Does Rasmus Dahlin need a change of scenery?

[GoPuckYourself]

37 minutes ago, The Ghost of NS said:

He’s on pace for, what? 60 points this season?

There are fans on here who think a 60 point defensemen needs time in the AHL? And that’s 60 points on a BAD team.

I don’t understand the thinking around here lately. 

Again and I'll say this every time, he is a liability on defense, great that he gets 60 pts but if he's giving up 2-3 goals a night because he's clueless on how to stop the opposition then what good is he? Victor Hedman throws his body around , Dahlin is a wuss. 

[Andrew Amerk]

2 minutes ago, GoPuckYourself said:

Again and I'll say this every time, he is a liability on defense, great that he gets 60 pts but if he's giving up 2-3 goals a night because he's clueless on how to stop the opposition then what good is he? Victor Hedman throws his body around , Dahlin is a wuss. 

How would he be giving up 3 goals a night? He’s not a goalie. 

Lidstrom didn’t throw his body around. Was he a wuss?

[Nozlen]

Some of you saying send Dahlin to Rochester do not understand how the Waiver Rule works. If you "Send Dahlin to Rochester" he would first need to be waived and then pass waivers...NOT HAPPENING!!!

Players who can be sent to Rochester or are in Rochester and can be called up and sent back down and do not need to be placed on Waivers to go Rochester are:

Biro, Brandon
Bryson, Jacob
Cozens, Dylan
Fitzgerald, Casey
Krebs, Peyton
Laaksonen, Oskari
Luukkonen, Ukko-Pekka
Murray, Brett
Pekar, Matej
Peterka, John-Jason
Quinn, Jack
Rousek, Lukas
Ruotsalainen, Arttu
Samuelsson, Mattias
Weissbach, Linus

[Zamboni]

10 minutes ago, Nozlen said:

Some of you saying send Dahlin to Rochester do not understand how the Waiver Rule works. If you "Send Dahlin to Rochester" he would first need to be waived and then pass waivers...NOT HAPPENING!!!

Players who can be sent to Rochester or are in Rochester and can be called up and sent back down and do not need to be placed on Waivers to go Rochester are:

Biro, Brandon
Bryson, Jacob
Cozens, Dylan
Fitzgerald, Casey
Krebs, Peyton
Laaksonen, Oskari
Luukkonen, Ukko-Pekka
Murray, Brett
Pekar, Matej
Peterka, John-Jason
Quinn, Jack
Rousek, Lukas
Ruotsalainen, Arttu
Samuelsson, Mattias
Weissbach, Linus

This is great info, but you aren’t going to stop posters from ignorantly screaming to send Dahlin to Roch. So the rest of us either ignore the drivel or remind the poster why it won’t or can’t happen.

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, The Ghost of NS said:

He’s on pace for, what? 60 points this season?

There are fans on here who think a 60 point defensemen needs time in the AHL? And that’s 60 points on a BAD team.

I don’t understand the thinking around here lately. 

cause he's a defenseman, not a forward. Don't think a single person questions his offensive skills.

Wins matter, not points. 

[Crusader1969]

8 hours ago, GoPuckYourself said:

Again and I'll say this every time, he is a liability on defense, great that he gets 60 pts but if he's giving up 2-3 goals a night because he's clueless on how to stop the opposition then what good is he? Victor Hedman throws his body around , Dahlin is a wuss. 

I would love to see Dahlins transition stats.  There’s more to playing D than throwing your body around.   
it’s also the ability to clear your zone with possession, either yours or by passing to a teammate 
whats Dahlins passing stats ? His defensive zone and offensive zone entries with possession?  
I’m assume these stats exist, just have no idea where to find them 
 

[Happy Days]

StatsCentre @StatsCentre 15h

In on his team's 1-0 marker against the Panthers tonight, Rasmus Dahlin has passed Gilbert Perreault for the 4th most career assists by a @BuffaloSabres player before their 22nd birthday (101). The only 3 to post more? Pierre Turgeon (195), Phil Housley (185) & Jack Eichel (112). Rasmus Dahlin’s (101) birthday is April 13th.

