Jack Eichel: Trade rumors and speculation

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, Gabrielor said:

What thinking is that? Your core is always 4-5 guys big, even on champions.

Never said 'this is good enough', so that's an invention of your interpretation.

Also, this started with a hypothetical where Krebs was acquired, so yes, Krebs is hypothetically on the team.

You listed 2, 3 if we want to count krebs. But that isn't point because the point is you need 5 and the supporting parts to make it work, which we are not close to. 

I am well aware of what you said, I can read. Wish you could, maybe Taro taught you how. Would explain a lot. "The exact type of thinking... good enough" was the sentence. It was not " you said this and I know you said this and here I am quoting it". But again you went to the Taro school of reading, which is not good. 

A core of 4-5 does not matter unless you have the underlying draft and development strategy to augment. You want proof? See the Buffalo Sabres 2014-2021. 

 

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

Krebs isn't on the team and a core of Cozens and Dahlin is the exact type of thinking that had us get Reinhart and Eichel and go "yea this is good enough"

Draft and develop. 

 

8 minutes ago, Gabrielor said:

What thinking is that? Your core is always 4-5 guys big, even on champions.

Never said 'this is good enough', so that's an invention of your interpretation.

Also, this started with a hypothetical where Krebs was acquired, so yes, Krebs is hypothetically on the team.

I bolded the relevant part of the sentence. Hope it helps, it doesn't help taro but everyone is different. 

[LGR4GM]

It's time for a break. A day even but good god this place is a dumpster fire inside Chernobyl as the sun explodes.  

[Marvin]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

It's time for a break. A day even but good god this place is a dumpster fire inside Chernobyl as the sun explodes.  

You should go to the Megaprojects YouTube channel to see what else you could make a comparison with.  😉

[sabremike]

6 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

It's time for a break. A day even but good god this place is a dumpster fire inside Chernobyl as the sun explodes.  

The difference between Chernobyl and the Sabres: Chernobyl was an accident.

[PromoTheRobot]

Just now, sabremike said:

The difference between Chernobyl and the Sabres: Chernobyl was an accident.

Exacerbated by incompetence. Not that different.

[Gabrielor]

16 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

You listed 2, 3 if we want to count krebs. But that isn't point because the point is you need 5 and the supporting parts to make it work, which we are not close to. 

I am well aware of what you said, I can read. Wish you could, maybe Taro taught you how. Would explain a lot. "The exact type of thinking... good enough" was the sentence. It was not " you said this and I know you said this and here I am quoting it". But again you went to the Taro school of reading, which is not good. 

A core of 4-5 does not matter unless you have the underlying draft and development strategy to augment. You want proof? See the Buffalo Sabres 2014-2021. 

 

The whole point of everything I said could be condensed to two sentences: "If the Eichel trade returns Krebs, we'll have Krebs, Cozens, and Dahlin all in the NHL next year, which is what I hope the future core we build around contains, along with Power. It should go without saying that this isn't complete, but a good start, and something to build around right now, rather than wait for 2022/2023 picks before beginning to support this group."

 

Thanks for the linguistic journey though, and I guess the insults. Enjoy your break.

[LGR4GM]

7 minutes ago, Gabrielor said:

The whole point of everything I said could be condensed to two sentences: "If the Eichel trade returns Krebs, we'll have Krebs, Cozens, and Dahlin all in the NHL next year, which is what I hope the future core we build around contains, along with Power. It should go without saying that this isn't complete, but a good start, and something to build around right now, rather than wait for 2022/2023 picks before beginning to support this group."

 

Thanks for the linguistic journey though, and I guess the insults. Enjoy your break.

We have to do this anyways. I'm sorry everyone but this team is a shitshow and it will take multiple drafts over multiple years to dig our way out. It sucks but that is the reality. Getting Krebs would help for sure but 2022 is going to be another really really important draft regardless. 

14 minutes ago, sabremike said:

The difference between Chernobyl and the Sabres: Chernobyl was an accident.

Accident caused by incompetence... so like the Sabres. 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

That was a short break @LGR4GM

😎

[Gabrielor]

8 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

We have to do this anyways. I'm sorry everyone but this team is a shitshow and it will take multiple drafts over multiple years to dig our way out. It sucks but that is the reality. Getting Krebs would help for sure but 2022 is going to be another really really important draft regardless. 

Accident caused by incompetence... so like the Sabres. 

No doubt.

Still, Krebs(hypothetically),Dahlin,Cozens will be nothing like 1C Girgensons, 1D Ristolainen, etc.

Edited August 9, 2021 by Gabrielor

[Doohicksie]

2 hours ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

In any trade of Eichel he will be the best player in the trade.  So, if you closely hold the old truth that you win the trade if you get the best player then the Sabres will not win this trade, even if the pieces received in exchange develop into very good players they are not likely to be Eichel good.  So, we better come to grips with that if we have not already.  The best we can hope for is the peices we get turn out to be good players and we strike gold on any draft pick.

Is he?

I mean, yes he *was* based on his play coming into this past season, but will he ever play at that elite level again?  Could it be that going forward, Krebs (for instance) could outplay Jack for the rest of the time they're both in the league?

[Mustache of God]

4 hours ago, inkman said:

DSL?

