Dreger: Expects Sabres Head Coach will be hired next week

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, Mustache of God said:

Dreger is 100% paid for his radio appearances. He doesn't show up at the same time every week out of the kindness of his heart. He shows up because they've contracted him for his time for the segment. 

 

Thanks for the information. 

[PerreaultForever]

5 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

And if you're suggesting we can somehow lose 130 points of offense totally roughly 50ish goals and still win games, we can't. 

But we don't, because it comes from other places and the people you bring in. It just isn't concentrated on 2 or 3 guys necessarily but maybe spread through the team.

Often, 2 25 goal scorers will take a team further than 1 50 goal scorer to simplify the argument. Also if you bring in great defenders/checkers/goalies maybe you win 2-1 instead of losing 5-4. Less points, more wins. 

[LGR4GM]

6 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

But we don't, because it comes from other places and the people you bring in. It just isn't concentrated on 2 or 3 guys necessarily but maybe spread through the team.

Often, 2 25 goal scorers will take a team further than 1 50 goal scorer to simplify the argument. Also if you bring in great defenders/checkers/goalies maybe you win 2-1 instead of losing 5-4. Less points, more wins. 

Your math doesn't work. The Sabres scored 138 goals last year, 4th worse in the entire league. You can bring in great defenders and goalies all you want but you have a team that currently does not score enough goals to be NHL relevant. You are talking replacing 1/3 of the Sabres total goals and to do that in the aggregate will be difficult. We also are ignoring the amount of assists Eichel creates in this scenario so there's that to consider. We are most likely going to be worse next year if you trade both Eichel and Reinhart because it is highly unlikely the pieces you get back equal 50 goals and 75 assists. 

You won't win games 2-1. You will lose games 3-1. You are going to get less wins straight up because any drop in the already abysmal goal scoring on this team just hurts you that much more. The best goals against is the Islanders with 128. Not only do they play some of the BORINGEST hockey ever but even they scored almost 20 more goals than Buffalo. So if we remove 50 goals and only replace say 40, we are still far far behind even if we were the Islanders. 

You have to add goals to this roster as well as fix the goaltending. Your idea simply won't work unless you gut the entire team and rebuild it to be an Islanders clone. 

Edited June 28, 2021 by LGR4GM

[PerreaultForever]

11 minutes ago, LTS said:

Trotz turned the Islanders completely around in 1 season with pretty much the same lineup and has kept them there.

I don't think anybody here would disagree that Trotz is one of the best coaches in the NHL, perhaps all time, and he makes teams over achieve regularly. The point would be we didn't try to hire him when Washington let him go, just like we never tried to hire Quenneville. We hire rookies and unknowns. It's just dumb. 

[PerreaultForever]

3 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Your math doesn't work. The Sabres scored 138 goals last year, 4th worse in the entire league. You can bring in great defenders and goalies all you want but you have a team that currently does not score enough goals to be NHL relevant. 

You won't win games 2-1. You will lose games 3-1. You are going to get less wins straight up because any drop in the already abysmal goal scoring on this team just hurts you that much more. The best goals against is the Islanders with 128. Not only do they play some of the BORINGEST hockey ever but even they scored almost 20 more goals than Buffalo. So if we remove 50 goals and only replace say 40, we are still far far behind even if we were the Islanders. 

You have to add goals to this roster as well as fix the goaltending. Your idea simply won't work unless you gut the entire team and rebuild it to be an Islanders clone. 

Okay, but it's NOT a math problem.

But to counter on your terms for the heck of it, the math does work. The Islanders lost 84 scoring points off their roster and then went on to gain 23 points in the standings. the math works. 

so yes, I am gutting the team, that is what I am suggesting. I'm tired of losing, and I will take so called boring hockey if it gets us to game 7 conference finals and maybe even the cup. 