Edited December 3, 2021 by Happy Days

[Crusader1969]

1 hour ago, Happy Days said:

StatsCentre @StatsCentre 15h

In on his team's 1-0 marker against the Panthers tonight, Rasmus Dahlin has passed Gilbert Perreault for the 4th most career assists by a @BuffaloSabres player before their 22nd birthday (101). The only 3 to post more? Pierre Turgeon (195), Phil Housley (185) & Jack Eichel (112). Rasmus Dahlin’s (101) birthday is April 13th.

yes, but where is he on the body checks per 60 chart?

[BMWR100RT]

If I didn't think Rasmus wasn't hard on himself or not interested in learning, I'd be concerned. His body language doesn't say that, and at times he's both absolutely amazing and absolutely frustrating in the same game. I'm enjoying watching him develop. I would be significantly disappointed of he is dealt in any way.  

[inkman]

Based on my observations, Rasmus Dahlin is a super talented kid that can’t get out of his own head.  He overthinks plays all the time.  Ten times a game I’m wondering what the heck is trying to do.  Five times a game I’m amazed at what he does on the ice.  Flip that ratio and I’ll become a fan of his.  Donnie needs to work his magic.  I’m not sold that Meatballs can do that with defenseman.  He certainly has the forwards humming.  It’s hard to tell with such porous goaltending, how the D is performing.  At least in their own zone. 

[GoPuckYourself]

On 12/3/2021 at 12:13 AM, The Ghost of NS said:

How would he be giving up 3 goals a night? He’s not a goalie. 

Lidstrom didn’t throw his body around. Was he a wuss?

Really man? Come on, I mean if you like the guy fine but did he not give the puck away twice that ended up as goals? Yes we all know there are goalies who make the stops but giving away pucks when we have weak goaltending is a must not and he does it 2-3 times per game.

Are you really comparing Lidstrom to him? Really? Lidstrom didn't have to throw his body around he actually knew how to play the position. 

I don't dislike Dahlin merely for the fact that he's not a tough guy I just don't like his overall game. 

[Norcal]

Someone thinks Dahlin is good at something 

 

[freester]

What could we realistically expect as a return if we we’re to trade Dahlin? He’s very young so we should be patient but we do have a bunch of LD already and we could certainly use another impact forward. 

[SABRES 0311]

10 hours ago, freester said:

What could we realistically expect as a return if we we’re to trade Dahlin? He’s very young so we should be patient but we do have a bunch of LD already and we could certainly use another impact forward. 

Maybe a goalie in a package deal.

[LabattBlue]

I’m not looking to trade Dahlin and I hope he can get his head out of his a$$, but just be glad he didn’t get the 8x8 or 8x7 deal that some were hoping for in the off-season. 
 

The clock is ticking. IMO he has 2-1/2 years to prove he is part of the long term core.  He has a long long way to go to reach that point. 

Edited December 5, 2021 by LabattBlue

[DarthEbriate]

This is the way. GM Sheevyn said no blocking the young folk... and there's no blocking. This is the way.

But! The change of scenery Dahlin needs is the same this entire new core needs: 1) a goalie they can trust and, 2) talent equal to what's being asked of their role. We're letting Dahlin play #1 minutes. That's fine if his #2 is capable of that. Pysyk is a good player, a steady, smart/savvy player. He's a great match for Dahlin, really. He's not a top-pairing D. He's a career 3rd pairing guy who's played a lot at forward because he is a smart/savvy player. Dahlin's other options are Joker (who is also a kid and might someday be a top-4, but right now should be a 3rd pair), Miller (career 3rd pair), and Butcher (7th). And if Dahlin switches... Hagg (3rd pair, maybe 2nd with a fantastic partner), and Bryson (3rd pair).

The question goes to roster construction: Do you think Detroit was worried about blocking Seider when they acquired Leddy (still capable of being a 1st-pair)? No. They went out and got someone to play with Seider at the top. And if Seider wasn't ready, then he would be getting 3rd pairing minutes. (Detroit also got a young, trending up goalie in Nedeljkovic.)

The worry now is --- who are we getting this offseason to support Dahlin? And will we need another one for Power?

