Did not realize the Sabres were 31st in attendance...pathetic

[Doohicksie]

31 minutes ago, JohnC said:

What is a ZFG attitude? If I am afflicted with  a ZFG attitude do I have to seek professional help? Or does that make me a functioning misfit? 

He didn't care about the consequences of his moves.  He thought he could bring in misfit bad boys who could put up good stats and the poor attitude somehow wouldn't rub off on the young prospects.

Edited April 25, 2022 by Doohickie
You know it stands for Zero F@*&s Given, right?

[Marvin]

22 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Now. But for how long did people discount his abilities because they were so invested in his draft narrative?

Outside of Buffalo, there still are a lot of people still invested in their pre-draft evaluations.  Make no mistake -- there are a lot of pseudo-draftniks who think JA17 is a phony as a (1 + sqrt(5))/2 dollar bill.

Aside from the Canadian fans, I think we have seen too many good starts ruined when the calendar turns.  For STH to really increase this time, this team needs to be in the playoff hunt until near the end.

That requires 30 more points.  Meanwhile, clearly ahead of Buffalo as of now are the 8 qualifiers plus the Islanders and Columbus. Even if we assume that most pundits and fans are wrong that Detroit, New Jersey, and Ottawa are all at least a year ahead of us, we still need at least 1 top team to fall back towards us while we leap over the other 2.

[Doohicksie]

8 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

That requires 30 more points.  Meanwhile, clearly ahead of Buffalo as of now are the 8 qualifiers plus the Islanders and Columbus. Even if we assume that most pundits and fans are wrong that Detroit, New Jersey, and Ottawa are all at least a year ahead of us, we still need at least 1 top team to fall back towards us while we leap over the other 2.

There is a whole generation of stars about to wink out.  Ovi, Bäckström, Crosby, Bergeron, Marchand, are all getting long in the tooth.  I think in the next year or two, the Caps, Pens and Bruins are going to fall off the table- they will either not even make the playoffs or struggle to make a wildcard spot.  Islanders and Bluejackets are bubble teams.

I think you're going to see the Sabres pass most of these teams next year, and Detroit, NJ and Ottawa will be chasing us.  It's time for a changing of the guard and the Sabres will be at the forefront.

[LGR4GM]

8 hours ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

Outside of Buffalo, there still are a lot of people still invested in their pre-draft evaluations.  Make no mistake -- there are a lot of pseudo-draftniks who think JA17 is a phony as a (1 + sqrt(5))/2 dollar bill.

Aside from the Canadian fans, I think we have seen too many good starts ruined when the calendar turns.  For STH to really increase this time, this team needs to be in the playoff hunt until near the end.

That requires 30 more points.  Meanwhile, clearly ahead of Buffalo as of now are the 8 qualifiers plus the Islanders and Columbus. Even if we assume that most pundits and fans are wrong that Detroit, New Jersey, and Ottawa are all at least a year ahead of us, we still need at least 1 top team to fall back towards us while we leap over the other 2.

We do not need a team to fall back. Loser thinking. We need to overtake them regardless. Stop hoping someone else gets worse and instead hope the Sabres get better and better until they simply are better. 

[Porous Five Hole]

19 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

We do not need a team to fall back. Loser thinking. We need to overtake them regardless. Stop hoping someone else gets worse and instead hope the Sabres get better and better until they simply are better. 

To make the playoffs next year, the Sabres will need a team or two to fall off a cliff.
Being 30 points better next year is a lot…

 

[LGR4GM]

12 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

To make the playoffs next year, the Sabres will need a team or two to fall off a cliff.
Being 30 points better next year is a lot…

 

No they do not. This is such a loser mindset. The Sabres need to get better, not rely on someone else getting worse. 

[Taro T]

27 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

To make the playoffs next year, the Sabres will need a team or two to fall off a cliff.
Being 30 points better next year is a lot…

 

Being 30 points better would be a huge ask.  Fortunately, they'll only need to be 21-25 points better.  So, if they win their last 2 games this year, they'll need to find 3 extra points each month to be on a playoff pace.  Not nothing, but with a real goalie tandem very realistically possible.

[LGR4GM]

5 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Being 30 points better would be a huge ask.  Fortunately, they'll only need to be 21-25 points better.  So, if they win their last 2 games this year, they'll need to find 3 extra points each month to be on a playoff pace.  Not nothing, but with a real goalie tandem very realistically possible.

We have no idea what this team really is because up until February half of it was broken. On top of that we're absurdly young so what growth do we find there. And on top of that goaltending. 