[LGR4GM]

The issue is Buffalo must both add goals and subtract goals against or the playoffs will continue to be a myth for the Buffalo Sabres. 138 goals is at a minimum 25 goals too low and 199 goals against is around 40 goals too high. Teams that make the playoffs almost all have a positive goal differential and the occasional outlier doesn't survive long. 

Just now, PerreaultForever said:

Okay, but it's NOT a math problem.

But to counter on your terms for the heck of it, the math does work. The Islanders lost 84 scoring points off their roster and then went on to gain 23 points in the standings. the math works. 

so yes, I am gutting the team, that is what I am suggesting. I'm tired of losing, and I will take so called boring hockey if it gets us to game 7 conference finals and maybe even the cup. 

Yes, it is a math problem. You must get a positive goal differential and your solution is playing lockdown defense while maintaining the current level of production AND it will not work. 

The Islanders lost 84 points, we are talking about upwards of 130 points. (85 points for Eichel and 55 for Reinhart)

[PerreaultForever]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

Yes, it is a math problem. You must get a positive goal differential and your solution is playing lockdown defense while maintaining the current level of production AND it will not work. 

You're looking at half my argument and trying to spin it for your narrative. Nowhere am I suggesting the current level of production is adequate. I expect more production from Cozens, Mitts, etc etc whoever is on this roster and the new guys be they Rossi or Zegras or Dach or whoever. 

I'm suggesting a new team approach is the answer and it's time for the failed less than dynamic duo to no longer be the focus of this franchise. 

Every year there's examples of teams without star power (or less star power) going further in the playoffs than expected and star power teams with early exits. Idk how many times we need to have this argument, I guess every season until we start winning. We are clearly oil and water. 

[LGR4GM]

The Islanders went from a 268goals to 224 goals after the Tavares trade but they went from 296 to 196 for goals against. They completely changed how they played hockey and went into a counter attack trap system. They went 192/193 the next season and 156/128 this season. They have won 3 playoff rounds since. I don't believe for a second Buffalo has the personnel or the coach (not sure that coach is even hirable) to replicate the Islanders style of hockey which has had limited success in the 3 years it has been run.  Further the Islanders even while losing Tavares never dipped below the level the Sabres score at. When Eichel gets traded we have to add back his production and more to be a competitive team . 

[PerreaultForever]

8 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

The Islanders lost 84 points, we are talking about upwards of 130 points. (85 points for Eichel and 55 for Reinhart)

Oh please weren't not. Islanders got NOTHING for Tavares. We will get producers for those two guys. Or at least we should. 

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

You're looking at half my argument and trying to spin it for your narrative. Nowhere am I suggesting the current level of production is adequate. I expect more production from Cozens, Mitts, etc etc whoever is on this roster and the new guys be they Rossi or Zegras or Dach or whoever. 

I'm suggesting a new team approach is the answer and it's time for the failed less than dynamic duo to no longer be the focus of this franchise. 

Every year there's examples of teams without star power (or less star power) going further in the playoffs than expected and star power teams with early exits. Idk how many times we need to have this argument, I guess every season until we start winning. We are clearly oil and water. 

And every year the teams without stars are eliminated. Montreal would be the first team in a decade at least to win without a superstar forward. 

I am not ignoring your argument, I am telling you that the math doesn't work without significant additional scoring coming from somewhere. At the same time the team must also severely cut scoring against. 

1 minute ago, PerreaultForever said:

Oh please weren't not. Islanders got NOTHING for Tavares. We will get producers for those two guys. Or at least we should. 

We might eventually. But if we get 3oa and Comtois you have only replaced half of Eichel's production while waiting for 3oa to develop. Thats just the reality of what we are doing. 

[PerreaultForever]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

The Islanders went from a 268goals to 224 goals after the Tavares trade but they went from 296 to 196 for goals against. They completely changed how they played hockey and went into a counter attack trap system. They went 192/193 the next season and 156/128 this season. They have won 3 playoff rounds since. I don't believe for a second Buffalo has the personnel or the coach (not sure that coach is even hirable) to replicate the Islanders style of hockey which has had limited success in the 3 years it has been run.  Further the Islanders even while losing Tavares never dipped below the level the Sabres score at. When Eichel gets traded we have to add back his production and more to be a competitive team . 

