Keybank Arena: What's Wrong With It?

[Carmel Corn]

Sorry if there is already a thread on this.  In the presser today, a reporter asked GMKA about the condition of Keybank arena.  The question contended the arena has problems.  For those of us who don't live local (anymore) or get to any games in person, what are the main complaints you have with Keybank?  In the presser I heard broken chairs, but I'd appreciate hearing what anyone on this board feels is sub-standard in relation to the rest league venues.  I am not referring to the cost of tickets or concessions, but rather anything physically wrong with the facility.

[Taro T]

300 level concourse is ridiculously narrow.  (Thanks, Larry Quinn. <_<)  Also, pretty sure there's only 1 elevator bank.  (Can be a choke point for those needing "additional assistance.")   Those are the only true "structural" issue that would cost real money to fix.

Other issues:

No hot water in many (all?) bathrooms.

A few broken seats throughout.

Many broken cup holders.

Not really issues, but go towards the overall experience:

The sound system leaves much to be desired.  People in the 200's whine that they can't really hear it, and those of us that are directly in front of the speakers get blasted out of our seats.

If you are in the 300's near the HVAC vents, the place is FREEZING.  Not nearly as bad in the lower levels.  This year it wasn't as big of an issue, likely because there were only 1/4  the people that would normally be heating the building up so it wasn't running as intensely.

The WiFi is likely undersized which is probably why the cashless payment systems take a week & 1/2 to process a payment.  (Only a slight exaggeration.) 

The food very often is cold/room temperature when you get it.  When the food is hot, it is actually edible to quite good.  The way much of it is served, it is close to inedible.

Pretty sure there are additional issues, but that's a fair sampling in a nutshell.

Edited May 3, 2022 by Taro T

[JohnC]

18 minutes ago, Taro T said:

300 level concourse is ridiculously narrow.  (Thanks, Larry Quinn. <_<)  Also, pretty sure there's only 1 elevator bank.  (Can be a choke point for those needing "additional assistance.")   Those are the only true "structural" issue that would cost real money to fix.

Other issues:

No hot water in many (all?) bathrooms.

A few broken seats throughout.

Many broken cup holders.

Not really issues, but go towards the overall experience:

The sound system leaves much to be desired.  People in the 200's whine that they can't really hear it, and those of us that are directly in front of the speakers get blasted out of our seats.

If you are in the 300's near the HVAC vents, the place is FREEZING.  Not nearly as bad in the lower levels.  This year it wasn't as big of an issue, likely because there were only 1/4  the people that would normally be heating the building up so it wasn't running as intensely.

The WiFi is likely undersized which is probably why the cashless payment systems take a week & 1/2 to process a payment.  (Only a slight exaggeration.) 

The food very often is cold/room temperature when you get it.  When the food is hot, it is actually edible to quite good.  The way much of it is served, it is close to inedible.

Pretty sure there are additional issues, but that's a fair sampling in a nutshell.

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't the Pegulas have control of the facility? What you describe is disgraceful. This level of deterioration happens when there isn't the day to day and year to year maintenance done on a facility, any facility. That's what is required for any building or facility, big or small. This building may require a major renovation project to get it up to a high standard. But that's not what I'm discussing here. It seems as if there is an inattentiveness and penny-pinching that has allowed this building to deteriorate to a second-rate level. This is appalling and shouldn't be tolerated. 

[JoeSchmoe]

The team has lost a 💩-LOAD of money over the last few years with COVID and the half full rink this year. Regardless of the reasons why the rink was half full this year, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt until fans come back and they get a little closer to breaking even. Not that I made it to a game this year... It's just that nothing on that list would bother me in the least.

Edited May 4, 2022 by JoeSchmoe

[LGR4GM]

36 minutes ago, Taro T said:

300 level concourse is ridiculously narrow.  (Thanks, Larry Quinn. <_<)  Also, pretty sure there's only 1 elevator bank.  (Can be a choke point for those needing "additional assistance.")   Those are the only true "structural" issue that would cost real money to fix.

Other issues:

No hot water in many (all?) bathrooms.

A few broken seats throughout.

Many broken cup holders.

