make any major moves until the off-season.

The argument that KA would respond back to you with is that this team is in a playoff position as it is currently constituted. Why disrupt the chemistry and make changes to the cohesive room? The GM would also point out that despite your lamentations this team is currently on a good run where it is in the process of passing teams on the road to the playoffs. In the GM's mind the younger players are getting better and the team is steadily rising. Or another way of looking at the issue is that both our short and longer term goals are being met. He would continue to argue that when the "status quo" is working then keep it. 

[French Collection]

The desire to make a move increases as other teams make them. 

I keep reminding myself only one team wins the Cup while a dozen of them make moves and add that ‘missing’ piece. The deal that pops into my mind is Giroux last year. They added a veteran star to a Presidents Cup team and fizzled. There are many examples of these types of deals every year.

I trust KA with the approach he has taken so far. He has said it and he will not mortgage the future for a high priced rental.

I think goal is where the biggest need is but there is not much available and the cost is probably steep. I can’t see Nashville moving Saros. Demko could be a possibility.

Defense needs some veteran help and I prefer a guy like Jensen. He is a rental but won’t cost a lot.

The Sabres have plenty of forwards but I could see adding Greenway for depth and a component they don’t have.

I still want him to use that cap space and acquire assets that can be used to improve draft position, move to fill holes or even stock the cupboard with more prospects. He can help multiple teams get their magic beans and get something in every deal.

[GASabresIUFAN]

21 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Why disrupt the chemistry and make changes to the cohesive room?

I wrote up thread that this is exactly the excuse KA would say when he didn’t do anything.   

 Except the status quo isn’t working on 2/3 of the team.  When you allow 3.4 goals a game and haven’t improved year over year despite adding Power, a full season of Samuelsson, adding Lyubushkin , and adding Comrie something has to change.  

Despite KO’s comments to the contrary,the players understand when changes are made for injury or ineffective play and they welcome additions at the deadline to bolster their playoff chances.  Remember they play to win.  

KA will be selective in who he brings in.  A forward like Greenway who has played for Donnie in the USNTDP should work in the locker room just fine.  Adding solid Cup winning veteran D like Schenn or Jensen would command instant respect in the locker room.  Both moved would be welcome with open arms.

 

[dudacek]

51 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I wrote up thread that this is exactly the excuse KA would say when he didn’t do anything.   

 Except the status quo isn’t working on 2/3 of the team.  When you allow 3.4 goals a game and haven’t improved year over year despite adding Power, a full season of Samuelsson, adding Lyubushkin , and adding Comrie something has to change. 

One thing that doesn't get a ton of play around here is that the 3.4 GAA is as much by design as it is roster construction.

Don Granato's Sabres are built to win games 5-4, not 2-1.

I'm not absolving the team of its need to improve, just pointing out that any cracks on the blueline are magnified by mediocre goaltending, inexperience throughout the roster and a coaching staff that is always urging the players to attack.

One of the cures will hopefully be experience, but that will take time. I'm not sure if you can "fix" the goals against short-term without a corresponding drop in scoring, shy of making a significant upgrade in goal.

Edited February 27, 2023 by dudacek

[Scottysabres]

1 minute ago, dudacek said:

One thing that doesn't get a ton of play around here is that the 3.4 GAA is as much by design as it is roster construction.

Don Granato's Sabres are built to win games 5-4, not 2-1.

I'm not absolving the team of its need to improve, just pointing out that the cracks on the blueline are magnified by mediocre goaltending, inexperience throughout the roster and a coaching staff that is always urging the players to attack.

One of the cures will hopefully be experience, but that will take time. I'm not sure if you can "fix" the goals against short-term without a corresponding drop in scoring, shy of making a significant upgrade in goal.

Fixing it? I agree. It will take time over all. But mitigating it to some extent, even the slightest, at a reasonable cost isn't outside the realm of reason I'd suspect.

I'll support Adam's regardless, there is enough data now to support the obvious, which is the team is definitely heading in the right direction.

