Sabres Officially Select #9, #16, and #28

[SwampD]

11 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

You should.  Samuelsson was drafted 32nd., Asplund 33rd, and JJP 34.  Jokiharhu went 29th to the Hawks, and St Louis grabbed Thompson at 26.  That's 5 important pieces of next year's roster drafted 26-34.  I'd say the Fla pick is important, maybe not for next year, but soon there after with a little luck.

Wait. I thought we had to lose on purpose to get the highest picks we could because it was the only way out from ninth place year after year?!

I love how the goalposts are always in motion.

 

I'm so tired of being sold the future. It's been decades. Call me when we are actually good in the present.

[woods-racer]

3 minutes ago, SwampD said:

Wait. I thought we had to lose on purpose to get the highest picks we could because it was the only way out from ninth place year after year?!

I love how the goalposts are always in motion.

 

I'm so tired of being sold the future. It's been decades. Call me when we are actually good in the present.

What's your number?

I plan on calling you in late October. 

[SwampD]

Just now, woods-racer said:

What's your number?

I plan on calling you in late October. 

It's November and December that I'm worried about.😀

[GASabresIUFAN]

35 minutes ago, SwampD said:

Wait. I thought we had to lose on purpose to get the highest picks we could because it was the only way out from ninth place year after year?!

I love how the goalposts are always in motion.

 

I'm so tired of being sold the future. It's been decades. Call me when we are actually good in the present.

While I understand and empathize with your feelings, don't you feel as though we have turned the corner (except in goal)? 

I agree that continuing to sell the future has worn thin, very thin, but getting Fla's pick is hopefully about sustaining a run of good play.  When I look back at the Briere/Drury teams, it's clear that DR failed to maintain the pipeline behind them, and when they left town, there wasn't enough in the pipeline to sustain the team.  

My hope now is that the Sabres have turned the corner and are ready to contend for the playoff.  These picks 2021 and now 2022, hopefully will develop well thereby allowing the team to remain good and cap compliant.  

[steveoath]

That Noah Warren profile makes him someone I would be taking a serious look at! Thanks @PerreaultForever

[SwampD]

3 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

While I understand and empathize with your feelings, don't you feel as though we have turned the corner (except in goal)? 

I agree that continuing to sell the future has worn thin, very thin, but getting Fla's pick is hopefully about sustaining a run of good play.  When I look back at the Briere/Drury teams, it's clear that DR failed to maintain the pipeline behind them, and when they left town, there wasn't enough in the pipeline to sustain the team.  

My hope now is that the Sabres have turned the corner and are ready to contend for the playoff.  These picks 2021 and now 2022, hopefully will develop well thereby allowing the team to remain good and cap compliant.  

I feel nothing. The Sabres have made me numb.

I found it comical that people were scoreboard watching and trying to sell the importance of pick 16 over pick 21, as if the difference is all that much. And the difference between pick 28 and 32 is even less (comically). All on the heels of being sold the Tank. Well, which is it?

It's too much to take sometimes. Until they are actually good, in the regular season, when it actually counts, I choose to reserve judgement and feel nothing.

[PerreaultForever]

10 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

strikes me as a pick 41 guy based on the projections and rankings

I know some people will say that, and I am moving him up a little but my thinking is with the 3 first round picks, assuming we take forwards with the first two, I'm securing need at that 3rd pick. I personally think he will go late first or very early second and thus we'd miss out on him.

[JohnC]

21 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

While I understand and empathize with your feelings, don't you feel as though we have turned the corner (except in goal)? 

I agree that continuing to sell the future has worn thin, very thin, but getting Fla's pick is hopefully about sustaining a run of good play.  When I look back at the Briere/Drury teams, it's clear that DR failed to maintain the pipeline behind them, and when they left town, there wasn't enough in the pipeline to sustain the team.  

My hope now is that the Sabres have turned the corner and are ready to contend for the playoff.  These picks 2021 and now 2022, hopefully will develop well thereby allowing the team to remain good and cap compliant.  

