Is Kevyn Adams doing anything?

[French Collection]

47 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

I’m sure this has been mentioned but he also tried to trade for Matt Murray as well.  Who seems to be doing his best Jack Campbell impression for the leafs.  Hopefully, he falls apart in the 2nd half just as Campbell did last year 

Health has been Murray’s biggest issue the last 3 years.

Don’t burst their bubble, the parade plans are well underway.

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Personally, I’m not certain I’ve seen enough to judge the real Comrie, especially considering he’s only played 3 games with an NHL defence.

I agree with this statement. Comrie has not been good but it is very early in his evaluation.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, Brawndo said:

Lance Lysowski discussed this on the latest episode of the Maintenance Day Podcast released 

 

“Linus kind of hosed the Sabres with the way those negotiations played out, from what I heard. Linus kind of lead them to believe they were in the drivers seat and were comfortable and then the big offer came in from the Bruins. With that injury history and everything else with the Sabres Plans they were like ewwww, don’t know if we go there with all Ullmark’s Injuries and where they were with development. It’s a tough pill to swallow to watch that guy play in Boston the way He is, but the way Boston Defends, that’s a juggernaut right there.” 

Disclaimer these are Lance Lysowski’s Words not mine.
 

“

So, another guy who really didn't want to be here.  (See ROR, Reinhart, Eichel, )

[grinreaper]

4 hours ago, Marvin said:

As always, I will believe these additions when I see them.  This smacks of "too good to be true."

You're a good poster along with a ton of people here. I'm just a hockey fan that has the time and enjoys practicing parody with a dose of sarcasm in my own amateurish way. Whenever it "fits" my post I preface my comments with BREAKING NEWS: which is an indication and warning that what is about to come is my feeble attempt at comedy. Elsewhere where I post people are generally aware that although I often post in a serious manner that they should look out for a good dose of my use of hyperbole. I've been around this place since before the Danny Briere days and posted a lot more back then but lost a bunch of my posts. Anyway, I'm posting more this year because I'm really feeling good about the Sabre's future along with having some extra time. 

[dudacek]

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

Edited December 13, 2022 by dudacek

[grinreaper]

39 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

Good post. It seems like it was just yesterday when I was seeing posts here criticizing Adams for not getting a  deal for Eichel done along with assumptions that with his inexperience he was going to end up with a crappy deal. Once the deal was finalized and announced the tone certainly changed. 

[SwampD]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

Great read. You are pretty spot on with everything.

Am I out of line for thinking that it’s gotta happen next year, though? I mean, I don’t expect a SCF appearance, but they have to be a lock for the playoffs next year, right? Maybe with even a shot at a second round series? I don’t think that’s unreasonable.

[LTS]

14 hours ago, sabresouth said:

As stated by other posters, this past off-season was relatively baren of good goalies.  And you will have to forgive me as for my memory of the previous two off-seasons. I don't know what was available or not then. I think KA made the mistake of not picking up one earlier when available and now he can't find one. You just can't give KA a free pass on this . He has had three years and this is the best that could possibly be done? I don't think so.

I give Adams a pass because it was not the plan. I think at that time they might have hoped for more out of UPL but clearly Adams does not believe in him. I have no doubt Adams wishes he had a better goalie situation, but sometimes the now has to suck for tomorrow to be better. It takes a lot of discipline to not go chasing the pretty shiny things.  I don't characterize it as a mistake, instead I look at it as the discipline to stay the course and see it through.  Something that has not been done with the Sabres in the past decade.

9 hours ago, SwampD said:

Great read. You are pretty spot on with everything.

Am I out of line for thinking that it’s gotta happen next year, though? I mean, I don’t expect a SCF appearance, but they have to be a lock for the playoffs next year, right? Maybe with even a shot at a second round series? I don’t think that’s unreasonable.

I think the evolution of Cozens, Peterka, Quinn is the signal to Adams that now is the time to press forward. I think roster players will be moved and some prospects as well to shore up the goaltending and the defense going into next season.  A lock for the playoffs in this division and conference?  I'm not so sure about that.

 

[Pimlach]

11 hours ago, dudacek said:

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

Great post on what Adams inherited and what he has done in a short time.  You didn't even mention working within the financial constraints of COVID, Ralph Kruger as coach, and the strained relationship between the team and the fanbase.   That had to be tough, and KA should be commended for having a plan, stating the plan, and so far sticking to it.  

