Shopping Jack Eichel: Winnipeg

[GASabresIUFAN]

21 minutes ago, Curt said:

Fair enough.  I think it depends on what type of deal the Sabres are looking to make.  Would they make a deal that returns a good established, but still young NHL player?

Like all good questions, the answer is it depends. What is KA’s off-season strategy? Is KA going down that maximum upheaval strategy of moving on from Jack, Sam, Risto, McCabe and Ullmark?  Essentially distilling the team down to Cozens, Mitts, R2, VO, Thompson, Asplund, Dahlin, Joki, Bryson and Borgen (or Samuelsson).  Is KA going for maximum retention by re-sign Ullmark and McCabe and keeping at least one of Jack or Sam, while using Risto and one of Jack or Sam as trade bait to fill other holes or is he plotting a middle course?  It’s a very hard decision.  His strategy may depend on what kind of offers he gets for the Tank Fruit.  

If I were the GM, I’d re-sign Ullmark first and foremost and then look at the offers I receive for Jack and Sam and see the lay of the land.  I’m not interested in moving on from both guys. Risto is a whatever.  If KA moves on from both a high end 2C at least must comeback in one of the deals.  Still the needs are the same; 2 reliable goaltenders, 2 veteran defensive D, a 4C and more physical play in the top 9 forwards.  Moving Jack and Sam also creates a hole at 1C.  

[GASabresIUFAN]

31 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

Who makes that determination? You?

No, I think the threads are just fine the way they are. IF or UNTIL Eichel gets traded, go thru every single team one thread at a time like @dudacek has been. If you think it’s a waste of time to discuss a certain destination, it’s cool, no problem. Avoid the thread. Problem for you solved 👍🏼 Heck, There are threads I avoid for various reasons. 

Do you really want to discuss Jack going to 31 different teams?  @dudacek is a smart guy and my guess is with a little research he could come up with 8 or 10 reasonable possibilities.  Vogl on the Athletic did exactly that already.  For example, do really think Jack wants to go to Ott or NJ?  They have the need, cap and assets but what is the likelihood of Jack wanting to work through another rebuild in those cities and therefore demanding a trade?  I'd say they odds are very high he'd want out and they'd have to trade him at the deadline to avoid his NMC.  Under this scenario why would they even make us an offer for his services?  That doesn't mean it won't happen, it's just not likely. 

The opposite is also true.  Some of the best teams either don't have one or more of the following such as the need or the cap or the assets to get a deal done.  Do you really think that a deal with Pittsburgh is likely?   

Edited May 20, 2021 by GASabresIUFAN

[Zamboni]

Just now, GASabresIUFAN said:

Do you really want to discuss Jack going to 31 different teams?  @dudacek is a smart guy and my guess is with a little research he could come up with 8 or 10 reasonable possibilities.  Vogl on the Athletic did exactly that already.  For example, do really thing Jack wants to go to Ott or NJ?  They have the need, cap and assets but what is the likelihood of Jack wanting to work through another rebuild in those cities and therefore demanding a trade?  I'd say they odds are very high he'd want out and they'd have to trade him at the deadline to avoid his NMC.  Under this scenario why would they even make us an offer for his services?

It doesn’t matter what I want to discuss… Maybe everybody else wants to discuss it. If you don’t … great…. 
 

if he makes 8 or 10 threads… Or if he makes 31 threads… So what…

again who makes that determination how many threads he should make? 

[Norcal]

I'd make the deal the OP suggests if it was my decision and the offer were presented to me. It's a hockey trade, one that benefits both teams IMO. Make it happen. 

[PerreaultForever]

4 hours ago, dudacek said:

Where does this come from?

We've never heard any suggestions that Jack hates the city of Buffalo. Why would he hate Winnipeg?

We've heard that Jack hates the incompetence of the Sabres organization. The Jets aren't incompetent.

Finally, Jack Eichel is under contract for five more years. Why do people pretend otherwise?

I'm guessing. If he went to Winnipeg he'd be staring right in the face of Eichel vs. McDavid constantly and he's not going to come out #1 in that and I don't think that sits well with him now and will be worse if he goes there. 