Well, we have a philosophical disagreement in terms of direction. Personally, I don't believe we can win any time soon without trying to follow this model. 

[LGR4GM]

You said "it's about winning games, not guys with points" and my point is that we don't have enough points to win games and will be more in the hole after the Eichel trade. 

Just now, PerreaultForever said:

Well, we have a philosophical disagreement in terms of direction. Personally, I don't believe we can win any time soon without trying to follow this model. 

Following the Islanders model is a terrible idea unless we suddenly change how and who we draft. Owen Power for example would be a bad defender to have in that model because it forces him to defend more than rush up the ice much in the same way Krueger tried to neuter Dahlin. The team isn't built to run that Islander model.

[LGR4GM]

We can eventually win the Eichel trade but unless Zegras is part of the return it will be a few years before we see that. Honestly I think this team will be better next year for the simple reason Krueger was an awful coach and growth from young guys will help. 

[PerreaultForever]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

And every year the teams without stars are eliminated. Montreal would be the first team in a decade at least to win without a superstar forward. 

I am not ignoring your argument, I am telling you that the math doesn't work without significant additional scoring coming from somewhere. At the same time the team must also severely cut scoring against. 

We might eventually. But if we get 3oa and Comtois you have only replaced half of Eichel's production while waiting for 3oa to develop. Thats just the reality of what we are doing. 

idk about you but I'd rather have a NYI or Montreal run and lose in the end than marvel at Eichel's great abilities and not make the playoffs. 

 

Islanders were one lucky bounce away from eliminating Tampa, a team that really nobody should be able to beat with thier taxation cap advantages combined with their cap cheating. Nobody else gets to hold that much talent in one place. If the league doesn't address it, we will have to get used to many Tampa cups. We can't compete with that on any level ever. 

3 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

You said "it's about winning games, not guys with points" and my point is that we don't have enough points to win games and will be more in the hole after the Eichel trade. 

Following the Islanders model is a terrible idea unless we suddenly change how and who we draft. Owen Power for example would be a bad defender to have in that model because it forces him to defend more than rush up the ice much in the same way Krueger tried to neuter Dahlin. The team isn't built to run that Islander model.

exactly. the team is BUILT WRONG. and this is our one opportunity to change that. 

Will we? I doubt it very much. The Krakhouse awaits. 

[LGR4GM]

Just now, PerreaultForever said:

idk about you but I'd rather have a NYI or Montreal run and lose in the end than marvel at Eichel's great abilities and not make the playoffs. 

 

Islanders were one lucky bounce away from eliminating Tampa, a team that really nobody should be able to beat with thier taxation cap advantages combined with their cap cheating. Nobody else gets to hold that much talent in one place. If the league doesn't address it, we will have to get used to many Tampa cups. We can't compete with that on any level ever. 

It isn't about Eichel...  It is about the production he brings. You can't take 85 points from the worst scoring team in hockey and tell me we will be better (eventually) or it isn't about the points. It is about the points. It has always been about scoring points and we don't score enough to even be an Islander like team. 

Every team that makes it to the finals is always one bounce away from not making it. Montreal was 1 bounce away from Vegas winning the series. The Islanders were outplayed heavily in that final game and had no real hope of winning without their own lucky bounce. 

The Sabre cannot become the Islanders. The do not even have the minimal scoring it would take to be them. 

[LGR4GM]

The final thing I will say on this is that your OP was about points. Let's say we trade Eichel and Reinhart and make up their lost points in the aggregate of 4 players. We are still another 20-30 goals away from being at the Islanders level of scoring and that is without addressing the defense and goaltending requirements. We must add more scoring after Eichel goes and continue to add it or we will continue to suck at the bottom of the league. 

