GDT: Sabres at Blue Jackets, Tue., Sept 28 at 7 PM ET, WGR 550, Streaming on Sabres.com

[Buffalonill]

Cozens didn’t  look ready at all  But once again you can't send him down to the AHL  It will likely mess with his mind. 

[nfreeman]

3 hours ago, tom webster said:

They offered him the deal he said he wanted and I think he planned on signing it till the Bruins stepped in. The Sabres were surprised someone offered more. I think Ulmark was surprised as well. You can’t blame anyone for picking the Bruins over the Sabres at this point in time. 

This may be true with respect to annual salary, but not, I would guess, on length of the contract.  Vogl reported that the Sabres offered only 1 or 2 years.  Any UFA in reasonable demand is going to want more term than that.

KA has royally screwed up at the most important position on the ice 2 years in a row.  He wears that, IMHO, and there's a decent likelihood that the Sabres have the worst goaltending in the NHL this year, and that it hurts the kids' development.

[tom webster]

11 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

This may be true with respect to annual salary, but not, I would guess, on length of the contract.  Vogl reported that the Sabres offered only 1 or 2 years.  Any UFA in reasonable demand is going to want more term than that.

KA has royally screwed up at the most important position on the ice 2 years in a row.  He wears that, IMHO, and there's a decent likelihood that the Sabres have the worst goaltending in the NHL this year, and that it hurts the kids' development.

It’s funny to me how we dismiss insider information that we don’t believe but refer to it to back up things we believe. 

[Buffalonill]

Why are people still on Ullmark? He was never healthy 

[Doohicksie]

4 hours ago, tom webster said:

They offered him the deal he said he wanted and I think he planned on signing it till the Bruins stepped in. The Sabres were surprised someone offered more. I think Ulmark was surprised as well. You can’t blame anyone for picking the Bruins over the Sabres at this point in time. 

If the offer was on the table prior to the trade deadline and not accepted, he should have been moved at the deadline.  It really is that simple.  That's a tough lesson that KA hopefully learned from.

3 hours ago, JohnC said:

That was the right decision. As you and others point out Ullmark made the right decision for himself and so did the organization. 

At the time, yes.  Rewind to the trade deadline though.... KA should have gotten what he could for Linus.

[JohnC]

48 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

If the offer was on the table prior to the trade deadline and not accepted, he should have been moved at the deadline.  It really is that simple.  That's a tough lesson that KA hopefully learned from.

At the time, yes.  Rewind to the trade deadline though.... KA should have gotten what he could for Linus.

KA made a decision with the information he had on hand. There was no guarantee that he would be able to sign the UFA player but he felt that there was a reasonable chance that a deal could get done in the offseason. In real life you don't have the ability to make hindsight judgments. The reality is that if he traded Ullmark at the deadline he wouldn't have gotten much for him because he was going to become a free agent in the offseason. So as a rental player his value would have been very limited. I have no problem how KA handled this situation. 

[Andrew Amerk]

1 hour ago, Buffalonill said:

Why are people still on Ullmark? He was never healthy 

Your posts are rarely healthy, yet here you are. 

[dudacek]

7 hours ago, tom webster said:

The Sabres will never admit it but they thought either Ulmark or Kuemper would be their goalie this year. They never envisioned someone exceeding Ulmark’s ask or Seattle signing Grubauer and scuttling plan B.

 

6 hours ago, Doohickie said:

So when do we start a Concept of Cozens thread to discuss his shortcomings?  It might be because he's still young, but I'm thinking he might need some more AHL seasoning.  JJP, Weissbach, Ruotsalainen all seem more comfortable out there than Cozens.  To be honest, I don't remember having a feeling that Cozens was ready to shoulder the load last season either.  Mitts is ready.  Cozens.... maybe not.

 

4 hours ago, K-9 said:

And yet when players exercise their right to go elsewhere for more money, some will insist on blaming Adams, anyway. 

If it were strictly a matter of a few more bucks for Linus, then I have to question how committed he was to ever staying in the first place. I imagine his mindset was like others of his time here and he really wanted to leave, anyway. 

I always liked Linus, Risto, and Reinhart and I thank them for their time here, but they wanted fresh starts and nobody can blame them for that given the lack of success while they were here. But like it or not, they were part of that lack of success and imo it was time to move on, regardless. 

