9/11, Twenty Years Later

[Hoss]

5 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Right.  And with JFK the nation let go and moved forward after a period of mourning.  Why we're still mourning 9/11 as a nation is beyond me.  It's time to move forward.

Agreed, to an extent. It was a horrible day. We’ve committed several atrocities worse than what happened that day, both before and since. I believe there are stories worth telling and worth consuming from that time, and I believe those still working with some form of grief or stress should consider seeking platforms to do so.

[ExWNYer]

38 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Talk about minimizing. You are trying to talk about how things changed after 9/11 and the most you can come up with are some beefed up security procedures at airports? You are truly lucky, I guess. Something like 20 veterans kill themselves every day because they can't live with what happened to them in the War on Terror. They and their families are forever changed. The rest of the country just keeps rolling along, as far as I can fell.

It's not "the most I can come up with". I was recounting my day 20 years ago, nothing more nothing less. I wasn't giving a 'woe is me' of how difficult my life is but that nuance seems to be lost on you. The small inconveniences now in place don't bother me. I know why they're in effect, it's a small sacrifice in the grand scheme of things, and I'm not the complaining type. I deal with it. You're the one that decided to come in and punch people in the nose for sharing their accounts. So, yeah, you calling people out for being 'cliched' was douchey but like I said, "you do you."

[Digger]

24 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Psychological warfare was waged on us. Asymmetrical warfare takes a relatively small act and gets a huge bang for its buck. Terrorists need societies to cooperate. I won't mark their anniversary for them and keep the cycle going.

Thanks.  I agree with the bolded text above.  I guess I was looking at it similar to remembering the sacrifices from the world wars and veterans in general that we remember on November 11th (Remembrance Day - Canada).  So I see 9/11 as a day to remember. 

[Pimlach]

I do feel that the effects 911 have continued and evolved for the past 20 years, right up to today.   
 

It is fascinating to hear politicians pledge “we will never forget” and then find that it is not even taught in many public’s schools across the nation.   Even more intriguing is what you teach them, when, and how.   
 

Looking back, I feel that I had a good education and most of my teachers were dedicated to their craft.   When I was in school we covered all the major wars/conflicts  that impacted this country and its foreign policy.  Viet Nam was covered a lot —- as a current event.    We lost brothers, sisters, friends and neighbors in real time.  We watched war protests, maybe some of us participated in them (or against them) too.  
 

Our children should learn what happened and more importantly why (the motivation against us and the reasons for our response).   How else can this heal or be avoided in the future?    I am not an educator or psychologist but not teaching this seems like a gap in the educational system.   
 

If I am being conned by the media and it is covered that would be good to know.  I can’t ask my kids, they are of the age that learned it live, as a current event. 

Edited September 12, 2021 by Pimlach

[etiennep99]

I was in another timezone when the first plane hit and I was asleep.  I woke up and took the red pill and haven't looked back. I no longer live in an MSM mind-control haze.  Y'all know where this thought leads, so I'll stop here because I know that 99% of y'all will now attack me, a patriot, yet again.

[grinreaper]

9/11 happened and it affected us all differently in specifics but not so much differently overall. What matters is what we've done about it or will do about it. Up until a few weeks ago we had kept the barbarians a good way from our gates. Not so much anymore. The country which harbored the terrorists 20 years ago had been kept in a pretty impotent position for virtually all of those 20 years. They are not impotent anymore. Lessons learned 20 years ago have most recently been forgotten and I'm afraid that we will be reminded of what we shouldn't have forgotten. 

[Doohicksie]

2 hours ago, etiennep99 said:

I was in another timezone when the first plane hit and I was asleep.  I woke up and took the red pill and haven't looked back. I no longer live in an MSM mind-control haze.  Y'all know where this thought leads, so I'll stop here because I know that 99% of y'all will now attack me, a patriot, yet again.

Anyone who describes themself primarily as a patriot, isn't, and the way you worded it will make any mention of it feel like an attack to you.  So there you go, you self-fulfilling prophecy, you.

Edited September 11, 2021 by Doohickie

[RangerDave]

3 hours ago, Wyldnwoody44 said:

Lastly, I wasn't there and I have no clue exactly how it happened, but if I was on a plane and 4 jackasses pulled boxcutters, I would throat punch all those M *****#rs.

Back then, highjacked planes were not used as weapons, killing everyone on board.  If a plane was highjacked in the US, they usually just wanted to land in someplace like Cuba.  Sometimes it was for money, but it was usually for a political message or action.

