John Wawrow says the Coaching Search Should be Completed Within the Week

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

So you were talking about "young" players. Ullmark is a 27 year old 7 year veteran. He's not some 22 year old kid. 

You are being overly punctilious.🤡 

[LGR4GM]

Once you hit 25 in the NHL you are middle age. 31 and up is old age. Sure someone will be like "WHAT ABOUT THIS GUY WHO's 36 AND STILL GOOD!!??" but in reality the age curve for forwards and defenders on average is in decline at 31.

I say all this because like with Ristolainen, we can't keep assuming some of the 25, 26, 27 year olds we have will suddenly be better. They either are what they are or are about to start their decline with only rare exceptions bucking that trend. 

Tage Thompson is about to a be a middle aged NHL player. This year is really a make or break because if he doesn't breakout, he's statistically unlikely to and we will know exactly what we have. I personally think we already know what tage is. 

Just now, JohnC said:

You are being overly punctilious.🤡 

No I am trying not to deal with the Risto thing again where the guy was 25 and a 6 year NHL veteran and ppl were talking about his potential and how he's still young and a growing kid. They aren't and we need to adjust our thinking accordingly. 

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Once you hit 25 in the NHL you are middle age. 31 and up is old age. Sure someone will be like "WHAT ABOUT THIS GUY WHO's 36 AND STILL GOOD!!??" but in reality the age curve for forwards and defenders on average is in decline at 31.

I say all this because like with Ristolainen, we can't keep assuming some of the 25, 26, 27 year olds we have will suddenly be better. They either are what they are or are about to start their decline with only rare exceptions bucking that trend. 

Tage Thompson is about to a be a middle aged NHL player. This year is really a make or break because if he doesn't breakout, he's statistically unlikely to and we will know exactly what we have. I personally think we already know what tage is. 

No I am trying not to deal with the Risto thing again where the guy was 25 and a 6 year NHL veteran and ppl were talking about his potential and how he's still young and a growing kid. They aren't and we need to adjust our thinking accordingly. 

When discussing goaltenders in contrast to forwards they have a much longer lifespan from productive standpoint. And with respect to Tage tall and long lean players take much longer than normal because it takes longer to physically fill out. 

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, JohnC said:

When discussing goaltenders in contrast to forwards they have a much longer lifespan from productive standpoint. And with respect to Tage tall and long lean players take much longer than normal because it takes longer to physically fill out. 

But my point is not about their lifespan. It is about considering Ullmark young with some magical unforeseen ability still to come... he is what he is at this point and is not "young". 

Tage's issue is not about filling out his body but about how he processes the game. He can have this year but after that, he's basically the player he's going to be. 

[JohnC]

4 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

But my point is not about their lifespan. It is about considering Ullmark young with some magical unforeseen ability still to come... he is what he is at this point and is not "young". 

Tage's issue is not about filling out his body but about how he processes the game. He can have this year but after that, he's basically the player he's going to be. 

Ullmark has steadily moved up the ranks from a developmental standpoint. I have never categorized him as a player with magical unforeseen ability (your words). What he has done is work his way up the system from the bottom to a credible starting goaltender. He's not elite and will never be. But it is not unreasonable to believe that he is a credible starting NHL net minder. 

I agree with you that this is a make or break year for Thompson to show what his talent level is. 

[LGR4GM]

3 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Ullmark has steadily moved up the ranks from a developmental standpoint. I have never categorized him as a player with magical unforeseen ability (your words). What he has done is work his way up the system from the bottom to a credible starting goaltender. He's not elite and will never be. But it is not unreasonable to believe that he is a credible starting NHL net minder. 

I agree with you that this is a make or break year for Thompson to show what his talent level is. 

You are missing the point. You called Ullmark young while talking about bringing in vets. He isn't young and is in fact a veteran NHL player with a seasoned progression through the NHL ranks and years of NHL experience. 

I don't care how someone values him as a player I care about the young moniker, that was my sole comment. 

[LGR4GM]

And again I am harping on this because Ristolainen was called young as recently as this year and he isn't either. These are NHL veteran players. 

[JohnC]

Just now, LGR4GM said:

You are missing the point. You called Ullmark young while talking about bringing in vets. He isn't young and is in fact a veteran NHL player with a seasoned progression through the NHL ranks and years of NHL experience. 

I don't care how someone values him as a player I care about the young moniker, that was my sole comment. 

