Don Granato as a HC

[pi2000]

Their shooting % and save % have suffered the past few games, and with the underlying poor possession numbers, this is the result.

They need a better coach. Period.

[dudacek]

37 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

Their shooting % and save % have suffered the past few games, and with the underlying poor possession numbers, this is the result.

They need a better coach. Period.

You could not be more wrong.

They need a better coach. Comma.

Better goalies. Comma.

Better skaters. Comma.

Better checkers. Comma.

Better scorers. Ellipses.

[MODO Hockey]

There are numerous of things to take in concideration when it comes to Don, 

It was obvious that people would start ranting "Don Granato should be the new  head coach!!" after we won a couple of games. 

But, 

This org must have more patience than ever before now, because this season wont tell jack sh1t other than a slight increase of players
totally destroyed confidence. 10 seasons has passed without playoff, this sh1t is deep as fk in all corners. All players that play for this team and players that consider joininig this team have this era of losing infecting their mindset, whether they like it or not and that does also include everyone else around the team that has an effect on the players such as coaching staff etc.

To break this curse this org needs a GM than has a mindset that has a affect on everyone connected to this team and this gm will need to hire a coaching staff that has the skills necessary to break this curse and BOY O BOY it will be hard as hell to find these assets needed. 

In my personal opinion when it comes to Don Granato i believe he has to go after this season, not because he is doing a bad job but because he is a part of the curse that needs to be broken. I do not have faith in Don Granato and i probably never will, eventhough i like him so far and he is beeing way more honest in interviews than RK was. I like how they are playing, i like that most players have improvded this season under DG but .. BUT, that would've most likely been the case with any other coach aswell just because its different to take on a team that has a 18 game losing streak than normally, obviously. 

Did i say i like but(s) ?

 

[Hoss]

If Gallant is willing to come here I'd be disappointed in any other outcome, honestly.

Have struggles in the last two games against the rival Bruins done anything to change the minds of those that had hopped on the Don train?

[Radar]

3 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

There are numerous of things to take in concideration when it comes to Don, 

It was obvious that people would start ranting "Don Granato should be the new  head coach!!" after we won a couple of games. 

But, 

This org must have more patience than ever before now, because this season wont tell jack sh1t other than a slight increase of players
totally destroyed confidence. 10 seasons has passed without playoff, this sh1t is deep as fk in all corners. All players that play for this team and players that consider joininig this team have this era of losing infecting their mindset, whether they like it or not and that does also include everyone else around the team that has an effect on the players such as coaching staff etc.

To break this curse this org needs a GM than has a mindset that has a affect on everyone connected to this team and this gm will need to hire a coaching staff that has the skills necessary to break this curse and BOY O BOY it will be hard as hell to find these assets needed. 

In my personal opinion when it comes to Don Granato i believe he has to go after this season, not because he is doing a bad job but because he is a part of the curse that needs to be broken. I do not have faith in Don Granato and i probably never will, eventhough i like him so far and he is beeing way more honest in interviews than RK was. I like how they are playing, i like that most players have improvded this season under DG but .. BUT, that would've most likely been the case with any other coach aswell just because its different to take on a team that has a 18 game losing streak than normally, obviously. 

Did i say i like but(s) ?

 

My position still is to wait for off season and evaluate this. Frankly, I'm not on Granato bandwagon or off it. The team has improved up to now under him but let's wait until seasons over. Past two games and remaining games are tough schedule we'll see. I'm not one who buys in on he should be disqualified simply because he's associated with the team though. 

 

[Doohicksie]

19 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

In my personal opinion when it comes to Don Granato i believe he has to go after this season, not because he is doing a bad job but because he is a part of the curse that needs to be broken.

This is complete and utter *****.

[NCBufFan]

2 hours ago, Doohickie said:

This is complete and utter *****.

What? Voodoo isn't a good reason not to hire a coach? 🤣

Edited April 24, 2021 by NCBufFan

[Doohicksie]

Yep.

I will say this:  I get why MODO says what he does.  He's saying the Sabres need to distance themselves from the chronic losing.  It makes sense.  But if you want to get metaphysical and political all at the same time, harken back to this post I made in this thread a few days back:

On 4/20/2021 at 11:51 AM, Doohickie said:

I kind of have the feeling that when fleshing out his staff, Krueger, having been in Europe in the lead up to his hire, depended on others in the Sabres org for recommendations/input into some of his selections for coaching staff.  Granato, according to my theory, was the suggestion of the organization's Deep State operative (i.e., Kevyn Adams).  Granato was the "spy" that provided the dirt on Krueger that Adams took to the Pegulas when it was time to move on from Ralph.

This whole thing was done so well Pegula doesn't even realize there was a coup.