Not really issues, but go towards the overall experience:

The sound system leaves much to be desired.  People in the 200's whine that they can't really hear it, and those of us that are directly in front of the speakers get blasted out of our seats.

If you are in the 300's near the HVAC vents, the place is FREEZING.  Not nearly as bad in the lower levels.  This year it wasn't as big of an issue, likely because there were only 1/4  the people that would normally be heating the building up so it wasn't running as intensely.

The WiFi is likely undersized which is probably why the cashless payment systems take a week & 1/2 to process a payment.  (Only a slight exaggeration.) 

The food very often is cold/room temperature when you get it.  When the food is hot, it is actually edible to quite good.  The way much of it is served, it is close to inedible.

Pretty sure there are additional issues, but that's a fair sampling in a nutshell.

I'd add the paint scheme is out of date and not team colors. 

The 300 level barely has beer vendors or any vendors. It's like a dirty hallway with a cart. 

[Taro T]

49 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't the Pegulas have control of the facility? What you describe is disgraceful. This level of deterioration happens when there isn't the day to day and year to year maintenance done on a facility, any facility. That's what is required for any building or facility, big or small. This building may require a major renovation project to get it up to a high standard. But that's not what I'm discussing here. It seems as if there is an inattentiveness and penny-pinching that has allowed this building to deteriorate to a second-rate level. This is appalling and shouldn't be tolerated. 

Knew who was responsible for what back when Golisano bought the team, but not sure who's responsible for what now.  99% sure the concessions are still run by Delaware North.  But don't know which of the rest of the upkeep / facilities / security falls to the Pegulas &/or the county & the city.

[Taro T]

55 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I'd add the paint scheme is out of date and not team colors. 

The 300 level barely has beer vendors or any vendors. It's like a dirty hallway with a cart. 

The building could use a new coat of paint.  Agreed.

But the bowl is now blue & gold instead of Jennifer Smith's weird plum & lavender walls (or whatever the muted purples & pinks that were there are called) behind the blue seats.

And, over near where the right escalator takes people up to the 300s there is a pretty big stand w/ a bunch of different craft beers and there are a bunch of beer kiosks all around up there for the more standard Blue & Coors Light & all sorts of seltzer.  Beer is one of the few things that can be readily found up there.  No idea where to go in the 300's to find wine or mixed drinks if they're even available up there.

There's 3 main food stand areas each with 4 or so concession stands in the 300's - 1 at each of the tops of the escalators & a 3rd over by the red line on the camera side.  Pretty sure there's a couple other full concession stands & then the cart vendors.  They SHOULD be able to keep up w/ demand, but this year lines were long all season.  Not sure why that was.

Edited May 4, 2022 by Taro T

[JohnC]

53 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Knew who was responsible for what back when Golisano bought the team, but not sure who's responsible for what now.  99% sure the concessions are still run by Delaware North.  But don't know which of the rest of the upkeep / facilities / security falls to the Pegulas &/or the county & the city.

According to this column "the Key Bank Center is owned by Erie County which says any internal improvements to the arena complex must come from Sabres' owner Pegula Sports and Entertainment (PSE). " This statement doesn't make it clear if there is a distinction between capital improvements or less structural type of internal improvements. 

https://www.wgrz.com/article/news/local/glowing-reviews-for-buffalos-big-weekend-but-what-about-keybank-center/71-6bd39a73-1723-46f9-b5e3-fce99ca30a06

[mjd1001]

yes this has been brought up a few times, but I do like this discussion because it is an issue. 

I haven't been to the Arena for a couple years, but some things I noticed when I was there last:

-ripped seats, broken cup holders, pitted concrete under the seats, bathrooms with no hot water, bathrooms with several stalls 'out of order, creaky and dirty seats, uninspired (to say the least) concessions.

That is what I saw in 2 hours when I was last there a few years ago.

I have been to many other Arenas because I travel a lot for work and like to take in some out of town games.  I have personally been to some that were built the same time as ours (Boston, Philly, Toronto) and all of them have been remodeled/upgraded and are in much better condition than Buffalo.  Somewhat newer ones like Columbus are A LOT nicer, and really new ones (Detroit) blow the KBC right out of the water.