[Taro T]

Just now, LGR4GM said:

We have no idea what this team really is because up until February half of it was broken. On top of that we're absurdly young so what growth do we find there. And on top of that goaltending. 

True.  Plus, the great run could to a degree be due to losing having no appreciable consequences for the team.  Individuals players, maybe, if they aren't learning from mistakes, but for the team there weren't real consequences to losing.

With where the Sabres currently are, a 21 point improvement is very much in the realm of what's possible.  Will it materialize?  No data, that's why they play the games.

[BMWR100RT]

I took my kids to a few games during the drought pre-covid. The product was boring and the atmosphere was dead. It's hard for me to drive in from Rochester and spend three hundred+ with parking and concessions and not have much fun. I've loved hockey but it's been a long time since I saw a game that had any meaning. Somehow this is my/our fault? 

[MBD]

Playing as well as they did in the 2nd half of the season in the first half of next season will get them those 30 points.  

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

No they do not. This is such a loser mindset. The Sabres need to get better, not rely on someone else getting worse. 

If we're getting better we take points from other teams... And they fall back.

Edited April 25, 2022 by PromoTheRobot

[PromoTheRobot]

30 minutes ago, MBD said:

Playing as well as they did in the 2nd half of the season in the first half of next season will get them those 30 points.  

The months of November, December, January and February were a black hole for the Sabres. In that span they were there worst team in the NHL.

But in October, March and April they played at a 108-point pace.

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

We have no idea what this team really is because up until February half of it was broken. On top of that we're absurdly young so what growth do we find there. And on top of that goaltending. 

This is why I can’t wait until October.

No doubt this team is better than it was a year ago. But how much?

Will we see the 75-point team we were this year again, the 85-point team we’ve been in the second-half, or the playoff team we’ve been over the past 6 weeks?

 

[Marvin]

One point which I missed: improvement in almost all of the conference bottom-dwellers will inevitably pull the top teams downward.  For instance, no sweeps by the top 8 over the bottom 8 takes probably 10 points off their totals and adds it to the lesser teams' totals.

[matter2003]

13 hours ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

Outside of Buffalo, there still are a lot of people still invested in their pre-draft evaluations.  Make no mistake -- there are a lot of pseudo-draftniks who think JA17 is a phony as a (1 + sqrt(5))/2 dollar bill.

Aside from the Canadian fans, I think we have seen too many good starts ruined when the calendar turns.  For STH to really increase this time, this team needs to be in the playoff hunt until near the end.

That requires 30 more points.  Meanwhile, clearly ahead of Buffalo as of now are the 8 qualifiers plus the Islanders and Columbus. Even if we assume that most pundits and fans are wrong that Detroit, New Jersey, and Ottawa are all at least a year ahead of us, we still need at least 1 top team to fall back towards us while we leap over the other 2.

Anyone who thinks Josh Allen isn't a superstar at this point should probably be banned from ever working on TV again and most likely must be brain dead.  Dude is a first ballot hall of famer if injuries don't derail his career.

[Zamboni]

3 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

Anyone who thinks Josh Allen isn't a superstar at this point should probably be banned from ever working on TV again and most likely must be brain dead.  Dude is a first ballot hall of famer if injuries don't derail his career.

I am admittedly speaking out of ignorance… So this is a honest question… If Josh Allen takes the bills to the playoffs several times in his career but never make it to the Super Bowl, let alone win the Super Bowl… Is he still considered a Hall of Famer when he retires? Wouldn’t that be kind of debatable? And are other quarterbacks who had that kind of career not in the Hall of Fame?

[matter2003]

12 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

I am admittedly speaking out of ignorance… So this is a honest question… If Josh Allen takes the bills to the playoffs several times in his career but never make it to the Super Bowl, let alone win the Super Bowl… Is he still considered a Hall of Famer when he retires? Wouldn’t that be kind of debatable? And are other quarterbacks who had that kind of career not in the Hall of Fame?

Not really.  Philip Rivers will likely get in and he had less playoff success than Allen has already had.  Allen has the highest all time passer rating in NFL history in the postseason, has had the only perfect offensive game ever in NFL History, playoffs or regular season, against NE in the divisional round and likely had the greatest 2 game stretch by any QB in NFL history against NE and KC with a ridiculous 149 passer rating, 9 TDs, only 14 incompletions and 2 GW drives within the final 2 minutes of the KC game. Additionally, he also has numerous accomplishments already where he is the only player in NFL history to have done it, or is on a list with 2 or 3 all time greats.  

