GDT: Sabres @ Predators, 1/14/23, 8:00 pm, ESPN+ and MSG

[matter2003]

8 hours ago, CTJoe said:

He was average first 2 periods, elite in the 3rd.  Clearly outplayed Nashville's all star goalie in the 3rd period and allowed 2 fewer goals while facing 5 more shots for the game

Nashville was getting quantity over quality tho. Not many were great scoring chances.

The Sabres on the other hand seemingly had an endless array of odd man rushes including two on ones, breakaways and even a two on zero rush at one point.

[SwampD]

1 hour ago, LTS said:

It's accurate. The Sabres still need to control the front of their net. The disallowed goal was too close to being a goal and once again because the Sabres allow teams to play between the D and the goalie and cannot clear a crease. I don't think it's a strength thing, it's a coached thing. Frankly I think it's a byproduct of the USA Hockey development program. If you watched USA in the WJC there were a lot of similarities.

The Sabres also don't spend a lot of time in front of the opponent net either. They also don't hit in many situations they could. I don't mean bone jarring hits but hits that are designed to slow the other team down. They want to play a pure speed game.

Not well for Nashville, in this game. But the Flyers, Kraken, and Jets all just did this to Buffalo and it did work.

Overall a win is a win. I'd still like to see a bit more of a "We're not gonna take it." attitude from this team. No, I don't mean fights and hard hits.. but I do mean stopping the drive-bys, clearing the crease, and crashing the net.

Excellent post. You explained perfectly the kind of physical game we’ve been complaining about not seeing. I’m going to save it for later reference.

It’s interesting, too, because if you look at even just the last two games, some of the most exciting plays have were a direct result of a big hit by a Sabre, and they ended up either in a scoring chance or goal.

[JohnC]

9 hours ago, Norcal said:

Did anyone else think Upie reached out into Smith there?

Resulting powerplay ended in nothingness but I thought he drew that penalty tbh.

Yes. I thought that the penalty should not have been called on the Predator. It was UPL who got in the way of the player. The goalie sold it and the referee bought it. 

[Pimlach]

54 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Yes. I thought that the penalty should not have been called on the Predator. It was UPL who got in the way of the player. The goalie sold it and the referee bought it. 

I am sensitive to anyone hitting our goalie, after the Miller-Lucic situation, I always want a response.  This was of course nothing like the Lucic hit, but I was triggered by that hit last night for sure.   It is a part of my old school hockey up bringing that can't be suppressed. 

We didn't score on the PP, that would have been enough. 

We don't have the players to answer their 4th line, which is stocked with slow hulking bodies.  I can see the Sabres eventually running 4 lines that can skate the pants off of other teams.   There only a few bigger forward prospects in the system.  

I want to see us get bigger in defense.  I want to add a big, strong, mobile, and smart veteran on the 2nd pair with Power.  I say smart because I don't want a Risto, who has all the other attributes.   Get this guy and let Power create and not have to cover for anyone.  Move Joker to the 3rd pair with Lobby.  Joker is another interesting guy.  At 23 now, he already has 230 NHL games.  He is listed at 6' and 200 lbs.  Most of his strength is lower body, which is great for his skating and stamina.  I think off-season emphasis on upper body strength training would help him a lot.  He could play at 205, no problem.  

[Pimlach]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

The physical maturity will come as it did with Dahlin and Tage. Although with Tage because of his lanky build it took some time.  Peterka already has a fuller build but in time he also will become more maturely strong. It's exciting to consider the upside for Quinn and JJ playing between the emerging Cozens.  

 

Peterka is listed at 6' and 189 lbs but I agree that he sure looks a little bigger (stouter) than Quinn to me.  I can see him being a hard guy to play against if he chooses to be.  

The speed and skill of these three is exciting, even though they can get pushed around and bottled up at times.  Put 24 year old bodies and experience on them and look out.  

[Doohicksie]

30 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Get this guy and let Power create and not have to cover for anyone.

This is ridiculous.  Power is at least as much about defense as he is about scoring.

[Pimlach]

2 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

This is ridiculous.  Power is at least as much about defense as he is about scoring.

Sure he has a great two way game.  But it’s not ridiculous to play him with someone that can steady things down and not need help.  It helps with Joker back, as opposed to pairing him with the bottom 5,6,7.  
 

He is the 20 year old rookie, right?  