I agree with@SwampD and @Thorny that the future is now. This isn't a mutually exclusive issue. By being a little more flexible the organization can still be on the path of long-term success and also on the same path of being a serious team sooner rather than later. The Sabres can unquestionably accelerate the rebuild and still stay on the more strategic longer path of restocking the pipeline. 

If there isn't a greater sense of urgency coming out of this franchise and ownership when on most game- nights the building was 2/3 empty and eerily quiet, then when are you going to get it?! This franchise has a stock of extra high draft picks and a capacious amount of cap space. How about using some of that abundance to bring in an outside talent or two in order to win now and create a better environment for the young players who are the foundation for the present and future? Sustaining mediocrity doesn't have much appeal to the customers. If you don't believe then count all the empty seats in the building. Enough is enough!

[Taro T]

47 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

While I understand and empathize with your feelings, don't you feel as though we have turned the corner (except in goal)? 

I agree that continuing to sell the future has worn thin, very thin, but getting Fla's pick is hopefully about sustaining a run of good play.  When I look back at the Briere/Drury teams, it's clear that DR failed to maintain the pipeline behind them, and when they left town, there wasn't enough in the pipeline to sustain the team.  

My hope now is that the Sabres have turned the corner and are ready to contend for the playoff.  These picks 2021 and now 2022, hopefully will develop well thereby allowing the team to remain good and cap compliant.  

Is it?  On a certain level removing context it is, but what team has had a pipeline strong enough to allow their 3 top C's to walk at once?

Was there ANY GM that had built up such a deep organization to be able to come through that sort of a debacle unscathed in a newly salary capped world?  They finished 10th in the Conference the 2 years after watching their THREE top C's walk in FA, but then won the division the next year only to fail in the playoffs after Boychuk intentionally took out Vanek's knee and then the next season were in 1st in the division the day Lucic showed the world the team had no heart.  By the end of that season, the Pegula era had begun and their most recent trip to the playoffs was completing.

 And to follow on to the Q's from the 1st paragraph, does it say anything at all about the pipeline to see the team back at the top of its division a mere 3 years later? Realizing that's a far cry from challenging for the best record in the league which is where they were prior to losing their top 3 C's, but still that's fairly impressive in its own right IMHO.

Video scouting definitely hurt.  But the pipeline didn't force the decision to tank and that decision didn't lead to swapping the picks & prospects obtained at the price of the tank for players that were obtained on overpay nor the subsequent selling of those players for pennies on the $ which got us to where we were when Adams took over.

[woods-racer]

44 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Is it?  On a certain level removing context it is, but what team has had a pipeline strong enough to allow their 3 top C's to walk at once?

Was there ANY GM that had built up such a deep organization to be able to come through that sort of a debacle unscathed in a newly salary capped world?  They finished 10th in the Conference the 2 years after watching their THREE top C's walk in FA, but then won the division the next year only to fail in the playoffs after Boychuk intentionally took out Vanek's knee and then the next season were in 1st in the division the day Lucic showed the world the team had no heart.  By the end of that season, the Pegula era had begun and their most recent trip to the playoffs was completing.

 And to follow on to the Q's from the 1st paragraph, does it say anything at all about the pipeline to see the team back at the top of its division a mere 3 years later? Realizing that's a far cry from challenging for the best record in the league which is where they were prior to losing their top 3 C's, but still that's fairly impressive in its own right IMHO.

Video scouting definitely hurt.  But the pipeline didn't force the decision to tank and that decision didn't lead to swapping the picks & prospects obtained at the price of the tank for players that were obtained on overpay nor the subsequent selling of those players for pennies on the $ which got us to where we were when Adams took over.

The pipeline was bare bones when Pegula bought the team. We thought we had prospects but they were busts. From 2009 thru 2013 Rochester should have been filled with prospects ready to go when we drafted Sam and Jack the next 2 seasons. The Sabres had next to nothing. Tanking was bad. Not having a good draft in over 5 years before that made it worse (some think you can't do worse than tanking, but the Sabres proved them wrong) . 

I won't argue losing your three best centers in one season was going to get fixed by any team quickly, but surely 5-6 years later  (2009 till 14/15) when Jack and Sam arrived we should have a very nice young core for them to meld into. We had so little.