If Rivers gets in having none of those things, which seems likely, Allen getting in would be a mere formality.  There has never been a QB like him in league history.  Elite at both running and passing, with most likely the strongest arm ever(according to Sports Science measurements it wasn't even close---Allen threw the ball so fast they thought their radar gun was broken because nobody had ever come close to throwing a ball with that velocity), and the ability to beat a defense with his mind also.  

The greatest defensive coach in NFL history in Bill Belichick literally has no answers for him and simply told the host of his show that "he is a real problem".  He has not forced the Bills to punt in over 2 games now.  Belichick was so impressed with Allen after the playoff game he came to the Bills locker room to seek him out to talk with him.  Not sure how many players Belichick has ever been that impressed with to do that for but I'm guessing it is a pretty short list.

Edited April 25, 2022 by matter2003

[Taro T]

17 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

I am admittedly speaking out of ignorance… So this is a honest question… If Josh Allen takes the bills to the playoffs several times in his career but never make it to the Super Bowl, let alone win the Super Bowl… Is he still considered a Hall of Famer when he retires? Wouldn’t that be kind of debatable? And are other quarterbacks who had that kind of career not in the Hall of Fame?

If Allen has a long career, IMHO he's close to a lock for the HoF.  He's already got a bunch of records for combining passing & running stats.  Playoff success will make the difference between being a 1st ballot HoFer and a guy that has to wait 3-4 years.

Fouts is in the HoF but never made it to a SB.  Marino is in & only got to 1 SB very early in his career.  Kelly was in on the 1st ballot but never won the big one.

And scoring a TD EVERY SINGLE time in the playoffs will be an impressive bonus card, too.

[Zamboni]

Thanks for the answers @matter2003 and @Taro T …. I thought the bar was set higher for the NFL HOF. That’s not a knock or an intended insult to the HOF. I genuinely thought the bar was set higher. So with those answers you gave… I guess there is a good possibility that Josh Allen gets into the HOF. Incredible.

[inkman]

1 hour ago, Zamboni said:

I am admittedly speaking out of ignorance… So this is a honest question… If Josh Allen takes the bills to the playoffs several times in his career but never make it to the Super Bowl, let alone win the Super Bowl… Is he still considered a Hall of Famer when he retires? Wouldn’t that be kind of debatable? And are other quarterbacks who had that kind of career not in the Hall of Fame?

If only there was a great QB to play for Buffalo, with great stats, that never won a Super Bowl. 

[K-9]

2 hours ago, Zamboni said:

I am admittedly speaking out of ignorance… So this is a honest question… If Josh Allen takes the bills to the playoffs several times in his career but never make it to the Super Bowl, let alone win the Super Bowl… Is he still considered a Hall of Famer when he retires? Wouldn’t that be kind of debatable? And are other quarterbacks who had that kind of career not in the Hall of Fame?

Fouts, Moon, and Jurgensen are three that never went to the SB but are in the HOF.

[French Collection]

3 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Fouts, Moon, and Jurgensen are three that never went to the SB but are in the HOF.

Not as big of an achievement but Moon is in the CFL HOF as well. 1978-83 in Canada before his NFL career. 
He could have accomplished more in the NFL had he moved there earlier.

[Taro T]

35 minutes ago, French Collection said:

Not as big of an achievement but Moon is in the CFL HOF as well. 1978-83 in Canada before his NFL career. 
He could have accomplished more in the NFL had he moved there earlier.

Had he come along a few years later, he might have.  Starting QB jobs were few & far between back then.  Doug Williams is the only starter that immediately springs to mind before Moon.  And Williams benefitted in getting the opportunity by being on a horrible Bucs team that was desperate.  Those 2 definitely were pioneers though there had been a few backups before them who got a handful of starts, including Buffalo's own James Harris.

[K-9]

3 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Had he come along a few years later, he might have.  Starting QB jobs were few & far between back then.  Doug Williams is the only starter that immediately springs to mind before Moon.  And Williams benefitted in getting the opportunity by being on a horrible Bucs team that was desperate.  Those 2 definitely were pioneers though there had been a few backups before them who got a handful of starts, including Buffalo's own James Harris.

Harris became the Rams starter in ‘74 when Knox benched Hadl and had a Pro Bowl year. Also became the first black QB to win a playoff game. Was the starter in ‘75 as well and led them to another division title, but he hurt his shoulder and was never the same. He got more than a handful of starts, but never got enough as it turned out.