Prediction time: will Eichel be traded by the draft, which is on Friday, July 23?

[Radar]

Going against the tide. Voted no. Maybe wishful thinking but I feel it's 50/50 Jack is traded period. Best case scenario for me they extend Rhino and keep Jack. Go out and get a true #1 goaltender. With improvement from our young guys this would be a playoff team. Unfortunately I think Rhino is gone and even odds Jack as well.

 

[ubkev]

Just now, Radar said:

Going against the tide. Voted no. Maybe wishful thinking but I feel it's 50/50 Jack is traded period. Best case scenario for me they extend Rhino and keep Jack. Go out and get a true #1 goaltender. With improvement from our young guys this would be a playoff team. Unfortunately I think Rhino is gone and even odds Jack as well.

 

You went with the tide by a more than 3:2 favor.

[Marvin]

34 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I am one with the force the force is with me i am one with the force the force is with me i am one with the

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

[Curt]

34 minutes ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

I think some of the no voters are like me, you and many others, who have no option in this poll to express that they believe that Jack will not be traded.

Granted some think that the trade will happen later in the summer.

This to me is even more surprising.  He is so clearly going to be traded.

Is it denial?

[Radar]

10 minutes ago, ubkev said:

You went with the tide by a more than 3:2 favor.

Right. Should have said most think Jack will gets traded at some point.

[Curt]

53 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Must be more surprised now. I am 

Yeah, I’m honestly very surprised.  I didn’t realize so many feel that Jack won’t be traded.

I feel like all evidence points to a trade.  This seems like people don’t want him traded and are kind of in willful denial.

[WildCard]

20 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I can sooner get my pop culture references off on this website than twitter, where my references are seemingly 1-2 generations too late and no longer relevant in the pop culture sphere 

I'm 28 so I'm with ya. 

Side note I absolutely loath tik tok

[Sabres Fan in NS]

8 minutes ago, Curt said:

This to me is even more surprising.  He is so clearly going to be traded.

Is it denial?

No.

I think that calmer heads on both sides will prevail.

I predict that neither Jack, nor Samson, are traded for many years to come.  I won't say never, because I can only think of one career Sabre that had a very long career with the team.

[nfreeman]

14 minutes ago, Curt said:

This to me is even more surprising.  He is so clearly going to be traded.

Is it denial?

FWIW, I think KA wants to trade him, but only for a rich package, and the injury creates a very real possibility that no one will offer a rich enough package, which in turn creates the possibility that he starts the season here -- and if that happens, and if the rest/rehab approach has worked, he could look like MVP-level Eichel, which would probably drive up KA's price, creating a longer period for him to play for DG and perhaps enjoy it, or perhaps make KA change his mind about keeping him, and give rise to the possibility of a reconciliation between Eichel and KA.

Is it likely that all those ifs break just the right way so that he ends up staying?  Definitely not.  But possible.

[Curt]

6 minutes ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

No.

I think that calmer heads on both sides will prevail.

I predict that neither Jack, nor Samson, are traded for many years to come.  I won't say never, because I can only think of one career Sabre that had a very long career with the team.

No?  That’s exactly what someone in denial would say!

Seriously, I think he is traded before the end of the month.

All the insiders are reporting that he is currently being shopped and it’s a matter of when and where the trade happens, not if.

When do you think they are going to make up?

[Curt]

10 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

FWIW, I think KA wants to trade him, but only for a rich package, and the injury creates a very real possibility that no one will offer a rich enough package, which in turn creates the possibility that he starts the season here -- and if that happens, and if the rest/rehab approach has worked, he could look like MVP-level Eichel, which would probably drive up KA's price, creating a longer period for him to play for DG and perhaps enjoy it, or perhaps make KA change his mind about keeping him, and give rise to the possibility of a reconciliation between Eichel and KA.

Is it likely that all those ifs break just the right way so that he ends up staying?  Definitely not.  But possible.

Anything is possible, but all the signs are pointing in the opposite direction. I’m just surprised that many think he won’t be traded despite the evidence that both sides want a trade.