Also, he's fine with Buffalo as a city. Everyone knows he'd rather be a Bruin but he's still relatively close to home, family, what he knows and likes. You think he'd be happy going up to another small market great white north nowhere land? I do not think so. I mean maybe these guys would go anywhere for their money but Winnipeg can't be anywhere near where he'd like to be. 

and it's 50 below in the winter...............

But maybe he could start a band, although both of these guys moved 🙂

 

 

[Norcal]

8 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Do you really want to discuss Jack going to 31 different teams?  @dudacek is a smart guy and my guess is with a little research he could come up with 8 or 10 reasonable possibilities.  Vogl on the Athletic did exactly that already.  For example, do really think Jack wants to go to Ott or NJ?  They have the need, cap and assets but what is the likelihood of Jack wanting to work through another rebuild in those cities and therefore demanding a trade?  I'd say they odds are very high he'd want out and they'd have to trade him at the deadline to avoid his NMC.  Under this scenario why would they even make us an offer for his services?  That doesn't mean it won't happen, it's just not likely. 

The opposite is also true.  Some of the best teams either don't have one or more of the following such as the need or the cap or the assets to get a deal done.  Do you really think that a deal with Pittsburgh is likely?   

If Eichel gets traded somewhere and that's his first reaction then he's just a dick and the league should blackball him and void his contract. Maybe he can find some work in the KHL? 

I get that players have some level of perceived control over their playing contract but teams hold all the real cards. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 minute ago, Norcal said:

If Eichel gets traded somewhere and that's his first reaction then he's just a dick and the league should blackball him and void his contract. Maybe he can find some work in the KHL? 

I get that players have some level of perceived control over their playing contract but teams hold all the real cards. 

We do have the most leverage on Jack.  He has a deal with us and KA can simply say we aren't trading you ever.  We are going to build around you as our top line center and want you to play out your contract.  End of story.

Reinhart on the other had has a ton of leverage.  He can take the team to arbitration play out the final year here and become an UFA after next season.  If that is his stance KA would likely have to trade him this offseason or at the deadline to avoid losing him for nothing.

[dudacek]

4 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

A couple of thoughts

1) Anyone trading for Jack will have the same problem we have if he doesn't want top be there such as WPG.  Given his NMC clause kicks in after next season and his current injury situation it's almost like he NMC is already in effect.  KA, if he wants to trade him, is going to have to find some place Jack is a good fit hockey wise, who has the assets we want/need for Jack, and is willing to take on the cap and injury risk.  Trade him to SJ to play with his buddy Kane.  Good luck KA.

2) May I suggest therefore we limit these threads to teams where at least Jack may want to go.  

To the macro, one of the reasons I wanted to do this was to give Sabrespace an opportunity to look more closely at each team and debate whether or not an opportunity exists for a deal. Thus "Will they be interested, do they have the pieces?" I'm hoping you guys make each other (and me) think of things we hadn't previously considered.

To the micro, Jack Eichel has five years left in his contract and no trade protection. Cap and injury risk may or may not have a role in who bids and will certainly have a role in how much they pay. But he will go wherever there is a willing buyer and a willing seller. That's how the NHL works.

[Kruppstahl]

18 hours ago, Claude Balls said:

Eichel ain't going anywhere. His trade value is a lot less now than it was before the season. 

Huh?  His current status isn't going to last forever.  I assume you mean his injury and the impasse about how to treat it best.  

If I had to guess, I'd say he's done as a Sabre. 

 

 

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

53 minutes ago, Kruppstahl said:

Huh?  His current status isn't going to last forever.  I assume you mean his injury and the impasse about how to treat it best.  

If I had to guess, I'd say he's done as a Sabre. 

 

 

 

I'm going to go the other way.  I've gone both ways on this, but I think it's more likely that Sam gets traded right now then Jack.  This situation could resolve itself pretty quickly if the Sabres agree to the surgery once the 12 weeks of rest is completed or if the conservative approach works and Jack's Drs and the Sabres Drs agree that he's healthy after the 12 weeks of rest..  KA also said Jack hasn't asked for a trade.  