The reason that Donny Meatballs doesn't need to be part of the exorcism is that he is part of the Deep State, the Sabres Illuminati, that protect that flame of what it means to be a Sabre. 

Kevyn Adams grew up in Clarence, NY, a Sabres fan.  He has been serving with the team on and off in various capacities, originally as Assistant Coach hired by Lindy Ruff.  The midi-chlorians of the Sabres Deep State were always with Adams as a young fan of the Sabres, but were more formally conferred on Adams by Ruff.

I looked back and so far as I can tell, no one knows why Don Granato was brought into the organization.  But Adams has been a foot soldier in the franchise for some years, filling various rolls.  My assertion is that Adams suggested to Ralph Krueger that he bring Granato in as an assistant.  He probably supported Krueger's hiring too at the time, in the knowledge that Krueger would be a colossal disaster.  Having TPeg's ear, he convinced him that JBott had to go, a pitch that was so persuasive that he was given the duties of GM.  Then he gave Krueger enough rope to hang himself, which he did.  Granato, as a confidante of Krueger, knew what was going on behind the scenes and gave Kevyn Adams enough information to persuade TPeg that Krueger's time had come.  Not wanting to tip their role in all this, Adams only named Granato as Interim Head Coach for the rest of the season.

He will interview other candidates of course, but Granato was Adams' selection for coach all along, before he was even GM, and together Adams and Granato staged a well-conceived coup to remove JBott and Krueger.  It was the only way to save the Sabres from the mismanagement of the well-meaning but meddling owner.  With the full trust of the owner he is not just the GM, he is TPeg's Grand Vizier of Hockey Operations.  He cultivated Pegula's trust and has acted this way not to deceive him but to save TPeg from himself.

Because that's what the Deep State does for the organization it serves.

Edited April 24, 2021 by Doohickie
Yes, this is a bit of over-the-top fan fiction on my part, but I think there may be a nugget of truth in there.

[Eleven]

5 hours ago, Doohickie said:

Yep.

I will say this:  I get why MODO says what he does.  He's saying the Sabres need to distance themselves from the chronic losing.  It makes sense.  But if you want to get metaphysical and political all at the same time, harken back to this post I made in this thread a few days back:

The reason that Donny Meatballs doesn't need to be part of the exorcism is that he is part of the Deep State, the Sabres Illuminati, that protect that flame of what it means to be a Sabre. 

Kevyn Adams grew up in Clarence, NY, a Sabres fan.  He has been serving with the team on and off in various capacities, originally as Assistant Coach hired by Lindy Ruff.  The midi-chlorians of the Sabres Deep State were always with Adams as a young fan of the Sabres, but were more formally conferred on Adams by Ruff.

I looked back and so far as I can tell, no one knows why Don Granato was brought into the organization.  But Adams has been a foot soldier in the franchise for some years, filling various rolls.  My assertion is that Adams suggested to Ralph Krueger that he bring Granato in as an assistant.  He probably supported Krueger's hiring too at the time, in the knowledge that Krueger would be a colossal disaster.  Having TPeg's ear, he convinced him that JBott had to go, a pitch that was so persuasive that he was given the duties of GM.  Then he gave Krueger enough rope to hang himself, which he did.  Granato, as a confidante of Krueger, knew what was going on behind the scenes and gave Kevyn Adams enough information to persuade TPeg that Krueger's time had come.  Not wanting to tip their role in all this, Adams only named Granato as Interim Head Coach for the rest of the season.

He will interview other candidates of course, but Granato was Adams' selection for coach all along, before he was even GM, and together Adams and Granato staged a well-conceived coup to remove JBott and Krueger.  It was the only way to save the Sabres from the mismanagement of the well-meaning but meddling owner.  With the full trust of the owner he is not just the GM, he is TPeg's Grand Vizier of Hockey Operations.  He cultivated Pegula's trust and has acted this way not to deceive him but to save TPeg from himself.

Because that's what the Deep State does for the organization it serves.

I think Adams wanted (and maybe still wants) Leaman.

[Radar]

18 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I think Adams wanted (and maybe still wants) Leaman.

Very possible. I think this is a very young team in immediate future. That would seem to influence whoever is chosen as the next coach. That's why I don't think Torts and his like would be a good fit. Leaman and Granato both fit to the degree of developing players it seems. Questions on them are obviously lack of NHL experience. I'm undecided on how important NHL experience is as opposed to just coaching experience. The game is still he game and maybe we complicate jt too much. Coaching players vs coaching hockey so to speak. Systems? How many can there really be?

[PromoTheRobot]

On 4/22/2021 at 4:16 PM, LabattBlue said:

I don't care how the Sabres play the last 10 games or so.  There is NO WAY Granato should be hired without a thorough search of the most experienced candidates on the market.  None of this "we know him and we like to hire within our comfort zone" crap.