You are missing the point. Ullmark is relatively young and with a longer lifespan than exists for other positions. There is no need to belabor the point. We just disagree. No big deal. 

[LGR4GM]

6 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You are missing the point. Ullmark is relatively young and with a longer lifespan than exists for other positions. There is no need to belabor the point. We just disagree. No big deal. 

He's not young. It has nothing to do with goalies playing into their 30's and has everything to do with you grouping him with guys that are 21 year old kids and prospects. 

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

The core of the team will revolve around young players such as Cozens, Dahlin, Mitts, Thompson, Joki, Ullmark (if he signs), Bjork (if not taken in the expansion draft) and maybe Samuelsson and Bryson.

Will there be some veterans added to the mix beyond Okposo, McCabe (if signed) who are currently not signed?  Yes.  

All of these guys except tage are 22 or younger and then Ullmark gets tacked on at the end. Ullmark is a 27 year old man with a family. That was my point we shouldn't think of him as some young kid. He's a veteran NHL player.

Edited June 18, 2021 by LGR4GM

[nikuman]

7 hours ago, Thorny said:

Do you think they've realized they need to be surrounded by capable vets, or do we trot out kay-see Mitelstadt as our 1C next season?

Disagree outright with the last bolded, obviously

 

I agree...the prospect of losing both Eichel and Reinhart, assuming we get no immediate impact players in return, feels like Briere/Drury Part II.

[Brawndo]

When Granato mentioned in an interview that the attitude the players convey in public is completely different than His actual attitude in the Locker Room. 
 

Reinhart was the First Player that came to mind based on this description. 
 

After listening to Hamilton BS Tirade about Reinhart on Vancouver, I would have the same attitude towards that dip ***** as Samson does.

 

[Pimlach]

6 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

He's not young. It has nothing to do with goalies playing into their 30's and has everything to do with you grouping him with guys that are 21 year old kids and prospects. 

All of these guys except tage are 22 or younger and then Ullmark gets tacked on at the end. Ullmark is a 27 year old man with a family. That was my point we shouldn't think of him as some young kid. He's a veteran NHL player.

Yes, we get it.  Some goalies get better with age but I want Uhlmark to be our #2.  I want our #1 to be a goalie that wins games for his team, even with little goal support.  We will not seriously compete until we get that level of goalie 

[JohnC]

40 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

When Granato mentioned in an interview that the attitude the players convey in public is completely different than His actual attitude in the Locker Room. 
 

Reinhart was the First Player that came to mind based on this description. 
 

After listening to Hamilton BS Tirade about Reinhart on Vancouver, I would have the same attitude towards that dip ***** as Samson does.

 

I discount Hamilton's comments on Reinhart. This friction has been going on for a while. Ullmark also has a very frayed relationship with Hamilton.

No one can question the attitude of Reinhart. He is one of the most honest and consistent players on the roster. Reinhart has in a classy and dignified way expressed his frustration with the status quo situation with this team not playing end of the season meaningful games. When all is said and done Reinhart will express his intention not through words but through the way he negotiates a contract. If he is not willing to have more than a one year deal that will give him an out the following year. My expectation is that he is going to be moved.  

[Thwomp!]

What was that article teased months ago by @john wawrow?  Something about the inner workings of the Sabres and some insight into past decisions?  I was looking forward to that, but no dice I guess.

Edited June 19, 2021 by Thwomp!
wording

[Zamboni]

3 minutes ago, Thwomp! said:

What was that article teased months ago by @john wawrow?  Something about the inner workings of the Sabres and some insight into past decisions?  I was looking forward to that, but no dice I guess.

Yea I have mentioned this exact thing a month or more ago, regarding something John kinda Teased with a “stay tuned, it’s coming soon”. 
unless I missed it. And I may have … @john wawrow never delivered. Hmmmm …

[Brawndo]

John Wawrow mentioned on the Tim Graham’s Podcast that the New HC and Adams need to have the symbiotic relationship as Mc Dermott and Beane do and put Their Foot down against roster interference from Ownership. 

[Thwomp!]

3 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

John Wawrow mentioned on the Tim Graham’s Podcast that the New HC and Adams need to have the symbiotic relationship as Mc Dermott and Beane do and put Their Foot down against roster interference from Ownership. 

That would be great, but Adams is the definition of a company man.  I don't see him closer to any coach than he is to Terry.  It's why he's where he is.  Why change anything if you're him?

[apuszczalowski]

23 hours ago, Norcal said:

Granato already met with Adams today. Wonder if it was good news or bad?