[bunomatic]

4 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

This is the way. GM Sheevyn said no blocking the young folk... and there's no blocking. This is the way.

But! The change of scenery Dahlin needs is the same this entire new core needs: 1) a goalie they can trust and, 2) talent equal to what's being asked of their role. We're letting Dahlin play #1 minutes. That's fine if his #2 is capable of that. Pysyk is a good player, a steady, smart/savvy player. He's a great match for Dahlin, really. He's not a top-pairing D. He's a career 3rd pairing guy who's played a lot at forward because he is a smart/savvy player. Dahlin's other options are Joker (who is also a kid and might someday be a top-4, but right now should be a 3rd pair), Miller (career 3rd pair), and Butcher (7th). And if Dahlin switches... Hagg (3rd pair, maybe 2nd with a fantastic partner), and Bryson (3rd pair).

The question goes to roster construction: Do you think Detroit was worried about blocking Seider when they acquired Leddy (still capable of being a 1st-pair)? No. They went out and got someone to play with Seider at the top. And if Seider wasn't ready, then he would be getting 3rd pairing minutes. (Detroit also got a young, trending up goalie in Nedeljkovic.)

The worry now is --- who are we getting this offseason to support Dahlin? And will we need another one for Power?

And Power and the mule will both be put in positions above their ability. Its a Sabre tradition

[DarthEbriate]

12 minutes ago, bunomatic said:

And Power and the mule will both be put in positions above their ability. Its a Sabre tradition

Samuelsson is going to join the team soon and he's going to become the #1 lockdown guy by default. Samuelsson-Jokiharju is not going to be ready for that pressure. Dahlin and Power will both need established top-4 guys, too, if that's how they're going to be deployed.

It's exciting to think about the defense 2 years from now: Dahlin, Power, Joker, Samuelsson. That's cool. They'll also all still be 24 and under, meaning still not even as experienced as Hagg and Bryson are today. They'll all still be unfinished D, not yet into their prime.

[sabresparaavida]

2 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

Samuelsson is going to join the team soon and he's going to become the #1 lockdown guy by default. Samuelsson-Jokiharju is not going to be ready for that pressure. Dahlin and Power will both need established top-4 guys, too, if that's how they're going to be deployed.

It's exciting to think about the defense 2 years from now: Dahlin, Power, Joker, Samuelsson. That's cool. They'll also all still be 24 and under, meaning still not even as experienced as Hagg and Bryson are today. They'll all still be unfinished D, not yet into their prime.

What About Power-Joki and then get someone to complement Dahlin and Samuelson 

[triumph_communes]

Just make him a forward. He will be a menace not having to play so hesitant all the time. His hockey vision is elite. Our team has tons of finishers he can end plays with. Just do it!

Edited December 5, 2021 by triumph_communes

[Weave]

Still not on the "sit him" train.  Nor the "trade him" train.  But his performance has dropped to the point where he is becoming a liability on the power play.  At this point I'd not complain if he was dropped to the 2nd unit where he'll see the 2nd best penalty killers.  Let him get his head straightened out before putting him back on the top unit.

 

[DarthEbriate]

3 hours ago, sabresparaavida said:

What About Power-Joki and then get someone to complement Dahlin and Samuelson 

I think we'll have to see a bunch of mix-and-match to see who gels with whom. (Yes, next year is also going to be a development year like this year... but it'll be easier if we have a real goalie.)

Power-Joker would work. I think that has to be a 3rd pair in terms of EV minutes. Joker is solid if unspectacular and he could be great for Power, but it's 2 kids. I'd rather see an older guy for Power to be able lean on (Myers-Tallinder, like). Then probably something like Samuelsson-Bryson and Dahlin-Pysyk/UFA. And it's really got to be a top-4 UFA, but the players available are going to be minimal.

Perhaps at the trade deadline we send a 2nd for a veteran rental from an eliminated team. Normally, you'd try to send that vet to a contender, but a top pick in the 2nd round could be enough to sway them to take the pick value, rather than worry about the player's chances at a Cup. Then, you've got 15 games or so to have that vet gel with Dahlin and re-sign. I don't like this proposal very much because that veteran may not sign.