Is that like high-speed internet?

[Sabres Fan in NS]

20 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Is he?

I mean, yes he *was* based on his play coming into this past season, but will he ever play at that elite level again?  Could it be that going forward, Krebs (for instance) could outplay Jack for the rest of the time they're both in the league?

I think that there is only one way that this could happen.  If John has the surgery and it goes horribly wrong, or he doesn't have the surgery and he does not recover in a timely / proper manner, leading to his retirement.

Well, seems like that is two ways, but the end result is the same ... John retires.

[HoosierDaddy]

1 hour ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

I think that there is only one way that this could happen.  If John has the surgery and it goes horribly wrong, or he doesn't have the surgery and he does not recover in a timely / proper manner, leading to his retirement.

Well, seems like that is two ways, but the end result is the same ... John retires.

Yeah, its not like a knee injury that can fully heal but reduce explosiveness.

Edited August 9, 2021 by HoosierDaddy

[inkman]

1 hour ago, Mustache of God said:

Is that like high-speed internet?

[Pimlach]

17 hours ago, Doohickie said:

Is he?

I mean, yes he *was* based on his play coming into this past season, but will he ever play at that elite level again?  Could it be that going forward, Krebs (for instance) could outplay Jack for the rest of the time they're both in the league?

This is spot on and it’s the reason why no GMs are making a trade.   Lots of people dreaming of acquiring a young player like Zegras, Byfield, LaFraniere, Rossi, and now Krebs - all of them will someday be better than the injured Jack that we saw last year.  Those players are not gonna happen in a trade package that requires four #1 type pieces like what's bantered about here.   Right now, most of these players probably will not be traded one for one for Eichel.  
 

Eichel is hurt, the team and the player are at an impass on the next steps. What if most of the teams agree with Buffalo’s position regarding the surgeries?  Why would they give up 3 or 4 first round quality pieces?  
 

I’ve been saying this for a long time.  Trading for Eichel is a risk and we are seeing 31 NHL GMs out there not willing to meet KA’s price until that risk is somehow mitigated.  It can be possibly mitigated by taking less, or with salary trade offs, or with performance considerations, or any combination of the aforementioned.   Unless he is actually getting better by rest and rehab, or we negotiate a path to a surgery and he recovers,  I think this situation is going to continue to linger.  

Edited August 10, 2021 by Pimlach

[Doohicksie]

4 hours ago, Gabrielor said:

The core pieces I'm comfortable calling core pieces, is what I should've said. Dahlin Cozens Krebs*. 

I think Mitts is the new Reino:  The second fiddle to the top talent, but really.... also top talent.

[Huckleberry]

1 minute ago, Doohickie said:

I think Mitts is the new Reino:  The second fiddle to the top talent, but really.... also top talent.

If he takes the next step, he might surprise us.

[Huckleberry]

So its been pretty quiet lately, gives me hope they are at least talking privately on a solution.

[Hoss]

21 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

So its been pretty quiet lately, gives me hope they are at least talking privately on a solution.

I think chances are high there hasn’t been a conversation about Eichel in days. These things don’t work the way we think they do. It’s not teams calling every single day seeing what wiggle room they can find on a deal. Both sides know what the other side wants and is willing to give. Until a side is willing to make a big step forward in talks they don’t continue.

We see it in the way GMs talk about big trades often. Diggs is a good example. Beane said he made one phone call around the trade deadline to see what it would take and both sides agreed the price wasn’t a match at that time. Then the offseason came and Diggs tweeted a hint that he wanted out, Beane made another call and the deal was made shortly after.

These things aren’t like politicians hammering out the finite details of a bill. It just takes two sides who know what the other want coming together motivated to make the price work.

[Weave]

1 hour ago, Huckleberry said:

So its been pretty quiet lately, gives me hope they are at least talking privately on a solution.

[Andrew Amerk]

2 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

So its been pretty quiet lately, gives me hope they are at least talking privately on a solution.

Tells me that it will probably stay quiet until training camp rolls around. 

Then we will see just how angry Captain John can get. Maybe even smashing-a-stick-into-a-hockey-net angry. Also known as SASIAHNA. 

Edited August 10, 2021 by Andrew Amerk

[LabattBlue]

No one has to worry about seeing Jack at training camp.  He is either going to be traded by then, or injured and still fighting with the organization over surgery options.  
 

To quote Dean Wormer...there will be “0.0” chance he will be on the ice.  

Edited August 10, 2021 by LabattBlue

[kas23]

7 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

No one has to worry about seeing Jack at training camp.  He is either going to be traded by then, or injured and still fighting with the organization over surgery options.  
 

To quote Dean Wormer...there will be “0.0” chance he will be on the ice.  

He has an incredibly important reason to be on ice come training camp. He needs to show GMs he is healthy or at least trick them he is. If he doesn’t, then there’s a 0.0 chance he’ll get traded. 

[Curt]

5 minutes ago, kas23 said:

He has an incredibly important reason to be on ice come training camp. He needs to show GMs he is healthy or at least trick them he is. If he doesn’t, then there’s a 0.0 chance he’ll get traded. 

No one is going to get tricked.  Eichel will be taking a physical.  The acquiring team will have all the information.