[dudacek]

14 hours ago, triumph_communes said:

Was gonna say how on earth did we blow a 2 goal lead again. But this time was mostly a UPL what were you doing 

The 3rd was a tough deflection, but the 2nd goal was iffy and the first was a stinker.

But he sure came to play at crunch time in the 3rd. He’s a big body and did a great job and closing off the bottom of the net in all that fury down low.

We’re starting to see that this will be a team that will consistently outscore their problems so getting the timely big save might be the right fit.

Kid is on a 7-1 run with a .916 save percentage.

Edited January 16, 2023 by dudacek

[triumph_communes]

45 minutes ago, dudacek said:

The 3rd was a tough deflection, but the 2nd goal was iffy and the first was a stinker.

But he sure came to play at crunch time in the 3rd. He’s a big body and did a great job and closing off the bottom of the net in all that fury down low.

We’re starting to see that this will be a team that will consistent outscore their problems so getting the timely big save might be the right fit.

Kid is on a 7-1 run with a .916 save percentage.

I’ll agree that as long as the team has confidence in front of him the stinkers don’t matter. People underestimate how teams mentally will play different depending on their confidence in their goalie. 

[DarthEbriate]

26 minutes ago, triumph_communes said:

I’ll agree that as long as the team has confidence in front of him the stinkers don’t matter. People underestimate how teams mentally will play different depending on their confidence in their goalie. 

This team has had reason to believe when they've had a goalie worthy of it. Completely different play when they had Ullmark vs. Hutton. Last season, Anderson calmed them all down and they rallied around Houser, but Toker, UPL, Dell last season all resulted in lesser team play. This season, UPL has gotten the team's rallies and confidence (and Anderson to an extent, too). Unfortunately, Comrie hasn't yet earned their trust and it shows (and the D-corps injuries hurt for few starts there before he was injured). The best thing that can happen to the Sabres is Comrie getting back to game speed and getting hot. It would chase UPL back to the AHL where he can get reps and continue to work on rebound control and quicker setting on long-range shots, remove the logjam of healthy forwards, and hopefully lead to lots of wins.

[dudacek]

11 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

This team has had reason to believe when they've had a goalie worthy of it. Completely different play when they had Ullmark vs. Hutton. Last season, Anderson calmed them all down and they rallied around Houser, but Toker, UPL, Dell last season all resulted in lesser team play. This season, UPL has gotten the team's rallies and confidence (and Anderson to an extent, too). Unfortunately, Comrie hasn't yet earned their trust and it shows (and the D-corps injuries hurt for few starts there before he was injured). The best thing that can happen to the Sabres is Comrie getting back to game speed and getting hot. It would chase UPL back to the AHL where he can get reps and continue to work on rebound control and quicker setting on long-range shots, remove the logjam of healthy forwards, and hopefully lead to lots of wins.

I think the best thing that can happen is UPL continues winning games and cements himself as a legit #1.

[JohnC]

7 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I am sensitive to anyone hitting our goalie, after the Miller-Lucic situation, I always want a response.  This was of course nothing like the Lucic hit, but I was triggered by that hit last night for sure.   It is a part of my old school hockey up bringing that can't be suppressed. 

We didn't score on the PP, that would have been enough. 

We don't have the players to answer their 4th line, which is stocked with slow hulking bodies.  I can see the Sabres eventually running 4 lines that can skate the pants off of other teams.   There only a few bigger forward prospects in the system.  

I want to see us get bigger in defense.  I want to add a big, strong, mobile, and smart veteran on the 2nd pair with Power.  I say smart because I don't want a Risto, who has all the other attributes.   Get this guy and let Power create and not have to cover for anyone.  Move Joker to the 3rd pair with Lobby.  Joker is another interesting guy.  At 23 now, he already has 230 NHL games.  He is listed at 6' and 200 lbs.  Most of his strength is lower body, which is great for his skating and stamina.  I think off-season emphasis on upper body strength would help him a lot.  He could play at 205, no problem.  

I have a little different view on Power. There is no question that he has added potential in the offensive side of his game. But his biggest asset, now and in the future, is as a defender. He has great instincts in his own end and is able to efficiently move the puck out of his own zone. Power has some similar traits to Samuelsson in that his positioning and instincts are superlative. Of course there is more upside to Power than Samuelsson because he has more potential as an offensive player. I thought that Power's game against Nashville was one of his best games. 

As it currently stands I have no problem with Joki being paired with Power. (This is a minority opinion.) Joki is willing to accept his role in supporting his defensive partner by backing him up so that Power can at times carry the puck and go deep in the offensive zone. 

