Pegulas New Bills Stadium Proposal a Public and Private Partnership

[SDS]

5 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

Can this region, this fan base, actually support/pay the costs associated with a new stadium? I mean once it’s built, which sets aside the matter of public money to build the stadium. I have my doubts.

The average cost of a general admission seat will be $82.14 in 2021, an increase of $7.68 per game. A club seat will average $253.96 per game, an increase of $10.48. Despite that, the Bills expect that they will remain in the bottom quarter of the 32-team league in average pricing.

“We're comparing our 2021 pricing to the other NFL teams’ 2020 pricing, and we're roughly 20% lower than the NFL average, still,” Colleary said.

[JohnC]

8 minutes ago, SDS said:

The average cost of a general admission seat will be $82.14 in 2021, an increase of $7.68 per game. A club seat will average $253.96 per game, an increase of $10.48. Despite that, the Bills expect that they will remain in the bottom quarter of the 32-team league in average pricing.

“We're comparing our 2021 pricing to the other NFL teams’ 2020 pricing, and we're roughly 20% lower than the NFL average, still,” Colleary said.

The majority of revenue comes from TV and other sources. That is shared revenue and should be going up. The revenue coming from attendance goes directly to the individual team. It is important but is not as prominent as other sources of revenue. 

I expect some public funding to a stadium project. I support it and have no problem with it. But a large proportion of the funding should be the responsibility of the main beneficiary. That is the Pegula Enterprise. Now the extended negotiations will begin over the ratio of costs. 

[Zamboni]

2 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The majority of revenue comes from TV and other sources. That is shared revenue and should be going up. The revenue coming from attendance goes directly to the individual team. It is important but is not as prominent as other sources of revenue. 

I expect some public funding to a stadium project. I support it and have no problem with it. But a large proportion of the funding should be the responsibility of the main beneficiary. That is the Pegula Enterprise. Now the extended negotiations will begin over the ratio of costs. 

Yea I personally hope it’s not a dime of taxpayer dollars but I know that’s completely unrealistic 😂

[That Aud Smell]

31 minutes ago, SDS said:

The average cost of a general admission seat will be $82.14 in 2021, an increase of $7.68 per game. A club seat will average $253.96 per game, an increase of $10.48. Despite that, the Bills expect that they will remain in the bottom quarter of the 32-team league in average pricing.

“We're comparing our 2021 pricing to the other NFL teams’ 2020 pricing, and we're roughly 20% lower than the NFL average, still,” Colleary said.

Not sure what to make of this, vis a vis a new stadium.

The NFL worships at the altar of mammon. Greater Buffalo doesn’t have, throw off enough of it. Sentiment, tradition, brand value will only protect this franchise to a point.

[JohnC]

11 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

Yea I personally hope it’s not a dime of taxpayer dollars but I know that’s completely unrealistic 😂

I realize that the request to have the stadium completely publicly funded was the first high bid stand. And from there it will be worked down. I just think that if the Pegula position would have been a lot lower, even as an opening stand, it would have been received more positively. 

[SwampD]

27 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

Not sure what to make of this, vis a vis a new stadium.

The NFL worships at the altar of mammon. Greater Buffalo doesn’t have, throw off enough of it. Sentiment, tradition, brand value will only protect this franchise to a point.

Til

[SDS]

29 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

Not sure what to make of this, vis a vis a new stadium.

The NFL worships at the altar of mammon. Greater Buffalo doesn’t have, throw off enough of it. Sentiment, tradition, brand value will only protect this franchise to a point.

I think the point is that we’re already in the bottom 25% in the NFL. I’ve heard a lot of commentary from a lot of people over a lot of years. Living in Maryland, I can definitely say that the average person in Buffalo does not have a good grasp at the types of prices paid around the league. I have serious doubts about how well the customer base (not the general taxpayer) can support this, including corporate suites.

[PromoTheRobot]

47 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The majority of revenue comes from TV and other sources. That is shared revenue and should be going up. The revenue coming from attendance goes directly to the individual team. It is important but is not as prominent as other sources of revenue. 

I expect some public funding to a stadium project. I support it and have no problem with it. But a large proportion of the funding should be the responsibility of the main beneficiary. That is the Pegula Enterprise. Now the extended negotiations will begin over the ratio of costs. 

You do know that visiting teams get a cut of gate revenue, right? So cheap tickets in Buffalo reduce that revenue by 20%. Should it be a big deal? No, But is it? Yes.

[SDS]

7 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

You do know that visiting teams get a cut of gate revenue, right? So cheap tickets in Buffalo reduce that revenue by 20%. Should it be a big deal? No, But is it? Yes.

I thought the cut was 30%?

[JohnC]

16 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

You do know that visiting teams get a cut of gate revenue, right? So cheap tickets in Buffalo reduce that revenue by 20%. Should it be a big deal? No, But is it? Yes.

Let me be more precise. Most of the money coming from attendance goes to the home owner. Money from boxes or special seating, concessions stays with the home owner. When you look at the overall revenue pie the biggest portion of revenue for each owner doesn't come from attendance. 