The hole at goaltending remains, although he added the top prospect in Levi.  

9 hours ago, SwampD said:

Great read. You are pretty spot on with everything.

Am I out of line for thinking that it’s gotta happen next year, though? I mean, I don’t expect a SCF appearance, but they have to be a lock for the playoffs next year, right? Maybe with even a shot at a second round series? I don’t think that’s unreasonable.

The bold is the million-dollar question. When?   People around the league are asking the same question. We heard Tochett, Carter and Hank all talking about it on TNT after we played an impressive game against an injury weakened Columbus team.   We look like a team that is getting better.  

We can score goals, but we don't play team defense and we have below average goaltending.  We have some fine young talent, and we get the youthful mistakes that often go with that.  Playoffs are unlikely this year, maybe we get on a run and can move up in the standings and build something positive for this year?  

Three division teams have past us right now - we see NJ among the top teams in the conference, Detroit challenging for the playoffs, and even Montreal ahead of us in the standings.  I think we have better core talent than all of them.  Yet, as I type this, we are tied with Ottawa for last place in the division, and we are tied for 13th of 16 teams in the conference. 

While most of us agree the roster is getting better, and more players are emerging, and we are scoring more, the team performance at this point actually has slipped within our very competitive division/conference. 

Adams says he is always looking to improve the team, but it takes two to trade.  The next batch of moves is probably the trade deadline.  The next offseason will be the most important one he has faced to date.  Something has to happen to propel this team into the top 8 of the conference.  

[SwampD]

3 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

The bold is the million-dollar question. When?   People around the league are asking the same question. We heard Tochett, Carter and Hank all talking about it on TNT after we played an impressive game against an injury weakened Columbus team.   We look like a team that is getting better.  

We can score goals, but we don't play team defense and we have below average goaltending.  We have some fine young talent, and we get the youthful mistakes that often go with that.  Playoffs are unlikely this year, maybe we get on a run and can move up in the standings and build something positive for this year?  

Three division teams have past us right now - we see NJ among the top teams in the conference, Detroit challenging for the playoffs, and even Montreal ahead of us in the standings.  I think we have better core talent than all of them.  Yet, as I type this, we are tied with Ottawa for last place in the division, and we are tied for 13th of 16 teams in the conference. 

While most of us agree the roster is getting better, and more players are emerging, and we are scoring more, the team performance at this point actually has slipped within our very competitive division/conference. 

Adams says he is always looking to improve the team, but it takes two to trade.  The next batch of moves is probably the trade deadline.  The next offseason will be the most important one he has faced to date.  Something has to happen to propel this team into the top 8 of the conference.  

16 minutes ago, LTS said:

I give Adams a pass because it was not the plan. I think at that time they might have hoped for more out of UPL but clearly Adams does not believe in him. I have no doubt Adams wishes he had a better goalie situation, but sometimes the now has to suck for tomorrow to be better. It takes a lot of discipline to not go chasing the pretty shiny things.  I don't characterize it as a mistake, instead I look at it as the discipline to stay the course and see it through.  Something that has not been done with the Sabres in the past decade.

I think the evolution of Cozens, Peterka, Quinn is the signal to Adams that now is the time to press forward. I think roster players will be moved and some prospects as well to shore up the goaltending and the defense going into next season.  A lock for the playoffs in this division and conference?  I'm not so sure about that.

 

We are doing all these great (better) things on offense not even spending to to cap floor. If KA can’t use that to make the team better enough to make the playoffs, then WTF is he good for?

The playoffs have to to be at least the expectation next year. I mean, they have to be! I don’t want to hear development year ever ***** again. And I even agree with it for this year. Next year. No way. They are going to have to start demanding that they win. They need to use that cap space to get good players that will help them win. Period.

And I don’t give a flyin ***** if they “want to be here.” Heck, I don’t want to be at my job, but I’m good at it and they pay me to do it, so I do my very best at it.

[Stoner]

Player development without team development is a huge risk.

[French Collection]

1 minute ago, SwampD said:

And I don’t give a flyin ***** if they “want to be here.” Heck, I don’t want to be at my job, but I’m good at it and they pay me to do it, so I do my very best at it.

