The 2003 and 2018 Canadian Junior Team Thread

[Buffalonill]

5 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Oh I'm not saying it wouldn't be a good idea, it's just something that hasn't been done, they've been treated as free adults, like me and you, and I think there'd be push back from the players if they were not given freedom. 

 

The team or the members of the jury? Not sure what this means. 

They brought in and drafted all these "Rapist"

[aristocrat]

19 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

On a semi related note, Virtanen just got off in his trial. Jury found him not guilty. As the story went the woman in question had a few memory lapses on events so Jake's lawyer stressed the "inconsistencies" and she hadn't fought back enough to convince the jury she wasn't a willing participant. 

In these cases, I suspect they will be even harder to "prove" with the time that's gone by, but that videotape is still the main piece of evidence. 

That's the unfortunate part of these types of cases. Essentially he said she said and very tought to convict. To Russia he will probably go I'd imagine. 

Edited July 27, 2022 by aristocrat

[Digger]

10 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Oh I'm not saying it wouldn't be a good idea, it's just something that hasn't been done, they've been treated as free adults, like me and you, and I think there'd be push back from the players if they were not given freedom. 

Are we free adults?  During our working years (if working for a company) we have to be careful with what we say comments, politics, opinions, even driving habits if we're driving a company vehicle.  Same goes when traveling and off site.  We are employees of the company and represent the company and are judged accordingly if we don't line up with expectations.

I know this is somewhat off the original topic and not meaning to criticize your comment at all but the players need to meet the expectations of the IIHF and specifically Hockey Canada in these cases being brought to light.  I would think the same would extend to any team the players are playing on (minor, CHL, College NCAA, NHL).  What's tolerated and what is put in place to ensure that things don't go wrong (education, discussions, code of conduct, etc.)

[LGR4GM]

This is a long thread but sums up what is going on today. I will post the first couple tweets but look it up if you are interested. 

 

[PerreaultForever]

7 hours ago, Buffalonill said:

They brought in and drafted all these "Rapist"

Riiiiiiight..........cause he had that on his resume when they drafted him. Sure. 

Also, whether we want to believe it or not, there is a legal system, it went to trail, he was found not guilty. So he's not a rapist like it or not. 

Bunch of ex-Sabres on that world junior team remember. Pots calling kettles and all that. 

[PerreaultForever]

5 hours ago, aristocrat said:

That's the unfortunate part of these types of cases. Essentially he said she said and very tought to convict. To Russia he will probably go I'd imagine. 

I don't want to defend the guy (I've heard from reliable sources he's always been an arrogant a-hole) but the justice system is what it is and if a person is found not guilty we can't just go on believing what we want to believe. imo if he's good enough he should get an NHL shot. If we move into a world where any accusation leads to a conviction then pretty soon no young people will ever have sex again. Either that or they will have to sign nuptial contracts before every encounter. 

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, Digger said:

Are we free adults?  During our working years (if working for a company) we have to be careful with what we say comments, politics, opinions, even driving habits if we're driving a company vehicle.  Same goes when traveling and off site.  We are employees of the company and represent the company and are judged accordingly if we don't line up with expectations.

I know this is somewhat off the original topic and not meaning to criticize your comment at all but the players need to meet the expectations of the IIHF and specifically Hockey Canada in these cases being brought to light.  I would think the same would extend to any team the players are playing on (minor, CHL, College NCAA, NHL).  What's tolerated and what is put in place to ensure that things don't go wrong (education, discussions, code of conduct, etc.)

You're not wrong, and the world has definitely changed. Back in my day I remember my first summer job in an office (Stelco in Hamilton) the place was filled with flirting, sexual comments, affairs at lunchtime, all kinds of comments and opinions that would get you fired in a heartbeat today. That's where I met Dave Andreychuk's dad, and man, some of the things he said!!!!!!!! All considered humour or acceptable in some form or other at the time. locker rooms in that era where far far worse. It was all just "boys will be boys" back then and Hockey culture has pretty much retained an element of that. They just hush it up better than most. 

So anyway, in today's world it's all changed and Hockey Canada has to change as well. I am certainly not against these kids being watched closely and chaperoned and so forth. A lot of them are thick as posts, dumb jocks, immature, and they need guidance well into adulthood. Absolutely. They won't like it though, and that's all I'm saying. So in the end I'm not sure where the money and the power fall into place. If you're a star prospect and you'll end up being a multi million NHL star are you going to step in line or are you going to do whatever you want? And considering all the money involved how motivated will they be to keep him in line? Or will they just work harder at covering anything that happens up? Money always rules in the end doesn't it? 

[Buffalonill]

1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

Riiiiiiight..........cause he had that on his resume when they drafted him. Sure. 

Also, whether we want to believe it or not, there is a legal system, it went to trail, he was found not guilty. So he's not a rapist like it or not. 

Bunch of ex-Sabres on that world junior team remember. Pots calling kettles and all that. 

Welp they did a fine job bringing 3 guys that have been  Accused of raping girls.

Really so just beacuse he was not found guilty he didn't do it .