[Taro T]

10 minutes ago, dudacek said:

One thing that doesn't get a ton of play around here is that the 3.4 GAA is as much by design as it is roster construction.

Don Granato's Sabres are built to win games 5-4, not 2-1.

I'm not absolving the team of its need to improve, just pointing out that any cracks on the blueline are magnified by mediocre goaltending, inexperience throughout the roster and a coaching staff that is always urging the players to attack.

One of the cures will hopefully be experience, but that will take time. I'm not sure if you can "fix" the goals against short-term without a corresponding drop in scoring, shy of making a significant upgrade in goal.

One other item not mentioned is that the team's lack of defense includes more than a bit of a lack of shot blocking.  With as little as they do, and with as few injuries as they have, two of their most significant injuries were due to blocking shots.  And IIRC, Samuelsson also was affected by a shot block too.  The defensive style this team plays is as you say in large part by design.

[GASabresIUFAN]

23 minutes ago, dudacek said:

One thing that doesn't get a ton of play around here is that the 3.4 GAA is as much by design as it is roster construction.

Don Granato's Sabres are built to win games 5-4, not 2-1.

I'm not absolving the team of its need to improve, just pointing out that any cracks on the blueline are magnified by mediocre goaltending, inexperience throughout the roster and a coaching staff that is always urging the players to attack.

One of the cures will hopefully be experience, but that will take time. I'm not sure if you can "fix" the goals against short-term without a corresponding drop in scoring, shy of making a significant upgrade in goal.

While there maybe some truth to your assertions, on closer inspection they are just excuses.  We have the same coaches as last year, ran the same system, but defense and goaltending were the two areas KA wanted to improve immediately by bringing in outside help.
 

 However we have seen no improvement and the PK is actually worse.  This is either a personnel issue or a coaching issue or both.  Considering KA’s commitment to DG, the first changes need to be in personnel and the sooner the better.

Edited February 27, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[LGR4GM]

 

[Scottysabres]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

 

So, what's floating around the Dollar General player shelves?

[bunomatic]

I sometimes pass the bargain bin in Walmart and man are there deals to be had there.

[Taro T]

11 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

 

So, is this board his source?

Pretty sure we've been saying that since the summer.  ;)

[Contempt]

11 minutes ago, Scottysabres said:

So, what's floating around the Dollar General player shelves?

Two things. Nothing and garbage.

[LGR4GM]

 

Short version is Adams will make a trade if the price doesn't hurt them in the future. Sabres are willing to be a 3rd party broker but not if it helps a team they might see in the playoffs or is chasing them in the playoff race. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

11 minutes ago, Scottysabres said:

So, what's floating around the Dollar General player shelves?

Is this a surprise? Over last two years look who he has brought in; Anderson, Subban, Dell, Comrie, Lyubushkin, Sheahan, Hayden, Pilut, Clague, Vinnie, Pysyk, Jankowski, Wolanin, Caggiula, Jost and Butcher.  Not exactly a list of all-stars.  Most were vet minimum signings (or nearly so) waiver claims or a vet someone paid us to take (Butcher).  

If he makes a trade for guys like Jensen or Greenway, it will be his biggest moves since he cleared the old core out.

It would also be a signal to the fans, coaches and players that the organization back to competing for championships even if more development is needed.

[Scottysabres]

1 minute ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Is this a surprise? Over last two years look who he has brought in; Anderson, Subban, Dell, Comrie, Lyubushkin, Sheahan, Hayden, Pilut, Clague, Vinnie, Pysyk, Jankowski, Wolanin, Caggiula, Jost and Butcher.  Not exactly a list of all-stars.  Most were vet minimum signings (or nearly so) waiver claims or a vet someone paid us to take (Butcher).  

If he makes a trade for guys like Jensen or Greenway, it will be his biggest moves since he cleared the old core out.

It would also be a signal to the fans, coaches and players that the organization back to competing for championships even if more development is needed.

Ya, what's Pysyk doing these days? Maybe they can swing him in for a 5/6 spot on D, and bring in John Scott for player interview photo-bombs to up the entertainment venue. By Georgia, I think your on to something here GA.