[That Aud Smell]

1 hour ago, SDS said:

I think the point is that we’re already in the bottom 25% in the NFL. I’ve heard a lot of commentary from a lot of people over a lot of years. Living in Maryland, I can definitely say that the average person in Buffalo does not have a good grasp at the types of prices paid around the league. I have serious doubts about how well the customer base (not the general taxpayer) can support this, including corporate suites.

I was about to dispute the bolded, until I focused on “average.” I think that’s fair, or at least not unfair.

I further predict that the NFL’s unrelenting pursuit of more (and more!) revenues will be its undoing. They’ll end up sacrificing the intangibles that made the brand(s) what it is (they are).

The NFL is king now. It won’t always be.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, SDS said:

I thought the cut was 30%?

No data on what it is nowadays.  Back in the 90's it was 60-40 for the regular seating but the home team kept all/almost all of the luxury box revenues.

[SDS]

11 minutes ago, Taro T said:

No data on what it is nowadays.  Back in the 90's it was 60-40 for the regular seating but the home team kept all/almost all of the luxury box revenues.

That sounds right.

[PromoTheRobot]

3 hours ago, SDS said:

I thought the cut was 30%?

Around that. But 30% at New England is likely double or more than Buffalo.

[PromoTheRobot]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

Let me be more precise. Most of the money coming from attendance goes to the home owner. Money from boxes or special seating, concessions stays with the home owner. When you look at the overall revenue pie the biggest portion of revenue for each owner doesn't come from attendance. 

Whatever it is, Buffalo will always be the poor sister among the 32, and Kraft and Jones will always cast a jaundiced eye at the Bills.

[JohnC]

17 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Whatever it is, Buffalo will always be the poor sister among the 32, and Kraft and Jones will always cast a jaundiced eye at the Bills.

The issue isn't whether you are at the bottom of the totem pole as it is whether in your own financial stratosphere are you making a sizeable sum of money? With respect to the Pegulas and the Bills the answer is yes. With respect to Kraft and Jones who cares what they think. The system is designed for revenue sharing. It isn't equally distributed but it is distributed to the extent where every owner makes money or should be able to make money. 

[SDS]

7 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The issue isn't whether you are at the bottom of the totem pole as it is whether in your own financial stratosphere are you making a sizeable sum of money? With respect to the Pegulas and the Bills the answer is yes. With respect to Kraft and Jones who cares what they think. The system is designed for revenue sharing. It isn't equally distributed but it is distributed to the extent where every owner makes money or should be able to make money. 

I don't know where you are coming from. Sharing is the exact reason for concern. That want the most shared possible.

[JohnC]

Just now, SDS said:

I don't know where you are coming from. Sharing is the exact reason for concern. That want the most shared possible.

Of course the lesser revenue teams want more in the sharing of revenue. And of course the higher revenue teams want less sharing. That tension shouldn't be surprising between the richer and poorer markets. But my basic point is that even with the tension in the current sharing setup a small market team such as Buffalo within the current system has the ability to be very profitable. That's my basic point. 

[SDS]

9 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Of course the lesser revenue teams want more in the sharing of revenue. And of course the higher revenue teams want less sharing. That tension shouldn't be surprising between the richer and poorer markets. But my basic point is that even with the tension in the current sharing setup a small market team such as Buffalo within the current system has the ability to be very profitable. That's my basic point. 

No. The big markets want to share less, but they want what is shared by other teams to be more. Including bigger markets for TV and merchandise sales. The Cowboys want others to make the most money for everyone as possible. 

[JohnC]

8 minutes ago, SDS said:

No. The big markets want to share less, but they want what is shared by other teams to be more. Including bigger markets for TV and merchandise sales. The Cowboys want others to make the most money for everyone as possible. 

We are not reading each other correctly. I agree that the Cowboys want other teams, including smaller market teams, to make more money. They believe that some markets are not contributing enough to growing the revenue pie. But where I disagree with you is that the Cowboys don't want to share the money that they internally generate from their stadium and ancillary sources. They have a lot more ability to generate money from their stadium with the suites, merchandizing, sponsorships etc. than Buffalo has the potential to generate. 

[SDS]

4 minutes ago, JohnC said:

We are not reading each other correctly. I agree that the Cowboys want other teams, including smaller market teams, to make more money. They believe that some markets are not contributing enough to growing the revenue pie. But where I disagree with you is that the Cowboys don't want to share the money that they internally generate from their stadium and ancillary sources. They have a lot more ability to generate money from their stadium with the suites, merchandizing, sponsorships etc. than Buffalo has the potential to generate. 

The big markets want to share less

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, SDS said:

The big markets want to share less

I agree with that! Either I am not being clear or there is a misinterpretation from my wording. 

[SDS]

Just now, JohnC said:

I agree with that! Either I am not being clear or there is a misinterpretation from my wording. 

It is what I wrote. Check the tape.

[JohnC]

Just now, SDS said:

It is what I wrote. Check the tape.

I'm to fatigued with this round-about to check anything. 

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

The issue isn't whether you are at the bottom of the totem pole as it is whether in your own financial stratosphere are you making a sizeable sum of money? With respect to the Pegulas and the Bills the answer is yes. With respect to Kraft and Jones who cares what they think. The system is designed for revenue sharing. It isn't equally distributed but it is distributed to the extent where every owner makes money or should be able to make money. 

They happen to be the two most influential owners and essentially run the league through Roger Goodell.