Eichel vs McDavid

[GASabresIUFAN]

Is this debate relevant to us anymore?  

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

That was the first Buffalo Braves playoff game in 1974.  I saw it from my last row seat near the left baseline on the YouTube Videos of the Braves.

I knew one of the guys who helped design the raising of the roof of the Aud to put in the Oranges.  My first time up there when they expanded capacity to 16,325 seated (+ 108 Standing Room)  I commented to him later that month that I felt like a dare-devil skier.  (The last row of the Oranges behind the visitor's net was all I could afford once a year.)

Still, according to an article in the Buffalo News back when Marine Midland Arena opened, the top of the Oranges was still closer to the ice than the first row of the upper bowl now.

Early '90's it happened at IIRC an Aisles game.  Person in the oranges landed on somebody in the blues.

Didn't know about it happening in a Braves game as well.

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

You're drawing the wrong conclusion. Tanking is fine as long as you also fix your drafting. Edmonton didn't and Buffalo didn't

Draft AND develop, but yes, you definitely don't trade away your high picks and you do have to draft better than we did. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

We’ll never know if the tank would have worked since we didn’t have competent management to execute the rebuild.  
 

 

[LGR4GM]

35 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Is this debate relevant to us anymore?  

Nope

[Marvin]

39 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Is this debate relevant to us anymore?  

It brought in a new poster.  For that, I will debate.

[Weave]

56 minutes ago, woods-racer said:

Pittsburg absolutely did what buffalo did, right down to trading goalies that where playing well. It's where the whole *tanking* mentality was born.

For Mario.  And it took a decade, Jagr, and Recchi for it to bear fruit.  Is it really a success when it takes that long AND required the drafting of two more HOF players?

Edited November 11, 2021 by Weave

[DarthEbriate]

2 hours ago, Weave said:

Neither of which tanked in the last 20 years.

Remember when the fanbase here was talking ourselves into believing that Jack was the better leader and would have more success than McD?

Hooboy was that a good time.

This board also loved calling him McClavicle and pointing out how much more durable a bigger/stronger Eichel was going to be.

[woods-racer]

14 minutes ago, Weave said:

For Mario.  And it took a decade, Jagr, and Recchi for it to bear fruit.  Is it really a success when it takes that long AND required the drafting of two more HOF players?

If you do it and do it right and you win multiple cups many will say yes, it was completely worth it. The Sabres did it completely wrong. The tank was the worst thing they could ever do at that point in their history given management, ownership and their pool of prospects.

Tanking and it's varies levels of tanking is part of the sport. 

[Taro T]

27 minutes ago, woods-racer said:

If you do it and do it right and you win multiple cups many will say yes, it was completely worth it. The Sabres did it completely wrong. The tank was the worst thing they could ever do at that point in their history given management, ownership and their pool of prospects.

Tanking and it's varies levels of tanking is part of the sport. 

The Wrong Way

[Stoner]

Kathy Bates vs. Kathy Griffin.

[Believer]

2 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Is this debate relevant to us anymore?  

Nope… But the Eichel Obsession dies slow on the board… He’s gone… Let it go… We have a fine roster of young stars to discuss… 

[K-9]

1 hour ago, Weave said:

For Mario.  And it took a decade, Jagr, and Recchi for it to bear fruit.  Is it really a success when it takes that long AND required the drafting of two more HOF players?

Do they win those cups without Mario? If the answer is no, then I’d say it was worth it. Hell, just the thrills Lemieux provided while they were building may have been worth it. What a player!

[Weave]

21 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Do they win those cups without Mario? If the answer is no, then I’d say it was worth it. Hell, just the thrills Lemieux provided while they were building may have been worth it. What a player!

Do they win them without Jagr?  Without Recchi?  If the answer is no then I say it wasn't the tank that produced those cups.

And this is the single, best example of a tank working.  Hell, it might be the only example.  Nearly a decade and 2 more HOFers were needed to be added before it "worked".  It's a faulty plan.

[calti]

6 hours ago, Mustache of God said:

Yes, McDavid was the prize, but it doesn't mean he's been the savior. An individual player won't win you any championships, you need a competent front office to build around your core. They've only made the playoffs twice since McDavid's been drafted and haven't done much with that opportunity.

