Offseason Gameplan 2022 - Solving the goaltending system wide.

[Marvin]

If we go with Pekka-Lukkonen with just Anderson or Tokarski with Subban with Houser or Tokarski, I might come around to someone else's theory that Adams does not value goaltending like you do, let alone how I do (because of how Carolina won the Cup).

[GASabresIUFAN]

2 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

If we go with Pekka-Lukkonen with just Anderson or Tokarski with Subban with Houser or Tokarski, I might come around to someone else's theory that Adams does not value goaltending like you do, let alone how I do (because of how Carolina won the Cup).

Carolina won that Cup because rookie Ward played out of his mind.

[Marvin]

44 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Carolina won that Cup because rookie Ward played out of his mind.

I know.  I worry that he expects that it is not necessary to have a clear #1 goalkeeper because someone will magically emerge in the playoffs.

[kas23]

2 hours ago, Contempt said:

IMO, the Sabres need a player who can step in and play competent #1 GK for at least 2 seasons if not 3. Levi is in college this year and will probably get at least 1 year in Rochester before he comes to Buffalo. The 3rd year gives you some buffer if Levi is slower to develop than we'd want.  MAF isn't going to give you 3.  I'm not sure he's going to even give you 2.

I would go even longer than that. Probably 4. Great teams need more than one competent goaltender at all times. I would prefer one bird in the bush now and see if we can’t get a 2nd one in there in the next 1-2 years, either UPL or Levi or whoever. Let the best one of all play the most games, but still go with the 1A/1B model. But, hope is not a strategy for any of our of goalie prospects to work out. We need a true starter next season. 

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Carolina won that Cup because rookie Ward played out of his mind.

Sometimes.  He also was hot garbage at times which is why Gerber also got a start in that playoff run.

IMHO, injuries were a far bigger factor in the run.  They were on their way to getting swept by Moe-ray-all until Williams high sticked Koivu in the eye.  As soon as Koivu was gone, so were the Habs.  Don't recall who, if anyone important Joisey lost, but the Sabres run of "win a game, lose a(nother) D-man" is well documented, as is the Eulers' goalie breaking in the Finals.

Carolina didn't lose a player that mattered until Weight went down in Game 5 of the Finals & was promptly replaced by Eric Cole.  They had 14 skaters dress for every game & Weight played all but 2 & Whitney missed 1.  16 of the 18 skaters had a sum total of 3 man games lost.  Un-friggin-real.

Edited May 10, 2022 by Taro T

[Weave]

9 hours ago, Taro T said:

Sometimes.  He also was hot garbage at times which is why Gerber also got a start in that playoff run.

IMHO, injuries were a far bigger factor in the run.  They were on their way to getting swept by Moe-ray-all until Williams high sticked Koivu in the eye.  As soon as Koivu was gone, so were the Habs.  Don't recall who, if anyone important Joisey lost, but the Sabres run of "win a game, lose a(nother) D-man" is well documented, as is the Eulers' goalie breaking in the Finals.

Carolina didn't lose a player that mattered until Weight went down in Game 5 of the Finals & was promptly replaced by Eric Cole.  They had 14 skaters dress for every game & Weight played all but 2 & Whitney missed 1.  16 of the 18 skaters had a sum total of 3 man games lost.  Un-friggin-real.

Not at all pertinent to the conversation, but I recently watched a Spittin Chicklets episode where Craig Rivet admitted to being the source of the injury that knocked Koivu out of the playoffs.  Rivet and Koivu were roomies.  There was some horseplay and Rivet unintentionally body checked Koivu into the toilet.  It broke and Koivu ended up with something like 30 plus stitches.  Supposedly the team was never aware of how it happened.

[Curt]

13 hours ago, Contempt said:

Does FLA move on from Bob if they get bounced early or if they sit him and ride Spencer Knight?

I also think Carter Hart is very available for not very much. Philadelphia is where goaltending goes to die so you'd have to have some faith that you could rehab his game and confidence.

Bobrovsky is not going to waive his NMC to go from cup contender in Miami to maybe up and comer in Buffalo.  He just isn’t.

What makes you think that Hart is so available?

[Contempt]

28 minutes ago, Curt said:

Bobrovsky is not going to waive his NMC to go from cup contender in Miami to maybe up and comer in Buffalo.  He just isn’t.

What makes you think that Hart is so available?

I agree, he probably won't. 

Re: Hart it's just a feeling I have.

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, Contempt said:

I agree, he probably won't. 

Re: Hart it's just a feeling I have.

What makes you think KA would want him?  He’s only 23.  That’s 17 years to young for Adams.  

[Porous Five Hole]

2 hours ago, Weave said:

Not at all pertinent to the conversation, but I recently watched a Spittin Chicklets episode where Craig Rivet admitted to being the source of the injury that knocked Koivu out of the playoffs.  Rivet and Koivu were roomies.  There was some horseplay and Rivet unintentionally body checked Koivu into the toilet.  It broke and Koivu ended up with something like 30 plus stitches.  Supposedly the team was never aware of how it happened.

For anyone that is curious, here you are. 

[Weave]

4 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

For anyone that is curious, here you are. 

We would’ve crushed Montreal, even down 5 NHL defensemen.

What could have been….

[Contempt]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

What makes you think KA would want him?  He’s only 23.  That’s 17 years to young for Adams.  