 

2 hours ago, Buffalonill said:

Cozens didn’t  look ready at all  But once again you can't send him down to the AHL  It will likely mess with his mind. 

I don’t blame Adams for Ullmark signing elsewhere in and of itself, I blame him for the series of decisions that led to the goaltending we currently have.

His job is to provide the team with capable goaltending. It seems he has not.

****
I’m not one of those fans who judges players strictly by hits thrown, shots taken and encounters won. There are also things like positioning and puck movement to consider.

Dylan Cozens centred a line with two rookies that won the possession battle by nearly 80 %. They didn’t give up much and they created their share.

Cozens is - and will be - fine.

[dudacek]

8 minutes ago, JohnC said:

KA made a decision with the information he had on hand. There was no guarantee that he would be able to sign the UFA player but he felt that there was a reasonable chance that a deal could get done in the offseason. In real life you don't have the ability to make hindsight judgments. The reality is that if he traded Ullmark at the deadline he wouldn't have gotten much for him because he was going to become a free agent in the offseason. So as a rental player his value would have been very limited. I have no problem how KA handled this situation. 

Sorry man, but GMing is like actual hockey. You can explain away any and every instance, but ultimately you have to win more than you lose.

[K-9]

2 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I don’t blame Adams for Ullmark signing elsewhere in and of itself, I blame him for the series of decisions that led to the goaltending we currently have.

His job is to provide the team with capable goaltending. It seems he has not.

…yet.

[Buffalonill]

15 minutes ago, Andrew Amerk said:

Your posts are rarely healthy, yet here you are. 

[dudacek]

10 minutes ago, K-9 said:

…yet.

Totally agree with this.

I think some people have started to pigeonhole me into anti-Adams because of my Eichel comments.

I like Adams, the vision and philosophy he projects. I support the steps he’s taken to fix the culture, modernize the hockey department and give the fans what they deserve.

I think these things are hard but necessary and could ultimately finally turn this ship around.

But strategy is useless without execution and so far we haven’t seen much execution.

Looking forward to that changing and I have plenty of hope that it will.

Edited September 29, 2021 by dudacek

[Taro T]

16 minutes ago, JohnC said:

KA made a decision with the information he had on hand. There was no guarantee that he would be able to sign the UFA player but he felt that there was a reasonable chance that a deal could get done in the offseason. In real life you don't have the ability to make hindsight judgments. The reality is that if he traded Ullmark at the deadline he wouldn't have gotten much for him because he was going to become a free agent in the offseason. So as a rental player his value would have been very limited. I have no problem how KA handled this situation. 

The deal Ullmark signed with the B's wasn't excessive and really wouldn't have blocked any of the 3 kids they're hanging their hat on.  Especially seeing how low the Sabres salary is today & into the foreseeable future, he should've come with an offer like that from the get go.

Would've forced the B's to overpay if they really wanted him and it would've allowed the kids to play the game the way the coach wants them to play.

Have 2 issues w/ Adams handling of this.  He could only get a 1 year deal worked out last year & he misread the goalie market again this year.

It is a major flaw that he will hopefully figure out soon.

[JohnC]

7 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Sorry man, but GMing is like actual hockey. You can explain away any and every instance, but ultimately you have to win more than you lose.

I don't understand your point or perspective. You are attributing the franchise's history of failure to a person who had absolutely nothing to do with its prior failures. What he's trying to do now is set a course and follow-through on it. With respect to the Ullmark situation the player was a free agent who made a decision that was in his best interest. And correspondingly the GM placed a value on the player and was not willing to going beyond what he believed his contract value was. Player movement is an intrinsic part of the hockey system. Sometimes the balance of control resides with the organization and sometimes the balance of control resides with the player. That's the system you work within. 

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, Taro T said:

The deal Ullmark signed with the B's wasn't excessive and really wouldn't have blocked any of the 3 kids they're hanging their hat on.  Especially seeing how low the Sabres salary is today & into the foreseeable future, he should've come with an offer like that from the get go.

Would've forced the B's to overpay if they really wanted him and it would've allowed the kids to play the game the way the coach wants them to play.

Have 2 issues w/ Adams handling of this.  He could only get a 1 year deal worked out last year & he misread the goalie market again this year.

It is a major flaw that he will hopefully figure out soon.

