Has this losing streak already doomed this season?

[Refuting]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

You can think that, but I think it's wrong. 

Lol there's no way to tell is there 

[Porous Five Hole]

4 minutes ago, Toilet_Mop said:

Agreeable but it sounds like you're saying Carolina wasn't a great team. They were 

In hindsight, that roster was pretty loaded with veteran talent. 
 

https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/leagues/seasons/teams/0009792006.html

I still think the Sabres were better and 100% agree with @Taro T that injuries played a huge role in how that series ended up.  

[Refuting]

Just now, Porous Five Hole said:

In hindsight, that roster was pretty loaded with veteran talent. 
 

https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/leagues/seasons/teams/0009792006.html

I still think the Sabres were better and 100% agree with @Taro T that injuries played a huge role in how that series ended up.  

They added Doug Weight and Mark Rechhi at the deadline which was paramount to their playoff success, I can't even remember if the Sabres made a move. Probably not 

They also had true stay at home defenseman just like the Sabres read right now.

Samuelsson being back really did change the outlook for me. Just gotta do it consistently. Adams seems to have gotten the Thompson/Samuelsson contracts correct  

[Marvin]

34 minutes ago, Toilet_Mop said:

Lol there's no way to tell is there 

Caveat: the under-rating of Carolina is not just in Buffalo, but league wide.  Having said that, they were exceptionally lucky not just with their lack of injuries, but critical injuries to their opponents -- not just Buffalo.  Does anyone beat Ottawa if Hasek does not get injured in the Olympics?  The Habs were up 2-0 on Carolina before Koivu got injured.  And you have to ask if Edmonton wins the Cup if their #1G is not injured -- in game 1 of the Final.  And most fans besides Buffalonians think the Sabres win that series handily with just 2 of the D back from injury; many make the argument that just 1 would have changed the outcome of Game 7.

However, sure we can make a very educated guess as to what could have happened.

Carolina was missing their #3C, which washes with the Sabres missing Connolly.

The Sabres were missing their #4D, Kalinin, the entire series.  Their #1D in Tallinder was injured in Game 3.  After game 2, their #5D in Numminen only played 1 period of Game 6.  And then the nail in the coffin was their #3D, McKee, getting the stapf infection after Game 6.  The analogue of that defence in Game 7 is Dahlin, Power, Lyubushkin, Bryson, Pilut, and Fitzgerald -- and saying Lyubushkin is the equivalent of Fitzpatrick is being pretty generous to Rory.

If Carolina had been so good that they would have beaten the Sabres with no injuries, why didn't they blow the Sabres out in any of games 4-7?  The Sabres were leading game 7 heading into the 3rd period, for God's Sake.  That should never happen if Carolina were as good as you claim; it should have been a shooting gallery in the Buffalo end with something like a 5-1 final with Carolina floating through the 3rd period.  And that does not even count that game 7 should never have happened if they had been that good.

I literally can not think of any reason that the Sabres don't win that series in 6 if they only had been missing Connolly, Kalinin, and Numminen after game 3.  Heck, I can make the argument that if the had had Connolly for the series, they beat Carolina even with the D injuries because he made that power play lethal.

Edited November 23, 2022 by Marvin

[Taro T]

5 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Caveat: the under-rating of Carolina is not just in Buffalo, but league wide.  Having said that, they were exceptionally lucky not just with their lack of injuries, but critical injuries to their opponents -- not just Buffalo.  Does anyone beat Ottawa if Hasek does not get injured in the Olympics?  The Habs were up 2-0 on Carolina before Koivu got injured.  And you have to ask if Edmonton wins the Cup if their #1G is not injured -- in game 1 of the Final.  And most fans besides Buffalonians think the Sabres win that series with just ONE of the D back from injury in game 7.

However, sure we can make a very educated guess as to what could have happened.

Carolina was missing their #3C, which washes with the Sabres missing Connolly.

The Sabres were missing their #4D, Kalinin, the entire series.  Their #1D in Tallinder was injured in Game 3.  After game 2, their #5D in Numminen only played 1 period of Game 6.  And then the nail in the coffin was their #3D, McKee, getting the stapf infection after Game 6.  The analogue of that defence in Game 7 is Dahlin, Power, Lyubushkin, Bryson, Pilut, and Fitzgerald -- and saying Lyubushkin is the equivalent of Fitzpatrick is being pretty generous to Rory.

If Carolina had been so good that they would have beaten the Sabres with no injuries, why didn't they blow the Sabres out in any of games 4-7?  The Sabres were leading game 7 heading into the 3rd period, for God's Sake.  That should never happen if Carolina were as good as you claim; it should have been a shooting gallery in the Buffalo end with something like a 5-1 final with Carolina floating through the 3rd period.  And that does not even count that game 7 should never have happened if they had been that good.

I literally can not think of any reason that the Sabres don't win that series in 6 if the D only had been missing Connolly, Kalinin, and Numminen.  Heck, I can make the argument that if the had had Connolly for the series, they beat Carolina even with the D injuries because he made that power play lethal.

