22-23 opening day line up

[sabresparaavida]

18 minutes ago, Flashsabre said:

Use a first +Johnson + to aquire Gibson or sign a UFA goalie to be the starter next year: Kuemper, Campbell, Husso, etc. 

Or sign two goalies to create a tandem:

Desmith+Comrie

They need new, competent blood in the crease next season in order to make a meaningful step forward.

You can have all the young guys you want progressing but if you are fishing the puck out of your net constantly it doesn’t mean squat.

I wouldn’t pay a cent for Gibson. He’s been below average since 2018 and has considerable term left. 

[Flashsabre]

37 minutes ago, sabresparaavida said:

I wouldn’t pay a cent for Gibson. He’s been below average since 2018 and has considerable term left. 

Well Anaheim have iced an awful team. That is where the analytics dept and Bales would have to come into play. Are his numbers caused by the team or has his play fallen off.

[freester]

I think he will give a big money 2 year deal to MAF. 

[Taro T]

3 minutes ago, freester said:

I think he will give a big money 2 year deal to MAF. 

Like it.

Ideally he'd sign Fleury for 2 years, Husso for 3, & trade Portillo's rights as part of a package (either directly, or what he'd bring back in return) for the top 4 RHD they need.  Presumes that Portillo isn't going to sign in the spring.  If he tells Adams he will sign, then skip that last part.

Overpay Husso so that he doesn't need a NTC to sign.  IF UPL can figure it out, you either have 1 too many goalies in 2-3 years at which point UPL or Husso can be part of a trade package or your tandem becomes Husso & UPL or if he doesn't figure it out you're still likely set at starter until Levi is ready.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

1 minute ago, Taro T said:

Like it.

Ideally he'd sign Fleury for 2 years, Husso for 3, & trade Portillo's rights as part of a package (either directly, or what he'd bring back in return) for the top 4 RHD they need.  Presumes that Portillo isn't going to sign in the spring.  If he tells Adams he will sign, then skip that last part.

Overpay Husso so that he doesn't need a NTC to sign.  IF UPL can figure it out, you either have 1 too many goalies in 2-3 years at which point UPL or Husso can be part of a trade package or your tandem becomes Husso & UPL or if he doesn't figure it out you're still likely set at starter until Levi is ready.

Ideally ?  Yes !

Likely reality ?  Not very !

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, freester said:

I think he will give a big money 2 year deal to MAF. 

I think he will try but MAF can go wherever he wants.

 

1 hour ago, Taro T said:

Presumes that Portillo isn't going to sign in the spring.  If he tells Adams he will sign, then skip that last part.

The mistake Adams made with Ullmark is trusting that Linus would re-sign.  He didn't and Kevyn got nothing back.  I agree with Adams in not signing Ullmark to more term than he wanted to give him, but even getting to that point was a problem.  So unless he's signed by, say, the trade deadline I think Adams should move Portillo if he can.  Of course the acquiring team only values Portillo if they're assured they can sign him, so he might not be a featured piece in a trade.

[Crusader1969]

4 hours ago, JohnC said:

I have heard on at least a half dozen occasions the GM comment on his overall philosophy in rebuilding the roster. He has repeatedly stated/declared that he is not going to take shortcuts at the expense of letting the process run its course i.e. mostly draft and develop approach. Although he certainly would like to make the playoffs next year he is not going to give up a young asset for a short term boost. That's why the discussion on Dubois is a fantasy discussion has little basis in reality as far as Buffalo being involved in a deal for him. 

I agree with you that we shouldn't expect Quinn and JJP as rookies to be instant successes. I don't believe that the GM or the coach have that lofty expectation either player. There is an expected uneven course of development that all young players go through, and they won't be exceptions. The road in development  for Tage, Mitts and Cozens has had its bumps. And there is still more road for them to cover before becoming established players in this league. Quinn and JJ will have to go through the same trials and tribulations just like every young player has to go through. 

There is a unanimity on this forum about the necessity of adding a goalie to this roster. Even here I don't see the GM expending much in resources to address that position. It just seems to me that this GM is taking a big picture view as opposed to a term more expedient short-term approach.  

This man gets it.  Great post 

Adams has said repeatedly he isn’t going to put a road block in front of guys like JJ and Quinn to become a Sabres.  Any of these ideas to bring in forwards isn’t going to happen IMHO

I believe he already has his top 12 forwards on the roster and wants to see how they perform next year 

he will concentrate on bringing him in a couple of dmen and a goalie

[freester]

51 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I think he will try but MAF can go wherever he wants.

 

 

MAF won’t turn down 2 years 22 million 

[tom webster]

5 hours ago, JohnC said:

I have heard on at least a half dozen occasions the GM comment on his overall philosophy in rebuilding the roster. He has repeatedly stated/declared that he is not going to take shortcuts at the expense of letting the process run its course i.e. mostly draft and develop approach. Although he certainly would like to make the playoffs next year he is not going to give up a young asset for a short term boost. That's why the discussion on Dubois is a fantasy discussion has little basis in reality as far as Buffalo being involved in a deal for him. 

