Is Don Granato the best coach the Sabres have had since Lindy Ruff?

[dudacek]

7 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

I'm not really objective when it comes to DG. I just like him. I really like him. I like how he carries himself. I like what he says when he's interviewed. I like his "vibe." I like what appears to be his core philosophy as an NHL HC - in terms of how you develop players and how you build a team (positive reinforcement, play to your strengths, don't play scared, develop an open and fast pace of play). I like that he was instrumental in turning around Dahlin's stalled/failing development. I like that he helped turn Tage Thompson into a good top-6 NHL forward.

 

I feel like I wrote this. Could not agree more.

I hope Donnie is able to adapt when today becomes the focus of the franchise, but for right now he is doing the job being asked of him with insight and class.

[woods-racer]

29 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

I saw the talk in the Kings GDT about how Granato was a cheap-ass budget option as HC, that no legitimate NHL coach wanted the job anyway, and HC DG is so deficient that he's holding the team back (or will hold them back, maybe?). So I dug around and found this thread.

I'm not really objective when it comes to DG. I just like him. I really like him. I like how he carries himself. I like what he says when he's interviewed. I like his "vibe." I like what appears to be his core philosophy as an NHL HC - in terms of how you develop players and how you build a team (positive reinforcement, play to your strengths, don't play scared, develop an open and fast pace of play). I like that he was instrumental in turning around Dahlin's stalled/failing development. I like that he helped turn Tage Thompson into a good top-6 NHL forward.

But there are others who think he's not enough. @PASabreFan, for one. So, what gives?

 

BOLD.

They just named every first time coach in every sport on every level.

*Legitimate* coaches (aka retreads) could very easily come in here and tried to win now and have a better win/loss record, in fact I'm positive they would have a better winning record. They would also never get the development of young talent because they would not be allowed to make mistakes. We would see ice time go to those best suited to play a trap style game that limits the other team. We're complaining about the ice time Eakin gets now, just imagine if his game was exactly what a veteran head coach wanted?

They could have done a heck of a lot worse than Granato for the development of a team this young, not sure there are that many out there that would do better.

 

[French Collection]

36 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

I saw the talk in the Kings GDT about how Granato was a cheap-ass budget option as HC, that no legitimate NHL coach wanted the job anyway, and HC DG is so deficient that he's holding the team back (or will hold them back, maybe?). So I dug around and found this thread.

I'm not really objective when it comes to DG. I just like him. I really like him. I like how he carries himself. I like what he says when he's interviewed. I like his "vibe." I like what appears to be his core philosophy as an NHL HC - in terms of how you develop players and how you build a team (positive reinforcement, play to your strengths, don't play scared, develop an open and fast pace of play). I like that he was instrumental in turning around Dahlin's stalled/failing development. I like that he helped turn Tage Thompson into a good top-6 NHL forward.

But there are others who think he's not enough. @PASabreFan, for one. So, what gives?

 

I like DG and want him to continue with this team. He brings positive energy and seems to have the development of our young talent at the top of his list.

Keep in mind he is a rookie and will develop along with his players. I think he is intelligent enough to improve his technical approach and to figure out how to be better than his opponents. I would hope he has a checklist on how to get there because development is only part of this.

 

[That Aud Smell]

Paging @PASabreFan ... paging @PASabreFan. Please pick up the nearest blue and gold courtesy phone.

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

I saw the talk in the Kings GDT about how Granato was a cheap-ass budget option as HC, that no legitimate NHL coach wanted the job anyway, and HC DG is so deficient that he's holding the team back (or will hold them back, maybe?). So I dug around and found this thread.

I'm not really objective when it comes to DG. I just like him. I really like him. I like how he carries himself. I like what he says when he's interviewed. I like his "vibe." I like what appears to be his core philosophy as an NHL HC - in terms of how you develop players and how you build a team (positive reinforcement, play to your strengths, don't play scared, develop an open and fast pace of play). I like that he was instrumental in turning around Dahlin's stalled/failing development. I like that he helped turn Tage Thompson into a good top-6 NHL forward.

But there are others who think he's not enough. @PASabreFan, for one. So, what gives?

 

I don't take anything PA says seriously because it's mostly agenda-driven.

Don Granato is the coach the Sabres needed at this point. Are we going to ignore the improvements in Dahlin, Thompson and Skinner? As for why DG was hired, he was the interim and brought back a pulse to a team that was flatlined last year. He earned a shot.

I suggest we wait until the end of the season to assess how Don did. 

 

Edited March 7, 2022 by PromoTheRobot

[K-9]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

I saw the talk in the Kings GDT about how Granato was a cheap-ass budget option as HC, that no legitimate NHL coach wanted the job anyway, and HC DG is so deficient that he's holding the team back (or will hold them back, maybe?). So I dug around and found this thread.