 

Edited May 24, 2022 by woods-racer

[Curt]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I agree with@SwampD and @Thorny that the future is now. This isn't a mutually exclusive issue. By being a little more flexible the organization can still be on the path of long-term success and also on the same path of being a serious team sooner rather than later. The Sabres can unquestionably accelerate the rebuild and still stay on the more strategic longer path of restocking the pipeline. 

If there isn't a greater sense of urgency coming out of this franchise and ownership when on most game- nights the building was 2/3 empty and eerily quiet, then when are you going to get it?! This franchise has a stock of extra high draft picks and a capacious amount of cap space. How about using some of that abundance to bring in an outside talent or two in order to win now and create a better environment for the young players who are the foundation for the present and future? Sustaining mediocrity doesn't have much appeal to the customers. If you don't believe then count all the empty seats in the building. Enough is enough!

My answer would be, when the young core is ready to compete.  Not that I’m fully against making a trade to acquire an under 25 key NHL player.  Depends on the deal.

50 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Is it?  On a certain level removing context it is, but what team has had a pipeline strong enough to allow their 3 top C's to walk at once?

Was there ANY GM that had built up such a deep organization to be able to come through that sort of a debacle unscathed in a newly salary capped world?  They finished 10th in the Conference the 2 years after watching their THREE top C's walk in FA, but then won the division the next year only to fail in the playoffs after Boychuk intentionally took out Vanek's knee and then the next season were in 1st in the division the day Lucic showed the world the team had no heart.  By the end of that season, the Pegula era had begun and their most recent trip to the playoffs was completing.

 And to follow on to the Q's from the 1st paragraph, does it say anything at all about the pipeline to see the team back at the top of its division a mere 3 years later? Realizing that's a far cry from challenging for the best record in the league which is where they were prior to losing their top 3 C's, but still that's fairly impressive in its own right IMHO.

Video scouting definitely hurt.  But the pipeline didn't force the decision to tank and that decision didn't lead to swapping the picks & prospects obtained at the price of the tank for players that were obtained on overpay nor the subsequent selling of those players for pennies on the $ which got us to where we were when Adams took over.

No GM could have come away from Briere & Drury walking unscathed, but the drafting in that period really was terrible.  I don’t think that is debatable.  There really was a big lull in the prospect pipeline.

Edited May 24, 2022 by Curt

[Taro T]

3 minutes ago, woods-racer said:

The pipeline was bare bones when Pegula bought the team. We thought we had prospects but they were busts. From 2009 thru 2013 Rochester should have been filled with prospects ready to go when we drafted Sam and Jack the next 2 seasons. The Sabres had next to nothing. Tanking was bad. Not having a good draft in over 5 years before that made it worse (some think you can't do worse than tanking, but the Sabres proved them wrong) . 

I won't argue losing your three best centers in one season was going to get fixed by any team quickly, but surely 5-6 years later  (2009 till 14/15) when Jack and Sam arrived we should have a very nice young core for them to meld into. We had so little.

 

But, there seems to be a confluence of different issues all getting lumped into a lack of pipeline.  Black Sunday was 7 years prior to the 2nd full-on tank season '14-'15).  The team won its division in the 3rd season post-Black Sunday.  The prospect pool, or lack thereof, wasn't the only issue and, in fact, wasn't enough of an issue to keep the team from being competitive even relatively quickly after Black Sunday.   And that's WITH Regier having to live w/ Video Scouting.  Thanks, Larry.

And, will agree that the biggest thing the Pegulas could've done day 1 was invest a #### ton of money into having the best scouting department anywhere.  But a bigger issue than the prospect pool was the whiplash caused by switching directions every 2 years after new ownership took over.  FA''ll fix it.  No, tanking.  No, accelerated rebuild in the LA model.  No, re-retooling to the Pittsburgh model.  No, FA can work this this time.  No, develop our own.

Well, we're now entering year 3 of the newest direction.  (Or, year 2 if Adams 1st year doesn't get included.)  Hoping they stay the course, as this SHOULD be feasible if they fix the blankety blank goaltending.