 

Edmonton Oilers Postseason Results

Year Record Result

2021 35-19-2 Lost First Round (Won 0 Rounds)

2020 37-25-9 Missed Playoffs

20193 5-38-9 Missed Playoffs

2018 36-40-6 Missed Playoffs

2017 47-26-9 Lost Conference Semi-Finals (Won 1 Round)

2016 31-43-8 Missed Playoffs

2015 24-44-14 Missed Playoffs

2014 29-44-9 Missed Playoffs

2013 19-22-7 Missed Playoffs

2012 32-40-10 Missed Playoffs

2011 25-45-12 Missed Playoffs

2010 27-47-8 Missed Playoffs

2009 38-35-9 Missed Playoffs

2008 41-35-6 Missed Playoffs

2007 32-43-7 Missed Playoffs

2006 41-28-13 Lost Stanley Cup Final (Won 3 Rounds)

you brought up the fact that edmonton is a disastrous franchise just like the sabres.

[Claude Balls]

The Sabres have lost since the Pegulas took over.

[PerreaultForever]

You know, the annoying thing is he's out in the Vegas community, hanging with youngsters, and his jerseys are apparently flying off the shelf. Quick reinvention. 

[Billznut]

7 hours ago, Weave said:

For Mario.  And it took a decade, Jagr, and Recchi for it to bear fruit.  Is it really a success when it takes that long AND required the drafting of two more HOF players?

Sorry but your premise is wrong in regards to Pittsburgh. Mario’s rookie season was 1984-85. Recchi’s rookie season was 1988-89. Jagr’s rookie season was 1990-91. The Pens won their first cup in 1990-91.  So it wasnt even close to a decade for the Pens to win. It was Mario’s 7th year, Recchi’s 3rd year and Jagr’s 1st year. 

[Billznut]

2 hours ago, Claude Balls said:

The Sabres have lost since the Pegulas took over.

Sure looks like they are going to try to match the Bills record of 17 years of futility. It’s going to be damnnnnn close since we are already at what? 11 years and counting? 

[North Buffalo]

11 hours ago, OrangeSeatVertigo said:

My bounce on Sabres losing Eichel is I felt years ago they lost the day the tank only got them the #2 pick and Eichel.  With Oilers/Sabres coming soon, wanted to put out there the only worthy prize for the tank season was McDavid , and they missed.   McDavid is a one of kind talent and 5x the player Eichel is.   I watch Oilers highlights whenever I can to marvel at the guy's talent.

So I have no qualms losing Eichel, as the Sabs lost this one years ago.  

At this point John is gone... my only reaction at this point is "who cares"

[Weave]

4 hours ago, Billznut said:

Sorry but your premise is wrong in regards to Pittsburgh. Mario’s rookie season was 1984-85. Recchi’s rookie season was 1988-89. Jagr’s rookie season was 1990-91. The Pens won their first cup in 1990-91.  So it wasnt even close to a decade for the Pens to win. It was Mario’s 7th year, Recchi’s 3rd year and Jagr’s 1st year. 

Ok it took 7 years AND TWO MORE HOFers.  That wasnt a tank success story.

[sabrefanday1]

14 hours ago, woods-racer said:

Pittsburg absolutely did what buffalo did, right down to trading goalies that where playing well. It's where the whole *tanking* mentality was born.

totally agree...funny many do not want to say Pittsburg tanked yet are so quick to criticize Buffalo for doing so. It worked for Pittsburg obviously with a bunch of cups as I guess they did it right (if there is a right or wrong). It seems no matter who Pittsburg throw out there they do well (eg:  Rodrigues has become a top 6 forward with them). 

[lost in dc]

You know Eichel has a lot to prove in Vegas. Question is whether he’ll be able to.

[Weave]

22 minutes ago, sabrefanday1 said:

totally agree...funny many do not want to say Pittsburg tanked yet are so quick to criticize Buffalo for doing so. It worked for Pittsburg obviously with a bunch of cups as I guess they did it right (if there is a right or wrong). It seems no matter who Pittsburg throw out there they do well (eg:  Rodrigues has become a top 6 forward with them). 

Pittsburgh did not tank to land Crosby.  They won an altered lottery coming off a lockout season.  Lottery balls were based on an average of multiple season standings that year.  Buffalo had equal chances as Pittsburgh to win that lottery. 

[Taro T]

14 minutes ago, Weave said:

Pittsburgh did not tank to land Crosby.  They won an altered lottery coming off a lockout season.  Lottery balls were based on an average of multiple season standings that year.  Buffalo had equal chances as Pittsburgh to win that lottery. 

No, but they did to land Fleury & Malkin.  (And yes, the Pens moved from 3 to 1 for Fleury, but they'd already cleaned house to get down to 3.)