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

3 hours ago, dudacek said:

To the macro, one of the reasons I wanted to do this was to give Sabrespace an opportunity to look more closely at each team and debate whether or not an opportunity exists for a deal. Thus "Will they be interested, do they have the pieces?" I'm hoping you guys make each other (and me) think of things we hadn't previously considered.

To the micro, Jack Eichel has five years left in his contract and no trade protection. Cap and injury risk may or may not have a role in who bids and will certainly have a role in how much they pay. But he will go wherever there is a willing buyer and a willing seller. That's how the NHL works.

I'm sure KA is listening to all offers, but I'm not sure he is a "willing seller."  I just don’t think he'll move on from both Jack and Sam.  One of the two probably but not both.  Jack's contract gives KA some certainty and if Reinhart is only willing to sign a 1 year deal, I think the pendulum swings toward him being the guy that gets traded.

Edited May 21, 2021 by GASabresIUFAN

[Ducky]

9 hours ago, Thorny said:

Even what's spoken about the weather here is largely a myth at this point. Winters are way more mild nowadays aside from a big cold stretch or two every winter, -8 celsius is your average December day time high. Hardly frigid. And our summers and falls are among the best one will find - I think we used to have the record for the biggest discrepancy between our winters and summer temperatures, but I can't see that being the case anymore with how much more mild the winters are of late. Not sure about the greater Buffalo area but if city life matters to Jack, Winnipeg is actually about 3 times the population of Buffalo. 

Not only that but they are on the road for half the season. Country living is right outside the city if you don't want neighbors within farting distance. 10m USD turns into about 13m CAD...housing is cheap...free medical...access to world-class hunting/fishing/boating/hiking...yadda yadda yadda. Like I said, most players that come here enjoy it here give or take an Evander Kane or Trouba. Laine even liked playing here...he just wanted to be THE player and make more than Chevy was willing to give him.

Most players go home or have a home in places like Florida (ex. Wheeler) for the off-season and like you say, they miss a great summer.

I think Eichel would love it here playing with our top 6 and regularly making the playoffs but Chevy isn't trading Ehlers or Scheif. Even KC I doubt he trades. It would have to be heavy with prospects/picks along with PLD and even then I don't think he would be willing to pay the price to bring him here.

As far as lining up against McD, we don't play them that often in a normal season. Three times a season I think?

Edited May 20, 2021 by Ducky

[Weave]

5 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Do you really want to discuss Jack going to 31 different teams? 

About twice a week you write a novel on another of endless permutations on next seasons lineup and you are bitching about threads discussing hypothetical trades of the teams biggest star?  Gimme a break.

And the answer is, yes.  What the ***** else do we have to discuss in another early offseason?

Other than another permutation of next seasons lines of course.

[woods-racer]

On 5/20/2021 at 6:49 AM, Hoss said:

*****. This was a test to see how the filter works. Turns out it cocksureness is a good, solid workaround.

Synonyms

arch, audacious, bold, 

bold-faced, brash, brassbound, 

brassy, brazen, brazen-faced, cheeky, 

cocky, fresh, impertinent,

impudent, insolent, nervy, sassy, saucy, wise

[matter2003]

Are you crazy?  I would want more than that for just Eichel

[Kruppstahl]

17 hours ago, Weave said:

About twice a week you write a novel on another of endless permutations on next seasons lineup and you are bitching about threads discussing hypothetical trades of the teams biggest star?  Gimme a break.

And the answer is, yes.  What the ***** else do we have to discuss in another early offseason?

Other than another permutation of next seasons lines of course.

Lots of hockey fans seem to love writing down imaginary line combinations and do it all the time. 

With the Sabres, it's kind of like being on the Titanic, noting that there is a hole in the side of the hull one hundred meters long, and then deciding that maybe its time to re-arrange the lounge chairs on the promenade deck.

You can play with those line combos all you want and rearrange the deck chairs, but guess what?  That ship is still sinking.

😂

 

 

[Eleven]

On 5/19/2021 at 10:41 PM, Claude Balls said:

Eichel ain't going anywhere. His trade value is a lot less now than it was before the season. 