I get this.
I retired 4 years early because I hated my job, management work did not suit me but it helped my pension. I am back working part time at the entry level position and loving it.

Anyway, winning will make them want to be here, so just start winning.

[nfreeman]

15 hours ago, dudacek said:

I think it’s strange that our goaltending struggles are being pinned on Adams as sins of omission, when quite clearly they are sins of commission.

It’s not that Adams chose not to address the crease; he quite clearly targeted Eric Comrie as his best available option, then went out and signed him with the idea that he could progress into a viable starter with Anderson as his support and safety net. Meanwhile UPL would get the reps needed to grow into his own in the AHL until his play allowed him to take over from Andy and challenge Eric for the starter’s role.

That looks to me a lot less like an unwillingness to “get a real starter” and more like a misreading of what Comrie and Luukkonen are actually capable of.

This comes on the heels of underestimating Linus Ullmark’s ability and/or market value (a failure he apparently shares with a lot of Sabrespacers)

Personally, I’m not certain I’ve seen enough to judge the real Comrie, especially considering he’s only played 3 games with an NHL defence.

But at this point I’m far more skeptical of Adams’ ability to judge goaltenders than I am of his willingness to go get them.

I think the bolded is true regarding this season, but for his 1st 2 seasons, the sins were of omission IMHO.  In 2020-21, he didn't upgrade in net and went into the season with Ullmark and Hutton -- even though Hutton was clearly not an NHL goalie at that point and Ullmark was very much unproven. 

It was even worse in 2021-22 -- despite finishing 2nd-last in goals against the previous year, and losing Ullmark, all KA did was add the elderly Craig Anderson and a bunch of Tokarski-type AHL journeymen.

I could be wrong, but I don't remember the Sabres being in on any Matt Murray-type deals in those 2 offseasons where KA was clearly trying to bring in legit goaltending but the deals were vetoed by a goalie with a NTC.

 

12 hours ago, dudacek said:

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

 

Great post, as always, and I largely agree, but with one quibble:  KA has been the GM for 166 games now -- 56 in 2020-21, 82 last year and 28 this year.  So 3 offseasons and 2+ regular seasons worth of games.

 

 

12 minutes ago, SwampD said:

We are doing all these great (better) things on offense not even spending to to cap floor. If KA can’t use that to make the team better enough to make the playoffs, then WTF is he good for?

The playoffs have to to be at least the expectation next year. I mean, they have to be! I don’t want to hear development year ever ***** again. And I even agree with it for this year. Next year. No way. They are going to have to start demanding that they win. They need to use that cap space to get good players that will help them win. Period.

And I don’t give a flyin ***** if they “want to be here.” Heck, I don’t want to be at my job, but I’m good at it and they pay me to do it, so I do my very best at it.

 

I guess I just think at this point, there are very few guys on D or in net that would represent a difference-making upgrade and are available, and, of those, most or all wouldn't be interested in coming here.  That may change by the deadline or next offseason, but in the meantime, I'm not interested in committing term to a guy who isn't a real difference-maker.

[inkman]

12 hours ago, dudacek said:

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, SwampD said:

We are doing all these great (better) things on offense not even spending to to cap floor. If KA can’t use that to make the team better enough to make the playoffs, then WTF is he good for?

The playoffs have to to be at least the expectation next year. I mean, they have to be! I don’t want to hear development year ever ***** again. And I even agree with it for this year. Next year. No way. They are going to have to start demanding that they win. They need to use that cap space to get good players that will help them win. Period.

And I don’t give a flyin ***** if they “want to be here.” Heck, I don’t want to be at my job, but I’m good at it and they pay me to do it, so I do my very best at it.

I don't disagree with your reactions, but I don't see playoffs this year, not with the current roster.  Next year, if he can make the right moves.  

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

Player development without team development is a huge risk.

Insightful.  

[GASabresIUFAN]

14 hours ago, dudacek said:

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

Most of the assets you mention including the now head coach he inherited.  He has drafted well and made some solid trades dismantling the old failed core.  Everyone acknowledges these facts.  However outside of getting Tuch in the Eichel trade, which specific acquisition from another organization has made this team demonstrably better?  I'd argue none.  

His plan is draft and develop to build a core and go from there.  Well the core is in place. 

Now that the core's is in place what's the plan to elevate the team?  More waiting for more prospects to develop seems to continue to be the plan, except this is no help coming on defense or in goal from the pipeline any time soon! 