"Don't let Rex Ryan leave the room."

[PromoTheRobot]

I don't get what an interview is going to tell you. How a new coach plans to blow everything up? What system he's going to make them play? Granato is doing more than just winning more games. He's waking up players that have not played to their potential under a parade of former Sabres coaches. Krueger, Housley, Rolston, Bylsma... 

 

You have a young team. You need a talent whisperer. That's Granato. Don't overthink it.

Edited April 24, 2021 by PromoTheRobot

[JohnC]

7 hours ago, Doohickie said:

Yep.

I will say this:  I get why MODO says what he does.  He's saying the Sabres need to distance themselves from the chronic losing.  It makes sense.  But if you want to get metaphysical and political all at the same time, harken back to this post I made in this thread a few days back:

The reason that Donny Meatballs doesn't need to be part of the exorcism is that he is part of the Deep State, the Sabres Illuminati, that protect that flame of what it means to be a Sabre. 

Kevyn Adams grew up in Clarence, NY, a Sabres fan.  He has been serving with the team on and off in various capacities, originally as Assistant Coach hired by Lindy Ruff.  The midi-chlorians of the Sabres Deep State were always with Adams as a young fan of the Sabres, but were more formally conferred on Adams by Ruff.

I looked back and so far as I can tell, no one knows why Don Granato was brought into the organization.  But Adams has been a foot soldier in the franchise for some years, filling various rolls.  My assertion is that Adams suggested to Ralph Krueger that he bring Granato in as an assistant.  He probably supported Krueger's hiring too at the time, in the knowledge that Krueger would be a colossal disaster.  Having TPeg's ear, he convinced him that JBott had to go, a pitch that was so persuasive that he was given the duties of GM.  Then he gave Krueger enough rope to hang himself, which he did.  Granato, as a confidante of Krueger, knew what was going on behind the scenes and gave Kevyn Adams enough information to persuade TPeg that Krueger's time had come.  Not wanting to tip their role in all this, Adams only named Granato as Interim Head Coach for the rest of the season.

He will interview other candidates of course, but Granato was Adams' selection for coach all along, before he was even GM, and together Adams and Granato staged a well-conceived coup to remove JBott and Krueger.  It was the only way to save the Sabres from the mismanagement of the well-meaning but meddling owner.  With the full trust of the owner he is not just the GM, he is TPeg's Grand Vizier of Hockey Operations.  He cultivated Pegula's trust and has acted this way not to deceive him but to save TPeg from himself.

Because that's what the Deep State does for the organization it serves.

You have weaved together an interesting conspiracy theory. The problem with it is that it is not true, especially as it applies to Botterill. The former GM would be still on the job if he accepted the owners' request to downsize the hockey operation to save money. The owners had a number of conversations with Botts to go along  with their austerity program. He made it clear that he would not be on board with their reorganization. So he left. Did he leave on his own accord or was he fired? It doesn't matter how that conclusion is interpreted. It didn't take long for history to show that Botterill was right and the owners were wrong with their attempt to refashion the organization. Now what is being done is to restore what they took apart. When you take one step forward and two back you end up falling behind. 

[JohnC]

25 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

I don't get what an interview is going to tell you. How a new coach plans to blow everything up? What system he's going to make them play? Granato is doing more than just winning more games. He's waking up players that have not played to their potential under a parade of former Sabres coaches. Krueger, Housley, Rolston, Bylsma... 

 

You have a young team. You need a talent whisperer. That's Granato. Don't overthink it.

The next coach will be expected to work well with a young roster. We already have that. 

The next coach will be expected to be able to match the players with the upbeat style of play that is more entertaining. We already have that. 

The next coach will be expected to put  players in the best position to succeed. We already have that. 

The next coach will be be expected to hold players accountable. We already have that. 

When you have the ingredients at home to make meal you don't have to go outside to the store.

[Radar]

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

"Don't let Rex Ryan leave the room."

How did that work out? As opposed to the inexperienced McD?

[JohnC]

6 minutes ago, Radar said:

How did that work out? As opposed to the inexperienced McD?

Coach McDermott was not inexperienced. He had extensive experience in the league in a variety of roles before being hired as a HC. He was a student of the game and was prepared to be a HC when he was hired. A number of teams were interested in him as a candidate for a HCing position. The same scenario applies to Granato. He has had a long and varied history in hockey in all segments of the business both in the pro and amateur ranks. And as an interim coach he has quickly demonstrated that he knows how to take an underachieving roster and a dispirited team and in short order dramatically turn things around. If you consider this interim stint as part of the interview process he has aced the test. 