[Hoss]

32 minutes ago, Curt said:

This to me is even more surprising.  He is so clearly going to be traded.

Is it denial?

This is a trend that developed in the last week or so but I’m feeling pretty strongly that he’s not getting traded this offseason.

[Hoss]

7 minutes ago, Curt said:

No?  That’s exactly what someone in denial would say!

Seriously, I think he is traded before the end of the month.

All the insiders are reporting that he is currently being shopped and it’s a matter of when and where the trade happens, not if.

When do you think they are going to make up?

I think the insiders have blown this out of proportion. I do believe the end of season pressers have reasonably put this into defcon one because both sides refused to commit to each other and the GM won’t even acknowledge Jack by name but it feels like a lot of gamesmanship.

I DO think Jack Eichel is a complete asshat who I don’t want leading my team but his talent is supreme here. I think he’s acting like this because he realizes a few things: this franchise is and has been putrid, the GM has zero experience and the head coach has zero head coaching experience. He seems to be bullying an experienced group as a 24 year old.

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, nfreeman said:

FWIW, I think KA wants to trade him, but only for a rich package, and the injury creates a very real possibility that no one will offer a rich enough package, which in turn creates the possibility that he starts the season here -- and if that happens, and if the rest/rehab approach has worked, he could look like MVP-level Eichel, which would probably drive up KA's price, creating a longer period for him to play for DG and perhaps enjoy it, or perhaps make KA change his mind about keeping him, and give rise to the possibility of a reconciliation between Eichel and KA.

Is it likely that all those ifs break just the right way so that he ends up staying?  Definitely not.  But possible.

Here's the thing, we've been at this for two straight months of multiple Insiders feeding reports of ongoing talks and more or less guaranteeing he will be traded. These insiders have not backed off from this message in the slightest.

As recently as last week, Adams more or less confirmed these rumours with his silence about Jack while talking about the future.

The situation with Jack's injury existed when the "auction" started.

My question to you is if your scenario is true, why haven't we heard — two months later — that teams' interest has cooled or wasn't high in the first place, or Adams leaking or making a public statement along the lines of "we are preparing to approach this fall as if Jack Eichel is a Sabre?"

I'd say it's because there is interest in spite of the injury. And that interest is rich enough to keep Adams at the table.

Personally, I think the Sabres are prepared to take Comtois/3OA/+ or Turcotte/8OA/+ or whatever is the best offer currently in front of them, but they are holding out in order to maximize the +, or in hopes they can get another team to beat it.

Edited July 9, 2021 by dudacek

[nfreeman]

4 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Here's the thing, we've been at this for two straight months of multiple Insiders feeding reports of ongoing talks and more or less guaranteeing he will be traded. These insiders have not backed off from this message in the slightest.

As recently as last week, Adams more or less confirmed these rumours with his silence about Jack while talking about the future.

The situation with Jack's injury existed when the "auction" started.

My question to you is if your scenario is true, why haven't we heard — two months later — that teams' interest has cooled, or Adams leaking or making a public statement along the lines of "we are preparing to approach this fall as if Jack Eichel is a Sabre?"

I'd say it's because there is interest in spite of the injury. And that interest is rich enough to keep Adams at the table.

Personally, I think the Sabres are prepared to take Comtois/3OA/+ or Turcotte/8OA/+ or whatever is the best offer currently in front of them, but they are holding out in order to maximize the +, or in hopes they can get another team to beat it.

 

I agree with much of this, but I think the bolded is not correct.  There have been multiple reports from credible hockey writers that the injury is a major concern.

Scott Burnside: https://theathletic.com/2690216/2021/07/07/is-this-the-nhls-summer-of-the-blockbuster-here-are-5-stars-who-could-be-traded/?article_source=search&search_query=eichel

Quote

And then there is the neck injury that cost Eichel half a season and which must be resolved before any deal is finalized.

Michael Russo:  https://theathletic.com/2689856/2021/07/06/wild-fan-survey-3-0-results-whats-it-worth-to-get-eichel-how-hard-to-push-in-kaprizov-talks/?article_source=search&search_query=eichel

Quote

And, I’m with the fans: Sending two blue-chip prospects and multiple firsts back for Eichel, who has a number of red flags starting with a neck injury that must be remedied, makes little sense.