I agree with you that we shouldn't expect Quinn and JJP as rookies to be instant successes. I don't believe that the GM or the coach have that lofty expectation either player. There is an expected uneven course of development that all young players go through, and they won't be exceptions. The road in development  for Tage, Mitts and Cozens has had its bumps. And there is still more road for them to cover before becoming established players in this league. Quinn and JJ will have to go through the same trials and tribulations just like every young player has to go through. 

There is a unanimity on this forum about the necessity of adding a goalie to this roster. Even here I don't see the GM expending much in resources to address that position. It just seems to me that this GM is taking a big picture view as opposed to a term more expedient short-term approach.  

All of this makes sense except for thing. PLD is exactly the type of player that fits. A 24 year old upgrade that half the league can’t afford to offer a multi year deal to. I don’t know if he’s the guy but someone like him should be on the radar.

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, Crusader1969 said:

This man gets it.  Great post 

Adams has said repeatedly he isn’t going to put a road block in front of guys like JJ and Quinn to become a Sabres.  Any of these ideas to bring in forwards isn’t going to happen IMHO

I believe he already has his top 12 forwards on the roster and wants to see how they perform next year 

he will concentrate on bringing him in a couple of dmen and a goalie

The one trait that the GM has is transparency. He has publicly stated that this offseason he needs to address the goalie position and has stated that he wants to bring a defenseman that will support the play of Power. The GM has clearly stated what his philosophy is in rebuilding the roster, and by his deeds/decisions he is adhering to it. 

I'm confident that the GM is going to bring in another goalie. But in my view it is not going to be a costly player that many would consider to be a big splash addition such as MAF.  I just don't see it. 

 

 

[dudacek]

Just now, tom webster said:

All of this makes sense except for thing. PLD is exactly the type of player that fits. A 24 year old upgrade that half the league can’t afford to offer a multi year deal to. I don’t know if he’s the guy but someone like him should be on the radar.

This.

They aren't interested in players that don’t fit with what they are building. 

That certainly doesn’t mean they aren’t interested in players that do.

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, tom webster said:

All of this makes sense except for thing. PLD is exactly the type of player that fits. A 24 year old upgrade that half the league can’t afford to offer a multi year deal to. I don’t know if he’s the guy but someone like him should be on the radar.

If there was a defenseman who fit the mold that you were describing here, I would say that it is a more likely acquisition. But for a forward player like PLD who has moved around a lot and is not shy about voicing his opinions, I don't see him as the type of personality he wants in his room. I simply don't see him willing to include in a deal any of his young talents such as Cozens, Mitts, Krebbs, Quinn or even JJ for Dubois. 

I have previously expressed a view that I would be willing to give up our lowest first round pick in a deal for a Tuch like player. So I'm open to a reasonable deal. But even given that I don't see a PLD deal happening here. 

[tom webster]

23 minutes ago, JohnC said:

If there was a defenseman who fit the mold that you were describing here, I would say that it is a more likely acquisition. But for a forward player like PLD who has moved around a lot and is not shy about voicing his opinions, I don't see him as the type of personality he wants in his room. I simply don't see him willing to include in a deal any of his young talents such as Cozens, Mitts, Krebbs, Quinn or even JJ for Dubois. 

I have previously expressed a view that I would be willing to give up our lowest first round pick in a deal for a Tuch like player. So I'm open to a reasonable deal. But even given that I don't see a PLD deal happening here. 

As I said, it may not be PLD, although I wouldn’t dismiss him based on the fact that he and Torts didn’t see eye to eye, Torts embarrassed him and he reacted like a lot of 21 year olds with a guaranteed contract would.  By all accounts, Winnipeg wants him back but he sees a declining core and doesn’t want to sign up for 7 years.

As you yourself said, and with which I agree, Quinn and JJP. aren’t expected to be major contributors next year. By that logic, the 9th in this years draft won’t contribute for 3 to 4 years. A 24/25 year old forward will be ready to start gelling with the group this Fall and be primed to be a major factor next year.

[JohnC]

43 minutes ago, tom webster said:

As I said, it may not be PLD, although I wouldn’t dismiss him based on the fact that he and Torts didn’t see eye to eye, Torts embarrassed him and he reacted like a lot of 21 year olds with a guaranteed contract would.  By all accounts, Winnipeg wants him back but he sees a declining core and doesn’t want to sign up for 7 years.

As you yourself said, and with which I agree, Quinn and JJP. aren’t expected to be major contributors next year. By that logic, the 9th in this years draft won’t contribute for 3 to 4 years. A 24/25 year old forward will be ready to start gelling with the group this Fall and be primed to be a major factor next year.