[Eleven]

6 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Coach McDermott was not inexperienced. He had extensive experience in the league in a variety of roles before being hired as a HC. He was a student of the game and was prepared to be a HC when he was hired. A number of teams were interested in him as a candidate for a HCing position. The same scenario applies to Granato. He has had a long and varied history in hockey in all segments of the business both in the pro and amateur ranks. And as an interim coach he has quickly demonstrated that he knows how to take an underachieving roster and a dispirited team and in short order dramatically turn things around. If you consider this interim stint as part of the interview process he has aced the test. 

I certainly didn't feel this way 24 hours ago.

I think a bit of caution is warranted.

[triumph_communes]

Judge Granato when he brings in his own pick of assistants as well. 

[dudacek]

2 minutes ago, triumph_communes said:

Judge Granato when he brings in his own pick of assistants as well. 

Are Ellis and Girardi also auditioning for full-time gigs as well?

Seems to me that Ellis probably has more to do with Mittelstadt than any other factor. And how much influence has Girardi had on transforming Dahlin and Joki?

Whether they stay behind the bench or not, they certainly seem to be showing results in their roles as development coaches.

[Trettioåtta]

1 minute ago, dudacek said:

Are Ellis and Girardi also auditioning for full-time gigs as well?

Seems to me that Ellis probably has more to do with Mittelstadt than any other factor. And how much influence has Girardi had on transforming Dahlin and Joki?

Whether they stay behind the bench or not, they certainly seem to be showing results in their roles as development coaches.

I don't know how good they are at assistant coaches - but it would seem mad for NHL franchises with young players not to have dedicated development coaches (unless it brings too many cooks or something)

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I certainly didn't feel this way 24 hours ago.

I think a bit of caution is warranted.

I'm not looking at individual games to support or not support my position on Granato. What is evident to me from an overview standpoint is that he took a roster that was grossly underachieving and whose confidence was lost and in short order changed that negative dynamic. There isn't a player on this roster that isn't playing better under him than under Krueger. Without much practice time he has altered the style of play and he has instilled confidence in a demoralized team he took over. In my view he has earned a new contract to be the next HC.  

[dudacek]

4 minutes ago, Trettioåtta said:

I don't know how good they are at assistant coaches - but it would seem mad for NHL franchises with young players not to have dedicated development coaches (unless it brings too many cooks or something)

It’s certainly a valid argument that they are more valuable as development coaches. It is what they were originally hired to do and our prospects are developing.

Probably comes down to the person ultimately hired to be head coach, and to Adams.

[Radar]

29 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Coach McDermott was not inexperienced. He had extensive experience in the league in a variety of roles before being hired as a HC. He was a student of the game and was prepared to be a HC when he was hired. A number of teams were interested in him as a candidate for a HCing position. The same scenario applies to Granato. He has had a long and varied history in hockey in all segments of the business both in the pro and amateur ranks. And as an interim coach he has quickly demonstrated that he knows how to take an underachieving roster and a dispirited team and in short order dramatically turn things around. If you consider this interim stint as part of the interview process he has aced the test. 

My point is that Rex had HC experience in the NFL. I agree that Granato has experience as a coach but many on here are talking about experience has to be NHL experience. Hence the comparison Rex and McD.

[JohnC]

26 minutes ago, Radar said:

My point is that Rex had HC experience in the NFL. I agree that Granato has experience as a coach but many on here are talking about experience has to be NHL experience. Hence the comparison Rex and McD.

I know what you are saying and I'm not trying to distort what your point is. It makes sense. But for those who give the Rex comparison the reality is that the owner hired a known failed huckster in the league because he was more interested in getting attention for his nondescript franchise instead of doing what was required to rebuild a middling franchise. He tried to take the short cut and PR route instead of the more substantive route. What Pegula has learned with the McDermott hire is that substance trumps obnoxious style. The Rex hire was not simply a bad hire it was always a weird hire. When all is said and done the loud coach outhustled the befuddled owner and ended up pocketing a lot of money for his short and indistinguishable stint. If the owner wants to blame anyone for that setback he needs to look in the mirror. To his credit he corrected his own mistake and the rest is history.  

[Doohicksie]

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

I certainly didn't feel this way 24 hours ago.

I think a bit of caution is warranted.

We're not the ones who have to exercise caution, we're just spectators.  Many of us here follow the Sabres like a soap opera or a movie, and try to figure out the plot.  Because of our involvement I believe many of us project what we think the key players are thinking and begin to think we know what they think.  So we worry, for instance, that KA has already decided to keep Granato without doing his due diligence. 

I'm sure KA is exercising a helluva lot more caution than we're projecting on him.  That's part of the reason I labeled my post above as fan fiction in the Edit comment.  I know I was projecting, I was just having a little fun with it.  I'm also pretty sure that if this is an audition for Granato the judgment won't be complete until all the games play out as far as Adams is concerned.