 

Elliotte Friedman:  https://info.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/another-issue-emerges-in-potential-jack-eichel-trade?fbclid=IwAR3sAHiGBDbNhUVe1PJheQ5PygTDOkobM33YAWWENpgzEFdfW_tA8cbQVqA

Quote

While the injury wasn’t supposed to be an issue in a potential trade, now with time passing on, Sportsnet’s Elliotte Friedman believes this has become another issue in trade talks.  In his latest 31 Thoughts podcast, Friedman reveals how interested teams might get out of the Eichel sweepstakes. 

“I think the only thing that’s suddenly becoming an issue here is, if you don’t do this soon, is the acquiring team going to be comfortable that Eichel is going to have enough time to recover to be ready for next year?” 

 

 

As for the reason KA hasn't said that he is assuming Eichel will remain a Sabre, this could simply be him trying to pump up the bidding frenzy -- i.e. trying to make the other GMs think that they are going to miss the boat if they don't pony up their crown jewels in the next 2 weeks.

And while you are right that KA may simply be trying to squeeze more out of the interested buyers, it's also possible that he hasn't taken Comtois/3OA or the other offers because those offers may be contingent on the buyer getting comfortable with Eichel's health status, which KA may not want to agree to, or the offers may otherwise not be real.

We'll see.

[dudacek]

36 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

 

I agree with much of this, but I think the bolded is not correct.  There have been multiple reports from credible hockey writers that the injury is a major concern.

Scott Burnside: https://theathletic.com/2690216/2021/07/07/is-this-the-nhls-summer-of-the-blockbuster-here-are-5-stars-who-could-be-traded/?article_source=search&search_query=eichel

Michael Russo:  https://theathletic.com/2689856/2021/07/06/wild-fan-survey-3-0-results-whats-it-worth-to-get-eichel-how-hard-to-push-in-kaprizov-talks/?article_source=search&search_query=eichel

Elliotte Friedman:  https://info.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/another-issue-emerges-in-potential-jack-eichel-trade?fbclid=IwAR3sAHiGBDbNhUVe1PJheQ5PygTDOkobM33YAWWENpgzEFdfW_tA8cbQVqA

 

As for the reason KA hasn't said that he is assuming Eichel will remain a Sabre, this could simply be him trying to pump up the bidding frenzy -- i.e. trying to make the other GMs think that they are going to miss the boat if they don't pony up their crown jewels in the next 2 weeks.

And while you are right that KA may simply be trying to squeeze more out of the interested buyers, it's also possible that he hasn't taken Comtois/3OA or the other offers because those offers may be contingent on the buyer getting comfortable with Eichel's health status, which KA may not want to agree to, or the offers may otherwise not be real.

We'll see.

I'm certainly not saying it's not a concern, or pertinent.

But to be clear, Burnside states the obvious, Russo offers his personal opinion, and Friedman was relaying the words of executive indicating his team is ready to deal but not willing to wait for the Sabres forever to make the deal because they want to start Jack rehabbing sooner rather than later. None of them are saying Eichel is probably not going to be traded.

The bolded could be the case, but if Adams truly is trying to sell damage goods in bad faith, we're more ***** than ever.

Edited July 9, 2021 by dudacek

[Hoss]

57 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Here's the thing, we've been at this for two straight months of multiple Insiders feeding reports of ongoing talks and more or less guaranteeing he will be traded. These insiders have not backed off from this message in the slightest.

As recently as last week, Adams more or less confirmed these rumours with his silence about Jack while talking about the future.

The situation with Jack's injury existed when the "auction" started.

My question to you is if your scenario is true, why haven't we heard — two months later — that teams' interest has cooled or wasn't high in the first place, or Adams leaking or making a public statement along the lines of "we are preparing to approach this fall as if Jack Eichel is a Sabre?"

I'd say it's because there is interest in spite of the injury. And that interest is rich enough to keep Adams at the table.