I agree with you that the Sabres can add another big defender whose forte is as a defender to the unit. 

[dudacek]

To me, the difference between Jokiharju and the next guy on the depth chart is huge.

He can play in all situations, with any teammate and against any competition. 

No, he won’t shine, but he will usually hold his own and he won’t be overmatched in the way we’ve seen Bryson and Clague and Lyubushkin at times.

He’s the definition of a competent #4 and continues to be unappreciated.

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, dudacek said:

To me, the difference between Jokiharju and the next guy on the depth chart is huge.

He can play in all situations, with any teammate and against any competition. 

No, he won’t shine, but he will usually hold his own and he won’t be overmatched in the way we’ve seen Bryson and Clague and Lyubushkin at times.

He’s the definition of a competent #4 and continues to be unappreciated.

Still believe at present he's a 5, not a 4.

But, he's young & could very well mature into a 4.

And still want him to have his own Samuelsson.  Would completely solidify the top 4 & Joker/Lyubushkin could be an elite 3rd pairing with either having the ability to fill in on the top 4 to cover for an injury.

[dudacek]

3 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Still believe at present he's a 5, not a 4.

But, he's young & could very well mature into a 4.

And still want him to have his own Samuelsson.  Would completely solidify the top 4 & Joker/Lyubushkin could be an elite 3rd pairing with either having the ability to fill in on the top 4 to cover for an injury.

To me, a 5 is a 1-way guy you can’t play in certain situations - has good qualities, but also situations where he’s overmatched: Jason Woolley, springs to mind.

I think Joki is more well-rounded than that.

[Taro T]

11 hours ago, LTS said:

It's accurate. The Sabres still need to control the front of their net. The disallowed goal was too close to being a goal and once again because the Sabres allow teams to play between the D and the goalie and cannot clear a crease. I don't think it's a strength thing, it's a coached thing. Frankly I think it's a byproduct of the USA Hockey development program. If you watched USA in the WJC there were a lot of similarities.

The Sabres also don't spend a lot of time in front of the opponent net either. They also don't hit in many situations they could. I don't mean bone jarring hits but hits that are designed to slow the other team down. They want to play a pure speed game.

Not well for Nashville, in this game. But the Flyers, Kraken, and Jets all just did this to Buffalo and it did work.

Overall a win is a win. I'd still like to see a bit more of a "We're not gonna take it." attitude from this team. No, I don't mean fights and hard hits.. but I do mean stopping the drive-bys, clearing the crease, and crashing the net.

If the Sabres have Granato at one of the B&G insights will try to ask him about the philosophy of not trying to box out F's in front of the Sabres net.  Believe you are correct that it is in fact a coaching decision to play that way.  Lyubushkin is the only one that seems to do it & expect that's more of him falling back into a habit as he doesn't seem to do it all that often.

[Taro T]

2 minutes ago, dudacek said:

To me, a 5 is a 1-way guy you can’t play in certain situations - has good qualities, but also situations where he’s overmatched: Jason Woolley, springs to mind.

I think Joki is more well-rounded than that.

Don't believe a 5 is necessarily a 1 way D-man, though he usually is.  Believe he can also be a 2-way guy that gets overmatched when the other team's top line is out or when a cycle gets going & he takes himself out of the play.

Again, believe he's a GOOD 5, & believe he's improved a lot over the past 2 years & very well could become a 4.  (Don't ever see him becoming a 3 though.)

And, he's gotten better about not pinching at bad moments, but still get nervous watching him pinch.

And his play on the PK when he's forced into a structure is a big part of why he likely can grow into a 4.  He's good on the PK; he doesn't run around.  So he SHOULD be able to grow out of that 5v5.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

To me, the difference between Jokiharju and the next guy on the depth chart is huge.

He can play in all situations, with any teammate and against any competition. 

No, he won’t shine, but he will usually hold his own and he won’t be overmatched in the way we’ve seen Bryson and Clague and Lyubushkin at times.

He’s the definition of a competent #4 and continues to be unappreciated.

I appreciate him. But if we upgraded him at 4, he would be a great guy for the third pairing.  With the style we play we need great defensemen. 

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

To me, the difference between Jokiharju and the next guy on the depth chart is huge.

He can play in all situations, with any teammate and against any competition. 