Fair enough

[Taro T]

9 hours ago, Weave said:

Not at all pertinent to the conversation, but I recently watched a Spittin Chicklets episode where Craig Rivet admitted to being the source of the injury that knocked Koivu out of the playoffs.  Rivet and Koivu were roomies.  There was some horseplay and Rivet unintentionally body checked Koivu into the toilet.  It broke and Koivu ended up with something like 30 plus stitches.  Supposedly the team was never aware of how it happened.

No, Koivu played in Game 3 in Moe-ray-all & took a high stick to the eye from Williams & didn't play again that series.

And, if you listen to Rivet, he says Koivu didn't play in game 3.

Not calling BS on his story, (well, maybe 😉) but things didn't happen exactly the way Rivet related the story.  Koivu left game 3 in the 2nd period w/ blood dripping from his face after the high stick from Williams.  (Which somehow the entire reffing crew managed to miss.  But the ref did help him to the bench.  So, there is that going for them.)

Koivu played a Habs forward most 23+ minutes in the double OT game 2 they won in Carolina the night he'd supposedly taken 30+ stitches in the arse.  He played 33 shifts & had the 2ndary assist on the game winner.  (He must've recieved REAL good Advil that day to play that much & still matter in the outcome.)

Now maybe he was able to get 30+ stitches & play 10 minutes more in game 2 than he had in game 1 only a few hours after getting his arse cut that bad before game 2 and his real reason for not playing again after going to the hospital in Moe-ray-all during game 3 was due to his arse still being sore 3+ days later, but this kid ain't buyin' that baloney.

No, no, really NOBODY on the team except for Koivu, Rivet, & the trainer knew ANYTHING at all about this horrific injury that REALLY DID happen but somehow didn't affect his play.

 

Doesn't Rivet like to fish?  Seems he might have had a record haul w/ that trip. 😉

 

Edited May 10, 2022 by Taro T

[Weave]

Ok Rivet is a liar and you know the truth LOL.

[Flashsabre]

Rivet said that Koivu played Game 3 but didn’t play the rest of the series. He had so many stitches in his back he couldn’t bend over.

[Taro T]

3 hours ago, Weave said:

Ok Rivet is a liar and you know the truth LOL.

Or ALL the news reports at the time were "fake news" and his face wasn't really bleeding after he took the high stick.  It was all an elaborate rouse.

😄

[Taro T]

3 hours ago, Flashsabre said:

Rivet said that Koivu played Game 3 but didn’t play the rest of the series. He had so many stitches in his back he couldn’t bend over.

No, he said "and he didn't play a couple of games after that, we lost the next 3 games after that."

[Taro T]

Pretty sure this is from that game 3

[Weave]

30 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Or ALL the news reports at the time were "fake news" and his face wasn't really bleeding after he took the high stick.  It was all an elaborate rouse.

😄

Yeah, teams don’t hide real injuries.  Especially in cities with massive media pressure.

I don’t care enough to continue.  I just find it odd that you’re so confident in knowing what happened that you’ll call a guy with no reason to make up the story and who was there a liar.

To each their own I guess.

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, Weave said:

Yeah, teams don’t hide real injuries.  Especially in cities with massive media pressure.

I don’t care enough to continue.  I just find it odd that you’re so confident in knowing what happened that you’ll call a guy with no reason to make up the story and who was there a liar.

To each their own I guess.

Not really calling him a liar, but rather saying that there's a very good chance he was embellishing at a minimum.  His wouldn't be the 1st "war story" that became more impressive 15 years after the incident was over.

And posted info from the actual game logs.  Koivu played more than any other forward the Habs dressed that 2nd game.  Could he have simply been battling through?  Sure.  But that doesn't seem to fit Rivet's story.

And Koivu really did take the stick to the eye in game 3 and never returned after it.  He also went to the hospital that night and did not play again in that series.  Was that all a clever rouse to hide Koivu's REAL injury (that he'd logged more than 30 minutes after suffering per Rivet, but never played another minute after the eye injury even though just his being available had clearly left the team playing better).

If he could play through it for a game & a half, why couldn't he come back at all after the presumably imaginary injury when his team really needed him?  Doesn't make sense.

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

So who are going to be our goaltenders next season? 

[Taro T]

5 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

So who are going to be our goaltenders next season? 

3 people who have never been in my kitchen.  😉

 

[Flashsabre]

1 hour ago, Taro T said:

No, he said "and he didn't play a couple of games after that, we lost the next 3 games after that."

He told the story a couple of times in varying degrees of detail. Once with Peters, once with Friedman, once on that podcast. Depends who you listened too.

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, Flashsabre said:

He told the story a couple of times in varying degrees of detail. Once with Peters, once with Friedman, once on that podcast. Depends who you listened too.

Fair enough.

Only heard the version on the podcast.  And what he said in that did not state that he played in Game 3.  (Though he in fact did until he got high sticked by Williams.  He did not play again after the high stick.) 

 

[Flashsabre]

1 minute ago, Taro T said:

Fair enough.

Only heard the version on the podcast.  And what he said in that did not state that he played in Game 3.  (Though he in fact did until he got high sticked by Williams.  He did not play again after the high stick.) 

 

The story he told was that when they got to the rink Koivu was basically hiding in the trainers room. The trainer had took him to get stitched up but never told the team. Saku told Rivet that he couldn’t bend over. But he DID play that night but missed the rest of the series after that game.