Good for Granato, bad for Sabres Fans?

[apuszczalowski]

19 minutes ago, Thwomp! said:

That would be great, but Adams is the definition of a company man.  I don't see him closer to any coach than he is to Terry.  It's why he's where he is.  Why change anything if you're him?

What they need is people from outside their inner circle to come in and take control. They need a coach and GM with the same vision that work together with the same plan, not guys that are here because they will do what the Pegulas want to do. Adams isn't going anywhere right now, and its looking more and more that they are going to just take the interim tag off Grannato so it will continue to be inexperinced GM with a first time HC (at the NHL level)

[JohnC]

20 minutes ago, apuszczalowski said:

What they need is people from outside their inner circle to come in and take control. They need a coach and GM with the same vision that work together with the same plan, not guys that are here because they will do what the Pegulas want to do. Adams isn't going anywhere right now, and its looking more and more that they are going to just take the interim tag off Grannato so it will continue to be inexperinced GM with a first time HC (at the NHL level)

Granato may be a first time coach at the NHL level but he has had a myriad of experience at many other levels. It should be forgotten that he was a coach of the year in the AHL. And although it was for a short stint he did more than a commendable job last year taking over for Krueger. What Granato excels at his previous job is developing young talent. If he is selected that attribute is critically important with the young roster he will be working with.

I can't criticize anyone who is wary of Adams because of his inexperience at the position he holds because it is true. 

[PerreaultForever]

4 hours ago, JohnC said:

I discount Hamilton's comments on Reinhart. This friction has been going on for a while. Ullmark also has a very frayed relationship with Hamilton.

No one can question the attitude of Reinhart. He is one of the most honest and consistent players on the roster. Reinhart has in a classy and dignified way expressed his frustration with the status quo situation with this team not playing end of the season meaningful games. When all is said and done Reinhart will express his intention not through words but through the way he negotiates a contract. If he is not willing to have more than a one year deal that will give him an out the following year. My expectation is that he is going to be moved.  

Sorry, but I do question his work ethic and his desire. 

Regarding Hamilton and the justification of these players' attitude I totally disagree. WINNERS can scoff at the press and their critiques. Constant losers have to suck it up and take it. That's my view. Reinhart wants to make Hamilton look like an idiot? Win. 

Edited June 19, 2021 by PerreaultForever

[JohnC]

7 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Sorry, but I do question his work ethic and his desire. 

Regarding Hamilton and the justification of these players' attitude I totally disagree. WINNERS can scoff at the press and their critiques. Constant losers have to suck it up and take it. That's my view. Reinhart wants to make Hamilton look like an idiot? Win. 

There has never been a hint from anyone inside or outside the organization questioning Reinhart's effort and desire. Throughout his time in Buffalo he has been our most consistent player while playing for an organization shrouded in the fog of mediocrity. Your negative opinion is your opinion, you are entitled to it. I strenuously disagree with it. 

Even with players on winning teams that doesn't guarantee warm relations with the press. That's the human element that you won't be able to eliminate. Whatever the relationship is between any particular player/s I simply don't care. That's for them to work out.  

[Zamboni]

2 minutes ago, JohnC said:

There has never been a hint from anyone inside or outside the organization questioning Reinhart's effort and desire. Throughout his time in Buffalo he has been our most consistent player while playing for an organization shrouded in the fog of mediocrity. Your negative opinion is your opinion, you are entitled to it. I strenuously disagree with it. 

Even with players on winning teams that doesn't guarantee warm relations with the press. That's the human element that you won't be able to eliminate. Whatever the relationship is between any particular player/s I simply don't care. That's for them to work out.  

When it comes to Reinhart opinions here, consider the source. I haven’t taken certain posters opinions about certain players seriously for quite some time. It’s just white noise to me. 

[JohnC]

26 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

When it comes to Reinhart opinions here, consider the source. I haven’t taken certain posters opinions about certain players seriously for quite some time. It’s just white noise to me. 

Some people have the odd notion that to save a village you have to nuclear bomb it out of existence and then start anew. ☠️

[Radar]

5 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Some people have the odd notion that to save a village you have to nuclear bomb it out of existence and then start anew. ☠️

Some who advocate blowing it up should realize we've pretty much put ourselves in the position we're in by doing that. From management down. I know it's probably not happening but Rhino should be signed long term if he is willing. Jack, unfortunately, has set himself up to get out. Both the organization and Jack have responsibility in that.