Sabres Trade Taylor Hall (50% of His Salary Retained)and Curtis Lazar to Boston for a 2021 2nd and Anders Bjork

[JoeSchmoe]

Just now, apuszczalowski said:

How is he a liability?

Doesn't he also have one more goal then Hall does this year?

Look at his stat line on one of the best teams in hockey.

Go see what the Bruins boards are saying.

[inkman]

3 minutes ago, Hoss said:

A quick look at her profile shows she’s a pretty in-touch hockey analyst with 21,000 people who are interested enough in what she has to say to follow her. Let’s be better than “who is this person I disagree with their opinion doesn’t matter because I didn’t know her name?”

I’m not better than anyone.  I’m the lowest of the lows, the scum of the Earth. 

[Doohicksie]

2 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

don't know why we traded lazar though 

I liked Lazar fine but he's basically a JAG and might not even have been in the team's plans for next year.  We have a lot of bottom sixers and while he's one I would have kept we weren't going to keep them all.

Edited April 12, 2021 by Doohickie

[PromoTheRobot]

2 hours ago, Srw1525 said:

Bjorks stats since being with Boston...bounced back and forth between both teams.....

And he's funny looking.

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, matter2003 said:

What kind of garbage trade is this??

That has been discussed extensively in this thread.

[SDS]

Here’s what baffles me about fan analysis on this (disregarding general disappointment on the perceived value of the trade)...

Do people think there were better offers on the table and that Adams just took the lowest one? When teams decided not to beat Boston‘s offer was this Adam’s fault? Were all of the willing trade partners that stupid that they would let Boston get Hall for such a bargain basement price, yet they weren’t willing to up their offer?

this wasn’t a secret deal, inexplicably made in the middle of the night in early December. Every single team in the league knew that Hall was available. Every single team knew they could acquire Taylor Hall. Every single team could have put in a better offer.

Again, unless Adams deliberately decided to pick a lower offer, it’s only reasonable to expect that this was actually the best offer.

[JoeSchmoe]

1 minute ago, Doohickie said:

I liked Lazar fine but he's basically a JAG and might not even have been the team's plans for next year.  We have a lot of bottom sixers and while he's one I would have kept we weren't going to keep them all.

But we took another 4th liner back who sucks on a good team. He's next year's Eakin.

[PromoTheRobot]

3 minutes ago, SDS said:

Here’s what baffles me about fan analysis on this (disregarding general disappointment on the perceived value of the trade)...

Do people think there were better offers on the table and that Adams just took the lowest one? When teams decided not to beat Boston‘s offer was this Adam’s fault? Were all of the willing trade partners that stupid that they would let Boston get Hall for such a bargain basement price, yet they weren’t willing to up their offer?

this wasn’t a secret deal, inexplicably made in the middle of the night in early December. Every single team in the league knew that Hall was available. Every single team knew they could acquire Taylor Hall. Every single team could have put in a better offer.

Again, unless Adams deliberately decided to pick the lower offer, it’s only reasonable to expect that this was actually the best offer.

It's possible Hall waited too long. Maybe he had a better deal earlier and decided to hold out thinking it could get better. We'll never know unless these things leak out later.

 

But it was also suggested by the top tier media good the Hall's market was soft. GMs have eyes and can see Hall play this year.

Edited April 12, 2021 by PromoTheRobot

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

It's possible Hall waited too long. Maybe he had a better deal earlier and decided to hold out thinking it could get better. We'll never know unless these things leak out later.

But it was also suggested by the top tier media good the Hall's market was soft. GMs have eyes and can see Hall play this year.

They also have a functioning analytics department unlike the Buffalo Sabres. 

 

[SDS]

Just now, PromoTheRobot said:

It's possible Hall waited too long. Maybe he had a better deal earlier and decided to hold out thinking it could get better. Well never know unless these things leak out later.

 

But it was also suggested by the top tier media good they Hall's market was soft. GMs have eyes and can see Hall play this year.

Sure it’s possible. But it’s damned if you do damned if you don’t. What are the chances it was so much better that everyone here would’ve been happy, and Adams said no because he wanted more? 

Again. Every single team knew for a month that Taylor Hall was available. This snuck up on no one.

Other than Toronto, what team made a big trade that precluded this from happening?