Personally, I think the Sabres are prepared to take Comtois/3OA/+ or Turcotte/8OA/+ or whatever is the best offer currently in front of them, but they are holding out in order to maximize the +, or in hopes they can get another team to beat it.

We have heard several reports of teams’ interest cooling and insiders have backed off multiple times. Some going from saying a trade was days away to a month+ away “if it happens.”

EDIT: freeman, a poster who I have a deep history of agreeing with, provided some evidence of this already which you responded to. I think there’s been some backing off that’s a bit deeper than those posts and comes down to a shift in tone.

Edited July 9, 2021 by Hoss

[dudacek]

4 minutes ago, Hoss said:

We have heard several reports of teams’ interest cooling and insiders have backed off multiple times. Some going from saying a trade was days away to a month+ away “if it happens.”

I've seen "Columbus is out" "the Kings were never seriously in" "the Avs are now in" "watch the Ducks" and all kinds of particular specific rumours like that.

I have yet to see a report that general interest has cooled, or an "if it happens." The reports have been the Sanres want to trade him, numerous teams have interest, some have serious interest and talks have been/continue to be ongoing.

If Minnesota firmly has Rossi off the table and the Sabres are just as firmly not interested in a deal that doesn't include him, then talks won't be ongoing two months later. There must still be common ground with at least one team where a deal can be made.

[Hoss]

7 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I've seen "Columbus is out" "the Kings were never seriously in" "the Avs are now in" "watch the Ducks" and all kinds of particular specific rumours like that.

I have yet to see a report that general interest has cooled, or an "if it happens." The reports have been the Sanres want to trade him, numerous teams have interest, some have serious interest and talks have been/continue to be ongoing.

If Minnesota firmly has Rossi off the table and the Sabres are just as firmly not interested in a deal that doesn't include him, then talks won't be ongoing two months later. There must still be common ground with at least one team where a deal can be made.

We’ve also seen Dreger say he doesn’t believe the Ducks are as in as they’re reported to be. I think you’re demanding something too specific. If you hear several teams aren’t willing to go where the Sabres need them to go and/or aren’t as interested then that’s a reflection that the general interest either wasn’t as high as reported or is going down.

I’m not saying this is all the truth of what’s going on vs teams using the media to negotiate but more just saying what you’re saying isn’t there is definitely there in these reports.

[Digger]

7 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I've seen "Columbus is out" "the Kings were never seriously in" "the Avs are now in" "watch the Ducks" and all kinds of particular specific rumours like that.

I have yet to see a report that general interest has cooled, or an "if it happens." The reports have been the Sanres want to trade him, numerous teams have interest, some have serious interest and talks have been/continue to be ongoing.

If Minnesota firmly has Rossi off the table and the Sabres are just as firmly not interested in a deal that doesn't include him, then talks won't be ongoing two months later. There must still be common ground with at least one team where a deal can be made.

But how much stock do you put into these reports?  I think this is all part of the negotiations between the teams trying to get the best deal.  

I'm surprised the Sabres haven't leaked it that they plan on keeping Eichel through rehab just to keep upping the offers. 

I still expect this trade to happen after the expansion draft.  Insiders information is suspect in my opinion.  We absolutely need to get at least one A+ prospect for him and a top pick.  Still have faith in that occurring.  

[Digger]

7 minutes ago, Hoss said:

We’ve also seen Dreger say he doesn’t believe the Ducks are as in as they’re reported to be. I think you’re demanding something too specific. If you hear several teams aren’t willing to go where the Sabres need them to go and/or aren’t as interested then that’s a reflection that the general interest either wasn’t as high as reported or is going down.

I’m not saying this is all the truth of what’s going on vs teams using the media to negotiate but more just saying what you’re saying isn’t there is definitely there in these reports.

Dreger was also on the Instigators and said that he thought the Sabres might be asking for too much (which was his personal opinion and not based on anything from a team source).  The next day it was reported as a fact by WGR that the Sabres were asking too much.