And here is the final point to consider.  Should it just be about the product on the ice? In theory that sounds great, and that may have been true 20 years ago. But, if I am only concerned about the actual game, I am likely to be able to have a lot better experience at home.  High Def TV, numerous camera angles, replays on tv, advanced states on a laptop or tablet as I watch the game...etc.  As a pure fan of hockey, other than being able to 'see the play develop' outside of the camera...I can get more of 'the game' at home than in the Arena.    SOOOOOO...if you WANT me at the Arena, you better give me reason to come.  Give me an experience. Give me entertainment. Give me fun things to do while I'm there. 

I really think things have swapped from the way it was in the past.  A 'true' fan who wanted to see 'just the game' was best served at a small Arena sitting close to the action like the Aud, rather than watching it low-definition on a 19" TV with few replays and no internet (decades ago).  Today it is just the opposite. You want to take in the game and just the game many of us are better at home. To get us to the arena, give us something nice and a reason to go.  The best reason to go is winning, but is it so hard to repair/replace seats that are broken, torn, and just plain disgustingly dirty?

Edited May 4, 2022 by mjd1001

[JoeSchmoe]

2 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

yes this has been brought up a few times, but I do like this discussion because it is an issue. 

I haven't been to the Arena for a couple years, but some things I noticed when I was there last:

-ripped seats, broken cup holders, pitted concrete under the seats, bathrooms with no hot water, bathrooms with several stalls 'out of order, creaky and dirty seats, uninspired (to say the least) concessions.

That is what I saw in 2 hours when I was last there a few years ago.

I have been to many other Arenas because I travel a lot for work and like to take in some out of town games.  I have personally been to some that were built the same time as ours (Boston, Philly, Toronto) and all of them have been remodeled/upgraded and are in much better condition than Buffalo.  Somewhat newer ones like Columbus are A LOT nicer, and really new ones (Detroit) blow the KBC right out of the water.

And here is the final point to consider.  Should it just be about the product on the ice? In theory that sounds great, and that may have been true 20 years ago. But, if I am only concerned about the actual game, I am likely to be able to have a lot better experience at home.  High Def TV, numerous camera angles, replays on tv, advanced states on a laptop or tablet as I watch the game...etc.  As a pure fan of hockey, other than being able to 'see the play develop' outside of the camera...I can get more of 'the game' at home than in the Arena.    SOOOOOO...if you WANT me at the Arena, you better give me reason to come.  Give me an experience. Give me entertainment. Give me fun things to do while I'm there. 

I really think things have swapped from the way it was in the past.  A 'true' fan who wanted to see 'just the game' was best served at a small Arena sitting close to the action like the Aud, rather than watching it low-definition on a 19" TV with few replays and no internet (decades ago).  Today it is just the opposite. You want to take in the game and just the game many of us are better at home. To get us to the arena, give us something nice and a reason to go.

Just give me a good game to watch and I'm happy. It will always beat any tv and sound system money can buy.

I'm also the guy though who will happily stay at any no-frills hotel and be happy as long as it's clean and the bed is comfortable. Just as long as I'm going someplace cool, the hotel is just a place where I sleep at the end of the day.

[Eleven]

3 hours ago, Carmel Corn said:

Sorry if there is already a thread on this.  In the presser today, a reporter asked GMKA about the condition of Keybank arena.  The question contended the arena has problems.  For those of us who don't live local (anymore) or get to any games in person, what are the main complaints you have with Keybank?  In the presser I heard broken chairs, but I'd appreciate hearing what anyone on this board feels is sub-standard in relation to the rest league venues.  I am not referring to the cost of tickets or concessions, but rather anything physically wrong with the facility.

There is.  It is two weeks old, and it is here:  

 

 

Now we can all read the same arguments from people who haven't been in a modern sports/concert facility other than the Arena since about 1997, again.

Edited May 4, 2022 by Eleven

[Pimlach]

The unfixable thing is the sight lines and distance from seats to the ice.  It’s not intimate.  Poor design.  Make it steeper and it will be more intimate and louder.  
 

The fixable things are the run down condition, and generally poor services and conveniences.  
 