No.  The analog is having Samuelsson, Jokiharju, Pilut, Fitzgerald, Clague, & Prow (Davies, Pritchett, other).  How often do teams win that one?

[Sabres Fan in NS]

1 hour ago, Curt said:

Something doesn’t need to be surprising for it to be considered an accomplishment.

I think you mean overachievement.

As to the 95-96 team, it was before my time.

👀

[pi2000]

46 minutes ago, kas23 said:

What we need is another Muel. I don’t care if we need to trade anyone not named Power, Dahlin, or Tage. We are way too dependent on a single defenseman. 

Players like Muel simply are not available for trade, they're too valuable.    

What worries me is they don't have anybody else like him in the pipeline.... Komarov or Novikov maybe?   Don't know those 2 well enough.

[triumph_communes]

No, St Louis had a bigger hole. But they fixed their coaching problem. We haven’t. We just played a team whose defense wasn’t physical and those are teams we beat. 

[Refuting]

6 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Caveat: the under-rating of Carolina is not just in Buffalo, but league wide.  Having said that, they were exceptionally lucky not just with their lack of injuries, but critical injuries to their opponents -- not just Buffalo.  Does anyone beat Ottawa if Hasek does not get injured in the Olympics?  The Habs were up 2-0 on Carolina before Koivu got injured.  And you have to ask if Edmonton wins the Cup if their #1G is not injured -- in game 1 of the Final.  And most fans besides Buffalonians think the Sabres win that series handily with just 2 of the D back from injury; many make the argument that just 1 would have changed the outcome of Game 7.

However, sure we can make a very educated guess as to what could have happened.

Carolina was missing their #3C, which washes with the Sabres missing Connolly.

The Sabres were missing their #4D, Kalinin, the entire series.  Their #1D in Tallinder was injured in Game 3.  After game 2, their #5D in Numminen only played 1 period of Game 6.  And then the nail in the coffin was their #3D, McKee, getting the stapf infection after Game 6.  The analogue of that defence in Game 7 is Dahlin, Power, Lyubushkin, Bryson, Pilut, and Fitzgerald -- and saying Lyubushkin is the equivalent of Fitzpatrick is being pretty generous to Rory.

If Carolina had been so good that they would have beaten the Sabres with no injuries, why didn't they blow the Sabres out in any of games 4-7?  The Sabres were leading game 7 heading into the 3rd period, for God's Sake.  That should never happen if Carolina were as good as you claim; it should have been a shooting gallery in the Buffalo end with something like a 5-1 final with Carolina floating through the 3rd period.  And that does not even count that game 7 should never have happened if they had been that good.

I literally can not think of any reason that the Sabres don't win that series in 6 if they only had been missing Connolly, Kalinin, and Numminen after game 3.  Heck, I can make the argument that if the had had Connolly for the series, they beat Carolina even with the D injuries because he made that power play lethal.

I appreciate the detailed response 

However, we did lose the season series 3-1 to them 

Carolina also had home ice advantage which as we all know is huge come playoff time. They had top to bottom goal scoring on all 4 lines. They made key acquisitions at the trade deadline. We did not 

I did not agree with some coaching and player efforts either. Why did Ruff bench Vanek? He was a rook yes but had scored 25 goals on the season. Why didn't Ruff put him back in when Connolly got injured? Confusing. And Miller imploded in that final period. He gave up. One goal in particular there was a scrum and Carolina scored and Miller literally gave up. I'll always remember that image 

We have a low point thread in here somewhere and I think it's that series loss. I agree with many of the points you guys are making. But people act like Carolina was some scrub team that would've gotten 4-0ed if it wasn't for injuries. I disagree 

[PromoTheRobot]

4 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

The Sabres are 8-11. There are 63 games to go, but I’m sorry to say, the Sabres odds of making the playoffs are nearly zero.  In fact they have to play at an over 104 pt pace the rest of the way to even have a chance.  The Sabres need to go 37-20-6 the rest of the way to get to 96 pts.  Last year 96 points would have fallen short of the playoffs, but in most normal years, 96 points would put the team as one of the last ones in.  

So can this team make such a run? While the 102 point pace late last season says it is possible, with NJ and Bos playing dominate hockey and another 8 teams playing solid to excellent hockey in the East, the Sabres task is nearly overwhelming.  The only way I see it happening is for the team to start a 5 or 6 game winning streak and soon.  

Take heart patient Sabres fan, fearless leader KA said this was another developmental year.  

 

Christmas came early, huh?

[Marvin]

18 minutes ago, Taro T said:

No.  The analog is having Samuelsson, Jokiharju, Pilut, Fitzgerald, Clague, & Prow (Davies, Pritchett, other).  How often do teams win that one?

Yeah, that's more like it.  Like I said, how is a team with THAT defence not blown out by an eventual Cup Winner if they would have won even without the Sabres' injuries?

