Dreger: Eichel situation may be shifting, multiple teams involved

[thewookie1]

I wonder if the Sabres could agree to a deal with Anaheim in which he has the surgery while a "Sabre" and then is sent to Anaheim with the Sabres agreeing to pay the percent insurance doesn't cover if he ends up flaming out due to the surgery. 

[Digger]

24 minutes ago, Digger said:

Is Eichel's surgery not insurable just like any other surgery option?  I would think yes otherwise other NHL teams would not agree to it as an option either.

10 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

That's a question no one has ever answered. We bring it up but it's never proven.

I would think the Sabres would leak that information if the surgery is not insurable just to help strengthen their condition.

[Doohicksie]

14 hours ago, dudacek said:

Interesting element of the Brisson interview was how much pressure he is feeling to get this done now.

It's why he was hired, so... yeah.

[nfreeman]

17 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I understand that. I'm questioning that stance.

In hindsight, it seems they would have been a better position to improve the team had they taken that risk.

...unless the surgery failed, ending Jack's career and (presumably) voiding the insurance.

Respectfully, I will repeat that the risk on the ADR is the whole issue from the Sabres' perspective.  Yes, it might've worked, but there is a significant chance that the doomsday scenario would've resulted.  I think the Sabres think there is no reason for them to take that risk.  They have the right to make Jack sit until he caves and has fusion surgery, at which point, there is a better chance, relative to ADR, that he'll be back on the ice with his trade value restored.

 

12 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

I wonder if the Sabres could agree to a deal with Anaheim in which he has the surgery while a "Sabre" and then is sent to Anaheim with the Sabres agreeing to pay the percent insurance doesn't cover if he ends up flaming out due to the surgery. 

With Anaheim losing whatever it gave up in trade and the Sabres eating the $50MM?  I don't think either team would be interested in those risks.

[Doohicksie]

14 hours ago, Andrew Amerk said:

Maybe he is Jack to you, if you personally know him. 

He is Jack in the public world.  This putting on airs and calling him John is just dumb at this point.

[Taro T]

22 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I'm not sure why you are asking this question again. We both agree they don't.

I understand that. I'm questioning that stance.

In hindsight, it seems they would have been a better position to improve the team had they taken that risk.

Is that actually the case or simply the perception because of the frustration of the moment?

If there is a deadline to move Eichel (and not convinced there is one from the Sabres perspective) it's the last day of the current league year (historically June 30, but pretty sure it's in the 1st week of July this year) which is the day before the NMC kicks in.

And, if Adams wants as high a draft pick as he can get this year (which seems clearly obviously the case), then having a $10MM asset on the sideline helps him reach his goal of improving the team his way.

Also, honestly don't expect the actual package he gets for Eichel varying significantly from now to next year, keeping the state of his health a constant.  (Meaning what somebody will pay for a presurgery Eichel today is essentially the same as it'll be in June & whatever somebody would pay for a post-surgery Eichel is essentially the same today as it would be in June.  Having Eichel for 5 years or 4 years is IMHO essentially equivalent value wise.)

So, yes, THIS season's Sabres would be better had Eichel been traded.  But management has given no indication that winning this season is a goal (and actually losing might be the goal for this year) & they sure seem to think finishing low this year helps improve the team LT.  So, from our perspective, yes, the team would've been better.  But management isn't viewing g this from our perspective.  Which is ridiculously frustrating. 

[Doohicksie]

12 hours ago, JoeSchmoe said:

This thread has turned into another bickerfest just like the main Eichel one. The wild speculations are annoying too.

As foretold by the prophecy:

On 10/6/2021 at 7:22 AM, JoeSchmoe said:

A lot of people (like me) don't open the main thread because there's very little news. It's mostly just internal forum discussion and a lot of bickering.

On 10/6/2021 at 7:25 AM, Doohickie said:

That's what this thread will be by lunch time.

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by Doohickie

[Doohicksie]

3 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

At minimum the Sabres should demand a Bluechip Prospect, a cap dump and some conditional stuff. 

Did someone say cap dump?

3 hours ago, WildCard said:

Just make it end already

It's over.  Seriously, the team has moved on.  If something eventually comes back for Eichel that will be wonderful but they're building without him or his return.

[Doohicksie]

3 hours ago, nfreeman said:

It’s not OK to be dishonest or to pretend or be ignorant of the key factors in a situation because you’re taking sides.

You don't watch cable news, do you?

[thewookie1]

2 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Did someone say cap dump?

It's over.  Seriously, the team has moved on.  If something eventually comes back for Eichel that will be wonderful but they're building without him or his return.

I don't want him anywhere our youngsters this time around.

[Doohicksie]

3 hours ago, CallawaySabres said:

Maybe a stupid question but if there are conditions involved, how does that work if major pieces in trade are players, not picks??

It doesn't.  The conditions will be levied on on future picks.

[thewookie1]

My guess is we get 1 Top Prospect as the payment for Eichel.

1 or 2 Cap Casualties to level the salary cap

An assortment of conditional picks

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, Digger said:

perhaps the Sabres could allow him to get that surgery and then use the Olympics (which Brisson says is still possible) as the show case for him.  I think that it will be hard for Eichel to make that timeline and maybe even harder to walk into high pressure hockey right off the bat without injury but you never know. 