I'm open to using some of our cap and draft capital to get more immediate help. However, based on what the clearly spoken GM has repeatedly stated I don't believe that he is going to pursue any significant forward help this offseason. My sense is that KA is a process guy. I don't see him giving up any significant assets to make any bold moves to give this developing team an immediate jolt. That's just my impression on how KA operates. If there is going to be a major jolt to this roster it is going to come from internal improvement from players such as Cozens and Mitts. 

[Pimlach]

13 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I don’t understand your post.  He improved last year’s roster by bringing in Tuch and Krebs during the season and then again adding Samuelsson once he got healthy.  The goal now is to further remove JAGs from this roster by getting real goaltending and a few veteran D this off-season and continue to elevate the team.  This is his opportunity to improve the roster for opening day.  

Whether these offseason moves payoff by the end of next season is anyone’s guess.  Some offseason moves work (Hinotstroza, Anderson, Pysyk) and others don’t (Hall, Dell, Staal, Eakin).  How he also tinkers with the roster over the course of next season is another completely different issue. 

What don’t you understand?   You said improve on where we started last year (added Krebs and Tuch).  I’m saying he has to improve on where he ENDED last year.  He needs to add a few better players.  One player MUST be a goalie.  Adding UPL, Quinn and Peterka is not enough.  

Edited June 1, 2022 by Pimlach

[Pimlach]

14 hours ago, JohnC said:

If you are factoring in Krebs, JJ and Quinn in addressing the center and winger/s needs then those positions are accounted for. And that leaves us with the obvious need of upgrading the goalie position and adding a defenseman. Both of those needs have been publicly mentioned by KA as offseason priorities. 

This offseason, the most dominating issue (obviously so) is what goalies is the GM going to target? For a large chunk of the roster the pieces are falling into play from inside the system. This overshadowing issue is making this offseason so intriguing to follow. Will the GM go for a middling option or be a little bolder in his pursuit of filling the position? I simply don't know. 

Disagree with the bolded.  Krebs is already a Sabre.  The other two are rookies.  I’m not counting on rookies.  Sure they will make the team and play a lot because they can beat out JAGs.  
 

We need to be stronger at center.  Eakin should be gone, he was not very good.  We need to get better up the middle.  Thompson is fine.  Mitts might make a jump.  Cozen might make a jump.  Girgs is more of. winger.  I also think we need more muscle on wing.  Look at the playoff teams. 
 

I like this team.  But I know we need more.   

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I'm open to using some of our cap and draft capital to get more immediate help. However, based on what the clearly spoken GM has repeatedly stated I don't believe that he is going to pursue any significant forward help this offseason. My sense is that KA is a process guy. I don't see him giving up any significant assets to make any bold moves to give this developing team an immediate jolt. That's just my impression on how KA operates. If there is going to be a major jolt to this roster it is going to come from internal improvement from players such as Cozens and Mitts. 

What has Adams repeatedly said that has convinced you he is not going to add a forward?

Is it the “blocking”, the caring about the future as much as the present, and the giving his young players room to grow together?

Because if he doesn’t think of, say, Casey and Victor as “his” young players and trades them for, say, a 24-year centre he is planning to sign for 7 years, who is he blocking, and how is that preventing a young core from growing together, or sacrificing the future?

I mean I mostly agree with your basic beats on this, but I fail to see the evidence supporting your certitude.

Related, but more pointed, when has Adams ever specifically talked about his forwards?

[Pimlach]

11 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

How? Cozens, Mitts, Krebs, Girgensons, Thompson and Asplund all have experience at center. R2 also has experience at center.  This is a very flexible roster.  Nearly all the wingers play both sides and most of the centers have experience on the wing and vice versa. 

Centers, or lack there off, are certainly an issue in Rochester and the prospect pipeline, but not in Buffalo.  

Let’s see. I have experience at center too.   Having experience at center, and being a center are not the same.  If both Mitts and Cozens take a step I will stop worrying about center, instead I’ll worry about the wingers.  

[Doohicksie]

4 hours ago, freester said:

MAF won’t turn down 2 years 22 million 

TPegs won't authorize it either.  It'd be fun though.

[Pimlach]

18 hours ago, JohnC said:

I have heard on at least a half dozen occasions the GM comment on his overall philosophy in rebuilding the roster. He has repeatedly stated/declared that he is not going to take shortcuts at the expense of letting the process run its course i.e. mostly draft and develop approach. Although he certainly would like to make the playoffs next year he is not going to give up a young asset for a short term boost. That's why the discussion on Dubois is a fantasy discussion has little basis in reality as far as Buffalo being involved in a deal for him. 