[Torpedo Forecheck]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

They also have a functioning analytics department unlike the Buffalo Sabres. 

 

So Hall was good ?

[apuszczalowski]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

They also have a functioning analytics department unlike the Buffalo Sabres. 

 

And 2 of them had Staal.

[Doohicksie]

35 minutes ago, chileanseabass said:

If this is Hall + Sheahan for that return, I don't think it's a terrible trade.  I think there's little to no interest in Hall out there, and didn't imagine getting more than a 2nd for him.  Adding Lazar makes no sense to me.

But is there really that much of a difference between Sheehan and Lazar?

[nfreeman]

6 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I expected more because the market said he was worth more because of the Foligno deal.  At least he could have gotten another late pick or a conditional 1st such as Stanley Cup or re-signing like Jbot did in the Kane deal.

 

6 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Are Foligno and Hall not both top 6 wingers?  Isn't Hall the younger, faster and the more productive player the last 1, 2, 3 & 4 years?  Honest Hall should have been worth more then Foligno. Obviously you believe and maybe correctly that our GMs have zero negotiating skills and that every time we make a bad deal that it was the only offer on the table and that the other side said take it or leave it.  If that is the case then Jbot should be absolved for the terrible ROR trade.  Under your reasoning that was the best deal available at that time.  

Why do other GMs make better deadline deals?  Do we just wait to long, lack negotiating skills, have zero clue how to create a market for our players etc?

No.  Foligno, who is a warrior with some skill, is a much more desirable commodity for a playoff run than Hall, who has looked terrible and useless all season.

 

6 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Foligno was not acquired for his point totals. he brings what they lack. They are a much better playoff team now. 

Exactly.  This was a great move for the Leafs.

Frankly, if the Sabres had traded Hall for Foligno and given him an extension immediately, I would've been thrilled.

 

2 hours ago, Thorny said:

Ya, I still think the cost to move the return from a 3rd into a 2nd was the downgrade from Lazar to Bjork 

Do you seriously think the Bruins made the Sabres take Bjork?  I really doubt that -- I think the Sabres wanted a prospect with upside in the deal and the upgrade from Lazar to Bjork was the extra part of the price the Bruins paid for Hall.

[Doohicksie]

29 minutes ago, apuszczalowski said:

and actually play well, probably get a few hat tricks  against Buffalo just because

If that happens I'll eat my own head.

[JohnC]

The bottom line is that we got a second round pick for Hall. That is what many people thought we were going to retrieve for him. As far as having to play half of what he was due in order to get a second round pick then so be it. What's more important is that the money that went to him now could be directed to a player such as Ullmark next season. 

I don't know enough about Bjork to even respond to his talent level and how it compares to the Lazar. Although I like Lazar as a player I'm not going to inflate this fourth line player's value. He is a likeable and earnest player but also replaceable player.

This Hall transaction wasn't an exceptional deal for our GM. It was a reasonable deal for a very diminished player who was an UFA. The notion that he was going to garner a first round pick was a delusion. For the most part this was a neutral and inconsequential deal. I don't understand the hysteria surrounding this trade. 

[Doohicksie]

29 minutes ago, SDS said:

I must be completely missing the point about the retained salary. He’s on a one-year contract. Who cares? It doesn’t affect the team one iota moving forward and it’s Terry’s money. Who was going to deal us back a worthwhile, high dollar player  (since the team trading for a Hall would be still in the hunt) in order for the receiving team to fit Hall under the cap?

Yeah, I said something similar earlier in the thread.  The salary retention isn't as significant in this case as people are making it out to be.

[PromoTheRobot]

4 minutes ago, SDS said:

Sure it’s possible. But it’s damned if you do damned if you don’t. What are the chances it was so much better that everyone here would’ve been happy, and Adams said no because he wanted more? 

Again. Every single team knew for a month that Taylor Hall was available. This snuck up on no one.

Other than Toronto, what team made a big trade that precluded this from happening?

Hockey twitter is saying Hall had a no movement clause. Is that true? First I've heard. It's being suggested EDM we offering a 1st but Hall nixed it.

Edited April 12, 2021 by PromoTheRobot

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, Torpedo Forecheck said:

So Hall was good ?