No, he won’t shine, but he will usually hold his own and he won’t be overmatched in the way we’ve seen Bryson and Clague and Lyubushkin at times.

He’s the definition of a competent #4 and continues to be unappreciated.

You highlight the aspect of his game that gives him great value i.e. he can be paired with anyone and enhance the player he is playing with. What I noticed about his game this year is that he is more willing to shoot the puck and be part of the offense. As you noted, he is more of a subordinate player with the player he is playing with, but that is the role that he plays very well. In addition, he is still very young and has more potential upside to his game. 

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, Taro T said:

Don't believe a 5 is necessarily a 1 way D-man, though he usually is.  Believe he can also be a 2-way guy that gets overmatched when the other team's top line is out or when a cycle gets going & he takes himself out of the play.

Again, believe he's a GOOD 5, & believe he's improved a lot over the past 2 years & very well could become a 4.  (Don't ever see him becoming a 3 though.)

And, he's gotten better about not pinching at bad moments, but still get nervous watching him pinch.

And his play on the PK when he's forced into a structure is a big part of why he likely can grow into a 4.  He's good on the PK; he doesn't run around.  So he SHOULD be able to grow out of that 5v5.

I agree with you that he is more of a 4 than a 3 defenseman. On a team that accentuates speed over brawn he fits in well on how this roster is constructed. I would also like to see another Lyubushkin rugged type added to the lower pairings to balance out the unit. 

[grinreaper]

21 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I agree with you that he is more of a 4 than a 3 defenseman. On a team that accentuates speed over brawn he fits in well on how this roster is constructed. I would also like to see another Lyubushkin rugged type added to the lower pairings to balance out the unit. 

The Sabres, what with their salary cap room and ability to lock up younger forwards on controlled contracts, have a window that should allow them to beef up their defense. They have the harder to find puck moving defensemen that can captain the PP. A couple nasty guys to fill out the defense would make their high flying offense look even better.

[Taro T]

53 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You highlight the aspect of his game that gives him great value i.e. he can be paired with anyone and enhance the player he is playing with. What I noticed about his game this year is that he is more willing to shoot the puck and be part of the offense. As you noted, he is more of a subordinate player with the player he is playing with, but that is the role that he plays very well. In addition, he is still very young and has more potential upside to his game. 

Except, he doesn't enhance the guy he's playing with when it isn't a 3rd pairing guy.

Dahlin is worse w/ him than w/ Samuelsson.

Power shouldn't have to cover for his mistakes, Jokiharju's the vet on that pairing.  It SHOULD be the other way around but it's not.  And, yes, he's a better partner for Power than Bryson.  He's a better player than Bryson.

[PerreaultForever]

22 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

Sometimes you just take the powerplay if it wasn’t clearly malicious. UPL played it up a bit and was outside the crease. This wasn’t Smith going well into the crease and plastering UPL into the net. One must know when to fight your battles and that wasn’t one of them.

More blatant attacks on the goalie have been reacted to pretty well this year 

Ya, but no. I don't think we will agree on this, so maybe no point in going on at length, but this team hasn't been respected for quite a while, and that won't get us respected. Some things are more important than any individual game or PP. 

[JohnC]

9 hours ago, Taro T said:

Except, he doesn't enhance the guy he's playing with when it isn't a 3rd pairing guy.

Dahlin is worse w/ him than w/ Samuelsson.

Power shouldn't have to cover for his mistakes, Jokiharju's the vet on that pairing.  It SHOULD be the other way around but it's not.  And, yes, he's a better partner for Power than Bryson.  He's a better player than Bryson.

There is no question that Samuelsson is better than Joki as a #2 pairing partner with the first or second pairing. He's simply a better player. No one would argue otherwise. That's not the issue here. In my view Joki is a good/solid second pairing partner for Power. And that is evident by the emerging play of Power. If the organization brings in a player comparable to Samuelsson, then Joki would be bumped down. I would celebrate and not lament that kind of upgrade to the unit.

[JohnC]

10 hours ago, grinreaper said:

The Sabres, what with their salary cap room and ability to lock up younger forwards on controlled contracts, have a window that should allow them to beef up their defense. They have the harder to find puck moving defensemen that can captain the PP. A couple nasty guys to fill out the defense would make their high flying offense look even better.

I have been saying all along that what this unit needs is another Lyubushkin type player added to the defensive mix. Some posters advocate for the pursuit of Chychrun. I'm not one of them because of the cost. The additions to this unit are more likely come are in the offseason.