Truthfully this was the year to push the team into playoff contention and build on last season's improvement.  He had unlimited cap space, the core locked up or under team control, and just a few areas of real need.  Unfortunately, the value brand band-aids he hired, Comrie and Bush, have been mostly absent and haven't added anything really when playing.   Now what?  The answer remains nothing.

My hope is that KA learns something from having failed to support the team after another good start and becomes more aggressive in filling the obvious holes in the roster.  The GM's in Chicago and Pitt added guys like Campbell, Sharp, Hoosa, Gonchar and Recchi to shepherd their young squads to the playoffs.  When will Ka doing something similar?   

[msw2112]

15 hours ago, dudacek said:

I can’t get behind the idea that Kevyn Adams is blithely sitting on his hands when he clearly spelled out his plan then spent the past 18 months doing exactly what he said he would.

And I can’t get behind the idea that Adams needs to deviate from his plan when he has made so much clear and demonstrable progress over such a relatively short period of time.

Adams told you he was going to strip the roster of players who didn’t want to be here, and invest his time and effort in developing and rewarding the players who did. And that he would assemble a team that would respect the fans, the city and each other, and grow together into something that would endure.

He broke up a 31st-place, .330 team that sported the league’s 29th best offence and 29th best defence with terrible analytics, a league-worst goal differential and, by all accounts a miserable dressing room.

His bag of assets included:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Dahlin, Jokiharju, Bryson, Cozens, Olofsson, Thompson, Mittelstadt, Asplund)
• Perhaps the worst contract in the league, along with another generally considered bottom-10 (Skinner, Okposo)
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Quinn, Peterka, Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Samuelsson, 6 1sts and 6 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• Not a single proven top-six forward, top pairing defenceman or starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

109 games later he has progressed to a 24th-place, .464 team that sports the league’s best offence and 24th best defence, with middle of the pack analytics and goal differential, and, by all accounts, a tight, happy room.

His bag of assets now includes:

• An intriguing collection of unproven NHL talent (Power, Quinn, Peterka, Krebs, Luukkonen)
• No anchor contracts
• A bucket of prospects and picks (Johnson, Portillo, Levi, Rosen, Poltapov, Kisakov, Savoie, Östlund, Kulich, Leinonen, Neuchev and more, 3 1sts and 5 2nds over the next 3 drafts)
• An emerging legitimate #1 NHL centre (Thompson) signed long-term on a 2C contract
• An emerging legitimate #2 NHL centre (Cozens)
• An emerging legitimate shutdown defenceman (Samuelsson) on a long-term contract
• A legitimate Norris Trophy contender (Dahlin)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL scoring winger (Skinner, 5th in scoring among NHL LWs)
• A legitimate 1st-line NHL power forward (Tuch, 6th in scoring among NHL RWs) on a bargain long-term contract.
• No starting goalie
• A whack of cap space

In short, in less than a season and a half, Adams’ plan has produced 6 core pieces where none existed before. And he’s done that without cutting into our cap space, or sacrificing our treasure chest of futures, just trying to maximize what each player has to give.

All this and we’re upset that he didn’t put in a waiver claim for a 29-year-old depth blueliner who has been an NHL regular exactly one season in his entire career? Or paid Jack Eichel trade prices for a Doug Bodger-level defenceman?

Does the above mean Adams is beyond reproach? Of course not.

But it does mean that he is capable and consistent: two qualities this organization’s leadership has been bereft of for far too long. We are making progress - significant, measurable progress. I suspect he will have no hesitation to make moves to fill in the holes when the right moves come available at the right time. I’m confident the groundwork is being laid and re-laid on a daily basis.

We’ve been at the bottom of a deep, dark pit for far too long for quick fixes.

From my vantage point, he’s doing what needs to be done.