[SDS]

10 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

The final thing I will say on this is that your OP was about points. Let's say we trade Eichel and Reinhart and make up their lost points in the aggregate of 4 players. We are still another 20-30 goals away from being at the Islanders level of scoring and that is without addressing the defense and goaltending requirements. We must add more scoring after Eichel goes and continue to add it or we will continue to suck at the bottom of the league. 

Honestly, it’s really hard to believe you’re getting pushback on this.

[WildCard]

5. Last week was quieter on the Jack Eichel front, but I’d expect that to get going once again when Buffalo hires its head coach. Incumbent Don Granato and Rick Tocchet are among the contenders.

From Friedman's 31 Thoughts 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/31-thoughts-blackhawks-must-publicly-address-sexual-assault-allegations/

[PromoTheRobot]

Just now, WildCard said:

5. Last week was quieter on the Jack Eichel front, but I’d expect that to get going once again when Buffalo hires its head coach. Incumbent Don Granato and Rick Tocchet are among the contenders.

From Friedman's 31 Thoughts 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/31-thoughts-blackhawks-must-publicly-address-sexual-assault-allegations/

Tocchet? 

[WildCard]

23. Had a chance last week to chat with new Columbus head coach Brad Larsen, who was promoted from within. One of the things we discussed was how incredibly difficult it can be to move from assistant coach to head coach on the same team. You go from good cop to bad cop, and players can see that as phony. Rod Brind’Amour is one of the very few who made it work.

 

From Friedman's 31 Thoughts

[Marvin]

For those with more information, is it possible that both the Sabres and Jack Eichel have a change of heart if his neck is actually healing slowly, but not fast enough for him, and the Sabres get a coach that he's excited about?  Or is it already bust?  It looks like they both considered this last year, so I imagine it is already beyond repair.

Oddly, with no one in the arenas most of the year, last off-season was the prime time to trade Jack Eichel because it would not have affected attendance.

[LGR4GM]

45 minutes ago, WildCard said:

5. Last week was quieter on the Jack Eichel front, but I’d expect that to get going once again when Buffalo hires its head coach. Incumbent Don Granato and Rick Tocchet are among the contenders.

From Friedman's 31 Thoughts 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/31-thoughts-blackhawks-must-publicly-address-sexual-assault-allegations/

Tochett... meh

[pi2000]

4 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I think Rolston is a reasonable hire because of how young the team is. Thank you for laying out your thoughts. 

fixed

[Marvin]

Cascading @LGR4GM's original and @PerreaultForever's response.

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

..

Following the Islanders model is a terrible idea unless we suddenly change how and who we draft. Owen Power for example would be a bad defender to have in that model because it forces him to defend more than rush up the ice much in the same way Krueger tried to neuter Dahlin. The team isn't built to run that Islander model.

2 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

...

exactly. the team is BUILT WRONG. and this is our one opportunity to change that. 

Will we? I doubt it very much. The Krakhouse awaits. 

Waitaminnit, waitaminnit, waitaminnit. 

If you are arguing that the teams is built wrong as a response to Dahlin being neutered by Kruger, are you arguing some variation that Dahlin is part of the improper building?  It sure looks that way.

[PerreaultForever]

4 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

It isn't about Eichel...  It is about the production he brings. You can't take 85 points from the worst scoring team in hockey and tell me we will be better (eventually) or it isn't about the points. It is about the points. It has always been about scoring points and we don't score enough to even be an Islander like team. 

Every team that makes it to the finals is always one bounce away from not making it. Montreal was 1 bounce away from Vegas winning the series. The Islanders were outplayed heavily in that final game and had no real hope of winning without their own lucky bounce. 

The Sabre cannot become the Islanders. The do not even have the minimal scoring it would take to be them. 

Well in fairness, we're not much of anything. We're the worst team in hockey. Continuing on with the same core will yield the same results. You want to do that? If so, enjoy. You won't have to worry about arguing with me about new directions, I will be gone.