The passengers on Flight 93 found out that other planes were used as weapons and flown into buildings.  Knowing that their fate would probably be similar, they decided to act rather than allow themselves to be passive and just crash into a building.

This is why I don't think this kind of thing will happen again.  Too many of us, like you, would not sit idly by but would defend ourselves in whatever way we could.  Even if the terrorists snuck a gun or even a bomb on board, if all the passengers rushed them at once with the intent to  "throat punch" them, we would overwhelm them.  We may all die as a result, but at least we would go down swinging and quite possibly save people at the intended target.

[Marvin]

The last day when everyone thought of me as an American because I was born here was 10 September 2001.  Since then, I daily see people looking at me with suspicion and fear.  My wife was called a terrorist sympathiser at work.  I had death threats put in my mailbox.

I had season tickets to the Sabres and Bills.  Midway through the first quarter of the next Bills game, a security guard came down to me and a friend.  He told us to signal for an escort if we wanted to get up.  I had been on TV during the pregame and several death threats had been phoned into the Bills' main line.  He pointed me to at least 10 guards at the top of the stairs.

At the first Sabres game after 9/11/2001, there was a fight near my section.  The next game, there was extra security.  A guard met me at the entrance to the arena and escorted me to my seat.  I found out that three men had intended to grab me and throw me out of the upper bowl into the lower bowl.  The ushers and men in the area defended me as a real Sabres fan.  Then the fight started.  The three people who had threatened me were charged with attempted murder.  The people who defended me were not charged.  The were extra guards in sections 312-314 the entire season.

When Bush 43 ordered the invasion of Afghanistan, I found out an old friend was working in Kandahar with the civilian population.  When I told me Dad, he told me that his father's family's farm village from before India's partition was near there.  He had me tell my friend how anyone can escape through the mountains into Pakistan if they were captured.  Sikh temples throughout Pakistan were ready to house Allied escapees.

I will be honest.  When I heard a plane had hit the World Trade Center, I thought it had to be fake.  When I saw the carnage, I knew it had to be Bin Laden -- three years before in a news magazine, there was an interview with him entitled, "This Guy Is Dangerous."  I also knew that my life was going to get worse.  My Dad and I talked about me learning Urdu and Arabic so that we could go to Waziristan to kill Bin Laden ourselves.

Interestingly, Buffalo was the top 300 city with the fewest anti-Muslim incidents for the few weeks after 9/11.  In the years since then, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, Baha'is, and others moved to the area from other parts of the country.  All of the congregations of our local houses of worship doubled or even tripled within a year.  People in several local immigrant communities were told that Buffalo was a good place to live because of this.

[Hoss]

3 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

The last day when everyone thought of me as an American because I was born here was 10 September 2001.  Since then, I daily see people looking at me with suspicion and fear.  My wife was called a terrorist sympathiser at work.  I had death threats put in my mailbox.

I had season tickets to the Sabres and Bills.  Midway through the first quarter of the next Bills game, a security guard came down to me and a friend.  He told us to signal for an escort if we wanted to get up.  I had been on TV during the pregame and several death threats had been phoned into the Bills' main line.  He pointed me to at least 10 guards at the top of the stairs.

At the first Sabres game after 9/11/2001, there was a fight near my section.  The next game, there was extra security.  A guard met me at the entrance to the arena and escorted me to my seat.  I found out that three men had intended to grab me and throw me out of the upper bowl into the lower bowl.  The ushers and men in the area defended me as a real Sabres fan.  Then the fight started.  The three people who had threatened me were charged with attempted murder.  The people who defended me were not charged.  The were extra guards in sections 312-314 the entire season.

When Bush 43 ordered the invasion of Afghanistan, I found out an old friend was working in Kandahar with the civilian population.  When I told me Dad, he told me that his father's family's farm village from before India's partition was near there.  He had me tell my friend how anyone can escape through the mountains into Pakistan if they were captured.  Sikh temples throughout Pakistan were ready to house Allied escapees.

I will be honest.  When I heard a plane had hit the World Trade Center, I thought it had to be fake.  When I saw the carnage, I knew it had to be Bin Laden -- three years before in a news magazine, there was an interview with him entitled, "This Guy Is Dangerous."  I also knew that my life was going to get worse.  My Dad and I talked about me learning Urdu and Arabic so that we could go to Waziristan to kill Bin Laden ourselves.