I'm not really objective when it comes to DG. I just like him. I really like him. I like how he carries himself. I like what he says when he's interviewed. I like his "vibe." I like what appears to be his core philosophy as an NHL HC - in terms of how you develop players and how you build a team (positive reinforcement, play to your strengths, don't play scared, develop an open and fast pace of play). I like that he was instrumental in turning around Dahlin's stalled/failing development. I like that he helped turn Tage Thompson into a good top-6 NHL forward.

But there are others who think he's not enough. @PASabreFan, for one. So, what gives?

 

I feel the same way about DG. My only concern is his tactical/strategic ability; especially in game adjustments. Which is why I’ve said he is the right coach, right now for this team, but he may not be the one to take us all the way. I hope I’m wrong, because he will have deserved that. 

[That Aud Smell]

1 hour ago, K-9 said:

My only concern is his tactical/strategic ability; especially in game adjustments. 

That does seem like an area that can be lacking. Biron seemed pretty insistent during the Kings game broadcast that the plan the Sabres had coming in was not working and that they needed to change their approach to gaining the zone.

[Stoner]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I don't take anything PA says seriously because it's mostly agenda-driven.

Don Granato is the coach the Sabres needed at this point. Are we going to ignore the improvements in Dahlin, Thompson and Skinner? As for why DG was hired, he was the interim and brought back a pulse to a team that was flatlined last year. He earned a shot.

I suggest we wait until the end of the season to assess how Don did. 

 

I have no agenda against Tony. He's done his job, and done it pretty well. I doubt many fans think he's the one who will be behind the bench if/when the team is contending. I think the bolded above shows you agree with me.

FTR my only agenda is against the rich scumbug earth rapist with the obscene mega yacht — and the Mrs.

[That Aud Smell]

16 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

The biggest move the team could make to signal to the fans/players and hockey world that there's a commitment to winning next season would be to get an NHL coach in here.

10 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

I have no agenda against Tony. He's done his job, and done it pretty well. I doubt many fans think he's the one who will be behind the bench if/when the team is contending. 

You take the position that he's not "an NHL coach." But no agenda. 🤨

[Stoner]

1 minute ago, That Aud Smell said:

You take the position that he's not "an NHL coach." But no agenda. 🤨

Are all opinions agendas? I haven't said much about TG. I was skeptical of the hire, warmed up to it, then didn't like his response to his team getting shafted by the league twice in short order, which again looks to me like a franchise that doesn't act like it cares about losing.

Let's say Adams tries to what virtually everyone wants over the summer: put a lot more talent around the kids. Free agents are targeted. Can you not imagine a potential free agent seriously asking his agent, "Wait, who's the coach up there now?"

[LGR4GM]

19 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Are all opinions agendas? I haven't said much about TG. I was skeptical of the hire, warmed up to it, then didn't like his response to his team getting shafted by the league twice in short order, which again looks to me like a franchise that doesn't act like it cares about losing.

Let's say Adams tries to what virtually everyone wants over the summer: put a lot more talent around the kids. Free agents are targeted. Can you not imagine a potential free agent seriously asking his agent, "Wait, who's the coach up there now?"

Can you not imagine that Granato has a 20yr coaching resume and that ufa might know him?

 

[That Aud Smell]

39 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Are all opinions agendas?

Perhaps not. Then again, not all opinions are quite as strong as saying that the Sabres don't currently have a legitimate NHL coach. The stronger the opinion, the more apt it is to be an agenda, or, perhaps worse, a narrative.

18 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Can you not imagine that Granato has a 20yr coaching resume and that ufa might know him?

Hailing from a family of hockey royalty should help as well.

[Randall Flagg]

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I don't take anything PA says seriously because it's mostly agenda-driven.

Don Granato is the coach the Sabres needed at this point. Are we going to ignore the improvements in Dahlin, Thompson and Skinner? As for why DG was hired, he was the interim and brought back a pulse to a team that was flatlined last year. He earned a shot.

I suggest we wait until the end of the season to assess how Don did. 

 

Nobody isn't agenda-driven, thats how biology works. You just don't like his agenda and prefer yours 

[SwampD]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

I have no agenda against Tony. He's done his job, and done it pretty well. I doubt many fans think he's the one who will be behind the bench if/when the team is contending. I think the bolded above shows you agree with me.

FTR my only agenda is against the rich scumbug earth rapist with the obscene mega yacht — and the Mrs.

I do. I think he’s a good coach. We have seen that he knows the Xs and Os as well as the interpersonal stuff. I have anyway.

As to the coaching yesterday, i just thought it was a teaching moment. I think he wanted to show those guys that they were being soft, and that they were going have to try a little harder to beat the trap on their own. He could have had them dumping in pucks from behind the centerline with a guy breaking to beat the icing, but it just never happened. It was also a one goal game on a nothing Sunday. Whatever.

[Stoner]

51 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Can you not imagine that Granato has a 20yr coaching resume and that ufa might know him?