I agree with you that the deal that Ullmark signed with Boston wasn't excessive. From what I have read about the offer the agent took the Boston offer to Buffalo and demanded more term-wise and annual salary-wise. KA said no because he felt that it went beyond the value he pegged Ullmark at. I have no criticism for the player wanting more because from a hockey standpoint Boston was a better situation for him. That's life in the free agent market: The player and organization acting in their own best interests.  

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

I agree with you that the deal that Ullmark signed with Boston wasn't excessive. From what I have read about the offer the agent took the Boston offer to Buffalo and demanded more term-wise and annual salary-wise. KA said no because he felt that it went beyond the value he pegged Ullmark at. I have no criticism for the player wanting more because from a hockey standpoint Boston was a better situation for him. That's life in the free agent market: The player and organization acting in their own best interests.  

And again, the reports all are that the Sabres offer was a 2 year deal for basically the same money.  The reports all say the Sabres thought they had a deal but that Ullmark wanted to see if somebody would beat it.  The B's did beat it.  Ullmark seems to be a stand up guy; if he & the Sabres had originally agreed to the B deal he eventually signed for & then wanted to see if somebody would beat it, can't see him taking the deal from the B's instead & telling the Sabres to beat what they'd agreed to.

And, though Adams was acting in the Sabres best interests as he saw them, his only offering a 2 year deal (presuming that report is correct) wasn't actually in the Sabres best interest.

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, Taro T said:

And again, the reports all are that the Sabres offer was a 2 year deal for basically the same money.  The reports all say the Sabres thought they had a deal but that Ullmark wanted to see if somebody would beat it.  The B's did beat it.  Ullmark seems to be a stand up guy; if he & the Sabres had originally agreed to the B deal he eventually signed for & then wanted to see if somebody would beat it, can't see him taking the deal from the B's instead & telling the Sabres to beat what they'd agreed to.

And, though Adams was acting in the Sabres best interests as he saw them, his only offering a 2 year deal (presuming that report is correct) wasn't actually in the Sabres best interest.

Ullmark was a free agent. He and his agent were going to explore what the market was for him. That was the right thing for the player to do. I have read accounts that the agent wanted Buffalo to offer a longer term and more $$$ per year than what Boston offered. Is that account accurate? I believe so because Ullmark wasn't willing to sign a deal until he became a free agent and had an opportunity to see what other offers were available. In my view there are no bad guys here. The GM was not going to sign the player beyond what he valued him at; and the player went to a better hockey situation than he had in Buffalo. That's how the market works for a free agent. 

[dudacek]

33 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I don't understand your point or perspective. You are attributing the franchise's history of failure to a person who had absolutely nothing to do with its prior failures. What he's trying to do now is set a course and follow-through on it. With respect to the Ullmark situation the player was a free agent who made a decision that was in his best interest. And correspondingly the GM placed a value on the player and was not willing to going beyond what he believed his contract value was. Player movement is an intrinsic part of the hockey system. Sometimes the balance of control resides with the organization and sometimes the balance of control resides with the player. That's the system you work within. 

I don’t think I’m doing any such thing.

53 minutes ago, dudacek said:

 

 

 

I don’t blame Adams for Ullmark signing elsewhere in and of itself, I blame him for the series of decisions that led to the goaltending we currently have.

His job is to provide the team with capable goaltending. It seems he has not.

 

38 minutes ago, dudacek said:

 

I think some people have started to pigeonhole me into anti-Adams because of my Eichel comments.

I like Adams, the vision and philosophy he projects. I support the steps he’s taken to fix the culture, modernize the hockey department and give the fans what they deserve.

I think these things are hard but necessary and could ultimately finally turn this ship around.

But strategy is useless without execution and so far we haven’t seen much execution.

Looking forward to that changing and I have plenty of hope that it will.

 

[JohnC]

4 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I don’t think I’m doing any such thing.

 

First I want to let you know that I am not pigeon holing you into any "anti" category. With respect to this year's goaltending situation I agree that our goaltending staffing is precarious. That doesn't mean that it is automatically disastrous. With the exception of UPL the netminders we have are short-term. This is a rebuilding team. I just don't think that the GM was willing to seek the market (if available) for a high cost or even mid-level cost for a goalie when he believes that UPL is ready or near ready to be on this roster. 