 

On 5/19/2021 at 10:53 PM, Ducky said:

I'd bet he is traded before the next season starts.

 

On 5/19/2021 at 11:06 PM, pi2000 said:

nah

Ok.  All of these threads are premised upon Eichel being traded.  We're exploring possible returns.  It's unnecessary to guess whether he will or will not be traded in each thread.

 

Winnipeg?  I want Hellebuyck coming back.

[Ducky]

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

 

 

Ok.  All of these threads are premised upon Eichel being traded.  We're exploring possible returns.  It's unnecessary to guess whether he will or will not be traded in each thread.

 

Winnipeg?  I want Hellebuyck coming back.

Helle? Straight up and you retain 3.5m maybe...

Dream on. An elite goalie (signed to 6.17m AAV) is hard to find.

[Marvin]

21 hours ago, Ducky said:

Not only that but they are on the road for half the season. Country living is right outside the city if you don't want neighbors within farting distance. 10m USD turns into about 13m CAD...housing is cheap...free medical...access to world-class hunting/fishing/boating/hiking...yadda yadda yadda. Like I said, most players that come here enjoy it here give or take an Evander Kane or Trouba. Laine even liked playing here...he just wanted to be THE player and make more than Chevy was willing to give him.

Most players go home or have a home in places like Florida (ex. Wheeler) for the off-season and like you say, they miss a great summer.

I think Eichel would love it here playing with our top 6 and regularly making the playoffs but Chevy isn't trading Ehlers or Scheif. Even KC I doubt he trades. It would have to be heavy with prospects/picks along with PLD and even then I don't think he would be willing to pay the price to bring him here.

As far as lining up against McD, we don't play them that often in a normal season. Three times a season I think?

If you have a family, I heard Winnipeg is a helluva nice place to live.

[Ducky]

15 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

If you have a family, I heard Winnipeg is a helluva nice place to live.

I don't like living in cities but I work in Winnipeg and it is only 20-25 minute drive to work...next to no traffic on the way in and not much on the way home.

What I like about the area is the proximity to nature for fishing/hunting and so forth.

[Eleven]

8 hours ago, Ducky said:

Helle? Straight up and you retain 3.5m maybe...

Dream on. An elite goalie (signed to 6.17m AAV) is hard to find.

I said nothing about straight up.  If Greenland wants Buffalo's best player, I want Greenland's in return, is all.  It can be jiggered.  But not Laine or any other of the slim sticks un in Nunavut.

[Ducky]

3 hours ago, Eleven said:

I said nothing about straight up.  If Greenland wants Buffalo's best player, I want Greenland's in return, is all.  It can be jiggered.  But not Laine or any other of the slim sticks un in Nunavut.

Laine? Seriously? Laine? Maybe you should trade us Gilbert Perreault?

 

Brossoit is better than anyone not named Lehner you guys have had for awhile. Your GM should be taking a look at him.

Edited May 22, 2021 by Ducky

[steveoath]

18 hours ago, woods-racer said:

Synonyms

arch, audacious, bold, 

bold-faced, brash, brassbound, 

brassy, brazen, brazen-faced, cheeky, 

cocky, fresh, impertinent,

impudent, insolent, nervy, sassy, saucy, wise

Solid lineup although I would put cocky on the audacious line with bold. 🤣

[Eleven]

4 hours ago, Ducky said:

Laine? Seriously? Laine? Maybe you should trade us Gilbert Perreault?

 

Brossoit is better than anyone not named Lehner you guys have had for awhile. Your GM should be taking a look at him.

Yes.  Seriously.  If I'm a GM trading Jack Eichel to the frozen tundra, I am getting Connor Hellebuyck in the deal, or I'm not making the trade; there are 30 other teams I can trade with.

[Curt]

59 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Yes.  Seriously.  If I'm a GM trading Jack Eichel to the frozen tundra, I am getting Connor Hellebuyck in the deal, or I'm not making the trade; there are 30 other teams I can trade with.

I think most of his consternation stemmed from your mention of not wanting Laine, who is not even on the Jets anymore.  That’s why he countered with Gil Perrault, who obviously isn’t on the Sabres anymore.