Interestingly, Buffalo was the top 300 city with the fewest anti-Muslim incidents for the few weeks after 9/11.  In the years since then, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, Baha'is, and others moved to the area from other parts of the country.  All of the congregations of our local houses of worship doubled or even tripled within a year.  People in several local immigrant communities were told that Buffalo was a good place to live because of this.

Thank you for sharing your story. This is what I mean when I say America changed forever. The ripple effects will go on forever. I hope your life has more peace than what you were met with in the days, weeks, months and years that followed the attacks.

[drnkirishone]

1 minute ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

The last day when everyone thought of me as an American because I was born here was 10 September 2001.  Since then, I daily see people looking at me with suspicion and fear.  My wife was called a terrorist sympathiser at work.  I had death threats put in my mailbox.

I had season tickets to the Sabres and Bills.  Midway through the first quarter of the next Bills game, a security guard came down to me and a friend.  He told us to signal for an escort if we wanted to get up.  I had been on TV during the pregame and several death threats had been phoned into the Bills' main line.  He pointed me to at least 10 guards at the top of the stairs.

At the first Sabres game after 9/11/2001, there was a fight near my section.  The next game, there was extra security.  A guard met me at the entrance to the arena and escorted me to my seat.  I found out that three men had intended to grab me and throw me out of the upper bowl into the lower bowl.  The ushers and men in the area defended me as a real Sabres fan.  Then the fight started.  The three people who had threatened me were charged with attempted murder.  The people who defended me were not charged.  The were extra guards in sections 312-314 the entire season.

When Bush 43 ordered the invasion of Afghanistan, I found out an old friend was working in Kandahar with the civilian population.  When I told me Dad, he told me that his father's family's farm village from before India's partition was near there.  He had me tell my friend how anyone can escape through the mountains into Pakistan if they were captured.  Sikh temples throughout Pakistan were ready to house Allied escapees.

I will be honest.  When I heard a plane had hit the World Trade Center, I thought it had to be fake.  When I saw the carnage, I knew it had to be Bin Laden -- three years before in a news magazine, there was an interview with him entitled, "This Guy Is Dangerous."  I also knew that my life was going to get worse.  My Dad and I talked about me learning Urdu and Arabic so that we could go to Waziristan to kill Bin Laden ourselves.

Interestingly, Buffalo was the top 300 city with the fewest anti-Muslim incidents for the few weeks after 9/11.  In the years since then, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, Baha'is, and others moved to the area from other parts of the country.  All of the congregations of our local houses of worship doubled or even tripled within a year.  People in several local immigrant communities were told that Buffalo was a good place to live because of this.

I am sorry you had to experience what you did due to misguided and ignorant "patriots".

[grinreaper]

26 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Anyone who describes themself primarily as a patriot, isn't, and the way you worded it will make any mention of it feel like an attack to you.  So there you go, you self-fulfilling prophecy, you.

Let me get this straight. If I'm a patriot I can't call myself one because if I do I won't be a patriot? I hope you didn't really mean what you actually said. 

[Zamboni]

Thank you for sharing your stories of that day and the days, weeks and months that followed. Very impactful. Heartfelt. I salute you. And give you handshakes and hugs. For some it’s still very raw. I feel it in your posts. Don’t ever apologize for what you still think and feel about that day. I’m sure most of us have evolved over time to look back with different lenses than we had on 9/11/2001. 👍🏼

[Digger]

16 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

The last day when everyone thought of me as an American because I was born here was 10 September 2001.  Since then, I daily see people looking at me with suspicion and fear.  My wife was called a terrorist sympathiser at work.  I had death threats put in my mailbox.

I had season tickets to the Sabres and Bills.  Midway through the first quarter of the next Bills game, a security guard came down to me and a friend.  He told us to signal for an escort if we wanted to get up.  I had been on TV during the pregame and several death threats had been phoned into the Bills' main line.  He pointed me to at least 10 guards at the top of the stairs.

At the first Sabres game after 9/11/2001, there was a fight near my section.  The next game, there was extra security.  A guard met me at the entrance to the arena and escorted me to my seat.  I found out that three men had intended to grab me and throw me out of the upper bowl into the lower bowl.  The ushers and men in the area defended me as a real Sabres fan.  Then the fight started.  The three people who had threatened me were charged with attempted murder.  The people who defended me were not charged.  The were extra guards in sections 312-314 the entire season.

When Bush 43 ordered the invasion of Afghanistan, I found out an old friend was working in Kandahar with the civilian population.  When I told me Dad, he told me that his father's family's farm village from before India's partition was near there.  He had me tell my friend how anyone can escape through the mountains into Pakistan if they were captured.  Sikh temples throughout Pakistan were ready to house Allied escapees.