Over all its not a very good venue. 

Edited May 4, 2022 by Pimlach

[Stoner]

3 hours ago, JoeSchmoe said:

The team has lost an 💩-LOAD of money over the last few years with COVID and the half full rink this year. Regardless of the reasons why the rink was half full this year, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt until fans come back and they get a little closer to breaking even. Not that I made it to a game this year... It's just that nothing on that list would bother me in the least.

Nothing on that list bothered me.

[Doohicksie]

I've never been to a game there.  In fact I haven't been to a Sabres home game since the 1970s.  I've seen the Sabres several times in Dallas.

5 hours ago, Taro T said:

The WiFi is likely undersized which is probably why the cashless payment systems take a week & 1/2 to process a payment.  (Only a slight exaggeration.) 

This is a common problem in many sports venues.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

Nothing on that list bothered me.

I still go to games there.  Just answering the question.  The facility is mediocre at best.  

[Zamboni]

What’s wrong with the arena?

What changes would be nice to see?

What about the physical arena building actually prevents fans from enjoying their experience?

 

Sometimes the answers to those questions could overlap… But I think the majority of the time if one’s being honest, it’s different answers to those questions.

 

I’ve been a STH since 2004. So I’ve gone to a lot of games there. Not so many since the end of the 2020 season.

And I understand everybody is different about what they prefer or want or like to complain about. For me, The lack of two escalators on both sides of the arena from the concourse going up to the 300 level has always been and continues to be a gross oversight and the number one pet peeve for me. At least two more elevators would be the second pet peeve of mine. Other issues that I notice doesn’t rise to the level of bitching and complaining and thinking about really needing some major overhaul‘s. It’s more like a mild annoyance. 
 

As far as broken seats… I can only speak to my own experience… Two people in my row had broken seats. One game. they told the usher in our section about them … The usher moved the fans to a different pair of seats for that game. The next time I saw those people at the next home game about a week later … Those seats were fixed.
The cupholders being broken… For me it’s a mild annoyance… But doesn’t rise to the level of bitching and complaining and thinking the arena is in major disrepair or some other dramatic statement. I see people holding onto their drink or putting it down by their feet. And they don’t seem to mind it in the least. Because it just isn’t that gigantic of a problem for 99% of people. 
 

Those are my experiences throughout the years. And like I said… Everybody’s different.

[Xzy89c]

Pegulas want to sell team.  They have lost in the neighborhood of 300 million since purchase.  They have cut spending on everything Sabres related.  Scouts, players, Staff, building etc...

If Marine Midland Center is going to get major upgrades it will be taxpayers paying for it. If I was owner in NY state I would make state pay for it too.  Thanks to the union suck up laws in NY it will cost twice as much as it should.  Just like new football stadium.

[SwampD]

What's Marine Midland Center?

[dudacek]

9 minutes ago, SwampD said:

What's Marine Midland Center?

I understand it’s at the Crossroads.

[SwampD]

2 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I understand it’s at the Crossroads.

Thar be monsters!

 

[LabattBlue]

Anyone remember when early plans were to build the arena in the area of where the Kensington Expressway  ends?

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, Xzy89c said:

Pegulas want to sell team.  They have lost in the neighborhood of 300 million since purchase.  They have cut spending on everything Sabres related.  Scouts, players, Staff, building etc...

If Marine Midland Center is going to get major upgrades it will be taxpayers paying for it. If I was owner in NY state I would make state pay for it too.  Thanks to the union suck up laws in NY it will cost twice as much as it should.  Just like new football stadium.

Enjoy your right to work state and thanks for calling. 

Can we get a thumbs down option? I just really want to thumbs dumb something so shockingly nonsense

[PromoTheRobot]

Mike Harrington is envious of other arena's Jumbotrons. They are much larger.

[Stoner]

1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Mike Harrington is envious of other arena's Jumbotrons. They are much larger.

I'd have the Sabres logo up there during play and 10 seconds before every faceoff. Make the people look at the ice.

[PromoTheRobot]

12 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

I'd have the Sabres logo up there during play and 10 seconds before every faceoff. Make the people look at the ice.

That's a game ops thing.