[Marvin]

16 minutes ago, Toilet_Mop said:

And Miller imploded in that final period. He gave up. One goal in particular there was a scrum and Carolina scored and Miller literally gave up. I'll always remember that image 

We have a low point thread in here somewhere and I think it's that series loss. I agree with many of the points you guys are making. But people act like Carolina was some scrub team that would've gotten 4-0ed if it wasn't for injuries. I disagree 

The goal you are thinking of was Carolina's go-ahead goal.  He looks deflated on the replay, but giving up?  I don't see that at all.  (All of Game 7 is on YouTube.)

I don't know of anyone anywhere who thinks we would have swept Carolina without injuries.  The fewest games I see people say with "ordinary" injuries is 6, like I do.

[thewookie1]

21 minutes ago, Toilet_Mop said:

I appreciate the detailed response 

However, we did lose the season series 3-1 to them 

Carolina also had home ice advantage which as we all know is huge come playoff time. They had top to bottom goal scoring on all 4 lines. They made key acquisitions at the trade deadline. We did not 

I did not agree with some coaching and player efforts either. Why did Ruff bench Vanek? He was a rook yes but had scored 25 goals on the season. Why didn't Ruff put him back in when Connolly got injured? Confusing. And Miller imploded in that final period. He gave up. One goal in particular there was a scrum and Carolina scored and Miller literally gave up. I'll always remember that image 

We have a low point thread in here somewhere and I think it's that series loss. I agree with many of the points you guys are making. But people act like Carolina was some scrub team that would've gotten 4-0ed if it wasn't for injuries. I disagree 

Carolina weren't a scrub team, but were extremely lucky in the playoffs with every competitor having critical injuries. Additionally Cam Ward was truly a 1 hit wonder for them that year. 

Buffalo had a far better team when healthy and seeing as we took them to 7 games using a Defense held together with glue and scotch tape.

[Refuting]

2 minutes ago, Marvin said:

The goal you are thinking of was Carolina's go-ahead goal.  He looks deflated on the replay, but giving up?  I don't see that at all.  (All of Game 7 is on YouTube.)

 

Don't need to watch it again. I remember it vividly

Deflated is a synonym for giving up as far as I'm concerned. I can't be convinced that he didn't give up. He did, and the look was all over his face 

[Marvin]

1 minute ago, thewookie1 said:

Carolina weren't a scrub team, but were extremely lucky in the playoffs with every competitor having critical injuries. Additionally Cam Ward was truly a 1 hit wonder for them that year. 

Buffalo had a far better team when healthy and seeing as we took them to 7 games using a Defense held together with glue and scotch tape.

As my friend at NASA says, "bubble gum and hairpins."

[Refuting]

1 minute ago, thewookie1 said:

Carolina weren't a scrub team, but were extremely lucky in the playoffs with every competitor having critical injuries. Additionally Cam Ward was truly a 1 hit wonder for them that year. 

Buffalo had a far better team when healthy and seeing as we took them to 7 games using a Defense held together with glue and scotch tape.

Do not agree. At all 

[Curt]

32 minutes ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

👀

Yeah, I was 9 and not a fan yet.

[Refuting]

I do agree that the Sabres made an admirable effort getting that series to 7 games. Exciting times, indeed 

[Stoner]

Just for S&G's, the 05-06 Sabres sat 8-9 on 11/12 and had already been routed three times by the Senators.

[Refuting]

9 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Just for S&G's, the 05-06 Sabres sat 8-9 on 11/12 and had already been routed three times by the Senators.

Ya I remember watching that 10-4 Ottawa game. They were loaded that year too. Was thinking here we go again more pre-lockout Sabres and then they took the league by storm multiple comebacks was a great season 

[Marvin]

22 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Just for S&G's, the 05-06 Sabres sat 8-9 on 11/12 and had already been routed three times by the Senators.

People also forget how many injuries they had that season.

[Taro T]

19 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Just for S&G's, the 05-06 Sabres sat 8-9 on 11/12 and had already been routed three times by the Senators.

Losing Miller led to them losing 4 in a row & 5 of 6 before the team settled down & Biron went on his ridiculously improbable winning streak (which was helped by not getting charged the L vs SJ).

It also didn't hurt that they could avoid the Otters for about 2 more months.  Those guys were Buffalo's kryptonite early that year.

[Norcal]

I was watching a segment last night in between periods of the Golden Knights game and they had a graphic depicting playoff teams at the Thanksgiving point in the season. 

According to them the teams in playoff position by Thanksgiving are usually the teams that make it. 

Last year there were 3 changes in the west and i missed what they said about the east.

That being said, the Sabres are on the outside looking in but there are some teams they should be able to overtake.

I'll say no. They're not done, they're barely getting started! 

Lets GO Boys!!!!

[LGR4GM]

4 hours ago, Toilet_Mop said:

Lol there's no way to tell is there 

And yet you brought it up and claim you're right. 

3 hours ago, pi2000 said:

Players like Muel simply are not available for trade, they're too valuable.    

What worries me is they don't have anybody else like him in the pipeline.... Komarov or Novikov maybe?   Don't know those 2 well enough.

Those are the 2 I'd think of. Idk if they'll become Muel but yes, that's their hopeful trajectory 

[Gatorman0519]

Out of the playoff race but I think 90 points would mark a successful season.