The most Buffalo thing ever would be to do this and then Jack isn't invited to play on the Olympic team.

1 hour ago, Digger said:

I hate all the speculation and assumptions that we need to make on this issue.

Yeah.  Real life is hard that way.

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, K-9 said:

The only thing I can think of that would prevent KA from continuing to be patient is that the Pegulas just don’t want to pay $2.5m for a player to sit out the year and would force him to make a lesser deal just to remove Jack from their books. But they would have paid him as an injured player needing to sit out the year anyway if bad blood didn’t exist, so it can’t be just about the money. 

fify.  The insurance pays the other $7.5m.

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, Digger said:

Is Eichel's surgery not insurable just like any other surgery option?

Apparently with the Sabres' insurance underwriter and the ADR procedure (which has no precedent with an NHL player) the answer is no.  Other teams may have other insurance companies that are willing to insure against that risk.

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, nfreeman said:

1 hour ago, Let's Go B-Lo said:

Option 3 is that Jack just doesn't play hockey anymore.

I think Eichel would cave and have fusion surgery before he chose this option.

[Radar]

Frankly I think insurance ramifications play a big part in all this. In an case it's something that needs to just play out. Weekly blurps from supposed "insiders" aside.

[Doohicksie]

32 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

My guess is we get 1 Top Prospect as the payment for Eichel.

1 or 2 Cap Casualties to level the salary cap

An assortment of conditional picks

If that came to pass I'd be perfectly okay with it.  It's kind of what I've expected anyway.  This whole four first equivalents thing was always a pipe dream.  If we get one top prospect and or two higher picks in the future that's fine (and if Jack never regains form, not getting the draft picks is fair compensation).

[dudacek]

10 minutes ago, Taro T said:

If there is a deadline to move Eichel (and not convinced there is one from the Sabres perspective) it's the last day of the current league year (historically June 30, but pretty sure it's in the 1st week of July this year) which is the day before the NMC kicks in.

And, if Adams wants as high a draft pick as he can get this year (which seems clearly obviously the case), then having a $10MM asset on the sideline helps him reach his goal of improving the team his way.

Also, honestly don't expect the actual package he gets for Eichel varying significantly from now to next year, keeping the state of his health a constant.  (Meaning what somebody will pay for a presurgery Eichel today is essentially the same as it'll be in June & whatever somebody would pay for a post-surgery Eichel is essentially the same today as it would be in June.  Having Eichel for 5 years or 4 years is IMHO essentially equivalent value wise.)

So, yes, THIS season's Sabres would be better had Eichel been traded.  But management has given no indication that winning this season is a goal (and actually losing might be the goal for this year) & they sure seem to think finishing low this year helps improve the team LT.  So, from our perspective, yes, the team would've been better.  But management isn't viewing g this from our perspective.  Which is ridiculously frustrating. 

I agree with all of this, particularly the bold.

There seems to be a prevailing sentiment around here that:

1) something other than the Sabres caving on ADR is going to happen to increase Eichel's market value

2) we shouldn't care about forcing Eichel to choose between playing hockey and a surgery he doesn't want when there is another plausible option out there

I don't agree with either of these principles

[Doohicksie]

43 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

I don't want him anywhere our youngsters this time around.

Sorry @thewookie1 I didn't mean to get your blood pressure up  😄

[Hoss]

Thank the lord we have a guy with zero hockey front office experience handling one of the most delicate player transactions in league history.

[K-9]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

I'm not sure why you are asking this question again. We both agree they don't.

I understand that. I'm questioning that stance.

In hindsight, it seems they would have been a better position to improve the team had they taken that risk.

Apologies for the confusion, so I’ll try to explain. 

When Brisson says that Jack is a “depleted” asset and a lesser deal is all that’s feasible, imo that is trying to establish the market. At the very least, it’s market manipulation. 

It’s interesting that Eichel and Britton think so little of their product, too. Of course they don’t really and I assume both are anticipating a return to full health and superstardom.

Not saying you or anyone here is saying this, but KA is out of line for believing the same thing? I don’t buy that. 

[thewookie1]

7 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Apologies for the confusion, so I’ll try to explain. 

When Brisson says that Jack is a “depleted” asset and a lesser deal is all that’s feasible, imo that is trying to establish the market. At the very least, it’s market manipulation. 

It’s interesting that Eichel and Britton think so little of their product, too. Of course they don’t really and I assume both are anticipating a return to full health and superstardom.

Not saying you or anyone here is saying this, but KA is out of line for believing the same thing? I don’t buy that. 

Well I'd tell Brisson I disagree and he can go on as many radio shows and podcasts as he wants but it won't change that I want significant value for Eichel.  

[K-9]

Just now, thewookie1 said:

Well I'd tell Brisson I disagree and he can go on as many radio shows and podcasts as he wants but it won't change that I want significant value for Eichel.  

I don’t think the Sabres need to dignify anything Brisson says publicly with a response, but that’s been the team’s stance the whole time it seems to me. Maybe it’s time for Lehner to get involved.😄

[PromoTheRobot]

12 minutes ago, Hoss said:

Thank the lord we have a guy with zero hockey front office experience handling one of the most delicate player transactions in league history.

Why don't you tell us how you really feel?