[Taro T]

27 minutes ago, Curt said:

My answer would be, when the young core is ready to compete.  Not that I’m fully against making a trade to acquire an under 25 key NHL player.  Depends on the deal.

No GM could have come away from Briere & Drury walking unscathed, but the drafting in that period really was terrible.  I don’t think that is debatable.  There really was a big lull in the prospect pipeline.

No, but what IS VERY debatable is that it was that lack of a pipeline that kept the team unsustainable in the wake of the C's walking.  That pipeline-less team went from losing their 3 top C's and missing the playoffs to division champ within 3 seasons.

It was the wild gyrations that killed the team's chances this past decade.  Not the pipeline, though that didn't help.  MHO.  YMMV.

Edit: and the original comment was in reference to the comment that it was the pipeline that killed the team post- Black Sunday.  The record doesn't seem to bear that out.

Edited May 24, 2022 by Taro T

[Marvin]

16 hours ago, Mustache of God said:

Meh, I don't care what we'll do with pick 32 next year.

 

16 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

I care.

 

14 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

You should.  Samuelsson was drafted 32nd., Asplund 33rd, and JJP 34.  Jokiharhu went 29th to the Hawks, and St Louis grabbed Thompson at 26.  That's 5 important pieces of next year's roster drafted 26-34.  I'd say the Fla pick is important, maybe not for next year, but soon there after with a little luck.

 

13 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Absolutely. Teams rise or fall based on these not obvious selections. Speaking of Samuelsson, while some people will consider this pick too soon, I'd strongly consider Noah Warren with that Florida pick. Big strong RHD. Not offensively skilled, but we already have that so he'd be the compliment and the shut down in 2-3 years. 

(and since we aren't going to get Shane Wright, might as well get a guy who can take him out of the play :))

https://thehockeywriters.com/noah-warren-2022-nhl-draft-prospect-profile/

You all missed the point: @Mustache of God is saying that the Sabres are winning the Cup, so they will have pick 32 of the first round.  If that happens, he won't care.

[Derrico]

3 hours ago, SwampD said:

Wait. I thought we had to lose on purpose to get the highest picks we could because it was the only way out from ninth place year after year?!

I love how the goalposts are always in motion.

 

I'm so tired of being sold the future. It's been decades. Call me when we are actually good in the present.

Maybe I'm naïve but I think we're getting close.  Atleast should be alot more fun moving forward..... 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

#28 is the pick from Florida, eh??

That may be alright.

Might it be a better idea to package it up with somethings to get a decent player at a needed position?

Edited May 24, 2022 by Sabres Fan in NS

[North Buffalo]

31 minutes ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

#28 is the pick from Florida, eh??

That may be alright.

Might it be a better idea to package it up with somethings to get a decent player at a needed position?

Again depends on who... sure in a vacuum... Sabres are getting better and a better pipeline but still work to be done... if its for a young goalie yup Id do it

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, Curt said:

My answer would be, when the young core is ready to compete.  Not that I’m fully against making a trade to acquire an under 25 key NHL player.  Depends on the deal.

 

I'm a little more positive in where this team is at the compete level than you seem to believe. Our young core is already in place with players such as Dahlin, Samuelsson, Power, Joki, Cozens and Mitts. Next year, it is likely that Quinn and Peterka  will be added to that expanding young core. With veterans such as Skinner, Okposo and Tuch this roster is filling up. Is this a playoff roster? I can't say for sure. What I can comfortably say is if the  Sabres can add a Tuch caliber player and a good goalie to this roster this offseason, this team should be able to contend for a lower rung playoff spot up to the end of the season. There is no question that the Sabres have accumulated enough draft assets and cap capacity to accomplish such an attainable upgrade this offseason without jeopardizing the long-term plan to restock the system. A half generation of mediocrity and irrelevance is enough. The fans deserve a greater display of urgency from this too flaccid franchise.  It's time. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by JohnC

[steveoath]

1 hour ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

#28 is the pick from Florida, eh??

That may be alright.