I will be honest.  When I heard a plane had hit the World Trade Center, I thought it had to be fake.  When I saw the carnage, I knew it had to be Bin Laden -- three years before in a news magazine, there was an interview with him entitled, "This Guy Is Dangerous."  I also knew that my life was going to get worse.  My Dad and I talked about me learning Urdu and Arabic so that we could go to Waziristan to kill Bin Laden ourselves.

Interestingly, Buffalo was the top 300 city with the fewest anti-Muslim incidents for the few weeks after 9/11.  In the years since then, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, Baha'is, and others moved to the area from other parts of the country.  All of the congregations of our local houses of worship doubled or even tripled within a year.  People in several local immigrant communities were told that Buffalo was a good place to live because of this.

Thanks for sharing your experiences.  I hope that you and your family are blessed with peace.

I think the fear generated many inappropriate responses.  Still does today. 

[Weave]

46 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

The last day when everyone thought of me as an American because I was born here was 10 September 2001.  Since then, I daily see people looking at me with suspicion and fear.  My wife was called a terrorist sympathiser at work.  I had death threats put in my mailbox.

I had season tickets to the Sabres and Bills.  Midway through the first quarter of the next Bills game, a security guard came down to me and a friend.  He told us to signal for an escort if we wanted to get up.  I had been on TV during the pregame and several death threats had been phoned into the Bills' main line.  He pointed me to at least 10 guards at the top of the stairs.

At the first Sabres game after 9/11/2001, there was a fight near my section.  The next game, there was extra security.  A guard met me at the entrance to the arena and escorted me to my seat.  I found out that three men had intended to grab me and throw me out of the upper bowl into the lower bowl.  The ushers and men in the area defended me as a real Sabres fan.  Then the fight started.  The three people who had threatened me were charged with attempted murder.  The people who defended me were not charged.  The were extra guards in sections 312-314 the entire season.

When Bush 43 ordered the invasion of Afghanistan, I found out an old friend was working in Kandahar with the civilian population.  When I told me Dad, he told me that his father's family's farm village from before India's partition was near there.  He had me tell my friend how anyone can escape through the mountains into Pakistan if they were captured.  Sikh temples throughout Pakistan were ready to house Allied escapees.

I will be honest.  When I heard a plane had hit the World Trade Center, I thought it had to be fake.  When I saw the carnage, I knew it had to be Bin Laden -- three years before in a news magazine, there was an interview with him entitled, "This Guy Is Dangerous."  I also knew that my life was going to get worse.  My Dad and I talked about me learning Urdu and Arabic so that we could go to Waziristan to kill Bin Laden ourselves.

Interestingly, Buffalo was the top 300 city with the fewest anti-Muslim incidents for the few weeks after 9/11.  In the years since then, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, Baha'is, and others moved to the area from other parts of the country.  All of the congregations of our local houses of worship doubled or even tripled within a year.  People in several local immigrant communities were told that Buffalo was a good place to live because of this.

A coworker and good friend of mine, Indian, moved back home rather than continue his career here after repeated abuses out in public after 9/11.  I hope your time is easier now.

[Pimlach]

40 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

The last day when everyone thought of me as an American because I was born here was 10 September 2001.  Since then, I daily see people looking at me with suspicion and fear.  My wife was called a terrorist sympathiser at work.  I had death threats put in my mailbox.

I had season tickets to the Sabres and Bills.  Midway through the first quarter of the next Bills game, a security guard came down to me and a friend.  He told us to signal for an escort if we wanted to get up.  I had been on TV during the pregame and several death threats had been phoned into the Bills' main line.  He pointed me to at least 10 guards at the top of the stairs.

At the first Sabres game after 9/11/2001, there was a fight near my section.  The next game, there was extra security.  A guard met me at the entrance to the arena and escorted me to my seat.  I found out that three men had intended to grab me and throw me out of the upper bowl into the lower bowl.  The ushers and men in the area defended me as a real Sabres fan.  Then the fight started.  The three people who had threatened me were charged with attempted murder.  The people who defended me were not charged.  The were extra guards in sections 312-314 the entire season.

When Bush 43 ordered the invasion of Afghanistan, I found out an old friend was working in Kandahar with the civilian population.  When I told me Dad, he told me that his father's family's farm village from before India's partition was near there.  He had me tell my friend how anyone can escape through the mountains into Pakistan if they were captured.  Sikh temples throughout Pakistan were ready to house Allied escapees.