2 hours ago, Weave said:

Still not on the "sit him" train.  Nor the "trade him" train.  But his performance has dropped to the point where he is becoming a liability on the power play.  At this point I'd not complain if he was dropped to the 2nd unit where he'll see the 2nd best penalty killers.  Let him get his head straightened out before putting him back on the top unit.

Agreed. He doesn't need to sit, but he needs to play fewer minutes. Give Bryson and Miller more PP time. And, regardless of score, roll all three D pairs. The issue now is Dahlin (or team defense) makes a gaffe and it automatically ends up in our net. Then, Dahlin plays more and more as our preferred offensive defenseman and keeps struggling because he's trying to press. Just aim to keep him under 22:00 until he gets consistent with his play.

[Taro T]

18 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

I think we'll have to see a bunch of mix-and-match to see who gels with whom. (Yes, next year is also going to be a development year like this year... but it'll be easier if we have a real goalie.)

Power-Joker would work. I think that has to be a 3rd pair in terms of EV minutes. Joker is solid if unspectacular and he could be great for Power, but it's 2 kids. I'd rather see an older guy for Power to be able lean on (Myers-Tallinder, like). Then probably something like Samuelsson-Bryson and Dahlin-Pysyk/UFA. And it's really got to be a top-4 UFA, but the players available are going to be minimal.

Perhaps at the trade deadline we send a 2nd for a veteran rental from an eliminated team. Normally, you'd try to send that vet to a contender, but a top pick in the 2nd round could be enough to sway them to take the pick value, rather than worry about the player's chances at a Cup. Then, you've got 15 games or so to have that vet gel with Dahlin and re-sign. I don't like this proposal very much because that veteran may not sign.

Agreed. He doesn't need to sit, but he needs to play fewer minutes. Give Bryson and Miller more PP time. And, regardless of score, roll all three D pairs. The issue now is Dahlin (or team defense) makes a gaffe and it automatically ends up in our net. Then, Dahlin plays more and more as our preferred offensive defenseman and keeps struggling because he's trying to press. Just aim to keep him under 22:00 until he gets consistent with his play.

 

They absolutely should be rolling the 3 pairs (provided Butcher isn't part of 1) as at this moment they have 3 3rd pairing tandems.

Would be nice to see them start to specialize the F lines rather than having hodgepodges playing all ES situations as well.  At least until they get out of this funk.  (Realizing, their scoring isn't in a funk, but the overall game is.) 

[Weave]

2 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

I think we'll have to see a bunch of mix-and-match to see who gels with whom. (Yes, next year is also going to be a development year like this year... but it'll be easier if we have a real goalie.)

Power-Joker would work. I think that has to be a 3rd pair in terms of EV minutes. Joker is solid if unspectacular and he could be great for Power, but it's 2 kids. I'd rather see an older guy for Power to be able lean on (Myers-Tallinder, like). Then probably something like Samuelsson-Bryson and Dahlin-Pysyk/UFA. And it's really got to be a top-4 UFA, but the players available are going to be minimal.

Perhaps at the trade deadline we send a 2nd for a veteran rental from an eliminated team. Normally, you'd try to send that vet to a contender, but a top pick in the 2nd round could be enough to sway them to take the pick value, rather than worry about the player's chances at a Cup. Then, you've got 15 games or so to have that vet gel with Dahlin and re-sign. I don't like this proposal very much because that veteran may not sign.

Agreed. He doesn't need to sit, but he needs to play fewer minutes. Give Bryson and Miller more PP time. And, regardless of score, roll all three D pairs. The issue now is Dahlin (or team defense) makes a gaffe and it automatically ends up in our net. Then, Dahlin plays more and more as our preferred offensive defenseman and keeps struggling because he's trying to press. Just aim to keep him under 22:00 until he gets consistent with his play.

Another option is to move Dahlin to the half wall.  He’s plenty good at play making and makes defenders miss.  I think he’d do well on the half wall, and when he does turn the puck over there is another layer of defense before they are in on the goalie.

[Cityo'Rasmii]

He needs to watch from up above in the press box eating popcorn