Hall was having a really bad year when it comes to sh%. This happens for players from time to time but all evidence points to it regressing towards his average. I would bet money he scores more goals for the Bruins. His underlying shot metrics, kinda like skinner, weren't bad but the end product just wasn't there. 

Good? Maybe but he was a decent player who clearly mailed it in after Ralph was fired. 

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

The bottom line is that we got a second round pick for Hall. That is what many people thought we were going to retrieve for him. As far as having to play half of what he was due in order to get a second round pick then so be it. What's more important is that the money that went to him now could be directed to a player such as Ullmark next season. 

I don't know enough about Bjork to even respond to his talent level and how it compares to the Lazar. Although I like Lazar as a player I'm not going to inflate this fourth line player's value. He is a likeable and earnest player but also replaceable player.

This Hall transaction wasn't an exceptional deal for our GM. It was a reasonable deal for a very diminished player who was an UFA. The notion that he was going to garner a first round pick was a delusion. For the most part this was a neutral and inconsequential deal. I don't understand the hysteria surrounding this trade. 

We could have always directed Hall money to Ullmark next season because Hall wouldn't be on the team next season. 

[Pimlach]

29 minutes ago, inkman said:

If you don’t think Jack Eichel is a star player, we can’t really have a conversation.  The whole “Reinhart was drafted 2nd overall, he needs to play like it” trope is the most tired take on Sabrespace.  He’s a good player. Arguably, the 2nd best of his draft class.  Let. It. Go.  

Please stop.  Stop making up whatever it is your making up.  

The post I was replying to said “keep Jack and Sam around”.   I said they need to be much more than players you keep around.  They need to be star players - which means they actually put the numbers up on the leaders board.  Goals and assists, that is what I want to see from them.  Pre Covid, Eichel was playing his best hockey.  Seems like forever.  Let’s see it again.  That is what I mean.

 Sam is a fine role player.  Second best in his draft class?   That is debatable and stats say otherwise.  Right now he ranks 6th in points among his draft class.  He is far behind Draisatil and Pasternak.  He is also behind Ehlers, Point and Larkin in points.  Points aren’t everything, so I put him behind Ekblad too.  You can argue he is 4th or 5th in his class if you chose to be open minded.  
 

[LGR4GM]

2 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Please stop.  Stop making up whatever it is your making up.  

The post I was replying to said “keep Jack and Sam around”.   I said they need to be much more than players you keep around.  They need to be star players - which means they actually put the numbers up on the leaders board.  Goals and assists, that is what I want to see from them.  Pre Covid, Eichel was playing his best hockey.  Seems like forever.  Let’s see it again.  That is what I mean.

 Sam is a fine role player.  Second best in his draft class?   That is debatable and stats say otherwise.  Right now he ranks 6th in points among his draft class.  He is far behind Draisatil and Pasternak.  He is also behind Ehlers, Point and Larkin in points.  Points aren’t everything, so I put him behind Ekblad too.  You can argue he is 4th or 5th in his class if you chose to be open minded.  
 

I don't care where Reinhart was drafted. I care that he is a durable and reliable 50pt player year in and year out who doesn't hurt you defensively and can be slotted in your top 6. I don't need him to be a "star" player at this point because I still need "role players" like Reinhart for the team to be good. 

[Thwomp!]

It was an error downgrading Lazar. We replaced him with a worse, more expensive player without the intangibles that Lazar brings.

And Boston gets Lazar, a cheap, useful player for a million dollars next year as well.

There's a reason this team sucks yet we have no cap room.

[#freejame]

I had no idea so many posters had eyes on Bjork for so long to already write him off. 

[LGR4GM]

Just now, Thwomp! said:

It was an error downgrading Lazar. We replaced him with a worse, more expensive player without the intangibles that Lazar brings.

And Boston gets Lazar, a cheap, useful player for a million dollars next year as well.

There's a reason this team sucks yet we have no cap room.

We did?

Bjork seems like younger more expensive Lazar. Not a big downgrade in my mind. 

[tom webster]

2 hours ago, Thorny said:

Ya, I still think the cost to move the return from a 3rd into a 2nd was the downgrade from Lazar to Bjork 

It’s not so much the downgrade in play. It was a way that Buffalo actually took on more salary to facilitate the deal. Boston wouldn’t have done it without moving the extra $800K(prorated)