This is an excellent post.  Realistic and rational.  Adams is not responsible for the last 11 years.  He is responsible for the last 2 or so years.  He did pretty much a full tear down and is doing a full rebuild.  The last time the rebuild was "rushed" by Tim Murray, it did not go well.  Sure, I am frustrated at how long this is taking, as I'm sure all of us are.  But Adams has a plan in place, he's been transparent about the plan, and the plan appears to be working.  Some of the moves a team like Detroit has made may get them higher in the standings in the short run, but I think that Adams' plan will put is in a better position in the long run.  I think that a Colorado Avalanche, or Houston Astros type of model is the goal.  The Astros were historically terrible for a long time, and now they are historically excellent.  I hate the Astros, and disdain their cheating a few seasons ago, but you can't argue that their plan has been highly successful.  Back to the Sabres: of course, the goaltending needs to be fixed by the start of next season.  Adams has proven to be highly competent thus far and it's just a hunch that he's aware of the goaltending issue and will do something about it.

Edited December 13, 2022 by msw2112

[grinreaper]

59 minutes ago, SwampD said:

We are doing all these great (better) things on offense not even spending to to cap floor. If KA can’t use that to make the team better enough to make the playoffs, then WTF is he good for?

The playoffs have to to be at least the expectation next year. I mean, they have to be! I don’t want to hear development year ever ***** again. And I even agree with it for this year. Next year. No way. They are going to have to start demanding that they win. They need to use that cap space to get good players that will help them win. Period.

And I don’t give a flyin ***** if they “want to be here.” Heck, I don’t want to be at my job, but I’m good at it and they pay me to do it, so I do my very best at it.

Taylor Hall was a perfect example of why a team should want no part of any player that "doesn't want to be here". Hockey is a team game and individual efforts, regardless of the player's skill don't make for a winning team. Players who make the free and willing decision to play where they don't really want to be don't magically become a part of a team and make the sum worth more than its parts, but when they are added up the total becomes much less. What would you rather have, a team full of Afinogenovs or a team consisting of Drurys? Anyway, I presume that all or the vast majority of people here want to see the Sabres succeed. They've been rebuilding for a dozen years or so with different people in charge, executing various plans but disregarding patience. We now have a GM who has a plan that has shown much progress in the last year or two. Losing patience and cutting the plan short would be a sure way of sabotaging the progress and assuring that the drought continues.

[PerreaultForever]

29 minutes ago, grinreaper said:

Taylor Hall was a perfect example of why a team should want no part of any player that "doesn't want to be here". Hockey is a team game and individual efforts, regardless of the player's skill don't make for a winning team. Players who make the free and willing decision to play where they don't really want to be don't magically become a part of a team and make the sum worth more than its parts, but when they are added up the total becomes much less. What would you rather have, a team full of Afinogenovs or a team consisting of Drurys? Anyway, I presume that all or the vast majority of people here want to see the Sabres succeed. They've been rebuilding for a dozen years or so with different people in charge, executing various plans but disregarding patience. We now have a GM who has a plan that has shown much progress in the last year or two. Losing patience and cutting the plan short would be a sure way of sabotaging the progress and assuring that the drought continues.

So to those key words "cutting the plan short" I'd counter what is the plan?????

We all want to win now. The "plan" is clearly not designed that way but WHEN is it time? next year? the year after? After that? When do you get to demand that the plan should be yielding results by now and it's behind (or ahead) of schedule? 

I see lost opportunities to be better than we are now. maybe not playoffs, but better than we are. How much longer do we have to wait????

[Marvin]

I know that part of my frustration is that we are only seeing minor growing pains from Power, Peterka, and Quinn plus accelerated development of Cozens, so the team feels about a year ahead of schedule, whence I think that GMKA should re-orient his mindset to that reality and shoot for the playoffs.

One adjustment would be to accept that the defence needs to catch up to the forwards.  Thus, GMKA ought to shelve the plan of trying to see which of Bryson, Fitzgerald, Pilut, or Clague might become NHLers and get actual current 3rd pair NHL defencemen for the #3 LHD and #7 D.  But he apparently can't or won't.  I lean towards the latter for failing to make claims on Reilly or Bear.

And that irks me.

[grinreaper]

1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

So to those key words "cutting the plan short" I'd counter what is the plan?????

We all want to win now. The "plan" is clearly not designed that way but WHEN is it time? next year? the year after? After that? When do you get to demand that the plan should be yielding results by now and it's behind (or ahead) of schedule? 

I see lost opportunities to be better than we are now. maybe not playoffs, but better than we are. How much longer do we have to wait????

Oh goody, a new subject to discuss. 

The team's plan is not a specific blueprint that demands following it to the letter and not providing any room for flexibility.