[dudacek]

I believe Dreger is a master of trying to make it sound like he knows things when he doesn't and that Lebrun heavily traffics in favour-trading and butt-kissing his sources.

I also believe the vast majority of what McKenzie, Friedman, Lebrun and Dreger talk to real NHL sources and what they report is an accurate depiction of what they've been told. As you point out with the WGR example, you have to listen to what they are actually saying.

I believe the majority of what they've been told has been relayed by a 2nd-hand source, or a source with an agenda, but I also believe they are trying to inform to the best of their abilities and that their credibility is important to them.

So when they say "I'm being told the price is too high" I believe that they have been told that. And when they say "the Kings are still in," I think they have reason to believe it to be true.

So the volume of what we are hearing may be, as @nfreeman suggests, the Sabres, or Eichel's camp trying to create the impression of feeding frenzy in an effort to spark one, or it may be other GMs trying to pressure Adams to bend and take a lowball offer.

But, either way, at least one party is very actively looking to trade or trade for Eichel.

If it is just Eichel's camp leading that push, then there is a pretty good chance Eichel is not traded by the draft because he doesn't have a heckuvalot of power right now.

But if there is a team leading that push, then I think there will be a deal soon, and if that team is only the Sabres, I'm skeptical we're going to like the results.

I'm praying the buyers are as interested as the sellers and that Adams is able capitalize.

Edited July 9, 2021 by dudacek

[klos1963]

3 hours ago, Curt said:

Anything is possible, but all the signs are pointing in the opposite direction. I’m just surprised that many think he won’t be traded despite the evidence that both sides want a trade.

He's definitely gone. If he wasn't going to get traded, KA and Granato would have been very clear that they're looking forward to Eichel on the team for years to come. They don't even mention his name anymore.

I think it will suck that he's traded, but it would be the most surprising thing if he wasn't.

[klos1963]

4 hours ago, Hoss said:

This is a trend that developed in the last week or so but I’m feeling pretty strongly that he’s not getting traded this offseason.

I think the only circumstance that he's not traded is that Adams made it clear that he won't trade him unless he gets what he wants, that he won't settle for less to just make the trade happen.

[Digger]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

I believe Dreger is a master of trying to make it sound like he knows things when he doesn't and that Lebrun heavily traffics in favour-trading and butt-kissing his sources.

I also believe the vast majority of what McKenzie, Friedman, Lebrun and Dreger talk to real NHL sources and what they report is an accurate depiction of what they've been told. As you point out with the WGR example, you have to listen to what they are actually saying.

I believe the majority of what they've been told has been relayed by a 2nd-hand source, or a source with an agenda, but I also believe they are trying to inform to the best of their abilities and that their credibility is important to them.

So when they say "I'm being told the price is too high" I believe that they have been told that. And when they say "the Kings are still in," I think they have reason to believe it to be true.

So the volume of what we are hearing may be, as @nfreeman suggests, the Sabres, or Eichel's camp trying to create the impression of feeding frenzy in an effort to spark one, or it may be other GMs trying to pressure Adams to bend and take a lowball offer.

But, either way, at least one party is very actively looking to trade or trade for Eichel.

If it is just Eichel's camp leading that push, then there is a pretty good chance Eichel is not traded by the draft because he doesn't have a heckuvalot of power right now.

But if there is a team leading that push, then I think there will be a deal soon, and if that team is only the Sabres, I'm skeptical we're going to like the results.

I'm praying the buyers are as interested as the sellers and that Adams is able capitalize.

I agree pretty much with what you wrote.  They (McKenzie, Friedman, Lebrun and Dreger) definitely get some great info from inside sources and they do provide good entertainment for us as fans while we are waiting for some news to come out (from behind closed doors).  My point was just that they do add their own personal opinions quite often.  McKenzie is the exception because he tends to stick more to real info from sources usually only reporting when a deal is close to being done. 

Most of what I've been reading is that no team wants to give up any of their top prospects for Eichel.  This sounds like the O'Reilly deal all over again which we can't afford.  Sabres need to stay patient and hold out for a top line center prospect even if it happens after the draft.  I still have faith this will work out as a fair deal.