I will be honest.  When I heard a plane had hit the World Trade Center, I thought it had to be fake.  When I saw the carnage, I knew it had to be Bin Laden -- three years before in a news magazine, there was an interview with him entitled, "This Guy Is Dangerous."  I also knew that my life was going to get worse.  My Dad and I talked about me learning Urdu and Arabic so that we could go to Waziristan to kill Bin Laden ourselves.

Interestingly, Buffalo was the top 300 city with the fewest anti-Muslim incidents for the few weeks after 9/11.  In the years since then, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, Baha'is, and others moved to the area from other parts of the country.  All of the congregations of our local houses of worship doubled or even tripled within a year.  People in several local immigrant communities were told that Buffalo was a good place to live because of this.

Wow.  Thanks for sharing this.  Hopefully it increases awareness in some small way.  
 

Also thanks for sharing about Buffalo.  It has a reputation as “the city of good neighbors”.    Clearly it’s not perfect, but it is comforting to hear there is more to it than marketing.  
 

[Doohicksie]

4 hours ago, grinreaper said:

Let me get this straight. If I'm a patriot I can't call myself one because if I do I won't be a patriot? I hope you didn't really mean what you actually said. 

That's exactly what I said.  People who describe themselves primarily as patriots are anti-government which is decidedly unpatriotic.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

What a story @Marvin, Sabres Fan. So sorry you had to go through all that.

My Brother, we would gladly welcome you and your wife here in Canada.

Peace.

[Hoss]

11 hours ago, Doohickie said:

That's exactly what I said.  People who describe themselves primarily as patriots are anti-government which is decidedly unpatriotic.

Oof. Being anti-government is often the most patriotic thing you can be.

[Marvin]

As someone whose views on patriotism were shaped by Vietnam and Watergate, I try not to question other people's patriotism.  I also try not to use patriotism as a shield.  Also, I have never seen anyone here attack someone for being patriotic.  Just remember that your definition of patriotism may not be universal.

[drnkirishone]

Generally speaking when someone says they are a "patriot" I think of the MERICA meme.

Some people that identify as patriots.

Jan 6th nut jobs that assaulted the capital.

Alex Jones

Most of the Caucasian mass shooters of the past 20 years

[Doohicksie]

7 hours ago, Hoss said:

Oof. Being anti-government is often the most patriotic thing you can be.

 

2 hours ago, drnkirishone said:

Generally speaking when someone says they are a "patriot" I think of the MERICA meme.

Some people that identify as patriots.

Jan 6th nut jobs that assaulted the capital.

Alex Jones

Most of the Caucasian mass shooters of the past 20 years

Exactly.  They call themselves patriots.  They're nut jobs.

[Huckleberry]

I just remeber I was 18 yrs old and playing NHL 2000 with my twin brother, goofing around and I told him lets watch some news.
Turned on CNN and was like , wow Plane flew into a building must be a freak accident, minutes later saw the 2nd plane go in live. 

 I know I felt mad about it for months after, and I still feel like the world has gotten worse.   The bombing of my airport in 2016 really pissed me of, you try to be open minded, but when you have Muslims that worked at the airport here celebrating the bombing and others showing IS vids on whatsapp.   Only thing that gives me hope are the few that go in against those kind of religious beliefs, sadly those are the older muslims and Europe let Wahabism sponsored by Saudia Arabia in to much.

[grinreaper]

On 9/11/2021 at 10:17 PM, Doohickie said:

That's exactly what I said.  People who describe themselves primarily as patriots are anti-government which is decidedly unpatriotic.

While there is such a thing as false patriotism your premise flatly sucks and is as convoluted as can be. It's the equivalent of me saying I'm a man but if I call myself one I can't be one. 

Being anti-government does not mean that you are unpatriotic. 80 years ago the Vichy were the German government's puppet that ruled southern France. There were French partisans that opposed that government and fought against it. Were these anti-government partisans patriots or not? 

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, grinreaper said:

While there is such a thing as false patriotism your premise flatly sucks and is as convoluted as can be. It's the equivalent of me saying I'm a man but if I call myself one I can't be one. 

Being anti-government does not mean that you are unpatriotic. 80 years ago the Vichy were the German government's puppet that ruled southern France. There were French partisans that opposed that government and fought against it. Were these anti-government partisans patriots or not? 

Are you comparing the current government of the US to the Vichy French? Being anti-government alone does not make you a patriot, in makes you an anarchist. 

Are the anti-government partisans currently operating in the US patriots?