[aristocrat]

3 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

I don't want to defend the guy (I've heard from reliable sources he's always been an arrogant a-hole) but the justice system is what it is and if a person is found not guilty we can't just go on believing what we want to believe. imo if he's good enough he should get an NHL shot. If we move into a world where any accusation leads to a conviction then pretty soon no young people will ever have sex again. Either that or they will have to sign nuptial contracts before every encounter. 

he was a decent third or fourth liner but that’s about it. Maybe time will heal if he goes over there for a couple years. 

[PerreaultForever]

8 hours ago, Buffalonill said:

Really so just beacuse he was not found guilty he didn't do it .

No, not saying that, but what other absolute standard do we have to go by? Not every accusation is legit. Many are, maybe most are, but sometimes the lines are blurry or vague. We can't just decide without the facts or being in the courtroom ourselves. We just get media reports that can be skewed. there's no way to know. 

So you don't like a guy, he's not on your team, it's easy to judge him negatively. Let me put it to you this way, if Rasmus Dahlin was accused of rape but was found not guilty in the trial would you want him shipped off to Russia? 

[PerreaultForever]

5 hours ago, aristocrat said:

he was a decent third or fourth liner but that’s about it. Maybe time will heal if he goes over there for a couple years. 

Absolutely. He's a third or fourth liner for sure. Bit of an agitator edge, some skill, but likely nothing above that role. I'd place him roughly equal to Zemgus (in terms of on ice skill, not character.) But lots of teams want guys like that to fill out the bottom of their roster. 

I mean come on, if Evander Kane can get adulation and big bucks after all his crap, surely a guy found not guilty of one thing deserves a try out somewhere no? 

[French Collection]

Rick Westhead of TSN reporting that Hockey Canada paid out plaintiffs 12 times over the years and one player was involved in 4 incidents, costing them $1M.

Wow, a repeat offender keeps coming back. I am really disappointed with that organization. So many people were hurt and it was hushed up because these guys are “hockey stars”.

[Weave]

54 minutes ago, French Collection said:

Rick Westhead of TSN reporting that Hockey Canada paid out plaintiffs 12 times over the years and one player was involved in 4 incidents, costing them $1M.

Wow, a repeat offender keeps coming back. I am really disappointed with that organization. So many people were hurt and it was hushed up because these guys are “hockey stars”.

Has any organization in any walk of life not hushed up these sorts of incidents?

Its disgusting what people will hide to keep the money rolling in.  I really hope Hockey Canada is burned to the ground and re-formed as a result.  

[Wyldnwoody44]

I'll say this about the legal system. 

 

I would rather see someone who is "probably" guilty get off than someone who is innocent get the book thrown at them. Our legal system has flaws, but for the most part, I think they get it right. Sometimes you have a good lawyer, sometimes the prosecution screws up.

This hockey Canada thing isn't earth shattering news, and I bet that if everything in the world came to light, any corporation with money would have a lot of blood on their hands. Sadly, humans kind of suck in general. 

If found guilty here, even though time has passed, let them all rot in jail. Some lines just shouldn't be crossed. 

[shrader]

2 hours ago, Weave said:

Has any organization in any walk of life not hushed up these sorts of incidents?

Its disgusting what people will hide to keep the money rolling in.  I really hope Hockey Canada is burned to the ground and re-formed as a result.  

We also live in a society where countless people have accepted those payoffs.  It makes you wonder just how important justice really is.  It clearly has a price tag.

[Curt]

13 minutes ago, shrader said:

We also live in a society where countless people have accepted those payoffs.  It makes you wonder just how important justice really is.  It clearly has a price tag.

True, but difficult to judge someone in that situation.  The choice isn’t always between justice and money.

Often the choice is between spending tons of money and years rehashing emotionally and physically traumatic events, or coming to an immediate agreement where you receive some compensation and can move on.

[JoeSchmoe]

You have some young adult men carrying out sexual assaults, then the young adult men should be responsible... Not HC.

Is it possible the victim(s) initially went after the alleged perps, but HC came in to protect their holier than thou young superstars? If so I'm pi$$ed given all the dues I've paid over the years! 

Or did the victim go after the HC cash cow?

If I'm in charge at HC, I'm defending myself fully on this matter and making it clear she should be going after the players. I'm also making a clear example out of the players and wouldn't use a shred of time or money to protect their identities.

[aristocrat]

6 hours ago, French Collection said:

Rick Westhead of TSN reporting that Hockey Canada paid out plaintiffs 12 times over the years and one player was involved in 4 incidents, costing them $1M.

Wow, a repeat offender keeps coming back. I am really disappointed with that organization. So many people were hurt and it was hushed up because these guys are “hockey stars”.

 

I'd have to think the four incidents happened and then they all came out later. I would hope after one incident they'd kick the kid out of the league. At least I hope. 

[aristocrat]

On 7/28/2022 at 7:24 AM, French Collection said:

Rick Westhead of TSN reporting that Hockey Canada paid out plaintiffs 12 times over the years and one player was involved in 4 incidents, costing them $1M.

Wow, a repeat offender keeps coming back. I am really disappointed with that organization. So many people were hurt and it was hushed up because these guys are “hockey stars”.

 

[LGR4GM]