I believe that KA thought he would be able to bring back Ullmark. Through no fault of his own (my opinion) it didn't work out. So you move on and make the best of the situation you are in. And just because the situation is what it is now doesn't mean that a trade can't be made to shore up the backstop position. 

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

In real life you don't have the ability to make hindsight judgments.

Right.  So you tell him I need you to sign by the trade deadline or the deal is off the table.  Then you trade him.  If he didn't want to sign during the season, why would KA think he would stay?  I mean, I'm not saying KA is an abject failure for not trading Ullmark at the deadline, but I think going forward he will keep this in the back of his mind when dealing with UFAs.

1 hour ago, Andrew Amerk said:

Your posts are rarely healthy, yet here you are. 

As much as it pains me to say it, Nilly has a point.

[Taro T]

39 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Ullmark was a free agent. He and his agent were going to explore what the market was for him. That was the right thing for the player to do. I have read accounts that the agent wanted Buffalo to offer a longer term and more $$$ per year than what Boston offered. Is that account accurate? I believe so because Ullmark wasn't willing to sign a deal until he became a free agent and had an opportunity to see what other offers were available. In my view there are no bad guys here. The GM was not going to sign the player beyond what he valued him at; and the player went to a better hockey situation than he had in Buffalo. That's how the market works for a free agent. 

First off, you don't have to explain how the FA market works.

And again, Adams reportedly only valued getting 2 years worth of Ullmark's services before he went to FA.  That is 1/2 of the term Bah-stan offered.  That the agent then came back & told the Sabres to beat the B's offer isn't surprising nor unexpected.

BUT, had the Sabres actually offered him the 4 year deal IN THE 1ST PLACE, then it would've been up to the B's to overpay, not the Sabres.  Why wouldn't Ullmark have told the Sabres to beat THAT offer?  Because Ullmark has integrity & he got a team to beat the Sabres original offer, not simply match it.

Adams misread Ullmark's value & the entire goalie market 2 years in a row.  How do we know that?  Because Linus Ullmark is a B, the other guy Adams had his eye on is an Av, and Martin friggin' Dell started last night.

Can he get better at reading the goalie market.  Absolutely.  Will he?  No friggin' clue, but hopefully he does.  Because if the goaltending doesn't improve the entire reset is doomed to failure.

But, though the Sabres didn't expect it, there was little chance that nobody would give Ullmark a deal longer than 2 years.  And that the Sabres let worrying about years 3 & 4 keep them from having an ONE legit NHLer that wasn't alive during Reagan's 1st term was IMHO a HUGE mistake.  You seem to be of the opinion that "well, Adams tried, that's good enough" (apologies if that is mischaracterizing your view) but, again, IMHO that is NOT good enough in his second go around.  And, if, IF, he was actually OK with NOT having a true 20 something NHL starting caliber goalie because he really sees this year as a purely throw away development year, well #### him and the horse he rode in on.

Honestly not sure if it was a misreading of the market or being OK w/ the insurance that they'll finish bottom 3 by having Carter Hutton level goaltending.  Either way, WE the fans lose this year.

[Andrew Amerk]

19 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

 

As much as it pains me to say it, Nilly has a point.

And yet John is currently in a wheelchair, and Sabres fans expect a combo of 4 top picks/prospects for him. 

Ullmark missed a handful of games in 2 seasons that were meaningless, and he’s okay to just let walk after investing 9 seasons developing him? 

Makes total sense.

[Doohicksie]

1 minute ago, Andrew Amerk said:

And yet John is currently in a wheelchair, and Sabres fans expect a combo of 4 top picks/prospects for him. 

Ullmark missed a handful of games in 2 seasons that were meaningless, and he’s okay to just let walk after investing 9 seasons developing him? 

Makes total sense.

As much as it pains me to say it, Andrew has a point.

[K-9]

Adams needed to keep Ullmark if only to prevent @MODO Hockey from leaving, no longer sharing panny videos from Sweden, and becoming a Bruins fan. 

[Marvin]

On 9/29/2021 at 8:04 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

Buffalo News article says all 6 preseason game will be streamed but only in the Buffalo area. Obviously someone messed up last night as I could see the stream in NH. Please don't fix it.

When I consider the Buffalo diaspora, I think they should allow people from all over the world to watch at sabres.com.