I agree with you that we shouldn't expect Quinn and JJP as rookies to be instant successes. I don't believe that the GM or the coach have that lofty expectation either player. There is an expected uneven course of development that all young players go through, and they won't be exceptions. The road in development  for Tage, Mitts and Cozens has had its bumps. And there is still more road for them to cover before becoming established players in this league. Quinn and JJ will have to go through the same trials and tribulations just like every young player has to go through. 

There is a unanimity on this forum about the necessity of adding a goalie to this roster. Even here I don't see the GM expending much in resources to address that position. It just seems to me that this GM is taking a big picture view as opposed to a term more expedient short-term approach.  

I hope you are wrong on all the bolded, and almost everything else you say.  

He can still draft and develop AND acquire proven NHL players.  He has to meet Cap Floor.

Sounds like your GM has settled for 10th place in the conference.  The big picture is to make the playoffs and give yourself a chance. 
 

The wait until next year has to stop. 

Edited June 1, 2022 by Pimlach

[Broken Ankles]

On 5/29/2022 at 6:05 AM, Taro T said:

Term is a bit long, but he would fit the bill.  As long as they wouldn't have to give him a full NMC, it could work.

After tonight’s performance maybe the comments about his poor +/-, and regression over the last few years is warranted.  Really poor play by Manson.  Mental mistakes too.  

[Sabres Fan in NS]

7 hours ago, Doohickie said:

TPegs won't authorize it either.  It'd be fun though.

What ??

[JohnC]

8 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I hope you are wrong on all the bolded, and almost everything else you say.  

He can still draft and develop AND acquire proven NHL players.  He has to meet Cap Floor.

Sounds like your GM has settled for 10th place in the conference.  The big picture is to make the playoffs and give yourself a chance. 
 

The wait until year has to stop. 

Most often it is better to observe what is being done than what is being said. With what the GM has done in his short tenure is implement what he has stated. He has without question followed the script that he has publicly announced.  In order to get a high-profile player that fits the makeup of a player he would want he would have to give up some of his young assets, such as Krebs, Cozens and Mitts. I just don't see that happening. I also don't see the GM making a big splash with an expensive acquisition from the free agent market. That's not how this organization under him operates. 

I do see the GM bringing in a goalie or two. But my sense is that if he does it won't be high profile additions. The one area where I do believe that it is conceivable that he might be aggressive is in his pursuit of another defenseman who can contribute right away. 

I'm not as pessimistic as you seem to be if the GM continues to follow his roadmap. The reliance on the "draft and develop" strategy is working! The young core is steadily getting bigger to the point that a critical mass of players is already on the roster to have a competitive team. The critical issue that you point to is how long is it going to take to wear that talent grows together to become a contending team? I can't say for sure. What I can say is if players such as Cozens and Mitts take the next developmental step next year the roster will be very competitive. 

 

[JohnC]

9 hours ago, dudacek said:

What has Adams repeatedly said that has convinced you he is not going to add a forward?

Is it the “blocking”, the caring about the future as much as the present, and the giving his young players room to grow together?

Because if he doesn’t think of, say, Casey and Victor as “his” young players and trades them for, say, a 24-year centre he is planning to sign for 7 years, who is he blocking, and how is that preventing a young core from growing together, or sacrificing the future?

I mean I mostly agree with your basic beats on this, but I fail to see the evidence supporting your certitude.

Related, but more pointed, when has Adams ever specifically talked about his forwards?

We are discussing what we believe the GM would do this offseason to address the roster. Certitude has nothing to do with presenting opinions. We are all giving opinions. What I believe is going to happen is based on what the GM has expressively said, and then done. I strongly believe (not to the point of certitude) that this GM is not going to trade any of his young assets such as Cozens, Mitts, Krebs, Quinn and JJ to bring in a more ready forward, such as Dubois,  who would require an expensive and long-term contract. 

This GM believes in an organic process where you build from within. And that is exactly what he is mostly doing. The Jack trade helped to accelerate that process by adding two players, and hopefully a future player with the first round pick. Maybe when this roster is more fully developed there will be a major trade to bolster the roster. But at this stage (this offseason) I don't see any big time players who will cost the system significant assets being brought in.  

[JohnC]

9 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Disagree with the bolded.  Krebs is already a Sabre.  The other two are rookies.  I’m not counting on rookies.  Sure they will make the team and play a lot because they can beat out JAGs.  
 

We need to be stronger at center.  Eakin should be gone, he was not very good.  We need to get better up the middle.  Thompson is fine.  Mitts might make a jump.  Cozen might make a jump.  Girgs is more of. winger.  I also think we need more muscle on wing.  Look at the playoff teams. 
 

I like this team.  But I know we need more.   

We do need more in order to become a contending team. What the organization is counting on is internal improvement from the younger players. Sometimes the slower and steadier process ends up being the quickest road to success. I know you will want to kick me in the nuts for saying this but patience is the right course of action to take for this franchise that has stumbled so much. The process is working. Trust it.