 

So the guys you're targeting were in elementary school when Tony broke in?

[LGR4GM]

3 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

So the guys you're targeting were in elementary school when Tony broke in?

So you're not interested in a real conversation. Got it. 

[JohnC]

4 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

I saw the talk in the Kings GDT about how Granato was a cheap-ass budget option as HC, that no legitimate NHL coach wanted the job anyway, and HC DG is so deficient that he's holding the team back (or will hold them back, maybe?). So I dug around and found this thread.

I'm not really objective when it comes to DG. I just like him. I really like him. I like how he carries himself. I like what he says when he's interviewed. I like his "vibe." I like what appears to be his core philosophy as an NHL HC - in terms of how you develop players and how you build a team (positive reinforcement, play to your strengths, don't play scared, develop an open and fast pace of play). I like that he was instrumental in turning around Dahlin's stalled/failing development. I like that he helped turn Tage Thompson into a good top-6 NHL forward.

But there are others who think he's not enough. @PASabreFan, for one. So, what gives?

 

You make a keen observation about how refreshing he is when being interviewed. There were more than a few occasions on WGR on his weekly Howard and Jeremy segments where he would listen to the question and then mull it over and respond: "That is an good point. I haven't looked at this particular issue that way." He is open-minded and willing to give a candid answer. He's not insecure and defensive when criticized about the play of his team. There is little pretense and bluster when he is at the podium. 

How he handles himself in interviews certainly doesn't make him a good coach. Although how he responds to the media is part of his job. What distinguishes him is how he has gotten players such as Skinner, Dahlin, Mitts and the team in general to play better. And what distinguishes him as a coach that it is evident is that under him players get better. 

He's not a savior or at this time can be categorized as an elite coach. But in my opinion he is the right coach at the right time for this team.  

[Weave]

I don’t know how anyone can form a firm opinion of Donny G as a coach when we’ve never seen him operate in an expectation of winning environment.

Im not on board with not blocking the kids and not prioritizing wins, but that’s Donny Gs marching orders.  It definitely sets up a how-can-you-evaluate-him-as-coach scenario, though.

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

So the guys you're targeting were in elementary school when Tony broke in?

Who's Tony?

[Thorner]

2 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

Are all opinions agendas?

Yes. 

Everyone has their own personal biases. It’s when the bias goes unacknowledged, masquerading as objectivity, that an issue arises.

18 minutes ago, Weave said:

I don’t know how anyone can form a firm opinion of Donny G as a coach when we’ve never seen him operate in an expectation of winning environment.

Im not on board with not blocking the kids and not prioritizing wins, but that’s Donny Gs marching orders.  It definitely sets up a how-can-you-evaluate-him-as-coach scenario, though.

Agree 

[Stoner]

29 minutes ago, Weave said:

I don’t know how anyone can form a firm opinion of Donny G as a coach when we’ve never seen him operate in an expectation of winning environment.

Im not on board with not blocking the kids and not prioritizing wins, but that’s Donny Gs marching orders.  It definitely sets up a how-can-you-evaluate-him-as-coach scenario, though.

You're admitting that an NHL head coach is a huge unknown in terms of whether he can coach. Kinda says it all.

I think he's good in his current role. That role can't last forever. It's wishful thinking on my part that his job is done here. Everyone can't be good at everything.

Put another way would Cooper or Trotz have done as good a job as Granato? I have my doubts.

[mjd1001]

I'm fine with him for now..more than fine I like him.  Honestly, most of us really have no idea just how complicated coaching an NHL team can be or how in-depth game day strategy is.  With that said, there are 2 things we do know. 

1.) we know what his coaching style/ attitude is....some don't like it but I do like it.. 

2.)  He has experience, a TON of experience. Head coaching at multiple levels, experience in a development role, experience in the minors, college level kids, experience with multiple organizations as an assistant working with NHL players.

Put those 2 things together, especially with me being a person who LIKES his attitude, and I'm happy he is in his role with the team.

[That Aud Smell]

43 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Who's Tony?

I saw PA call our HC Tony (Granato) in another post. Is this a thing?

[Doohicksie]

5 hours ago, French Collection said:

I like DG and want him to continue with this team. He brings positive energy and seems to have the development of our young talent at the top of his list.

Keep in mind he is a rookie and will develop along with his players. I think he is intelligent enough to improve his technical approach and to figure out how to be better than his opponents. I would hope he has a checklist on how to get there because development is only part of this.

I would be willing to bet that, along with developing his young team, he's also working on developing his own coaching skills.  The Donny Meatballs we've seen the last year and a half will not be the same Donny Meatballs we see when the Sabres are in Win Mode, hopefully beginning next year.

Edited March 7, 2022 by The Ghost of Yuri

[Weave]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

You're admitting that an NHL head coach is a huge unknown in terms of whether he can coach. Kinda says it all.

I’m not sure of what you are getting at with this.  Elaborate please?