Simply put, GMKA first set out to get rid of people who didn't want to be here or didn't have a fit for the kind of club he (and I presume the owners) wanted to ice. Recognizing that he had an abundance of potentially really good but unproven players plus an unusual amount of high draft choices he knew that he might end up with more top NHL players than what he could afford or utilize. The Sabres are presently in the stage in which these players are being evaluated regarding their value. Some have shown enough to earn long term, team friendly contracts, some might be close while the value of others has not yet been determined. The whole idea right now is for them to find out what they have and to lock up those that are deserving while avoiding picking up anyone that makes it difficult for them to stick to their plan. The Sabres, either by astute drafts & trades or dumb luck have their skill players under control and prime for reasonable contracts. What they need now and most likely for a few years are players like stay at home defensemen and a high caliber goalie. Those kind of D-men can be had at reasonable prices but not until the trading deadline or in the Summer. The goalie, who knows? To me, solving the goaltending issue is and will be Adam's biggest single challenge.

Demanding that the Sabre's rebuild timeline is determined by the calendar rather than progress is wishing for feel good headlines rather than results. 

 

[Thorner]

6 hours ago, SwampD said:

We are doing all these great (better) things on offense not even spending to to cap floor. If KA can’t use that to make the team better enough to make the playoffs, then WTF is he good for?

The playoffs have to to be at least the expectation next year. I mean, they have to be! I don’t want to hear development year ever ***** again. And I even agree with it for this year. Next year. No way. They are going to have to start demanding that they win. They need to use that cap space to get good players that will help them win. Period.

And I don’t give a flyin ***** if they “want to be here.” Heck, I don’t want to be at my job, but I’m good at it and they pay me to do it, so I do my very best at it.

Honestly, this.

“Development year” in a GM’s 4th would probably break me.

[nfreeman]

4 hours ago, grinreaper said:

Taylor Hall was a perfect example of why a team should want no part of any player that "doesn't want to be here". Hockey is a team game and individual efforts, regardless of the player's skill don't make for a winning team. Players who make the free and willing decision to play where they don't really want to be don't magically become a part of a team and make the sum worth more than its parts, but when they are added up the total becomes much less. What would you rather have, a team full of Afinogenovs or a team consisting of Drurys? Anyway, I presume that all or the vast majority of people here want to see the Sabres succeed. They've been rebuilding for a dozen years or so with different people in charge, executing various plans but disregarding patience. We now have a GM who has a plan that has shown much progress in the last year or two. Losing patience and cutting the plan short would be a sure way of sabotaging the progress and assuring that the drought continues.

I agree with much of this, and Drury was better than Max, but Max was about a million times better than Hall.  

[Eleven]

4 hours ago, grinreaper said:

Taylor Hall was a perfect example of why a team should want no part of any player that "doesn't want to be here". Hockey is a team game and individual efforts, regardless of the player's skill don't make for a winning team. Players who make the free and willing decision to play where they don't really want to be don't magically become a part of a team and make the sum worth more than its parts, but when they are added up the total becomes much less. What would you rather have, a team full of Afinogenovs or a team consisting of Drurys? Anyway, I presume that all or the vast majority of people here want to see the Sabres succeed. They've been rebuilding for a dozen years or so with different people in charge, executing various plans but disregarding patience. We now have a GM who has a plan that has shown much progress in the last year or two. Losing patience and cutting the plan short would be a sure way of sabotaging the progress and assuring that the drought continues.

 

5 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

I agree with much of this, and Drury was better than Max, but Max was about a million times better than Hall.  

 

Ok, but how do we magically know that Max didn't want to be here and Drury did?  It seems more likely to be the opposite, to me.

[grinreaper]

1 hour ago, Thorny said:

Honestly, this.

“Development year” in a GM’s 4th would probably break me.

Something to keep in mind: Adam's first job was to jettison players that weren't part of the Sabre's future. He didn't complete the Eichel trade until somewhere around the middle of last season and didn't get the benefit of Tuch until after that. He had to clear the decks before making progress in building the team on ice. Placing a timeline based on the calendar doesn't make a lot of sense other than in general terms. Rebuilding a team or a business or even a golf course may use a timeframe as a guide but the smart operators are results driven. 

10 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

I agree with much of this, and Drury was better than Max, but Max was about a million times better than Hall was when playing for the Sabres. 

FIFY.