Might it be a better idea to package it up with somethings to get a decent player at a needed position?

Tbh I'd like to see us keep it and use it to take a gamble on a boom or bust type of guy. Personal preference would be Miroshnichenko. Give him all the time he needs to recover and you could have a really good player on your hands. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by steveoath

[Sabres Fan in NS]

1 minute ago, steveoath said:

Tbh I'd like to see us keep it and use it to take a gamble on a boom or bust type of guy. Personal preference would be Miroshnichenko. Give him all the time he needs to recover and you could have a really good player on your hands. 

I tend to agree.  The Sabres are not in the position with the roster still in rebuild mode to make an aquisition that would make much difference.

I hate that the Sabres are still terrible, but I do see signs of life at the end of the tunnel.  Or is that light?

[Curt]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I'm a little more positive in where this team is at the compete level than you seem to believe. Our young core is already in place with players such as Dahlin, Samuelsson, Power, Joki, Cozens and Mitts. Next year, it is likely that Quinn and Peterka  will be added to that expanding young core. With veterans such as Skinner, Okposo and Tuch this roster is filling up. Is this a playoff roster? I can't say for sure. What I can comfortably say is if the  Sabres can add a Tuch caliber player and a good goalie to this roster this offseason, this team should be able to contend for a lower rung playoff spot up to the end of the season. There is no question that the Sabres have accumulated enough draft assets and cap capacity to accomplish such an attainable upgrade this offseason without jeopardizing the long-term plan to restock the system. A half generation of mediocrity and irrelevance is enough. The fans deserve a greater display of urgency from this too flaccid franchise.  It's time. 

I’m not down on this group at all, but we don’t even really know what we have yet.  Of the 8 players you listed as the young core, 6 of them have only played a handful of NHL games and/or have not proven themselves to be top-6 or top-4 players.  I’m pretty confident that some of them will be, but it’s a very unproven group.

In my mind, you should make those consolidation trades and/or sign that big FA when you know what holes you have to fill and are ready to make a push of sorts.  I don’t think we really know yet.

Although, like everyone else, I do think we know we need a goalie.

The bolded simply doesn’t resonate with me and I feel that’s a potentially damaging mindset.  I’m not against getting better, but it needs to be done with the timeline of this young core in mind.  I’m not very willing to burn any assets for short term gain that could compromise the long term.  This team will really be good when the young core of Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Thompson, Cozens, Mitts, Krebs, Quinn, Peterka are pretty much all near their peaks.  I’m not willing to mortgage 2025-30 in exchange for 2023.

Like I said in my previous post.  It depends on the specific deal.

[PromoTheRobot]

6 hours ago, SwampD said:

Wait. I thought we had to lose on purpose to get the highest picks we could because it was the only way out from ninth place year after year?!

I love how the goalposts are always in motion.

 

I'm so tired of being sold the future. It's been decades. Call me when we are actually good in the present.

So after the 2nd Stanley Cup?

[PerreaultForever]

3 hours ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

 

 

 

You all missed the point: @Mustache of God is saying that the Sabres are winning the Cup, so they will have pick 32 of the first round.  If that happens, he won't care.

Oh no I got that right away. Cute, but kind of not worth commenting on either. 

[PerreaultForever]

3 hours ago, Derrico said:

Maybe I'm naïve but I think we're getting close.  Atleast should be alot more fun moving forward..... 

Not naive, but optimistic. I share that optimism, but a lot of things still have to go right. there are still some big holes and question marks and it won't take much for a bunch of things to go wrong at once and then all the usual crap will fall back in and it could topple like a house of cards. I do NOT think that will happen this time, but right now I wouldn't bet heavily on next year being the year either. It's a maybe. 

[French Collection]

4 hours ago, steveoath said:

Tbh I'd like to see us keep it and use it to take a gamble on a boom or bust type of guy. Personal preference would be Miroshnichenko. Give him all the time he needs to recover and you could have a really good player on your hands. 

Another guy that I see as boom/bust is Sam Rinzel.

Seems to have a lot of tools but hasn’t really been challenged playing High School hockey. Could be the RHD of the future for them.